Modern F-35 bought by Poland. Good decision?

I have read that these engines are now so reliable that the advantage of two engines over one is now negligible.

@Miloslaw
Thats bullshit. One engine means its slower. The F-35 tops speed at 1500 km/h. Thats almost 900km/ slower than typhoon Eurofighter.

All in all this is a problem more and more. Poland is a american vasall of the worst kind and a security risk for not just Germany but also France and EU in general.

A american 5th colon

Eurofighter is a 4th gen+ aircraft and F-35 is a fifth generation stealth jetfighter. Those two do not even belong on the same shelf. Britain will replace its Typhoons with F-35, same as Italy. And France has its own Dassault Rafale fighters. Eurofighter is a dead project by now

@Spike31

The F.35 is dead as well. Since its slow, has no stealth (was busted by german passive radar).

F.35 cant operate alone without F-22 or Typhoon support,. Once its detected, its a dead duck.

Far from dead. It is the only mass produced and exported 5th generation jet fighter in the world.

Do those F-35's come with an aircraft carrier?

we would love to have one - after all, all we dream of is a revenge for the Swedish Deluge :) :P

NO! A terrible decision. Very very bad. Dumb PiS government.

- it's only the Baltic sea that stops us now heh ;) :P

@Spike31
exactly. Its mass produced for export, because its trash.

Wonder why USA doesnt export any F-22? Thats a top aircraft.

F-35 is garbage and depends on other aircrafts to protect it, because its low speed.

Its a guarantee to bind you on the americans, because without their support, F-35 will be shot down like ducks.

Germany looked into the F-35 and considers it garbage. It was kicked out of competition, as too slow, to fragile, too bad quality and ridicilous things like its helmet, which costs almost a million € each and is adjusted for each pilot.

Its stealth is broken as well, since our new passive radar busted it.

I know Poland likes to get pulled over the table by america, but thats up to you.

Look at your national airline LOT. Only Boeing...and now gets it from behind because Boeing bad quality standards.

At least can fly. And that`s enough for threat from western borders. Good enough from Disneyland and for charade for masses. Because Germany is baked anyway. Poland would just need to add some salt on it.

A top aircraft which even the US Army cannot afford to upkeep in decent numbers. That's why they've switched to F-35 themselves.

The only existing alternatives to F-35 are Chinese J-20 fighters since new Russian su57 are still being tested. And Russians also cannot afford a mass production of them either.

Since Poland already has F-16 with a stockpile of guided bombs and advanced cruise missiles like JASSM-ER it only makes sense to purchase a fighter which is already compatible with them such as F-35.


Those are not intended for an agression but for protection ie. air defense, combat air patrol and air policing.

@Spike31

Even Syria was able to shot at israeli F-35 badly damaging one.

The F-35 is trash.

We live in 2020 and you celebrate your country to depend on old trash that has no future in a world of AI weapons, drones and automated systems. A slow aircraft, with single engine, not working stealth.

Not good enough for Germany, but good enough for Poland?

The thing is, the Eurofighter can blast it out of the sky. And i have no doubt that russia can do this as well.

I hope you get it cheap.

German army is in a state of decay and not an example for Poland*

*bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-43134896

Polish army doesn't care what good for bundeswehr since pretty soon you'll be behind us in military power. And you're far behind us when it comes to morale.

@Spike31
maybe but even in decay its magnitudes above poland.

You will never be infront us in military power for the simple reason that you dont have the economy for it. Never had. Never will have.

With morale you pretty much cant mean working morale and technical standard morale.

Your GDP is 525 billion...thats roughly the economic power of Baden-Württemberg. Your entire economy is the size of a single german state. Just to put things into perspective.

But Russia won`t. Among else because Poles ride with Serbs.

Those disproportions will diminish with time.

The economy of Poland is constantly growing at a pace which is 2-3 times faster than an averag anual growth of a German economy.

Poland spends over 2% of its GDP on army and a recent reforms has incresed this number to reach 2.5% by the year 2024 and 3% by the end of this decade. Combined power of fast GDP growth + increased % relocated to a military expedinture will put Polish army on a totally new level by the end of decade.

And also Poland can arm itself with all sorts of heavy weaponry in very large volumes. If Germany tried to do the same they would meet political opposition from other European countries, even their close political allies, due to obvious historical reasons.

Number don't lie. To put things into perspective...

@Spike31
This disproportions cant diminish with time, because they are rocked in stone since millenia.

You are right, numbers dont lie. And becase your growing is based on your size, the distance between Germany and Poland grows even bigger.

You would need 9% annual growth to get the same numbers of growth as Germany. Which would mean with 9% annual growth you would be able to keep the status quo. You dont have 9% growth, which means the distance even gets bigger.

Germany too has heavy weaponry of evry sort. Even nuclear capapable submarines.

Defense politics never depend on "political oppossition". Even more so since Trump wants that Germany becomes 2nd largest military on the planet. Its Trumps dream that Germany spends 2% GDP on defense, which would give us an army more powerful than China (bigger than UK and France combined). At NATO summit he said Germany could even go to 4%, which is true. But we see no need in it. At least now.

Spike its better you look at history and do so quite good. Poland always was let fallen down, like a hot potato.

Your country always was used as pawn. Once you are not needed anymore, they drop you. Again and again. Your entire nations history, is a history of betrayal.

Your best option is to have good relations with Germany. Russia wants gut you. USA doesnt care about you. Germany is the only power that actually has a more friendly outreach towards Poland

Allow me to take a word of a German parliamentary commissioner for the armed forces over yours:

"No submarines or large transport planes were available for deployment at the end of last year, the report says. At the end of the year six out of six submarines were not in use. At times, not one of the 14 Airbus A-400M could fly,"

"The condition of the military's fleet of fighter planes, tanks, helicopters and ships is described as "dramatically bad".

bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-43134896


Yes, West Germany was a member of nuclear-sharing project during cold war under strict supervision of the US army occupying the German state to this day. Bombs were on a lease from the US army. Doesn't sound so badass anymore?


Surely, even you cannot be so delusional.

BTW: This thread is about new aircrafts bought by Polish army so you can stop diverting from the subject.

@Spike31

The new submarines are capable to launch.nuclear weapons. Germany has 2000 tons Plutonium. 2nd largest stockpile in the world. We can build any nuclear weapon in a matter of days. Its called the Japan Option and a Work around the nuclear treaty. Or how Experte say, to be Just one screw away from the bomb.

As for your First comment, yup, because they were in repairs. You dont even have that. No Transport Planes, No subs.

As for Trump, He wants us to spend 2% GDP on defense. That would mean we would have 2nd largest Military in the west.

Occupied by American troops? You are occupied by americans, german and french troops. Its called NATO.

I'm not going to discuss this stock of nonsense.

Also =>

The equipment and the headcount is not enough. The US had an advantage in both and lost in Vietnam. Israel was at a disadvantage in both categories and won every single time.

Just a couple of examples, so I don't want any crap that I am off the subject.

@Rich Mazur

Yup, keep in mind that F-35 is outdated trash.

The Thing is, its slow, once its stealth is away, its dead. Germany could bust its stealth, so what makes one think Russia cant?

It does not matter. Nobody seriously thinks Poland will use them in the next 100 years. Without proof, it's all politics, posturing, and corruption - all starting at this cesspool aka the DC where they spend money faster than they can borrow it from China.

The way the swamp operates is this: A lot of military hardware even the DoD doesn't want is made all over the US to help the DC wh*res help bring bacon home under the rule of I roll your log, you roll mine. Poland, with that purchase, just became one of the swamp enablers.

Not true. You don't know the future.


What do you mean? Since 19th century sure, not before thought.


Depends what for you is always. Like roots of the current German state is in 1871. What do you mean always. For a very long time there were a constant stream of economic immigrants from various German statelets to the Kingdom of Poland. So Always is just a question of perspective.

Spot on Weimarer.
In fact the latest released on them is that their main gun does not even shoot straight.
Read about all the flaws the F-35 has here:

bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-01-30/f-35-s-gun-that-can-t-shoot-straight-adds-to-its-roster-of-flaws

@johnny reb

Yes, so we have Just one engine, a malfunctioning gun and its stealth already busted.

Germany declined to buy it but Poland applauds this ****.

This plane is trash

"Days" is a very long time when there are rockets with nuclear warheads flying your way.

I like people who think outside of the box - sometimes referred to as cynics.
Whatever the reason for this purchase, the last one on my list would be to make Poland be able to fight Russia. After the bribes and other such reasons, F-35 flyovers come to mind as a way to make Polish chests swell.

I also can't think of a war with Russia - I just don't see a reason why Russians would want to invade Poland