Decoded talks inside Poland's president's plane are released in Internet

No, not yet at all. We need to know the contents of the other boxes before saying anything for certain - I'm actually wondering why they haven't been released yet.

Delph, do you believe that official authorities have never told a lie?? That's the way you come across sometimes, though I guess you don't mean it this way.

Feet dragging is a notoriously cumbersome process when you need to check the story carefully ;) ;)

It would be nearly impossible in this case - because by implication, it means that Lech Kaczynski's political stooges are involved in a cover up.

The fact that Jaroslaw Kaczynski (so far) hasn't been ranting about the process is all I need to know really.

The only thing I don't understand - why even attempt the landing in the first place? An automated landing is one thing, but to attempt such a risky landing with so many VIP's on board - jeez.

Had they had any doubts, they should have taken off the day after Tusk did and check in to a hotel there. Simple!

Most disasters are a combination of events...this one began with an aircraft taking off late , with no time to divert to anonther landing site without missing the ceremony...the pressure was on them from the start....

Well, their punctuality left a LOT to be desired. Most delegations are really punctual and lateness doesn't even cross their mind. I refuse to believe that they would have hashed it together at the last minute, a 70-year anniversary? Nah, I don't buy it!

Apparently they didn't have the weather, NOTAMs, or the most recent plates for Smolensk... Seems like lack of preparation to me...

It seems untenable/unfeasible to me ;)

Reading the other accident report, it doesn't seem too unfeasible to me.

Ever glossed up a report, convex? What kind of a pilot ignores multiple warnings and his own TAWS system? What kind of pilot wouldn't maintain a higher altitude to be sure? Fog is not new and doesn't pose problems for experienced pilots.

The kind of pilot that has the boss stood beside him...and the president of his country a few seats further back..Here was a chance to go down in history as the pilot that screwed up an important ceremony for Poland by chickening out of a tricky landing...or to go a bit lower than was safe in order to complete the mission and emerge a hero...

Its not all all uncommon for pilots to want to please the boss when he is on board , and there have been many incidents due to this situation...

There are many ways to please the boss ;) ;)

What 'hero' brushes shoulders with pure idiocy and risks harm to others in such a fashion?

Well , of course he thought he was going to get away with it...There was every chance that any small gap in the clouds might give them a glimpse of that runway and enable them to put the aircraft down safely...

I am guessing that like the crash of the casa aircraft the crew were peering intently out of the windows desperate for that sight of the runway , and did not take as much notice as they should have as to how low they were actually flying...They were looking out of the window and not at the instruments that would have revealed how dangerously low they were....

By the time they hit the first tree it was beyond saving ... the aircraft was still decending , a split second later they lost half a wing and the aircraft rolled over into the ground.....

Wildrover, my friend, that first part was like an acid-trip justification ;) ;) Like sth John Lennon would have said to Paul McCartney if a pilot ;)

The system told them everything, they didn't need to look outside.

Can you show the pictures of that happening? I'd be glad to look at them.

Here is another report of that casa crash...spookily similar to the Smolensk crash don,t you think....these pilots were trained no doubt by the same instructers that the Smolensk crew were....

The crash of the CASA C-295 is being blamed on pilot error. According to the official report, visibility was low and the pilot likely tried to land by sight. In the first landing attempt, the ILS landing system, which directs pilots to the landing strip, malfunctioned. During the second landing attempt, the pilot tried to land by sight and did not realize he was flying too low. The plane clipped trees and fell apart.

Almost all hero's, only after they get away with it ;)

Plenty actually, unfortunately. It happens nearly every single day. People descending below decision height to get down. There are various reasons why it happen, almost always pilot error.


And sadly, everyone has been in that position. Thank god I fly privately and don't have anything other than personal pressure to put the plane down. My personal minimums are pretty high. I always leave with plenty of time to put down the plane and rent a car. Unfortunately, when someone else is paying, the pressure is on...

Reports of the crash were out before it even allegedly happened. There is net coverage of this. Sth like what BBC did on 9/11. Misinformation has been spread from the start.

I remember flying in Russia with some friends in a light aircraft.....When we returned to the airfield we had taken off from we found a real pea souper , could not see a thing..!

My friend took it down as low as was safe , but we still could not see any ground...Diverting to another airfield meant we would have been a long way from our car...The temptation to go just a bit lower in order to spot that runway was there , but in the end we decided that being a long way from our car was better than having our heads a long way from our asses..!

I'm with Colonel Piotr £ukasiewicz on this one. The matter is inconclusive and, at first glance, fabricated.

I am trying really hard here to see your point of view Seanus , but i honestly can,t see anything to suggest that this was anything other than a tragic accident caused by a combination of human errors...all of them sadly , Polish ones...

thenews.pl/national/artykul132787_smolensk-crash-transcripts-inconclusive.html then read this.
Laymen simply cannot make clear statements based on fodder they are fed. Aviation authorities need to corroborate these recent releases with more evidence. Nobody is in a position to say either way. So, doing what I do, I question the evidence rather than defensively tow any official BS line.

There was a story run on bogus reporting where sb got wind of the story before the plane had even come down.

but it's true.. what don't you buy?? they were late, that is all there is to it..


plenty.. why is this unbelievable to you?


and they obviously ignored the warnings.. the TAWS went of so many times..

According to the RUSSIAN transcripts.

Lets not forget the Russians seized these black boxes before any Polish investigators were around. The Russians also made sure nobody could take pictures or videos of the crash site shortly after the plane crashed. We all know what happened to the guy who took that video of the crash site shortly after the crash.

So WHY did the guy who took that controversial video of the Polish crash site have to die??? Does anyone know?

got link?

A crew of nearly 100 would surely have planned their journey in advance. The fact is that fog can be easily negotiated by experienced pilots and they didn't need to rush the plane down.

Landing the plane was not a heroic act when they had a bailout option.

I agree, they ignored them for some unknown reason. He would have understood the command 'pull up'. He simply had to approach the runway at a higher angle of descent. The former KKK leader, David Duke, raised the point about the impact with the trees. I really can't comment on this but he was saying that clipping the tree wouldn't have irreperably damaged the wing. The 'oh kur*a' shouts from the cockpit would tend to suggest the pilots had another point of view ;) ;)

They have a record of sloppiness. Whether you choose to accept that or not is irrelevant. Fog is not easily negotiated by flight crews under pressure to land with strange configurations.


Seriously Seanus? Seriously? Are you being so sarcastic that it just went over my head?

Bear in mind that they already have done - it's just the data from the other black boxes haven't been released yet. The contents of the Polish box will be very interesting - as it's Polish built and designed and completely unreadable to Russians.


Yes, that old story, which originated from a Chechen website - hardly the bastion of impartial reporting about Russia!

The real question should be WHY do people keep believing one report from a dodgy website as somehow being "fact"? I mean - if I publish that Jaroslaw Kaczynski has been seen in the presence of young boys in a gay sauna club, it's not fact, even if I publish it.


No, perhaps not. But slamming into more trees a few split seconds later will tend to destroy wings. The first tree is really a red herring - it was the later trees that did the serious damage.

Perhaps the real conspiracy theory here is why the Polish Air Force didn't do anything about their training after the previous accent.

See I knew it!!!!! There's a proof here!

Believe me...hitting trees of any size with an aluminium wing at 180 mph is going to result in damage , and its not going to take a very thick tree to rip the wing in half... The wings are made to take the stresses of flying and landing , not high speed contact with ground objects....