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Poland has accepted over a million Ukrainian refugees. Why does the EU keep telling propaganda about Poland?

Marsupial - | 886
11 Jul 2017 #61
Still the whole uki nazi thing is a worry. They don't seem to realise that germans have long ago moved on and that being a dumb nazi living next to russia has an unbelivable negative result. Now, being sandwiched between poland and russia and being a dumb nazi is even worse. Just sayin.
11 Jul 2017 #62
jgrabner : totally agree.
"I can understand the post-colonial guilt feelings of some European elites"

The same goes for Turkey. It used to have a huge empire and they are still proud of it !
They do not care if they put millions into slavery and kille thousands.

The same goes for arabs with their empire, slavery and slaughter, force conversion.
Western colony is a thing of the past, same goes for Turkish and arab empire.
We should imitate the arab and refused their kind in our territory.
Mass immigration is madness and it will bring the downfall to all Europe even Poland.

When western Europe will be a caliphate they will attack Poland and history will repeat itself.
Instead of nazism, communism it is radical islam that is looming in the future.
Thats the next totalitarist state right into the heart of Europe. In 100 years some state in Europe will have huge muslim majority.
Our grand children who want to be atheist or christians or jews will have very hard time !
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
11 Jul 2017 #63
At least though Ukrainians share a similar Slavic heritage with the Poles.
Dirk diggler 10 | 4,643
11 Jul 2017 #64

Exactly. Aside from Jordan and Lebanon which are far poorer than many other gulf states they aren't taking in their fair share by far. Yet no one is forcing them to take in migrants but they want to fine poland czechy and Hungary? This is utter lunacy! Actually trump is one of the few politicians who publicly said The gulf states should be the ones taking these migrants in. The Saudis cite security risks and who can blame them. Only the blind can't see what the migrant hordes have done to Germany France Sweden Belgium and anywhere they go. Most the migrants coming from m.e. are Sunni and not even the Saudis want em lol. They're smart enough to realize the outcome. Even turkey has now seen an uptick in terrorist attacks since the migrant crisis.

This isn't Poland's problem. We didn't cause any migrant crisis nor did we invite migrants like Merkel did. They're just mad because now they realize their mistake and want to spread it out. If the migrants were so great and wonderful, so hard working and such a benefit, they'd want to keep them in their own lands rather than criticize others for not taking them in. Germany or even uk didnt ask any other countries to spread around all the Romanian polish Lithuanian Indians Chinese etc that came in. Why? Because those groups tend to work and not live off welfare nor do they commit bombings mass shootings mass rapes nor do they march down the street screaming Germany go to hell, we want sharia!

We need to worry about our own citizens and their safety first and foremost. If a migrant wants to come to poland they will have to deal with a way different life than they would in germany or Sweden - little welfare, not being able to march down the street with poland go to hell or promote sharia law and courts, no one will listen to them when they say crosses on a church offend them, they'll be constantly monitored by police to ensure they're not planning an attack, they will not be able to form Muslim ghettos where even police are scared to go, they will not be able to grope, assault, or rape women, and if one of them messes with pole they will have an angry mob mess them up while the police watch - just like when the poles burned down that prince kebab restaurant and broke windows while the cops watched from the other side.
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
11 Jul 2017 #65
Dirk, while in essence, everything you've said is true, we also have to realize that immigration has little to do with some sort of "kumbaya- '60'sidealism", but with simple economics! Migrants, typically from poorer countries otherwise they had little reason to migrate, represent a form of cheap labor to rich, industrialized countries ever consumed by capitalist incentive which unfortunately often translates into simple, raw greed. A US, German, French, Swedish industrialist/business man or manufacturer would rather hire a dozen Syrian, Haitian or Chinese workers for every native born white, college-educated, multi-lingual or technically trained one to whom a top salary plus benefits, vacations required by law:-) Said business man merely skirts, rather than "breaks" the law and gets the "same work" (not really, though) for less than it'd cost him top pay for a high earner. Therefore, John Q. Capitalist, boss, can dispense with the vacations, sick leave and all that expensive, "wasteful" stuff while getting the lower-paid worker to make HIM more and more mullahLOL

"Immigration is good for business"?? Sad, but so.
Dirk diggler 10 | 4,643
11 Jul 2017 #66

True... But the new wave of migrants seem to be content with wandering the streets and living on the dole, not working. If they wanted to work they could have stayed in czechy were wages are good but welfare system is not. Hence they left. At least the Turks who came in the 70s 80s etc in germany tend to be assimilated and actually work. Its the same thing with Denmark - as soon as Denmark started cutting benefits and welfare the migrants flocked to sweden. If they wanted to work it wouldn't matter to them... But no... Even in interviews with migrants they clearly say they want welfare money for cigs food and even to send to their family back in Syria!

Even if these new migrants do work most the jobs they take are working in stores or some sort of trade. They sell t shirts sodas etc in some stand or work in a kebab place... If they're actually working. A popular job for Pali migrants is to buy a 6 or 12 pack of beer and sell individual beers to tourists beach goers etc. A guy can barely support himself with a job like that let alone the 5 or more kids they tend to have. Of course the wives tend not to work as well. The Muslims who have been here for awhile do work but these new migrants seem to be content with receiving welfare

Also while your example may be true for low skill very low wage jobs its not for highly educated highly skilled people who tend to earn roughly the same regardless of where there from. In the us Mexicans dominate work like at McDonald's Amazon warehouses landscaping etc because they don't have the education or skills to get a better job. Companies pay you according to what your worth.
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
11 Jul 2017 #67
Why is it then across the board that women, even in management positions, earn less than a man? Is it a question of expectation? Age-old misogyny?

Statistically as well, according to Business Week magazine, Latino managers, for the same job, will earn LESS than a W.A.S.P male, while obviously still earning more than a female of the same rank or title:-)

For this, I've no answer, only lotsa guesses!
Dirk diggler 10 | 4,643
11 Jul 2017 #68

That's actually a huge fallacy and has been debunked due to not comparing apples to apples. If you compare a female ceos at xyz corp pay to a male ceos pay at xyz corp it'll be nearly identical" especially salary (as bonuses are performance based). However women in companies tend to take jobs such as p.r., h.r., marketing, book keeping, secretarial work etc which pay less than finance, law, it, etc. So of course a female cmo will make less than a male cfo. An hr director, a position with many females will also make far less than a sales director, a job occupied more typically by men. However a male nurse or doctoe and female nurse or doctor at the same hospital will get paid the same if they have the same amount of years of experience - same with corporate America. I worked for a company where we had some 200 customer service reps on the floor below mine and I know for a fact every man and woman there started at the same exact salary. If the gender gap studies compared the same types of jobs rather than a whole spectrum than it might be valid. However that was not their methodology.

If you're comparing the exact same job types at the same companies, no there is no statistically significant pay gap. These studies who claim that there is some huge pay gap are comparing average salaries across the board. They are typically conducted by feminists and purposely skew data by comparing, like your example, a senior level male executive to a female level executive rather than comparing a male vp at company abc to a vp at company abc. Or they will compare a bunch of jobs held by men to jobs held by women. Men get paid more simply because of the fields and jobs me!n typically chose. Even among blue collar jobs men dominate the high paying highly dangerous types jobs like fishing, construction, etc. Yet it would be erroneous to compare a fisherman's income with that of the fishing company's aecretary. If you make an apples to apples comparison you'll find no statistically significant wage gap. You just need to compare two of the same types of jobs at the same company.
jon357 72 | 21,022
11 Jul 2017 #69
Companies pay you according to what your worth.

In America yes (or rather they pay what they can get away with paying). In Europe (in theory anyway) the unions are supposed to make sure that people get a living wage, and everyone gets the same amount for the same job in the same organisation. This, sadly, is often undermined, certainly in Poland.
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
11 Jul 2017 #70

@Dirk Diggler, as far as companies paying employees what they're "worth", this is a lovely ideal which perhaps held true in nearly all cases round about fourty to sixty years ago. Unfortunately, since Reagan became president, bosses now had old-fashioned carte blanche to lie, cheat, steal and rationalize firing a worker merely because the boss didn't like them, fair or not:-) Usually, said worker had little to any recourse... and the boss knew it.

Returning to women's pay scales, this is not as much of a fallacy as you might imagine. To this day, women in the US continue to protest for higher wages. In Norway, Germany, and the Netherlands, such protests are relatively infrequent, as the job-gender gap was closed a long time ago.
Dirk diggler 10 | 4,643
11 Jul 2017 #71

That's because feminists egg them on and they're too lazy to do their own research. You are right though most workers can't do much aside from collect unemployment if they're fired. But as far as people not receiving what they're worth anymore id beg to differ. If you're a low education low skill worker why should you make the same as someone who's more skilled? A minimum wage for minimum skill only seems fair. Although I will agree the min wage is a bit too low to really be a living wage. I think 10 12 an hour would be fair but 15 no way. That's more than a department manager or even a secretary typically makes yet flipping a burger requires far less skill.

Also many of the people you see in demonstrations at least in the us are paid. Greenpeace and other organizations regularly advertise 'protesting jobs' on Craigslist.
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
11 Jul 2017 #72
Do they pay as well as green jobs??
Dirk diggler 10 | 4,643
12 Jul 2017 #73
Doubt it. They also advertise in local newspapers. I find it rather funny because typically you think of demonstrations as grass roots movements where people organize on their own accord. Yet capitalism proves that like anything, a protestor can be bought. A person will fight for an ideology they may not even believe in if they are compensated appropriately.
gregy741 5 | 1,250
12 Jul 2017 #74
some example of how stupid are all those pro immigrants,social justice antyfascists...funny,good laugh guys:
dudar - | 24
12 Jul 2017 #75
Well said.
Erykm - | 3
12 Jul 2017 #76
Oh look, another Russian troll trying to divide Poland and Ukraine.

You forgot the Russian hackers... Ukraine is a pain in the ass and its people did a lot of bad things to our country in the past, and you know exactly what I'm talking about, and I don't know what else they will do in future. Poland and Europe don't need Ukraine in its current condition, integration is possible only if Poland takes rule over Ukraine through religion and becomes Ukraine's guide in Europe. Maybe this way we can make Ukraine admit its crimes against Poles and return territories that Ukraine took away from us.

Most of the jobs the ukranians take are ones poles don't care much for or the types of jobs low skill poles have taken abroad for better wages.

Ukrainians have no culture and that's the main reason why they shouldn't be allowed in Europe. Good if they just take some dirty jobs, but they also want citizenship and benefits... Do you really want to maintain someone who just wants to drain you dry, just like Ukrainians do it?
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
12 Jul 2017 #77
Ukrainians have no culture.

Hmmm, what do you call Taras Shevchenko??? A street sweeper? Who was Yevgeny Yevtuskenko? A garbage collector?
And how about Shostakovitch? A burger flipper??
12 Jul 2017 #78
I would rather prefer millions of Ukrainian refugees flooding Europe than millions islamic men flooding Europe like they do nowadays.
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
12 Jul 2017 #79
See post #63, przyjacielPL!
dudar - | 24
13 Jul 2017 #80
Having millions of Ukrainian migrants (I can't say refugees because I agree with the fact they don't look for a shelter but for the benefits Europe can give them) as bad as having millions of Muslim incomers, maybe worse. We can depart Muslims and close the borders for them, but Ukraine is too close to Europe to limit the flow of Ukrainians to Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, and Romania and further. Of course we can build walls and prevent Ukrainians from coming to Europe but still it would be better to integrate them using religion as option. We can talk to Ukraine only after we change their mind. And having a similar heritage is not enough just because it's only similar.
gregy741 5 | 1,250
13 Jul 2017 #81
wow..most idiotic post of this forum thus far
gregy741 5 | 1,250
13 Jul 2017 #82
We can depart Muslims and close the borders for them,

listen,i will explain to you,cus you dont seems too bright.
NO,you cant deport you know how much time and money cost to deport a single muslim???? if hes clever and use taxpayers paid lawers,and use human right legislation it would take years to deport him and about half of millions dollars.providing that country of his origin will accept him back.

you have no clue how this works...UK couldn't deport 2 hate clerics for decades

still it would be better to integrate them using religion as option

what???? are you 6 years old?wtf do you mean?

And having a similar heritage is not enough just because it's only similar.

dudar - | 24
13 Jul 2017 #83
wow..most idiotic post of this forum thus far

Whatever you say...

listen,i will explain to you,cus you dont seems too bright.

Good to have you to explain everything.

Departing will cost a lot for sure, but it worth to clean up the mess. Laws can be changed and sometimes it is necessary. The incomers shouldn't misuse our hospitality.

what???? are you 6 years old?wtf do you mean?

Ukraine is orthodox and the biggest part of Europe is not. We are different and since Ukraine wants to be with Europe it must accept the Catholic faith.

And having a similar heritage is not enough just because it's only similar.

Being of the same Slavic heritage doesn't make Ukraine equal to Poland. We have a lot of differences with Ukraine and Ukraine need to do many things to be like us or any other European country and I already named a possible way.
gregy741 5 | 1,250
13 Jul 2017 #84
gets even more idiotic
Erykm - | 3
13 Jul 2017 #85
Shevchenko was born in the Russian Empire and many of his writings are also in Russian, and of course in Ukrainian. He also supported the Ukrainian language and promoted independence of Ukraine and that was 150 years ago. Yes we can consider him as the representative of Ukrainian culture, but not as representative of modern faithless and corrupted Ukraine not wanted in Europe.

Yevtushenko was a Soviet and Russian poet - not Ukrainian. Shostakovich also has no relation to Ukraine.
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
13 Jul 2017 #86
Names ending either in "-chuk", "-chak" or "enko" are Ukrainian! You may be right regarding Shostakovitch (actually of Polish descent partially!), but not about Yevtushenko:-)

Don't forget either, many Ukrainian nationals during the Soviet period tried to disguise their identity.
Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
14 Jul 2017 #87
many Ukrainian nationals

Probably even more Poles in the USSR did, usually passing themselves off as Ukrainians or Belarusians. Stalin had a phobia about Poles probably becuase of his 1920 muck-up that lost the war for the Bolsheviks. We constantly hear about KatyƄ, but that was a Sunday school picnic (a mere 22,000 victims! comapred to Stalin's great Polish purge of 1937-1938 when some 110,000 Poles were summariyl executed, others imprisoned or sent to Siberia. The NKVD even went through phone books picking out people iwth Polish-sounding names. Wonder why that is so rarely talked about. T'would make a great Hollywood blockbuster.
jon357 72 | 21,022
14 Jul 2017 #88
We are different and since Ukraine wants to be with Europe it must accept the Catholic faith.

Quite a lot of Europe is either secular or protestant. Or Orthodox.

what???? are you 6 years old?wtf do you mean?

Agreed. It is an idiotic idea.
Dirk diggler 10 | 4,643
14 Jul 2017 #89

I believe there is a katyn movie but its polish. Hollywood doesn't care about making polish people look patriotic or positive in any way- they aim to make us look stupid. Just look at 2 broke girls for example...
Lyzko 42 | 9,128
14 Jul 2017 #90
Why should the Ukraine forcibly convert to a different denomination? I think it's foolish too!

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