Polack/American Polonia/Plastic Pole "culture"

please do not use this term in the forum it is derogatory and not very nice.

Hmm - what I mean is that it's surprising that they don't have more of a balanced opinion, because there's no reason for them to be fiercely defensive of Poland.


Tell me about it. I was reading some old articles - and you can clearly see that there was little to no recognition of what the Loyalists were doing. It's common knowledge now about collusion, but then?

(the more I read, the more I realise how utterly complicated NI is as a question, especially when you realise that successive Irish leaders had no real intention to unify Ireland)


Sorry, but I don't - I jump up for Ode to Europe instead.

Would that not work the opposite, that they would be fiercely defensive because that is the team they root for?


Is it? I have not heard a murmur of anything in the slightest that could be even remotely misinterpreted as giving me the faintest impression that this was even the seed of a concept in world media or even English media,

(see how far away I am trying to put it:)

Being brought up in Irish and British media, I found the bias disgusting.
Paradoxically of course, the world was well aware of how experienced Britain was at overpowering the media and I never experienced any bother outside of England.

I must make a note here and now that I am delighted that the war is over.

Well, I can understand it where both parents are Polish - but when they really are just your average American mutt, it's very odd. It's even stranger when they have a very mixed bloodline, yet they identify so strongly with Poland.


Yep, it's now being reported quite widely - not that anyone is surprised by it ;)

I think there's also an inquiry at the minute into IRA-Garda collusion too? The nicest thing I've read recently though was a proposal by some DUP guy - saying that Gardai should respond to things in border areas where the PSNI can't react quickly. Amazing, really.

Its simple Poland was a multi ethnic place. Being occupied didnt make them less Polish. Perhaps they haven't taken an absolutist view of history.


Everyone does that as illustrated by your factually incorrect example.


Everyone creates a national narrative.

Well, they are going to keep doing it anyway and they are going to have fun doing it regardless of you not understanding it or approving.

How do you know they were actually Polish? Speaking Polish didn't neccessarily mean they were Polish - after all, the Lithuanian elite spoke Polish.


And we'll carry on ridiculing them and calling them "Polacks" and other offensive (to their oversensitive hearts) names.

But why is it such a big deal to you? Who cares if you call them Polacks? What does it matter, anyway.

Mutt? care to define that sir? :)


But it's not just bloodline, it's upbringing, it's what you are told you are, "never forget where you are from".

Although of course you do have a point where we have some (SOME) Americans on here going on about "blood lines" in such a varied "blood line" country as Poland.

But the same shite can be said about people from our countries...
It is culture or if you really want to water it down, "perceived culture" but is that not what culture is anyway, perception? identifying characteristics that run parallel?


Do I really have to come up with all those adverbs about how I have not heard anything about that? or could you just post any link?


They also consider themselves Polish.
I lived there and mingled...

People like MediaWatch get very upset when you use the term Polack. It's highly amusing.


I'm sick to death of the way that the American Polonia treat Poles. It's patronising, condescending and insulting in general.

Because they said they were Polish and told their families that they were Polish.


So you see how an absolutist view of history obscures things.

Doesn't mean a thing - they might have been half Polish, half Lemko.

They don't generally do that now.

Polish Lithuanian Diplomatic War? At last.

Piłsudski, like Hitler and Stalin (according to some Lithuanians)

As you know it is upbringing not some fantasy bloodline.

I hope you are not suggesting that bloodlines define people.

Bingo. Yet many of them claim that they're 100% POLISH - which is utter nonsense when you look at how ridiculously messed up Polish history is.


Not me, but the American Polonia is rather fond of saying how much Polish blood they have. The line "100% POLISH BLOOD" seems to be quite common among the more ignorant ones.

But some were brought up 100% Polish just in America.

You have just tied yourself in a knot.

But were they? Pledging allegiance to a foreign flag every morning doesn't strike me as being 100% Polish, for instance. And not speaking the language fluently - well, they always say that you need to know the language to understand the culture.

(heck, from what I gather, you need to know Irish to understand Hiberno-English!)

Anyway, the whole something-American thing is just snobbery, nothing more.

seconded

Paying taxes in Poland makes you less Scottish? what about typing on a polish forums about how Polish people feel about their diaspora?


Do you speak Scottish Gaelic?

Can I use the cop-out that taxes paid in Scotland are given to the English oppressor?


Nope, there's no history of speaking it in my area. The North-East of Scotland never traditionally spoke it - we spoke Pictish, then moved to Scots - there was never any Gaelic dominance there.

What I mean though, is that often, the native culture of a country often influences the language. I found an absolutely fantastic essay a while ago online about how Irish influenced the English language there - I wish I could find it again :(

Only as a Celt :)



You have already answered above :)


Do.

Cultural identity is very interesting, especially how it changes.
People live and die because of it, some serious stuff, I am just trying to figure it out...
There is a very "Plastic" idea of culture in all countries.

The really, really fascinating one for me at the moment is with the Northern Irish Protestants - they identify as being British, but so many Brits are now identifying themselves as Scottish/Welsh/English - so what's going to happen with them if the UK splits up? They don't really identify themselves as being from any one particular place.

This thread is wandering from the opening post.

The one for me is Islam, it means something very different to today's interpretation and perception.
Islamic countries in the past were places of real scientific advancement.
But I can see the PF hate crew with their talons drawn to type "how wrong I am". So I will save it for another time.

Ireland will be fine now we are not at war.

Edit*


Fair cop guv, Halloween and alll :)

Americans, bunch of mixed up folk who us Europeans love to hate to love :p

Polish Americans should have a critical viewpoint?

Such as?

What do you mean?

Those that are people living in such places as North America, speak no polish, know nothing of polish history and at best has some distant polish great uncle is hardly polish. This is comparable to that disgraceful program jersey shore where they talk like americans, cant speak italian, and act like americans but say that they are italian. However if said person learns polish, polish history and at least visits poland than they could be considered polish. Those who are born in poland, to polish family are obviously polish. Even someone born to polish parents in america is polish, but it is vital to have a connection deeper than a name.

If a person moves away from poland it does not make them any less polish unless when faced with the decision of poland or america having chosen america. Even by some definitions they are still polish, but I would say somewhat traitorous.

As I can see, you live in Canada, so "you're still Polish" but somewhat "traitorous"? LOL

pinching pete wrote:


yep.

I don't consider myself to be a patriotic guy, but there are few things more annoying than listening to people go on and on about the USA when they've either never stepped foot in the country or better yet, have been there once on some BS two week tour and now think they got the whole place figured out.

Ethnicity is most important in the major cities in the northeast and great lakes states, less so in the South and West. So in NC I would imagine ethnicity is non existent. Also the Polish settled in the cities of the Great Lakes: Chicago, Milwaukee, Detroit, Cleveland, Buffalo. Outside of these cities you'll find a smattering of Polaks but they're probably well assimilated, therefore indistinguishable from other Americans.

...and why should you. You guys are lucky and no one is trying to take over your country.

BTW, I love your new money.