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Modern F-35 bought by Poland. Good decision?


Rich Mazur 4 | 3,362
10 Feb 2020 #61
I just don't see a reason why Russians would want to invade Poland

Neither do I, but Russia hating sells well here and in the US. Russia derangement syndrome on steroids, I guess.
OP pawian 175 | 13,554
10 Feb 2020 #62
I just don't see a reason why Russians would want to invade Poland

Guys living in pre-partition times also claimed it. The result is known. Thank you very much for your wise predictions. :):)
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,362
10 Feb 2020 #63
OK, so what is your prediction, my wiseman? Like why would Russia attack Poland, for example.
OP pawian 175 | 13,554
10 Feb 2020 #64
Let this question be my reply: Why did Russia attack Poland in partition times? When you answer it, you will know. :))
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,362
10 Feb 2020 #65
Why did Eve give Adam that apple? Because it was on sale?
Spike31 2 | 1,968
11 Feb 2020 #66
Only the strength is a guarantee of peace and weakness provokes the aggression.

Poland should become a country which would be completely unprofitable to attack due to a huge cost - financial cost, human life cost, political cost - of invasion.

Every PLN spend on military now will pay huge divident in the future in our difficult geographical and geopolitical position.
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #67
@Spike31
By buying crap Like F-35 you become a victim. You waste good money on trash.

Look, Germany developed a radar that can bust the F-35. Now tell me, If we can detect it, what makes you think Russia cant?
Miloslaw 6 | 2,771
11 Feb 2020 #68
Germany developed a radar that can bust the F-35

Not exactly.Read this;

popularmechanics.com/military/aviation/a29307410/radar-tracking-f-35/
delphiandomine 85 | 18,261
11 Feb 2020 #69
Every PLN spend on military now will pay huge divident in the future in our difficult geographical and geopolitical position.

Meanwhile life expectancy is actually falling in Poland. Every PLN spent on military matters is one less spent on schools and health.

It's amazing how alleged free marketeers are so keen on supporting the procurement of highly expensive military hardware without any sort of tendering process to achieve the best possible price.
Torq 32 | 2,916
11 Feb 2020 #70
Every PLN spent on military matters is one less spent on schools and health.

When Russian tanks start rolling through the Suwalki Gap, schools won't be our biggest concern. Also, foreign invasions are known to be rather bad for your health, so in a way investing in strong army is also investing in nation's health.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,261
11 Feb 2020 #71
When Russian tanks start rolling through the Suwalki Gap

From a military point of view, why would they run through there when Lithuania would offer far less resistance, especially as the Poles in the Vilnius Region can't be relied on to support the Lithuanian state? I'm not saying that they would support the Russian invasion, but I suspect they simply wouldn't get involved.
Torq 32 | 2,916
11 Feb 2020 #72
why would they run through there

To quickly cut off the Baltic States, and engage Wojsko Polskie at the same time, to stop us from helping the Baltics.

One thing you have to give to PiS is that they are very thorough in their strengthening of Polish military: they increased the number of professional soldiers and armed them with new, modern equipment, created Territorial Defence forces, and now at highschools all over Poland new military sections/classes are opened...

Military Classes

... Poland, considering our geopolitical situation, needs to have both strong, modern professional army, as well as territorial defence and trained reservists. PiS are messing up the judicial reform, they are clumsy in international diplomacy, they are alienating the better educated groups of society (teachers, doctors, judges), but at least in the military area, they are improving things.
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #73
@Miloslaw

Yes exactly, it shows that the F-35 is garbage. Germany can detect it and i have no doubts that Russia can detect it as well.

So whats left? A slow aircraft with american beta tech, garbage.
Miloslaw 6 | 2,771
11 Feb 2020 #74
Yes exactly, it shows that the F-35 is garbage

No it does not.

Germany can detect it

Did you not read the article?

In normal circumstances the plane is undetectable and is by far the most advanced fighter in the world.
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #75
@Miloslaw

Bullshit. It is made of matter. Matter always is detectable when it crosses radiowaves.

Its also not the most advanced. It lacks behind in evry field to F-22.

If it would be most advanced, USA would not sell it.

F-35 is the crap you sell to your 2nd grade allies. It has just one engine, is slow, has low quality and is cheap.

Undetectable, my ass. Even syria managed to badly damage an israeli one.

The good thing in poland buying this trash is, that we can test our new radar system on it.
Miloslaw 6 | 2,771
11 Feb 2020 #76
Bullshit. It is made of matter. Matter always is detectable when it crosses radiowaves.

You didn't read the article or if you did, then you didn't understand it.
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #77
@Miloslaw
I did read. Its bullshit though, written by someone who has no clue about tec.

The radar detected the aircraft by its radar signature. The transponder was used to see that the signal indeed can be connected to the meassured radar shadow.

Journalists are idiots who have no clue about such things. The journalist who did write that has the IQ below room temperatur.

Fact is, we can detect it. And i have no doubts any industrial nation can detect this piece of **** as well.

Beside that, its lame and slow. Just one engine. Well at least its cheap.
Spike31 2 | 1,968
11 Feb 2020 #78
Its bullshit though, written by someone who has no clue about tec.

The journalist who did write that has the IQ below room temperatur.

I guess it takes one to know one.

There's a piece of information about stealth aircrafts for you to think about: it doesn't mean that they are "invisible" but that they are much harder to detect - and from a much closer distance - than a regular jet fighters. Which gives the army who possess them an advantage on a modern battlefield.
Ironside 49 | 10,680
11 Feb 2020 #79
Poland doesn't need them, can afford them and so forth. Some other gear is needed and pronto. Unless you plan a military invasion in the near future. Besides they are not that good IF American army doesn't want them.
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #80
@Spike31

Not when its dead slow. Which the F-35 is. Its a lame duck that can barely hold Mach 1.6. Thats laughable.

The Eurofighter is 500 km/h faster than that.

Your rubbish about "invisible" made me laugh. You assume i think its invisble?

Dude seriously.

At daytime the F-35 cant be used, because its so slow that any given fighter jet can take it down.

It depends to fly at night and trust that its radar signature cant be detected. Which proved wrong. Since german radar detects it easily.

Since it has only one engine, its dead in the air.

In any scenario it lost in dog fights. Even the old F-16 can easily out maneuver it.

Recent tests show that it gets unstable at higher speed, when it reachs Mach 1.6.

Infact its so badly designed, that it can hold super sonic speeds only for short moments, or it breaks apart

defensenews.com/air/2019/06/12/supersonic-speeds-could-cause-big-problems-for-the-f-35s-stealth-coating/

The F-35 can only fly at supersonic speeds for short bursts of time before the risk of structural damage and loss of stealth capability

This entire plane is the most funny fighter jet ever developed

The New York Times call it

Inside America's Dysfunctional Trillion-Dollar Fighter-Jet Program

nytimes.com/2019/08/21/magazine/f35-joint-strike-fighter-program.html

But i guess its good enough for Poland.
Spike31 2 | 1,968
11 Feb 2020 #81
@Ironside

Polish Air Force knows better what do they need or don't need. And there was only a question whether to buy more newest version F-16 block 72 or F-35 since Eurofighter is a dead bird. They are going to buy a mature F-35 block 4 version with an early development faults eliminated.

It's not true that the Americans don't want them since are planning to buy over 1700 of them and only under 200 F-22's.
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #82
@Spike31

The F-35 was not good enough for us, but its good enough for you?

Germany wants 85 new fighter jets. The F-35 was kicked out of selection, because its trash. We want buy Eurofighter (which cost more) and a few F-18 Super hornest because the nuclear sharing treaty.

Hey how is LOT doing with their Boeing only fleet? :D

thefirstnews.com/article/lot-polish-airlines-pay-high-price-for-grounded-boeing-maxs-7166

LOT Polish Airlines pay high price for grounded Boeing MAXs

Dude the americans rip you guys over the table so fast, you think the friction heat is love.

You know what must anger you most? You spend good money, get trash for it...and you cant even brag with the equipment, since its called trash evrywhere. In all media.

And you know whats even worse?

If Germany had bought it, we demanded it to be build in Germany and Germany be implemented into the program.

Poland doesnt even get that. You pay and get the trash thrown on your door map.
Miloslaw 6 | 2,771
11 Feb 2020 #83
@Weimarer

Read it and weep.............

aviatia.net/eurofighter-vs-f35/
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #84
@Miloslaw
Why should i weep? Because Poland spends it money on trash? Not my tax money
Miloslaw 6 | 2,771
11 Feb 2020 #85
Because Poland spends it money on trash?

Because it is not trash.
Just different.
The RAF will be using F35's and Typhoons.
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #86
@Miloslaw

Well, we will be using Typhoons and few F18 until our next gen jet is ready.

The F-35 is too slow for us.

The production quality is trash.

Btw will they be produced in poland?

Germany would demand to be implemented in production in such a contract. Dont know If Poland plays on Same Level.
Miloslaw 6 | 2,771
11 Feb 2020 #87
The F-35 is too slow for us.

You are completely missing the point.
This plane is so deadly that it does not need speed.
No, the only reason the Germans won't buy it is because they wanted to protect their own aerospace industry.
Weimarer 8 | 415
11 Feb 2020 #88
@Miloslaw

Its not deadly. Its trash. We want an interceptor. What we get with that Trash? If an enemy aircraft enters our airspace we could rather send a Cessna. This **** can only reach mach 1.6. it cant hold Supersonic speeds for long or risks to break apart.

Easy question, our demand is mach 1,9 and the aircraft must be able to hold it constantly. Can it do that? Yes? No? Eurofighter can. F-18 can as well.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,362
11 Feb 2020 #89
OK, boys, are you close to deciding whose brother is bigger?

Before I bought my Beretta, I defined the threat. That logic should apply here, too. Who is the threat? Russia? Really? And why would Russia want to attack Poland? The only country that could pose a military threat to Russia is the US - the country so corrupt and unwilling to win wars that it feeds its real enemy - China - with the boatloads of cash to pay for the products that used to be made at home, and allows its spies into the US by the thousands. I mentioned this here not to deflect the conversation, but to show you the bs you are discussing here like some little boys in the school yard.

Bottom line: define the threat before you go shopping. And what you or your new friends, the US, is doing about or with that threat.

If an enemy aircraft enters our airspace we could rather send a Cessna

Who is that enemy? Russia? That war would last 20 minutes and you would lose before you could dial 911. Notwithstanding the fact that Russia would gain nothing, but a lot of Muslims on welfare.
Miloslaw 6 | 2,771
11 Feb 2020 #90
If an enemy aircraft enters our airspace we could rather send a Cessna.

From what I have read about the current state of the German Air Force, that is about all you have that can fly........... :-)


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