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Marriage in Sweden, divorce in Poland (applying from Ireland?)



jbeer    
12 Jul 2015  #1

I am Irish national and my wife is polish national. We got married in Sweden 6 years ago. I was living there in Sweden for some time and she was living and working there in Ireland. Later we decided to live in Ireland. After years living together in Ireland things have changed between us and at that point we both want divorce through mutual consent. We do not have any kids involved neither any property etc. My question is as we both live in Ireland can we apply for a divorce in Poland and how long it can take depending on our circumstances


Atch 9 | 1,644    
13 Jul 2015  #2

I would imagine that as you got married in Sweden that's where you should apply for your divorce.
Pol attorney    
13 Jul 2015  #3

Hi ! It will take about 4-5 months for you to get a divorce in Poland if you manage to get jurisdiction of the Polish Court in your divorce case. According to Polish divorce law, this will depend on a few legal factors (for example, if your wife still has a place of residence in Poland). I am a lawyer based in Poland, so I would be able to help you with this case.
Atch 9 | 1,644    
13 Jul 2015  #4

JBeer, from the Dep of Foreign Affairs Ireland:

Recognition of Foreign Divorces

Under Irish Law, a divorce executed outside of the State may only be recognised if either spouse was domiciled in the jurisdiction of the Court that granted the divorce at the time that the divorce proceedings commenced. Domicile is a complex legal concept related to one's country of birth, or if they have emigrated, their intended place of future permanent residence.

So as the Polish lawyer is saying, your wife needs to establish domicile in Poland. But JBeer I checked it out and you can apply for a divorce in Ireland even if you were married abroad. As you're both living in Ireland would it not be easier and much cheaper? As there's no children or property involved you can just apply to the court for the papers, sign them and get them notarized by a solictor for about 15 euros per document, it's very cheap, probably wouldn't cost you more than 100euros.
Harry 79 | 13,371    
13 Jul 2015  #5

it's very cheap, probably wouldn't cost you more than 100euros.

He'd pay much more than that in Poland for only translations and interpreters!
Pol attorney    
13 Jul 2015  #6

Yes, in fact, what Atch has just said, is also legally possible in the Polish jurisdiction. Decisions made by foreign Courts (including Courts in Ireland) may be recognized by Polish Courts as fully valid -- however they need to meet certain requiremnts. So, an Irish Court's decison on your divorce will also mean that your wife will be recognized as "divorced" within the Polish legal system.
Atch 9 | 1,644    
13 Jul 2015  #7

He'd pay much more than that in Poland for only translations and interpreters!

People in Ireland often pay about 1,000 euros to a solicitor or about half that to a 'divorce service'. All the divorce service does is get the paperwork from the court, which you can do yourself for nothing, get you to sign it and then charge you a small fortune to have it notarized! Certainly in Poland I wouldn't do anything without a lawyer and neither would my husband even though he's Polish. Polish legal documents are as confusing as they can possibly be but in Ireland where it's all po Angielsku and phrased in very simple, layman's terms there's really no need for any legal eagles.
OP jbeer    
14 Jul 2015  #8

Thank you for your opinions but in Ireland before a court can grant a divorce, The parties must have been living apart from one another for a period amounting to four out of the previous five years before the application is made.
donnawatson - | 1    
14 Jul 2015  #9

You will need the help of international divorce expert as was with my case married in poland and then shifted USA and then we had many problems in the process of divorce so consulted the leemeierlaw.com and with there help my case was simplified.
Atch 9 | 1,644    
14 Jul 2015  #10

I don't think he needs an international divorce lawyer. Poland, Sweden and Ireland, the three countries involved are all in the EU. It's relatively straightforward. USA is a different kettle of fish.
OP jbeer    
15 Jul 2015  #11

Thank you guys
Atch 9 | 1,644    
15 Jul 2015  #12

The parties must have been living apart from one another for a period amounting to four out of the previous five years before the application is made.

Yes, that's true but you don't have to provide any proof. They take your word for it (typically Irish isn't it!). Also they will accept that you may have been living under the same roof but not living as man and wife. As you've been married six years you could say that you realized early on that you'd made a mistake, parted for a while, got back together, split up again.........worth a try considering that it would cost very little.
Erizoto - | 1    
1 Nov 2015  #13

@Pol attorney, Please can you help me out on this divorce thing, I have been separated from my wife for 3 years now , she has actually moved to Poland and I live in France. There is no children or any property together. Can some help?
bookkeeper - | 1    
2 Nov 2015  #14

Hi @POl attorney, I also need help. I married my wife in 2007 in Singapore and has since lived in The Netherlands and Poland for some periods. Now we are living in Singapore. We want to get divorced and we have a 3 year old son. I intend to let my wife go back to Poland with my son, but i want to have legal access to my son. Everything that we had i have paid for by myself, including properties. Please pm me. thanks!
twotter47    
5 Mar 2016  #15

Similar case for me. Married in Poland, normal civil marriage. I'm West-European. We have no kids, no shared property. However, complicating factor is that we are living in the Middle East, so I'm wondering how to get a divorce done. Maybe simply apply through the Polish court in the jurisdiction where we got married? Or go to the Polish embassy? Thanks in advance.
Pol attorney 2 | 106    
7 Mar 2016  #16

Normally, you will need a final decision made by Polish Family Court to get a divorce from your wife (the Polish office USC must make a statement on the Polish marriage certificate after a divorce decision is issued).

If your wife still has some place of residence in Poland (flat, apartment, etc. in Poland), then it might be possible to get the jurisdiction of the Polish Court in your divorce case.

Just my 5 cents.
porky pok 2 | 130    :-(
7 Mar 2016  #17

5 cents(a nickel) a lot bro:)
Dont you think if he registers his marriage in his homeland or the country he is living in with Polish marriage certificate he can apply for a divorce there provided he can serve her legally somehow just once (the initial divorce proceedings)?

I was married in states but had to register my marriage in Poland also(without the court ceremony) and told that we can get divorced either in Poland or States now.LOL hope that sheet never happens though just curious.
Pol attorney 2 | 106    
8 Mar 2016  #18

@porky pok Yes, in fact, this might also be a good option, although I assume that 95% of individuals and businesses want to go through the legal, non-legal and administrative procedures in Poland to make it affordable and cheap for both parties. This is what I have seen myself in the last years.

In most cases, a decision made by a foreign court will be recognized by the Polish court and government (if it meets certain requirements). Although there might be a problem with decisions made by foreign criminal courts.
James2016    
25 Apr 2016  #19

Merged: Divorce in Poland, Polish Marriage Registration A Mandatory Requirement OR Swedish Marriage Registration is OK

Hello Guys,

I would like to seek information regarding divorce in Poland. If someone married in EU (Sweden) with polish citizen many years ago but they didn't live in Poland rather they lived and worked in another EU country for years. Later things change and time comes to end the relationship. Your polish spouse goes back to live in his/her country (Poland) a year ago and you both want to get divorce in Poland. My question is can you get divorce in Poland direct from polish court with Swedish marriage certificate issued by swedish court with its sworn polish translation and other legal documents if your marriage was not registered in poland? Can polish judge issue divorce proceeding if you do not have a polish marriage certificate and your marriage is not registered in Poland? OR it is a must requirement to get register foreign EU marriage first in Poland and then proceed with divorce later? I would appreciate if I can get a clear and legal answer please.

Thank you very much.,
James
Sikander 1 | 10    
26 Sep 2016  #21

Hi
Me and my girlfriend living together for nearly 2 years she is polish national but we are living in ireland.
She is still married to someone else no kids no properties her husband dont wanna give her divorce.
I wanna know can she apply for divorce in poland while living in ireland.
She was married in ireland.
Thanks
Atch 9 | 1,644    
27 Sep 2016  #22

She should consider applying in Ireland. Ireland's divorce laws and legal system are far more straightforward and inexpensive. Also her husband is less likely to contest the divorce if it's going to go through the Irish courts as he will feel less confident than he would on his home turf in Poland.

With the situation you describe, they will grant the divorce anyway even if he contests it. The only stumbling block is the five year thing, that is, you need to be living apart for a total of four years out of the previous five. If her husband can demonstrate that they were living together and that he objects on those grounds, she can simply say that they were living under the same roof but the marriage had ended and that she stayed there because she couldn't afford to move out.

Q. How do I prove that I am Separated for four years ?

You will be required to complete a document called the "Family Law Civil Bill" in which you will be required to state the date you were married and the length of time you and your spouse have been living apart. You will be asked under Oath in Court to verify this information.


So basically if she's prepared to lie about it........however, the court could ask to see evidence that there were two separate households within the same house, ie separate bills but most couples don't go that far so there's a good chance that the court will accept her word. It's worth a try anyway. They have no interest in trying to force unhappy couples (especially when they're not even Irish!) to stay together where there are no children involved. She's been living with another man for two years so there is clearly very little prospect of reconcilliation.

She doesn't even need a solicitor for an Irish divorce. With no kids or property involved, it's very simple, a few forms to fill and get notarised, won't cost her more than a couple of hundred euros. All the forms are here:

courts.ie/Courts.ie/Library3.nsf/PageCurrent/641DC55CB065344F80257FB5003E11E1?opendocument&l=en
Sikander 1 | 10    
27 Sep 2016  #23

Thanks for the reply.
But the problem is she got married in 2013 and soon she left him because she found out he was already married in back his home.

But she cant prove he is already married so she just left him.
The law here is not letting her get divorce.
Only option we can think for poland.
Atch 9 | 1,644    
27 Sep 2016  #24

she cant prove he is already married

How could that be? Was it a civil wedding or a church wedding? If it was a civil wedding there should be a record of it. Then she could simply have his subsequent marriage to her declared null and void. She could get that done in Ireland.

poland.

Yes she can apply for a divorce in a country where she is domiciled. Domiciled is not the same thing as living in. As she's Polish she should be able to apply.
Sikander 1 | 10    
27 Sep 2016  #25

We contacted few solicitors on the phone in poland.
They saying if you married in ireland .then she cant apply for divorce in poland.
She need to live in poland for 6 months before the application for divorce.
Atch 9 | 1,644    
27 Sep 2016  #26

Hi there Sikander. I took a look at the following site which is maintained by the European Commission so I would take their word over that of a Polish solicitor. Clearly the solicitors you contacted don't really understand European law.

europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/family/couple/divorce-separation/index_en.htm

According to the EU:

You can file your request with the courts in the country where:

both you and your spouse are nationals.
[/b]

So in their case, Poland.

The six month rule applies if she is a national of Poland and has been living there for six months. What it means basically is that if your girlfriend decided that she didn't want to live in Ireland and went back to live in Poland, she would have to wait six months before applying for a Polish divorce. But, if she continues to live in Ireland, she can apply for a Polish divorce on the basis that both she and her husband are Polish nationals. Hope that makes sense.

Read the link in full anyway and you'll see it for yourself. If you feel you need to consult a solicitor you'd be better off using an Irish one as they are more accustomed to dealing with EU law than Polish solicitors, having been in the EU so much longer. You could also try a Polish solicitor based in Dublin as they'd be likely to have experience in these matters.
Sikander 1 | 10    
27 Sep 2016  #27

Sorry maybe its my mistake but i forgot to mention her husband is pakistan national.
Atch 9 | 1,644    
27 Sep 2016  #28

Well that narrows her options down considerably.

Option One: Go back to Poland and apply in six months time.

Option Two: She could chance her arm as we say in Ireland and file anyway in Poland, pretending she's living there, giving her parents' address. If she just gets a family member to get the forms from the court and doesn't use a solicitor she could get away with it.They're probably not likely to ask her for proof in the form of payslips or something. The worst that can happen is that it doesn't work. They won't throw her in jail or anything so she might as well try.

Option Three: Wait it out for the next two or three years and get her divorce in Ireland.

I presume our lovely Pakistani ex had some kind of religious ceremony in Pakistan which is why there's no record? If he had a civil wedding it may well have been recorded, even in a place as chaotic as Pakistan. What's the problem with getting the proof?
Sikander 1 | 10    
27 Sep 2016  #29

We have no idea how to get any proof from there all she knows from his friends that he is married and have kid back home.
terri 1 | 1,233    
27 Sep 2016  #30

GET evidence of everything. Marriage when one partner is already married is null and void. i.e. she is NOT married in the eyes of the law.




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