guesswho you miss understood, I mean in times of war how many would stick by poland in comparision with america, or as you pointed out canada. I did not choose canada over poland, residing here for a while does not imply that I am not loyal and that I will not come back. And I said maybe, because its not that cut and dry, you cant make assumptions like that while knowing very little.
Well, then make sure that next time, your expression won't give the reader any chance for speculations. I like that you used the word loyalty in your post. You asked, how many of them would fight for Poland in case of war? Actually a great question. I hope that at least the ones of them who were born in the US, would stick to us. I believe, the same you would expect from anyone who's born in Poland, right?
If they are the jersey shore type of poles (not nesecessarly to that extent of douchbaggery) then yes their dominant alignment with america is perfectly understandable. Maybe I am a little biased but if they have strong connections to Poland, through family or culture and they feel that association then I would be happy to see them show loyalty to poland. But to answer your yes I would hope that those born in poland would be loyal to it.
I believe you can count on most of the young immigrants, the ones that came here about hundred years ago are simply Americans with all they got and it would be unfair to expect from them more than keeping in touch with Polish culture but even if they don't, that should be accepted too.
Yes That would make sense but they should not be considered or worse, call themselves polish when the only conncection they have is ancestores, that is called heritage, especially 100 years ago. This is a different concept. I do believe that those who moved or have parents that moved and are "first gen" then they should keep in touch.
I do believe that those who moved or have parents that moved and are "first gen" then they should keep in touch.
Don't get me wrong, there's nothing with keeping in touch even if you're a 3d generation Pole but I was just trying to excuse those who just feel Americans and nothing else but that.
I’ve read some of your responses and I think I can help. I understand your frustration now, you're just not sure where to start learning about our nations.
Please read up on Chopin and "Mazurek. – Hopefully this sheds some light on traditions of Polonia. Feel free to ask questions. Read the words of Mazurek, there is a story... i.e."Póki my żyjemy" etc.
...and something about the US, google “a nation of immigrants” If you feel like it, go ahead and read the book.
No tears were shed, I apologize for the earlier response,,, there are lots of douchebags,(including me) on PF and I didn’t know you were Scottish.
Of course, but in their case, they have no real reason to. That's what makes it odd - you'd think that an American of Polish descent would be able to have a decent, critical viewpoint, but it seems that they have quite the opposite.
What do you mean by Polish Americans should have a decent critical viewpoint???
What do you mean by Polish Americans "have quite the opposite"??
What do you mean by Polish Americans should have a decent critical viewpoint???
I'd hope that they would be able to read history sources from different places and come to a balanced conclusion, rather than simply repeating whatever nonsense they read in Gazeta Polska.
What do you mean by Polish Americans "have quite the opposite"??
I mean that most of them are completely unable to make up their own minds, instead relying on what hateful, xenophobic newspapers tell them.
I'd hope that they would be able to read history sources from different places and come to a balanced conclusion, rather than simply repeating whatever nonsense they read in Gazeta Polska.
What does that mean?
What's an example of a Polish American doing that, whatever that is?
I mean that most of them are completely unable to make up their own minds, instead relying on what hateful, xenophobic newspapers tell them.
Oh yes, that was where I started really. Discovering why Poland mentioned Napoleon by name in their anthem was a great starting point :)
"We've been shown by Bonaparte Ways to victory"
The message of this verse is:
Polish people: let us learn from Bonaparte how to win, simple like budowa cepa
the song was written when Bonaparte was around fighting Krauts and winning hence his popularity with Polish. How did you interpret it? We love Bonaparte?
You're Scottish right? What’s your national anthem, do you guys even have one? I bet it’s something about Brits kicking your as$ all the time.
I don't know why Poles should be criticized for giving the leader of another nation credit in the Polish national anthem.
If anything it shows Poles are humble enough to give another nation credit which they felt it deserved and that maybe the Polish people themselves didn't always have the answers to everything. Its indirectly a humble self criticism of the Poles by themselves. Most nationalists of any country are NOT objective enough to give other nations credit for anything since they are blinded by their own nationalistic biases.
Most nationalists of any country are too ethno-centric to give other nations credit for anything, let alone do it in a nationalistic national anthem.
But I'm sure if the Polish national anthem was all about the Polish people and nothing else, the critics of Poles here would say "oh those Poles think they know everything', "their not objective" etc. lol
And end up exiled on St Helena, reviled throughout Europe and a prisoner of the British.
How is this relevant to the point I was trying to make up there?
Get a map. And look at it. You'll find that Scots are Brits too.
So now I wander, whenever i meet a scottish person they resent the english and welsh, when i ask them are you proud to be british? they just give me the finger. Pardon my ignorance, nevertheless you're right, Scots are British. Hopefully more of your Scottish buddies is reading this Jonni.
Please read up on Chopin and "Mazurek. – Hopefully this sheds some light on traditions of Polonia.
You mean, as soon as it looks like times are going to get tough, get out of Poland and then use one's family connections to make sure one won't get sent back to Poland but spend the rest of one's life idolising the Poland one refused to fight for? That sure sounds like Polonia to me.
First of all I'm not idolizing Poland, honestly, I’m more curious than “homesick”. I was just trying to explain the far reaching traditions of Polonia, that’s all.
I’m not afraid to fight, I served in the military. The majority of my family members were professional soldiers as well. Many many generations, stating with Prussians, Wehrmacht, the French Foreign Legion, US Army ending on the US Navy.
The real question is why do the majority of Polish in Poland think that Poland is not worth fighting for? Have you served in the military? Would you like to get drafted to wojska polskiego, Harry?
If anything it shows Poles are humble enough to give another nation credit which they felt it deserved and that maybe the Polish people themselves didn't always have the answers to everything.
Well...yeah...a national hymn has commonly a national theme...because beside the flag it is the symbol to rally under. Revering to a foreign power hungry, agressive dictator in a hymn could be seen as kind of bowing of a meek colony does to their imperial master.
The kicker is, why do people not living in Poland think it IS worth fighting for....
I remember as a kid some of our neighbors would laugh at my grandpa and call him a Nazi. People in Poland are very vindictive and bitter, i inherited some of that i guess. good character survival trait though.
Well, I would send some money to help a relative over there but other than that I've pledged my allegiance already, sorry.
What about the new generation of highly educated and skilled graduates who ended up in England or some other places? English people were wiping their butts with them by thousands for the past decade. I guess what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, right?
That place is still a "Kingsajz" jut a different flavor of it.
Szuflandia?? Szuflandia !? Plastic Pole "culture" lol... impostors
what a loser. i bet Johnny's parents were a bunch of nancies too scared to stay in Poland and throw rocks at the Germans as they approached their farm house :D
Get a map. And look at it. You'll find that Scots are Brits too.
I must admit, there's stupid, and then there's Polonia stupid.
Not only you dislike our Polonia, you think they are exceptionaly stupid. Bravo.
The American Polonia ("Polacks") are exceptionally stupid, yes. It's like they've taken the worst of Polish stupidity and incorporated it into American stupidity - yielding a particular blend of stupidity that only American Polacks could have.
Just throwing this one out there....any thoughts? Anyone offended? Hungry?
Yes :( Why the hell doesn't Europe do that kind of food well? :(
Your obsession with everything Polish is missing your love for Polish literature. Have you read any? And how much time have you spent among the Polish-Americans? In which U.S. city?
