News / Poland to officially demand $1.32 trillion WW2 reparations from Germany [457]


Exactly. The loss of their eastern lands was a direct result of the lost war of nazi aggression, not of some sort of reparations deal between Germany and Poland. Bringing it up is useless in reparations discussion. You lose a war, you lose some land - nothing unusual here. However, if on top of that you organise the greatest genocide in human history against the country's population, murder its ruling class and intelligentsia, raze its capital to the ground and rob it blind, then reparations are definitely in order. Ask the French or the Brits how long it took Germany to pay all the reparations for WW1.

Luckily, as I said before, Germany doesn't have to pay a single dime. All they have to do to make the reparations nightmare disappear is to stop meddling in Poland's internal affairs, stop trying to install their Gauleiter in Warsaw, and start conducting more friendly policies regarding e.g. the EU funds for Poland. If they can find it in their hearts to accept that Poland is an independent country that has every right to order her internal affairs as she sees fit, then there will be no reparations issue to bother our German friends and neighbours. Can they do it? I hope so. :)

News / Poland to officially demand $1.32 trillion WW2 reparations from Germany [457]


Of course not. Even the former DDR lands are depopulating - who would settle in former Polish lands if Germany ever somehow regained them?

Pragmatism and political realism should rule the behaviour of states, especially the allied ones - yes, Poland and Germany are still allies (at least on paper). The question now is, can Germany accept strong, independent Poland, ruled by a conservative Christian coalition, not willing to accept either the cultural revolution or meddling in her internal affairs. If they can do so, then I am quite sure the issue of reparations will disappear as quickly as it recently appeared.

The ball is on the German side (as usual). :)

News / Poland to officially demand $1.32 trillion WW2 reparations from Germany [457]


Where are the Eastern territories that Poland lost on your map, pawian? They are the same in terms of area as those we got from Germany plus the equivalent of the entire Czech Republic.

The fact is that neither Germany nor Poland had anything to do with the land swap - it was ordered by Stalin and nobody asked either Poles or Germans if they were happy with it.

News / Poland to officially demand $1.32 trillion WW2 reparations from Germany [457]


As people they might be (some individuals). As countries, apparently not.

News / Poland to officially demand $1.32 trillion WW2 reparations from Germany [457]


Germany's case might (just might) be solid from the legal point of view but that's not the most interesting thing here.

The most interesting thing is the question of reconciling being a "moral superpower" - having the right to lecture others on pretty much everything - and "taking full responsibility" for III Reich's crimes while, at the same time, flatly refusing to pay for them. :)

Interesting from moral and pragmatic points of view, and yes - perhaps also from the legal one. Can you, legally, take full responsibility for something but refuse to pay for damages? As in - "yes, I take full responsibility for burning my neighbours house, raping his wife and killing his grandma BUT I am certainly not going to pay for it".


Of course. Poland have been trying for over 300 years and will continue to do so. The problem is - thieves, being thieves, are rather unwilling to return stolen goods.

ciekawostkihistoryczne.pl/2018/09/25/bezcenne-polskie-skarby-ktorych-nie-zobaczysz-nad-wisla-mozna-je-podziwiac-tylko-w/

News / Poland to officially demand $1.32 trillion WW2 reparations from Germany [457]


This should probably read "Germany can owe Poland something" (too late to edit). The English language... *rolls eyes*

News / Poland to officially demand $1.32 trillion WW2 reparations from Germany [457]


Apparently you fail to grasp the idea of legal continuity. Tacitus may not owe Kashub anything, but at the same time Germany can owe something to Poland. Modern Germany is the legal heir of the Third Reich and Germans build their image of a "moral superpower" on the fact that they admitted the crimes of Third Reich and accepted their consequences.

As far as the issue in question is concerned, Poland can take two approaches: moral approach or pragmatic approach. Let's take a look at both:

a) moral approach

German reaction to Polish demands is somewhat disgusting (at least for people with weak stomachs) - on the one hand we have undoubted fault: unjustified aggression, millions of slaughtered civilians, country in ruins, works of art stolen etc. etc. and on the other hand legal tricks and small print from the times when Poland was a Soviet puppet-state (and even then, questionable legal claims). Basically, what Germany is saying now is: "Yes, we take the responsibility for III Reich's crimes", so Poland says "Well, then pay up", to which Germany replies: "No, no - we take the responsibility, BUT we won't pay - we don't have to pay because of X*". Absolutely indefensible approach and morally vomit-inducing. In this scenario, Poland cools down the relations with Germany, maybe even to the point of Polexit, seeing that Germans still think it suitable to block Poland's European funds and try to meddle in affairs not covered by European treaties (e.g. much needed judicial reform) and feel it also suitable to lecture Poland on democracy and European values (!). An unlikely scenario? Perhaps.

b) pragmatic approach

Germans are still Germans. People don't change that much in 75 years and certainly not nations or countries. They are still the 1939 Germans** but, luckily, they are much more pragmatic now, so maybe we should adapt their approach too. Sure it's unfair, sure it's disgusting, but for an average Jan Kowalski Poland in the EU, strong economic ties with Western Europe and wide cooperation with Germany is much more important than moral high ground and satisfied righteous indignation. So, if Germany gives up the meddling in Poland's internal affairs, we should adapt the pragmatic approach and keep the widely understood cooperation with Germany as an important part of the EU, and put the issue of reparations ad calendas Graecas. An unlikely scenario? Perhaps.

*X = legal tricks and small print;

I would be inclined to adapt approach B. Having said that, German reaction surprises me. I would expect at least some sort of negotiations; certainly not the quick and cold "nein" that we heard. Surprising (or maybe not - see **). Oh, well.

News / Poland to officially demand $1.32 trillion WW2 reparations from Germany [457]


Yes, socialism (and its more radical kind - communism) is as disgusting and vomit-inducing as fascism (and its more radical kind - nazism). Having said that, I don't think Pawian is a leftist. He hates PiS and is old enough to remember "good old days", and he can surely draw numerous analogies between PiS and PZPR (also personal analogies - there's literally throngs of post-communist PZPR apparatchiks in PiS).

Po polsku / Jak zwykle chodzi o kasę! [48]

Próbowałeś kiedyś palić węglem brunatnym w piecu, Grunni? :) Dlatego pisałem o węglu opałowym, z którym jest problem. Ludzie jeżdżą nawet do Czech po węgiel, co jest już zupełnym kuriozum.

Po polsku / Jak zwykle chodzi o kasę! [48]

Spada, bo wzrasta krajowe wydobycie, zapewniane są nowe źródła dostaw, a magazyny mamy prawie pełne. Proste. Z gazem nie powinno być większego problemu (chociaż nadal z 20 mld m3, których potrzebujemy, mamy zapewnione około 17 mld), gorzej będzie z węglem opałowym. To jest jakaś paranoja, żeby w Polsce brakowało węgla.

History / The British Royal Family and Poland: Any connection? [70]


The actual noble top 1% were the worst c*nts, Jon. They were the ones collaborating with invaders (Radziwiłłs for example), blocking all social and economic reforms, and eventually leading to Poland's downfall in the 18th century.

The 10-20% of szaraczki weren't that bad - they were the ones in panzer cavalry banners, fighting and dying for Poland in countless wars, keeping the Polish language and traditions alive in the borderlands. They weren't too bad. But the top 1% were the c*nts of the first order and I would be ashamed to be in any way associated with them.

History / The British Royal Family and Poland: Any connection? [70]


Privileges and titles.

"Szlachecki stan społeczny został prawnie zniesiony na mocy konstytucji"

pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Szlachta_w_Polsce


It is not me, but you confusing things, Gruni. :) Farmers and taxi drivers are professions - not stany społeczne. LOL :D

And monastic vows can be revoked individually as well as the entire orders can be abolished (as it happened in history).


Oh, so you are not talking about those clowns today who claim to be counts, barons and princes? Good. However, at the height of its development nobility encompassed more than 10% of Polish society - mixed marriages throughout centuries could make anyone claim to be of noble ancestry today. This kind of nonsense has no place in modern society (unless it's for popular fun - a royal zoo, like in the UK), that's why it was abolished in 1921.

The fact that szlachecki stan społeczny został prawnie zniesiony means that nobody can claim to be a nobleman today. You can claim (God knows what for) noble ancestry and say that your family comes from some hrabia or książe but you cannot claim that you are a nobleman yourself. So there. :)

History / The British Royal Family and Poland: Any connection? [70]


And, as I wrote above, nobility was legally abolished altogether in 1921, so if anyone today claims to be a count, he probably uses one letter too many. :D

History / The British Royal Family and Poland: Any connection? [70]


The dynasty stopped because Sigmundus II Augustus (the last of Jagiellons) and Catherine Habsburg were childless.

Sigmundus died on 7th July 1572, and Poland moved into electoral kingdom era.


Poland has no royal family.

On the 17th March 1921, Polish constitution abolished the existence of nobility. So ever since then there are no kings, princes, barons or counts in Poland (there are some still some c*nts though).

Po polsku / Dyrdymałki o Niczem 2 [312]

@Alien

Jesteś na 100% pewny, że Cojest to Iron? Też tak myślałem, bo ma podobny styl pisania i wydawało mi się, że kiedyś omyłkowo odpisał komuś używając konta Ironside zamiast Cojestdocholery, ale mogę się mylić.

History / The British Royal Family and Poland: Any connection? [70]

@BratwurstBoy

Elisabeth II was practically Polish.

She was the daughter of George VI who was the son of George V who was the son of Edward VII who was the son of Victoria of Hannover who was the daughter of Edward August of Hannover who was the son of George III of Hannover who was the son of Frederich Ludwig of Hannover who was the son of George II of Hannover who was the son of George I of Hannover who was the son of Sophie Dorothea Wittelsbach who was daughter of Friedrich V who was son of Friedrich IV who was son of Ludwig VI Wittelsbach who was son of Maria Hohenzollern who was daughter of Casimir Hohenzollern who was son of Zofia Jagiellonka who was daughter of Kazimierz Jagiellończyk (Casimir IV Jagiellon)...

wikidata.org/wiki/Q53459

plotek.pl/plotek/7,154063,27520272,krolowa-elzbieta-ii-ma-polskie-korzenie-drzewo-genealogiczne.html

Of course, Lithuanians will tell you that Casimir wasn't Polish but Lithuanian, but you should ignore them.

Life / Poland's birthrate on the decline [480]

Well, you know the old rule - your age divided by two, plus seven. :)

Life / Poland's birthrate on the decline [480]


So, eventually she wanted children. I am talking about so-called stare panny 35+ - who never wanted and won't have children. In their case it was the nature acting, and it's for the greater good of humanity that they never multiplied.

Life / Poland's birthrate on the decline [480]


Remember - do NOT correct nature, Grunni. If some women don't want to have children, that means nature doesn't want them to multiply (and listening to some childless women I can imagine why nature doesn't want them to multiply :D). Don't force them. Don't reason with them. Nature doesn't want their genes to multiply (maybe it's a question of certain illnesses in future generations, maybe something else - nature knows the best).

Travel / Poland in photo riddles - part 2 [1680]

The prices of coal are exorbitant, so he bought them to keep himself warm in winter. Behind the closed doors of the cupboard he keeps a stock of active carbon capsules from your local pharmacy, and he will take them every day in winter not to sh*t himself from the cold.

Easy.

Po polsku / Dyrdymałki o Niczem 2 [312]

Nieogarnięty?

History / Anniversary of Soviet Invasion [116]

Thank you for your answer, BB. Finally! ;)

As for me, I would NOT be grateful to the rapist. I would console my wife, heal my wounds, regain my strength, and at the first opportunity I would kick the motherf*cker out of MY FUCKIN' HOUSE, no matter how "ungrateful" it might seem to the bastard.

I'm just casually mentioning this, because the question of gratitude would seem to be a recurring one, when it comes to Polish attitudes towards the Soviet Union. :)

History / Anniversary of Soviet Invasion [116]


Not really. You said that your fate would be better with bandit B than with bandit A. I asked: would you be grateful? Not "would you hate him less?", "would it be less harmful to you?", "would he do less terrible things to you?" No, I asked: W-O-U-L-D Y-O-U B-E G-R-A-T-E-F-U-L???

F*ck... my English must be really lousy, people just don't seem to understand my question. :-(

History / Anniversary of Soviet Invasion [116]

You didn't answer my question, BB. Would you - looking at your raped wife, stolen posessions and bruised face - be overwhelmed with the feeling of gratitude? Would you be grateful to the second bandit? Can anyone, please, give me the answer to the question that I'm actually asking? :)

P.S. Again, I am NOT asking which bandit A or B was better or less harmful.

History / Anniversary of Soviet Invasion [116]

@Alien

Again, I will repeat - that is not the point here. The second bandit was certainly less harmful than the first bandit, but would you feel gratitude to the second bandit? Would you be grateful? That was the question.

History / Anniversary of Soviet Invasion [116]

That's not the point, BB. The question was - should we be grateful?

OK, imagine a situation:

... there is a murderer in your house who already killed your grandma and clearly has intention of killing you, after he finishes with his other plans (stealing everything etc.) When it is about to happen, another bandit comes into your house - kills the murderer, rapes your wife, steals what the other one didn't, gives you a black eye, and stays for 50 years. Would you be grateful?

Would gratitude be the prevailing feeling in you???

History / Anniversary of Soviet Invasion [116]

Should we be grateful to the Soviet Union?

youtu.be/ICTTaQfNDqA

Po polsku / Dyrdymałki o Niczem 2 [312]


...i czego nie da się z dnia na dzień zmienić, ale gdyby tak zacząć na przykład od Tygodnia Kultury Osobistej (w polityce, pracy, szkole, życiu codziennym, internecie)? Spierać się, różnić, ale bez obelg, agresji i nienawiści. Potem ten tydzień można by było rozszerzyć do miesiąca, a poźniej... ale nie... chyba za bardzo się rozmarzyłem. :)

News / Strengthening and modernisation of Poland's armed forces - is it done sensibly? [7]

@mods

Could someone please correct the misspelling in the thread title ('strengthening'). Thanks.

@Alien

We are getting drones too but not nearly enough of them imo.