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EU confirms it will take action against Poland over court reforms


mafketis 16 | 6,322    
10 Dec 2017  #151
Bc they made her. Kaczynski is the man in charge

Don't you remember the election campaign in 2015 when JK was in hiding and there were noises about him retiring and not filling any kind of role in a new-PiS government? HA HA HA HA!!! Suckers!

He owes having a government to her and has not shown one iota of public gratitude. What a nasty littel user he is.
delphiandomine 87 | 16,888    
10 Dec 2017  #152
also morawiecki was picked so he can talk some sense into the eu

What makes you think that a minor politician with no support base in his own party is going to influence the EU?

Morawiecki is a political lightweight, and unlikely to do anything except give powerpoint-assisted interviews.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,925    
11 Dec 2017  #153
What a nasty littel user he is.

He's the man behind the scenes who controls pis. They respond to Kaczynski... he's their boss..

Morawiecki is a political lightweight

Morawiecki use to work under Tusk and was a finance minister before this - one of the most important roles in PL government. prove how much you know... besides, he's trying to 're-christianize' Europe and remind them of their screw up with the migrants and bring back 'values' that they lost. That's good enough for me. I doubt they'll listen to him anyway since merkel is so stuck into forcing other country's to share the burden of her mistake

As long as we have zero Islamic terror attacks and our record is tainted, Idc who is in charge
OP Atch 16 | 2,647    
11 Dec 2017  #154
It's quite possible to have a country that's both Christian and at the same time a liberal democracy, with a Muslim population and zero Islamic terror attacks. Ireland has taken refugees from Muslim countries for decades now and we've never had an Islamic terror attack (God between us and all harm, to use the old Irish phrase). In fact Ireland is one of the safest countries in Europe, (officially safer than Poland). It's not the presence of a Muslim population that causes Islamic fundamentalist terrorist attacks, it's a nation's involvement in international affairs and in particular their military alliances. You don't have to be a right wing, authoritarian regime to protect yourself from Islamic terror attacks.
SigSauer 2 | 443    
11 Dec 2017  #155
@Atch

I have heard some very distasteful things on this board. However, you giving cover to Islamic terrorists who target and kill innocent people in the West, based on the foreign policy interests of those respective governments, is honestly stomach turning. You literally just spouted the SAME justification that the Islamists do for carrying out their attacks on European streets. Atch, you should be ashamed of yourself for what you just said.
OP Atch 16 | 2,647    
11 Dec 2017  #156
Don't be silly. Acts of terrorism that kill innocent civilians are despicable regardless of who is perpetrating them. However terrorism has its roots in politics and that's a fact. Religion is frequently used as an excuse for terrorist acts but politics is the reason. In Islamic states where the two are one it's hard to make that distinction but when Islamic terrorists attack the west it has nothing to do with religion, it's politics.
mafketis 16 | 6,322    
11 Dec 2017  #157
the politics are an excuse, the profile of the western european islamic terrorist is pretty obvious by now and the steps are as set as a tango

1. waste educational opportunities while following thug/gang culture while despising the mainstream culture and your parents' culture
2. wake up to terrible life options after wasting so much time and so many opportunities
3. turn to religion, specifically the religion of your parents that you've ignored/belitted and know almost nothing about
4. meet an imam who senses your rage and desire to do violence and offers to give your death meaning
5. allahu akbar (boooooom!)

The politics wouldn't mean anything without the violent narcissistic rage and cultural alienation
Sparks11 - | 338    
11 Dec 2017  #158
According to that logic America would be justified in sending in the SEALs and Rangers to wreak havoc on any civilian population of whose government it has a dispute.
OP Atch 16 | 2,647    
11 Dec 2017  #159
The politics wouldn't mean anything without the violent narcissistic rage and cultural alienation

Yes but that's also basically politics too, or rather social conditions, because social conditions arise as a result of government policy. There's really two issues here. The people who fund Islamic terror and the fools who do the dirty work and carry out the attacks. Their motives are rather different.
mafketis 16 | 6,322    
11 Dec 2017  #160
Getting back to court reforms, a shocking story on onet yesterday on Ziobro's personal jihad against Dariusz Dudek, the doctor he accuses (with no evidence whatsoever) of killing his father.

Although Dudek was cleared of any wrongdoing Ziobro has 5 (five!) investigations against him in what is clearly a personal vendetta.
How can anyone who cares about the rule of law of justice support this agenda? This is third world revenge politics and what everybody supporting PiS is supporting.

wiadomosci.onet.pl/tylko-w-onecie/skazany-na-wyrok-jak-polskie-panstwo-osacza-lekarza-ktory-leczyl-ojca-zbigniewa/wjg4yg3
Dougpol1 26 | 2,160    
11 Dec 2017  #161
court reforms

Cough. Shouldn't this be on the thread "PIS..at last Poland has the governmnet it always wanted.."? :))

If Ziobro was British he would need round the clock armed guards to stop the baying mob.
OP Atch 16 | 2,647    
11 Dec 2017  #162
This is third world revenge politics

Of course. The reforms are not about ensuring justice for the ordinary man in the street and a fair court system. They are part of a purge in the good old Stalinist tradition. The politicization of the judiciary ensures that PIS can pursue their various vendettas. Tusk will definitely be in their sights. When he returns to Poland after his EU role finishes, he will be charged regarding Smolensk (or if not that, anything else they can trump up), found guilty and imprisoned. That's my belief. Poland is going to hell in a hand-basket and by the time it gets there it will be far too late for the electorate to do anything about it.
mafketis 16 | 6,322    
11 Dec 2017  #163
When he returns to Poland after his EU role finishes, he will be charged regarding Smolensk

not so sure about that right now, I think they'll go after him but not about Smolensk, JK is clearly starting to disinvest and disassociate himself from the public movement and one newspaper is reporting that Macierewicz might be on his way out (okay the newspaper is fakt, but home springs eternal....).

The smolensk crazies have been given massive resources and extremely wide field to maneuver on and what have they produced? bupkis.

I think they'll go after him for money and/or treason for doing his job i brussels
OP Atch 16 | 2,647    
11 Dec 2017  #164
I find it really astonishing that people don't seem to see where this is heading. When you take into account the fact that all the military top brass were replaced almost overnight with PIS supporters, shortly after they came to power, that should give a clue. Firstly this kind of overnight change doesn't happen in democracies and secondly once a new government essentially takes over the army and the courts..........add to that JK saying that he expects PIS to remain in power for twenty years. He didn't say HOW that's to be achieved, he didn't say it will be done through elections. Oh but wait, it will, because we also have 'electoral reforms' about to be enacted which also take the form of sacking everybody and replacing them.
SigSauer 2 | 443    
11 Dec 2017  #165
@Atch

Disingenuous, dishonest, and just --- wrong. Denmark, Sweden, and Finland, when was the last time they invaded a Middle Eastern country? So far as I can tell, all they did was open their country to people who are in need, the people you're all advocating they take, and in return for their hospitality and very generous social welfare benefits, they are experiencing terror. Finland, a country who is neutral and bothers NO ONE. You took one pretty shameful remark, and decided to double down........Brilliant.
Dougpol1 26 | 2,160    
11 Dec 2017  #166
this kind of overnight change doesn't happen in democracies

That's OK though Atch. These democratic reverses don't seem to matter anymore, to people's way of thinking. A sizeable proportion of the population don't want to think for themselves, but prefer to be dictated to. Most Poles who can do, would seemingly prefer to live in other countries anyway, rather than their own. And others wonder why.
OP Atch 16 | 2,647    
11 Dec 2017  #167
Denmark, Sweden, and Finland, when was the last time they invaded a Middle Eastern country?

The level of terrorist attacks in those countries is very low. However due to their immigration policies, those countries have left themselves open to being used as a base for extremists. In any case neither attacker in the Finland or Sweden incidents fitted the bill of religious extremism, one was an economic migrant and the other a rejected asylum seeker, both angry people with an axe to grind.

This thread is about court reform so if you want to carry on the discussion you'd better do it in off-topic or another more suitable place.
cms 9 | 1,290    
11 Dec 2017  #168
Can't you stop spamming every thread with stuff about migrants ? This is about court reform - a far more serious and current issue for Poland. There are plenty of other threads to talk about the disease ridden barbarians.
mafketis 16 | 6,322    
11 Dec 2017  #169
Yes, Ziobro's flagrant abuse of the justice system under his control to persecute a private individual who's done nothing wrong stinks of the worst of the PRL. Oppose it or own it.
WielkiPolak 58 | 1,052    
11 Dec 2017  #170
Poland is going to hell in a hand-basket and by the time it gets there it will be far too late for the electorate to do anything about it.

Oh how little you know Atch. Then again, it's people who think like you that gives corrupt criminals in PO, who don't give two sh-ts about Poland, some hope of re-election.

Yes, why try and clear up the mess and rid the country of corruption and wrong-doing? We'd much prefer a bunch of corrupt guys in suits who eat octopus in restaurants, because at least Germany and the EU in general, will like us.

This whole case with Gronkiewicz-Waltz, is basically PO on a micro scale.
mafketis 16 | 6,322    
11 Dec 2017  #171
This whole case with Gronkiewicz-Waltz, is basically PO on a micro scale.

Then Ziobro's persecution of Dariusz Dudek is PiS on a micro scale?
gumishu 11 | 4,850    
11 Dec 2017  #172
I find it really astonishing that people don't seem to see where this is heading.

I know where this is heading actually - we are going to conquer Europe, Russia and then the whole world - it's pretty obvious isn't it ?

Then Ziobro's persecution of Dariusz Dudek is PiS on a micro scale?

I don't know the case of Mr Dudek, but if it is as onerous as you claim it to be where are other instances of such behaviour of PiS, to give you a backdrop there have been numerous corruption and similar scandals with PO or allies in main roles, so comm'on please do match it with the wrongdoings of PiS
mafketis 16 | 6,322    
11 Dec 2017  #173
but if it is as onerous as you claim it to be where are other instances of such behaviour of PiS

There is a link in #160 and what about the smolensk witch hunt or szyszko's anti-tree campaign, the destruction of pride of poland, the forester's daughter's envelope, the current low status of Poland vis a vis European institutions etc
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,925    
11 Dec 2017  #174
We finally have a government that has balls and listens to it's people. I recently even heard a pl radio station compare pis policies and kaczynski to pilsudzki

Poles don't want to share their land and want the country homogenous plain and simple. Israel.amd Japan can do it and that's what we're choosing. We had enough of that with partitions, ww2, and now eu attacks. Hordes of young uneducated Muslim economic migrants who break laws to gdt in and continue to in the country theyre have plenty of other places they can go that will welcome them were not one of those. Ireland isn't Poland we weren't cucked into changing our gay marriage laws for one. This is a decision for polish citizens and should be held via referendum like Hungary where over 90% didn't want migrants. That gives it legal.authprity like trumps election and brexit.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,925    
11 Dec 2017  #175
@mafketis

Were happy with Poland the way it is. We clearly dont care what eu thinks of our institutions. Poland has always been unique and although friendly with western Europe we've never rushed to be exactly like them. For one Poland never had colonies and poles mindset is different. Poles are closest and more similar Hungarians Lithuanian etc in their worldview economics foreign policies and history
mafketis 16 | 6,322    
11 Dec 2017  #176
Were happy with Poland the way it is. We clearly dont care what eu thinks of our institutions

So your'e cool with the government officials using public resources to pursue private vendettas agqainst individuals after they have been found not guilty? (see link at #160)
Dougpol1 26 | 2,160    
11 Dec 2017  #177
Were happy with Poland the way it is

Tut-tut. It's already been explained to you that you don't live here. Those of us who do are here to tell you that it is far from alright as it is.
OP Atch 16 | 2,647    
11 Dec 2017  #178
Ireland isn't Poland we weren't cucked into changing our gay marriage laws for one. This is a decision for polish citizens and should be held via referendum l

I feel duty bound to point out that we had a referendum in Ireland. Unlike Poland, the Irish constitution cannot be changed without the consent of the people. In Ireland for example you couldn't have the kind of changes being proposed to the judicial system in Poland.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,925    
11 Dec 2017  #179
@Dougpol1

Unlike you I am q polish citizen. These things concern polish citizens so even if i didn't live in Poland, even though ive explained I own property n pl and pay taxes and have two homes - I spent a significant amount of time each year in Poland and going to prolly stay till after nye. My stake alone just by citizenship is greater than yours. Furthermore, the majority of poles reject migrants, pis is the most popular party, and the majority of poles are conservative and the majority are against gay marriage, migration from 3rd world, etc. If you wish to make a change get your citizenship and vote. Otherwise you have no stake aside from being a foreign resident working in the country.

That's fine Ireland chose to have gay marriage, Poland is choosing not to. We're also choosing not to bring in migrants. The eu can push us all they want but we have more leverage and they know it. Many analysts are saying a polexit would be more significant bc of its symbolism than brexit. We are pursuing a policy of.maintaining a homogenous traditional country where Christ has been officially made king. We are choosing a course like Japan Israel and any other number of countries with strict citizenship lqws.
mafketis 16 | 6,322    
11 Dec 2017  #180
I own property n pl and pay taxes and have two homes

And what if some PiS government guy decides he wants it? What will you do without the rule of law on your side?



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