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Applying for Polish citizenship through marriage.



lalacruz 1 | 2    
24 May 2010  #1

Hello, I'm a Polish girl with an Australian boyfriend. We are living together and I'm about to apply for the de facto visa, but recently we started to discussing other options, like going together to England. And here is my question? If he marry me, and we will live together in England, how can he get EU and Polish benefits? Australians can stay and work in UK for max 2 years but we want to move there permanently,you know get married and have kids ect :))) so he will need a work permit or something to be able to work in EU when his visa finishes. As a Polish citizen he could work there with no problems.

thank you for any info or advice.


RevokeNice 15 | 1,867    
24 May 2010  #2

Before I post up EU directives, you are moving to the UK as in England, yes?

:)
nincompoop_not 2 | 192    
24 May 2010  #3

when he gets Polish permanent residency after 3 years of being married to you and living in Poland - then he'll be free to be in the UK on the same terms as you

here's info:

Who can obtain EC long-term resident status in Poland?

Foreigner is anyone who does not have Polish citizenship. Settlement permit or residence permit for EC long-term resident shall be granted at the request of foreigner folding on a special form , and accompanied by the relevant documents . The decision on granting a permit to settle or a residence permit for a long-term EC issued by the voivod competent with respect to the intended place of residence of the foreigner . Settlement of the case to grant a permit to settle or residence permit for EC long-term resident should be completed no later than three months from the date of initiation of the proceedings in the appeal proceedings - within two months from the date of receipt of the appeal .


not sure what kind of benefits you have in mind? and why benefits?
zuczek 3 | 52    
24 May 2010  #4

It used to be 5 years of marriage and residing in Poland. Has it been changed to 3? I just glanced at the first page of your link and saw 5 years mentioned but not 3.
RevokeNice 15 | 1,867    
24 May 2010  #5

then he'll be free to be in the UK on the same terms as you

Wrong.

(5)The right of all Union citizens to move and reside freely within the territory of the Member States should, if it is to be exercised under objective conditions of freedom and dignity, be also granted to their family members, irrespective of nationality. For the purposes of this Directive, the definition of 'family member' should also include the registered partner if the legislation of the host Member State treats registered partnership as equivalent to marriage.

(6)In order to maintain the unity of the family in a broader sense and without prejudice to the prohibition of discrimination on grounds of nationality, the situation of those persons who are not included in the definition of family members under this Directive, and who therefore do not enjoy an automatic right of entry and residence in the host Member State, should be examined by the host Member State on the basis of its own national legis-lation, in order to decide whether entry and residence could be granted to such persons, taking into consideration their relationship with the Union citizen or any other circumstances, such as their financial or physical dependence on the Union citizen.

eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2004:229:0035:0048:EN:PDF
richasis 1 | 419    
24 May 2010  #6

It used to be 5 years of marriage and residing in Poland.

Yes. I was under the very same understanding.
nincompoop_not 2 | 192    
24 May 2010  #7

yes, 5 - wrong key

Revoke - all's fine but

The United Kingdom has also opted out of Directive 2004/58/EC on the right of citizens and their family members to move and reside freely within the territory of the Member States

publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200506/ldselect/ldeucom/58/5808.htm

If your family members are not EEA or Swiss nationals and they are coming to live with you permanently or on a long-term basis, they will need to apply for an EEA family permit before coming to the UK. The EEA family permit is similar to a visa and is issued by visa services.

the whole UKBA section re: marriages and family members explains all

ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visitingtheuk/gettingmarried/permissiontomarryinUK/

this one explains in an easy way: all about poland/en/faq/departure/q6
RevokeNice 15 | 1,867    
24 May 2010  #8

Revoke - all's fine but

Aha, didn't know that.

EDIT- I am too tired but it seems that the speaker recommends that the UK opt out, not that they have actually opted out. I am tired, though. So I could be wrong.
nincompoop_not 2 | 192    
24 May 2010  #9

that's why my other links from the UKBA site - the most current info on the rules in the UK

there are questions of course where they going to get married - Poland or UK - as different rules will apply but they can read through

ah, and questions was: can you get polish citizenship through marriage outside of Poland?

you can get married abroad but he'd have to live in Poland for 5 years to get citizenship (correct version)
OP lalacruz 1 | 2    
24 May 2010  #10

Thank you RevokeNice and nincompoop_not for making it more clear to me.

The problem is, living in Poland for 3 years is not an option.
YES, We can get married there. But we will be living in England.

And the main think I'm trying to find out is: What's the easiest way to get my Australian partner long term work permission for England.

Is there any law that will apply for this case. A husband of Polish/EU resident is allow to work in England or not?

p.s. well, by "benefits" I meant - being able to work and live in most EU countries without visa.
nincompoop_not 2 | 192    
24 May 2010  #11

it's up there on the UK Border AGency website;
if you get married and plan to come to the UK he'd have to apply for a 'family permit'

If your family members are not EEA or Swiss nationals and they are coming to live with you permanently or on a long-term basis, they will need to apply for an EEA family permit before coming to the United Kingdom. The EEA family permit is similar to a visa and is issued by Visa Services. Your family members should apply for an EEA family permit at their nearest British diplomatic post.

source: icslegal.com

If he gets one - before coming to the UK - than he'll be able to work.

There's no short way/way around this.
poland_    
24 May 2010  #12

Is there any law that will apply for this case. A husband of Polish/EU resident is allow to work in England or not?

Firstly when you apply in the UK you should be able to prove that you are and have been a couple living together for a period of time. Maybe such as joint tenancy agreements,joint bank accounts and pictures of you both together in different locations. The problem you may find in the UK is that many Polish women/girls have been duped or paid into marrying a non EU national.

If I was in your position I would get married in Poland because you are a national of Poland and you can easily get all the documents you require if you decide to travel to the UK. But of course you will require a lot of documents from Aus so your boyfriend can get married to you in Poland. There is NO short cut and marriage should Not be considered an option for work extension.
Kshtriya - | 2    
24 May 2010  #13

Well I guess. If marriage is getting considered to reach to UK or staying in UK ... I dont get convinced with such decision .. on other hands if you marry him in Poland then its an easy for him to go to UK with you as you can get all the documents which you require in Poland rather its a difficult in UK.

I think Poland is a nice place so live here for 3 years and then go to UK and personally UK has nothing ... so be here :)
RevokeNice 15 | 1,867    
24 May 2010  #14

p.s. well, by "benefits" I meant - being able to work and live in most EU countries without visa.

The general rule is that the non-EU spouse has exactly the same right of free movement and work as the EU citizen (as long as they are doing it in the same place).

A. Employment
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen is currently working for an employer. This includes vocational training programmes and some non-proprietary directors.

B. Self-employment
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen is a sole trader, in a business partnership, or is a proprietary director of a registered company.

C. Study
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen is engaged in a course of study with a qualifying educational institute or college.

D. Involuntary unemployment
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen has been employed in the State but has since become involuntarily unemployed.

E. Residing with sufficient resources
Fill out this part when the EU/EEA/Swiss citizen has sufficient resources to maintain themselves and any dependants, subject to the conditions of Regulation 2(3) and Regulation 6(2) of the Regulations.

Please note: the EU, EEA or Swiss citizen of whom you are a family member must be engaged in one or more of these activities in order for you to qualify for a residence card under their EU Treaty Rights.".


If either of you become a drain on the public purse, his resident card can be rescinded.
Amathyst 19 | 2,706    
24 May 2010  #15

What's the easiest way to get my Australian

Find out if he can apply for a British passport - if he is of British heritage, parents born here ect.

You better get your skates on though, immigration rules will be changing and caps on immigration introduced.
OP lalacruz 1 | 2    
25 May 2010  #16

nincompoop_not : Thank you very much! the "family permit" is a solution for us :) and it's definitely a shortcut from "3 years in Poland plan" :)

warszawski: We are living together already and we're both signed tenancy agreement, so that shouldn't be a problem.

Kshtriya : We are planning to get married because we want to be together (and live together in London) ,not because he wants to work in UK. That's why I'm taking my Aussie man back to Europe, so my country and family is just a short flight away :)

RevokeNice : thanks for more useful info, that actually answer my question, because I was not sure if he, as my spouse, will have the same rights :)

Amathyst : no chance for British passport :(

Thank you Guys!! looks like we are going to London!!! yeeeee
RevokeNice 15 | 1,867    
25 May 2010  #17

Make sure you have sufficient funds. Your Australian spouse will be waiting for a minimum of six months for the stamp 4 visa(right to work). He will get a stamp 3 visa(permission to remain). So, you will be the bread winner for at least six months and if you become a burden on the state(i.e. claim welfare) he will find renewing stamp4/3 very difficult. Furthermore, Ireland, the UK and Denmark(what a combination) have already been brought to ECJ for failing to follow the directives(2008). Now, normally Ireland follows the UKs lead when it comes to immigration, due to the common travel area, so if Ireland is breaking the directives and *refusing to issue the non EU spouses with Stamp 4, that would lead me to believe that the Brits are or will be doing similar.

* - irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0511/1224270128873.html

** - Id recommend getting an immigration lawyer before you even enter the UK, especially with a new government just after being formed. A very eurosceptic one at that.
nincompoop_not 2 | 192    
25 May 2010  #18

Lalacruz
go through this check list from the UKBA

ukvisas.gov.uk/en/doineedvisa/

Revoke
I think that the stamps 3/4 you mentioned are specific to Ireland, and not the UK.

UK rules:

ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/eucitizens/applyingundereuropeanlaw/
Amathyst 19 | 2,706    
25 May 2010  #19

Thank you Guys!! looks like we are going to London!!! yeeeee

Dont want to pee on your parade, but I hope YOU have a job lined up because without the right papers your b/f wont be able to work and I can tell you now, its not a good time to come to the UK to look for work speculatively.

Good though!
al111 12 | 89    
25 May 2010  #20

It used to be 5 years of marriage and residing in Poland. Has it been changed to 3? I just glanced at the first page of your link and saw 5 years mentioned but not 3.

It never was 5years for married couples people always misinterpret this with the normal way of gaining permanent residence without family connection. The law stipulates that after 3years of marriage and 2years of residing in Polska Permanently then one is eligible to apply for permanent residence and if PR is granted then within 6months application for Citizenship should be made. What this means is that if you were married outside the country for 3years you only need to come and reside in the country with your spouse for 2years to be eligible for PR. Word of caution though it's not as easy as it sounds as this law can be interpreted differently in all the 16 Woiwodships and the application for PR and later on Citizenship is a very complicated process that can take ages up to 2years from what i hear. If you want to know more it's always good to conduct your Woiwodship office for foreigners. Hope this will shade some light.

udsc.gov.pl/INSTRUCTION,FOR,FOREIGNERS,,704.html
dhennie_jo 4 | 31    
28 May 2010  #21

Merged: Married to Polish citizen, how long before I can apply for Polish citizenship?

im married to Polish. I want to know how many years do i need or when I can apply for citizenship here? And what are the requirements?
TransAtlantyk - | 19    
29 May 2010  #22

You're married to Polish? I mean, it is a beautiful language, but come on . . .

anyways, I do believe it is five years of uninterrupted residence within the Republic of Poland. I'm also fairly certain that you must be able to communicate in Polish in some meaningful capacity.

The easiest thing to do would simply be to go onto the website of the Polish embassy in your home country, they should have all the information you need. If you are currently in Poland you could to go the correct government office, wait in line for twenty-nine days, and pray the person you see has the correct answer.

I'd go with the internet if I were you.
delphiandomine 87 | 15,827    
29 May 2010  #23

anyway, I do believe it is five years of uninterrupted residence within the Republic of Poland. I'm also fairly certain that you must be able to communicate in Polish in some meaningful capacity.

3 years and 6 months, to be accurate.

No requirement to speak Polish to any level - if there was, then they would never be able to issue endless passports to the American TRUE POLISH Polonia.
TransAtlantyk - | 19    
29 May 2010  #24

I stand correct, I guess I spewing misinformation.

As for the language thing, I've always been of the mind that if you cannot speak the cultural language, you are not part of the culture. If you are Polish-American, but can't speak a word of Polish . . . are you really Polish? Is not a Brit who has learned to speak Polish fluently actually more Polish than you?

On a cultural level, of course.
nincompoop_not 2 | 192    
29 May 2010  #25

if there was, then they would never be able to issue endless passports to the American TRUE POLISH Polonia.

hahaha

I love your reminders :)

check out this website. All you need to know is there. In English: polish-citizenship. eu
richasis 1 | 419    
29 May 2010  #26

American TRUE POLISH Polonia.

exactly. thank you very much.
delphiandomine 87 | 15,827    
29 May 2010  #27

As for the language thing, I've always been of the mind that if you cannot speak the cultural language, you are not part of the culture. If you are Polish-American, but can't speak a word of Polish . . . are you really Polish?

Nope, you're not in the slightest. Your ancestry might be Polish, sure - but you most certainly aren't, even if you hold the passport. They might be citizens, but they're no different from the African who married a Pole and got Polish citizenship. Let's not even get into their idiotic voting habits - certainly, should someone with no knowledge of the Polish language be allowed to vote?

It's funny just how many Americans "remembered" that they were TRUE POLISH PATRIOTS after Poland joined the EU.

The saddest story, if you ask me, is the way that the EU put pressure on Warsaw not to give Polish citizenship to those who ended up on the "wrong" side of the border, but rather to simply give them the "Karta Polaka". Those people are far more Polish than the vast majority of Polonia in America - yet they're denied full citizenship.
dhennie_jo 4 | 31    
30 May 2010  #28

3 years and 6 months, to be accurate.

thanks for this
stevepl 2 | 49    
30 May 2010  #29

Between 3 years and 3 years and six months (you have a limited window of 6 months to make the application after 3 years of marriage).

The major need though is either an EC long term residence permit ( so for EC nationals you must have a minimum of 5 years documented stay in Poland) and for Non EC nationals you will need a permit to settle (you can obtain this with 2 years documented stay in Poland plus a minimum of 3 years marriage to a Polish citizen or somebody with an EC long term residence permit).

If you miss the six month window after the three years marriage then you get a second six month window after acquiring the long term residence permit or the permit to settle. If you miss this you can't apply for the automatic grant of citizenship on the basis of marriage.

It is not a minimum period of 3 years and six months that in fact is the maximum period.
Rodrigo - | 9    
19 Apr 2011  #30

Merged: Polish citizenship through marriage, I've just got it.

All right everybody, for some time I've checked this forum, it helped me a lot and I've had lots of fun with some of the answers, now I think it's time to contribute;

I got married 4 years ago, when my wife got pregnant, she wanted to stay close to her parents so we decided to move to Poland, been loving the place since then, I have a great job, many friends, only the weather is an issue most of the times, but nothing is perfect, anyways, this is how it worked.

I'm Brazilian, when we moved to Poland I applied for a work permit, got it, started working, it was a temporary Karta Pobytu, valid for a year and half, six months before expiring I applied for another one, which was issued with expiring period of two years, after that I was eligible to permanent Karta Pobytu, I live in Silesia, so everything was done in Katowice, Urzad Wojewodski, after getting the permanent card, I had a period of six months to apply for citizenship, so off I went again to the Urzad Wojewodski, then they asked me to write a letter with the story of my life, which was quite simple, then I paid the fees, submitted the proper forms that were given on the above mentioned governmental office and waited for 45 days, then I got the decision, after two weeks the decision became public, whatever the decision is you have two weeks to contest, and after that I applied for an ID card, another 30 days of waiting, returning the karta pobytu to the U.W. , going to the bank to change all the data to the new documents, then I applied for the passport, a few more days and that is it. Now I have two kids, a successful importing-exporting business, Polish Vodka is really well appreciated in Brazil and Brazilian shoes and purses do well in Poland, so we're not moving anywhere, we're staying here, and that's it.

If you have any questions, e-mail me at rodrigo@op.pl

There was no crazy interviews, interrogation, polish language test or any other bureaucratic issue apart from paying fees, filling in forms and waiting, it took me a total of four years and two months to become a Pole.

Good luck to all newcomers and God bless you all.

Rod.

PS: Below is the letter that I submitted, hope it will help;)

Your name and surname Katowice, stycznia 2011 r.
Your address

Życiorys

Nazywam się .... Jestem obywatelem .... Urodziłem się .... 19... roku w .... i jestem synem .... oraz ..., którzy są obywatelami ..... Z uwagi na obowiązki służbowe ojca dużo podróżowałem w dzieciństwie i kolejne stopnie edukacji kończyłem w ...... Maturę zdałem w roku ...... w szkole ......., a następnie podjąłem studia na kierunku ...... W latach ....- ..... byłem studentem ..... w ..... Po ukończeniu studiów uzyskałem tytuł .... i podjąłem pracę zgodną z moim wykształceniem.

Od roku .... jestem mężem .... (ur. ...... w ......., córka ........ i .......), która jest obywatelką polską. Posiadamy ........dzieci - syna .... (ur. ....... w ....... ) oraz córkę ..... (ur. ....... w .....), które także posiadają polskie obywatelstwo.

W .... roku na stałe osiedliliśmy się w Polsce - początkowo mieszkając w................... . Kartę stałego pobytu otrzymałem w ........ roku. Od .... lat pracuję jako.................. , współpracując z ................ w ..........., prowadząc zajęcia dla osób prywatnych, firm i instytucji.


Make sure that the spelling, declination, etc. is correct.




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