Abortion still under control in Poland

Rapes aside, do you think that the Catholic Church should be welcoming Planned Parenthood baby killers and their pro-abortion political protectors?

Betcha zloties to paczki you were a Phyllis Schaffy supporter way back when. Ya sure talk like one with such psychologically inflammatory
rhetoric about "baby killers", indicating you obviously were never a woman:-)

I learned it from the masters of bs talk, the abortion freaks. To them, sticking a sharp object into a 28-week unborn baby is "reproductive rights".

Poland has one of the strictest abortion rules. The US - the most relaxed. Show me one statistical difference - skip the sob stories - where Poland is worse off for it

Poland may well be better off than the US, as she takes a more proactive role in assuring a single law for the whole country!

Incidents of rape in Poland are undoubtedly lower than in the US:-)

Is this supposed to be in response to my last sentence above or just two stand-alone comments?

One related statement meant to illustrate that for everything in life, there is cause and effect!

So, more restrictions on abortions, fewer rapes?

Merged:

Polish Court goes Catholic Jihad on Abortions

Banning severe foetal abnormalities as a reason for an abortion , what the actual ****? The middle class polish women will just continue going to go to czech for abortions and the poor women will have backyard abortions or drown the baby in the bath after birth. this is total madness. Hint to Polish Women just eat 50 Papaya seeds for a natural miscarriage.

@amiga500
You seem to be under the impression that murder has no consequences, especially towards those you seem esthetically unpleasing.

I am quite grateful that you are not the prime minister of Poland

This isn't about 'murder'. It's about forcing women to carry foetuses that aren't viable.

It's also about women being able to access terminations in sterile and regulated conditions, instead of getting out the coat hanger.

The scale of the protests show that Polish women want the same access to terminations as any other.


Pennyroyal tea was what they used to use in the UK. It's still on sale.

Yes the kind hearted souls of PiS want fetuses with untreatable fatal conditions to be born so they can suffer horribly for a few minutes or hours (and they want the women who give birth to them to watch it alll)

What a bunch of ghastly ghouls....

For those who are in favour of this ruling, what they don't realize is that it's only a small step from here to banning abortion when there is a fear for the health or life of the mother - and that could be passed in exactly the same way as this ruling has been. It's very easy, when you argue from a fundamentalist Catholic point of view, to say that the mother's life is in God's hands and she will live or die if it's God's will.

@jon357

What do you call killing unarmed prisoners? Tell me how can someone not born yet, protect themselves from death? We are not talking about a single cell that has no possibility on it's own to become a human being here.

You can bend it no matter how, I won't agree with you on this. It's just wrong, if women even considers this I rather spend the rest of my time as a hermit. Hidden away from anything you would call civilization

Love is what I aim for, and this action will never be love.

I don't think the consensus view of Polish women is for abortion on demand. I think there are many (like my mother in law ! but even among younger women) who think it should be allowed in these cases but not just because of an unwanted pregnancy.

Thank God for the long-awaited ruling of the Constitutional Court.

Eugenic abortions in Poland were performed in 24-25th week of pregnancy, when babies were old enough to survive outside mother's womb.

Overwhelming majority of eugenic abortions were conducted with the aim of killing babies suspected with Down syndrome (many of those diagnosis were false, and if the parents' didn't succumb to pressure, prefectly healthy children were born on many occasions); the usual procedure involved giving birth to the "sick" baby by artificial induction of labor, and if the baby didn't die during the labor, it was put away to stop breathing (which could take up to an hour). Unspeakable barbarism.

This will no longer happen in Poland and I am proud of my country, despite the tornado of insults, hate and mouth foam coming our way.

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I would say that if such practices were going on (where did you get your infomation?), in the 21st century, then a public enquiry is long overdue and a complete reform of the health service would be indicated.


Would this be because successive governments, including the present one, have no interest in funding the necessary supports and services for such children and their parents?

Agreed. There are reports from medical staff who took part in the procedures, and I also hope that it will be thoroughly investigated.


As much as I agree that the latest ruling of the Constitutional Court should be followed by serious financial aid to the children and their families, I cannot agree with what you would seem to suggest here -- that lack of money justifies, in a way, killing a child.

It's not just a lack of money - raising a disabled child can take over every aspect of your life. Fathers often leave and the mothers often find themselves sandwiched between caring for Babcia and caring for a special needs kid.

But I'm sure the timing of this whole issue is cynical - to get people on to the streets in crowds and without masks. Sets the stage for a whole lot of whataboutery for 1st November and the annual tight t shirt parade on the 11th.

It is all true, but it doesn't justify killing children. There must be greater help for the families now, and there will be a lot of pressure on the government to provide it.


...the timing is indeed bad, but better late than never. It was going on for far too long.

Yeah, what is wrong with you, eh?


Well, it is about killing of a human being, that should be put it right. Euphemisms you are using are serve as a deceptive crap to numb peoples awareness' of the issue.


Well you are one of those that got away and not only you suffer you cause suffering to others forced to listen to your horrendous self-hating crap. Plus, learn something about the issue from the source not from some biased pamphlets./you sound like a misinformed fool.


Speaking for Polish women now? Have they voted you to be their spokesman?


lol1 You and your Catholicism are just a sham.

An unviable foetus that has at best a few days of misery to actually live. Perhaps you get off on their suffering.


No they're speaking more than adequately for themselves right now. They don't need me or you or any other male to tell them what to do with their bodies. As the Polish saying goes, moja pizda, moja decyzja...

"Unviable foetus"? As I mentioned before, eugenic abortions were conducted on 6-months-old unborn babies. Such babies can survive outside their mothers' wombs. I have a friend whose daughter, now 11 years old, was born in 24th week of pregnancy.


Children are not their mothers' bodies, they are separate beings.

I wasn't suggesting that, but never mind.

The reports that you mention from medical staff, are the staff and the hospitals named? What is the source of the reports? Have you seen these reports yourself?

The answer to those abuses, if they were occurring on a regular basis, is not banning abortion. It is naming, shaming and punishing those taking part in them and ensuring that abortions are carried out in an ethical, professional and humane manner.

Your example of the little sweetie pie with Downes Syndrome is all very well, but she will grow up in a country that has no means of providing the right kind of supported living for her when she reaches adulthood and when she loses her parents, what becomes of her Torq? How does your conscious feel about her being placed in an institution, possibly a mental hospital or in some cases a care home for the aged? Will you be volunteering to visit her every weekend and take her to your house for Christmas? Maybe you are one of those rare souls, but if so there aren't enough of you.

And where the child is severely disabled and requires residential care, what do you know of such facilities in Poland? What kind of life does the child have there? Are they located close to the family home? What is the parents' involvement in their child's care?


And it won't happen.

dw.com/en/parents-of-disabled-children-occupy-polands-parliament/a-43555600

Pregnancies are terminated when appropriate. If you think they shouldn't happen, let us know how many severely disabled people you've cared for until the end of their short and difficult lives.


A foetus isn't a child.

Perhaps you prefer illegal home abortions.

as far as I know parents of diabled children now receive more support than before the protest (the article is from 2018)

Yet there's an option for someone not to be the parent of a profoundly disabled kid, or or not to give birth to a malformed mass of flesh without a brain.

Sadly, the monsters in government now expect women to carry such a foetus to term. Hence protests by Poles on a scale never before seen.

And the government will back down on this.

Yes, so let's just kill her.

Funny how some people worry about the children so much that they are willing to kill them (for their own good of course).


This doesn't even merit a serious reply. Pure idiocy.

Ah, well... I can see that pro-murder crowd has a strong representation on this board. Anyway, I've said what I wanted to say and I won't be dragged into endless discussions on the matter (been there, done that, got the t-shirt).

it's a Constitutional Tribunal ruling - the government cannot back down on it

And it seems that the mainstream pro-choice movement has a stronger representation in Poland than the anti-choice extremists.


We'll see...

And it's funny how those in favour of bringing severely disabled children into the world have nothing to say on the subject of the lives of those children, after they're born. Just as long as you can ensure that they come into the world, you're satisfied, but you lose interest in them after that. We won't be seeing you out on the streets protesting on behalf of the disabled, will we.

I see the abortion issue as a moral one, which has to be left up to the conscience of the individual. It's between them and God. If you think that's not the case and that the state should ban abortion on the basis that it's murder, then surely contraception should be banned too or at least be made available only to married couples on prescription.