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Modern F-35 bought by Poland. Good decision?


Vesko Vukovic 1 | 245
17 Feb 2020 #241
flightglobal.com/boeing-unveils-updated-f/a-xx-sixth-gen-fighter-concept/109292.article

There are at least three reasons why this thing will never enter service.

1. The US is broke and can't even fund existing programs.

2. High-tech stealth planes have this nasty habit of turning out to be piles of manure (e.g. F-22, F-35).

3. The era of manned combat aircraft is over. Drones are much cheaper and more practical.

"Stealth" planes are only stealthy when modern equipment is used.

warhistoryonline.com/instant-articles/serbs-shot-down-invisible-f-117.html/

The F-117 that was shot down in Serbia may have been stealthy in X band, but on the old L band Soviet radar from the 50's, its reflection was bigger than Madeleine Albright's fat a$$. What those old radars lack in precision is made up for by very large and powerful missiles with shrapnel that shreds the super-high-tech stealth "skin" into confetti.
Velund 1 | 391
17 Feb 2020 #242
Drones are much cheaper and more practical.

Yes, if used against some third world country. Use of "global coverage" drones against country that already have means to destroy or damage comm/control satellites will be problematic.

This does not make F-35 purchase by Poland more reasonable, though. ;)
johnny reb 23 | 4,467
17 Feb 2020 #243
country that already have means to destroy or damage comm/control satellites will be problematic.

This is true.
I was reading that one of America's billion dollar satellites is being shadowed by two Soviet space craft.
I found that very disturbing.
What hasn't been mentioned here though is those F-35's can be tricked out with lots of different awesome weapons.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,752
17 Feb 2020 #244
can be tricked out with lots of different awesome weapons.

....which is a total waste since the US is arming China and Europe is arming Russia by the boatloads of money being sent there.

At the very best, the US needs those F-35's in another police action against a minor player like Iraq while defenseless against civilians like Taliban.
Weimarer 10 | 620
17 Feb 2020 #245
@Velund

It also gives Germany the ability to test our new passive radar on it easily.
Velund 1 | 391
17 Feb 2020 #246
... unless this F-35 will not be used just like Javelins is used by Ukraine - storage in a well guarded warehouse only, without any usage in the field allowed. ;)
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,752
17 Feb 2020 #247
This is approaching the twilight zone....Poland's decision to buy some F-35's is discussed here by the Russians, Germans, Serbs, Brits but not the the Poles who will have to pay for them, keep them running and maybe even use them. Weird.
Velund 1 | 391
17 Feb 2020 #248
Poles (according to earlier posts to this thread) already very busy looking for nukes to load on their new wunderwaffe, and deciding what is first - duty or pleasure (you should know that joke). ;) Nobody take care to calculate total cost of ownership yet.

I can only wish good luck to polish pilots, who have to fly on that super high-tech coffins and must believe that they are invisible mans. ;)
johnny reb 23 | 4,467
17 Feb 2020 #249
is discussed here by the Russians, Germans, Serbs, Brits but not the the Poles

I noticed that too, Rich.
The Polish members have had little input in this thread while listening to the provoking wishful thinking that their potential enemies radar systems can detect the F-35's stealth.

The F-35 is packed with radar jamming equipment not to mention the satellites above that can jam those S-400 missile installations.
No one knows as they have never been tested under combat conditions so it boils down to pure provoking banter.
Why is this ?
Poland is buying these F-35's for defensive measures to protect Poland's sovereignty, not bully their neighbors so why do their neighbors insist on bullying Poland with their Commie b.s. insulting propaganda ?

I suggest this thread be closed.
Lenka 3 | 1,952
17 Feb 2020 #250
The funny thing is that mamy people question the deal ( is that the most needed equipment, the prize etc.) but here it comes to like almost personal offence that Poland dared to choose something else...Weird
johnny reb 23 | 4,467
17 Feb 2020 #251
Exactly, how dare Poland think for themselves, we want dominance over them.
Poland should bow to Germany and do it Germany's way so Poland can be, "one of our common wealth's".
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,752
17 Feb 2020 #252
That fake concern coming from a country that ran out of time to erase Poland is getting on my nerves.
OP pawian 170 | 11,264
17 Feb 2020 #253
Poland's decision to buy some F-35's is discussed here by the Russians, Germans, Serbs, Brits but not the the Poles

Yes, I am sorry. I started the thread, voiced my opinion and then only read opinions by other participants, not trying to argue with them or convince they need to change their mind etc. That must be this unusual culture and good manners of mine. I probably learnt them from having such a frequent contact with the posh British style of life, especially featured in this forum by British posters.

Well, my opinion remains the same as it was: I still would like to see more F-16s instead. Then they could display them all at a time, lining the airfield in those long rows. The view would be amazing.

Or elephant walk!

Check it out:





Rich Mazur 4 | 3,752
17 Feb 2020 #254
Yes, I am sorry.

Why would you be sorry? It's a good subject and affecting the US the most - right after Poland. I was surprised that I didn't see any posts from Poland. Instead, I read a lot of insults about F-35 from the bystanders with no stake in the deal.
OP pawian 170 | 11,264
17 Feb 2020 #255
I was surprised that I didn't see any posts from Poland.

I didn`t take part in discussing technical characteristics coz I had already lost touch with that advanced technology which is made now. I have too little knowledge and prefer to depend on others. I am an expert in WW2 and Cold War planes and other weaponry but those modern machines scare me. They are so inhuman. One day they will fly or ride and take part in combat on their own, without human operators. You know, like machines in Terminator films. Or Matrix.
Weimarer 10 | 620
17 Feb 2020 #256
@johnny reb

Our radar cant be jammed. It does not emitt any signals. It meassures the natural radiowaves and how an object that moves through them influences them. Once the F-35 is detected, its dead, since it is incredible slow for a fighter jet.

We place great value in the polish F-35 jets, since we can test our stuff on them.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,752
17 Feb 2020 #257
I didn`t take part in discussing technical characteristics

Tech specs are important but not critical. As I posted earlier, we had the specs in Vietnam and the guys breathing through bamboo sticks while in the swamp kicked the crap out of the greatest army in the universe.

That same army can't finish off Taliban today. Why? Because that great army is directed by lawyers and the career opportunists looking for nice cushy jobs within the military swamp when they retire. Or CNN.
Weimarer 10 | 620
17 Feb 2020 #258
@Torq
We invited dumbfuck americans to berlin airshow to present their F-35 and faked interest. They invested millions to fly here, only to see we tricked them and placed our mew radar right next them. They did not fly at the show. All the efforts for being mocked.

And when they left, we did hide the radar to capture the data.

When that junk is placed in poland we can gain more test data. We have freedom of movement in the EU. There is nothing you can do from stopping us to do that
johnny reb 23 | 4,467
17 Feb 2020 #259
One day they will fly or ride and take part in combat on their own, without human operators.

The United States Air Force already have them pawian but I didn't want to pop Cocky's cork.
(I think I have met this kid at the Smugglers Irish Pub when I was in Germany)
They are build so strong that they can take unbelievable G forces (mach 3 plus) that a man could not begin to withstand.
They are also tricked out with high powered lazers that can turn a tornado fighter jet into a gob of goo instantly.
They were designed to melt the S-400 missile sites which have been found to be very effective.
The missile never has time to get off the ground.
Like I said, the U.S. never lets their best weaponry out for the world to see.
What they don't know is best.
OP pawian 170 | 11,264
17 Feb 2020 #260
Like I said, the U.S. never lets their best weaponry out for the world to see.

You mean this?:



Joker 1 | 1,552
17 Feb 2020 #261
We

we

You act like you think youre someone special posting this rubbish on a public forum, in fact, there is no "we" its just "you" trolling away like a jealous git.. lol

Go for it Adolph start building your planes. You will just get your asses whooped again and again like in the previous 2 World Wars you dickheads started. Good idea! Do us the favor, back out of NATO as well, were sick and tired of paying and protecting you.
Weimarer 10 | 620
17 Feb 2020 #262
@Joker

Says someone coming from a country that has no running hot water.

Some history lesson, WW I was not started from Germany.

Im not trolling, we treat USA like the **** it is. The F35 stunt we did was amazing.

berliner-kurier.de/berlin/brandenburg/die-spione-vom-ponyhof-so-enttarnten-deutsche-spezialisten-die-us-tarnkappenbomber-33263472

Invite the americans and then bust them openly and made it public. Was pure gold.

With Poland will be easier though. Once the, we can test our radar better.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,752
17 Feb 2020 #263
Pawian, you like history. Try to imagine the US sending its manufacturing to Germany and Japan in 1937 to the point that nothing electronic could be build without their materials and parts. Does the word "insane" come to mind?

That is the US today.
Just as the USSR spent itself into a grave, we are doing the same, but always looking for a new enemy because that is how the swamp gets fatter.
Weimarer 10 | 620
17 Feb 2020 #264
@Rich Mazur
USA excuted noone. Only the uppermost, worthless politic class.

All the SS officers, judges and highest command structure was left intact and stayed basicly in office.

That said, what venom? We are an independend nation. Do you beg for gratitude? Thats pathetic.

Look, you offer a jet, that is garbage and you react kinda pissed, because Germany dismisses it when you offered it.

Germany is in NATO, Poland is in Nato. We see our poor eastern neighbor buying it and we see how USA pulls them over the table.

Its our freedom to mock their decission.

Why so angry? You can be happy you found a dumb one who buys that nonfunctional aircraft.

Btw, Lockheed Martin tries a 3rd attempt so Germany at least buys 20 of it. And they lowered price to 75 million per unit. Thats 50 million lower than what Poland pays.

Lets pretend we say yes, how will Poland see that price difference?

It appears USA ripped poland off.
johnny reb 23 | 4,467
17 Feb 2020 #265
I did a practica there. I dont care what you send.

Good, they will be aware of who you are then and since we have your permission to give them a call and have them take a look at your posts here on the Polish forum.

Anything other nice names you would like to call them before they are contacted ?

I have no respect for Poland.

One more reason you should not be posting here.
Hopefully the Mods will see it that way too and suspend your account permanently.
You give your country a bad name.
Weimarer 10 | 620
17 Feb 2020 #266
@johnny reb
You ride a dead horse, nothing of what i say is relevant for them.

I say nothing that would be illegal. I quote exactly what AfD says even in parliament. So stop to bore me. I know the law very well regarding that. Why you think i react so bold on your empty threats?

That said, you should stick to the topic, its F 35, not me.

Poland can use this aircraft only in slave missions in Iraq. It can only operate in areas with no airforce. Its doubtful if it could work against Iran, so i assume it will be for parades only.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,752
17 Feb 2020 #267
Look, you offer a jet, that is garbage and you react kinda pissed,

Do you want me to count the number of times you wrote "garbage" or "trash" in this thread? Do you think we are that stupid not to get it after the first one hundred?

Lets pretend we say yes, how will Poland see that price difference?

And what fu*cking business is this of yours as a German? At least I bitc* about things that have a direct and immediate impact on me. Like the fact that I have to pay more to protect your as*es because you spend less.

Please, don't tell me that the US protecting Germany is good for the US. We do this because we are sick of the Euro morons starting sh*it we have to finish and clean up.

But for the US and those trashy F's, you, morons, didn't start WW3 in 1960 when enough young idiots became available for another march east.
Weimarer 10 | 620
17 Feb 2020 #268
@Rich Mazur
Idk how you explain your "special" friend poland that they must pay 125 million per unit, while you dropped the offer for Germany to 75 million per unit. Why you offer us to participate in the program, but poland not?
johnny reb 23 | 4,467
17 Feb 2020 #269
I already told you, Poland gets brand new shiny ones and you were offered the old used junk ones.

not me.

So you are a fire fighter in Weimar and not a police officer ?
When you hear those Polish F-35's causing sonic booms over your house let us know.
I know the Tornado goes 200 miles per hour faster than the F-35's but the F-35's still break the sound barrier to break the windows out of your house when they are doing training practice to lock onto those S-400 sites.
Weimarer 10 | 620
17 Feb 2020 #270
@johnny reb

No, Germany even gets offered that those are partial build in Germany. USA wants us to have them. But we dont want them.

Poland wants them to act as puppy of america and accepted the high price.

And no, polish jets dont enter german airspace.


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