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Poland's post-election political scene


OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
2 Apr 2017 #2,401
Constitution of the RP

Pig-faced ex-commieRzeplińslki violated the constituion which states that the Const. Tribunal function inaccordnace with the law. That implies the currently binding law. Rzeplo decided to follow an oudated law which was no longer binding.

Ever wonder why Gównaine Wieści and TV Nonsense have hidden that fact from the public?
mafketis 24 | 9,372
2 Apr 2017 #2,402
That implies the currently binding law

No. You really hate the law when it's not on your side. Laws that the Sejm passes that violate the constituion ARE NOT CONSTITUTIONAL!

At present Poland has no constitution because the commie-style party leader never intended to follow any law that restricts his power to hand out goodies to his toadies. I just hope that whatever he's handing out to you is worth it.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
2 Apr 2017 #2,403
Laws that the Sejm passes that violate the constituion ARE NOT CONSTITUTIONAL!

But who decides what the law is? Why, the Dear Leader Kaczyński of course!

At present Poland has no constitution

Quite. One reason why PiS wants to destroy the independent judiciary is that the Supreme Court is now the only competent institution able to interpret the Constitution correctly.

Still, one wonders what Polonius will write when the next government writes a law that bans PiS from politics. The law will say that the President's signature is not needed, and that the Constitutional Tribunal cannot rule on the law. According to Polly's logic, that will be just fine.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
2 Apr 2017 #2,404
GOOD NEWS FOR THE OPPOSITION

After a highly successful March in the opinion polls, the beginning of April brought great news for Poland's pro-democracy forces.

ewybory.eu/sondaze

As we can see from the above link, the centrist opposition from PO/N./SLD/PSL led the right wing pro-government forces 43.5% to 41.8%. Among votes that will definitely vote and have made up their minds, the centrist opposition leads 47.1% to 45.6%.

Votes are clearly rejecting the hateful and spiteful "government" led by two marionettes, instead preferring liberal democracy. With farmers due to march on Warsaw and a successful school strike, one wonders whether or not the government can even rule for 4 years instead of the 16 that they have previously proclaimed.

please note: this post has been written in the style of Polonius3
Ironside 50 | 10,939
2 Apr 2017 #2,405
Oh what a joy, some or other polls that you like. who cares about that? Polls stopped to be reliable in the last 20 years and in Poland never were even close to reliable. Unless 20% or 25% error margin you call acceptable.

What you call lib democracy in fact is a kleptocracy i.e. a bunch of useless post-commie morons who are worse than useless and who are not even attempt to do their job - like solving problems in the interests of Poland.
mafketis 24 | 9,372
3 Apr 2017 #2,406
What you call lib democracy in fact is a kleptocracy

Exactly what PiS is doing through nepotism and the appointment of unqualified dolts. Remember Pride of Poland? It took PiS one year to destroy three quarters of its previous value.

Good change?!?
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
3 Apr 2017 #2,407
whatever he's handing

That shows that you are obviously on the take. People of your ilk cannot fathom anyone doing something from higher motives, from a belief in values and pricniples without waiting for their 30 pieces of silver.

The constitution does not prohibit lawmakers from enacting laws. It does not brand changing laws regulating the Constitutional Tribunal law as illegal or requiring a 2/3 majority. The POO refgime regularly simply ignored the Tribunal's rulings and proceeded as if they didn't exist.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
3 Apr 2017 #2,408
People of your ilk cannot fathom anyone doing something from higher motives, from a belief in values and pricniples without waiting for their 30 pieces of silver.

Given the huge amount of stories concerning friends and acquaintances of Kaczyński earning huge sums of cash from state-owned companies, are you surprised that we have such views?

The POO refgime regularly simply ignored the Tribunal's rulings and proceeded as if they didn't exist.

That lie was thoroughly debunked by the Constitutional Tribunal.
Wulkan - | 3,250
3 Apr 2017 #2,409
the centrist opposition from PO/N./SLD/PSL

Not sure why you call them "centrist"
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
3 Apr 2017 #2,410
by the Constitutional Tribunal

The Tribunal led by ex-commie Rzepliński who sought to entrench the post-communist status quo. Not surprisng, since he was one of its chief beneficiaries.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
3 Apr 2017 #2,411
Tribunal

PO failed to impelment 48 TK rulings. But they got hold of clever, well-paid lawyers who alleged there was no absolute imperative to implement the TK's rulings nor does the t spell out any time-frane by which they are to be followed.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
3 Apr 2017 #2,412
You're spreading the tired out myth pushed by PiS.

The reality is that PO simply abandoned the unconstitutional parts of the law, which meant that they complied with the rulings. PiS tried to claim that as PO didn't do anything, they somehow disregarded the TK, but that's simply a lie.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
3 Apr 2017 #2,413
Anyway, more important news.

GREAT NEWS FOR CENTRIST OPPOSITION

In a poll conducted today by the highly respected IBRiS polling agency, the latest poll reveals that the centrist opposition in Poland are now pulling ahead in the polls. The highly discredited "good change" government led by PiS are clinging onto 1st place by the narrowest of margins, while voters are now clearly rejecting right wing politics in Poland.

PiS: 30.5%
PO: 29%
Kukiz'15: 8.8%
N.: 7.4%
PSL: 6.6%
SLD: 6%

This gives a result of 39.3% for right wing parties, while the centrist coalition is now on 49%. That's a 10% advantage for the opposition and proves that voters are unhappy with the "good changes".

Another poll was conducted by Pollster, which gave the following results:

PiS: 31%
PO: 26%
N. 11%
Kukiz'15: 11%
SLD: 12%
Razem: 5%

This poll would put the right wing on 42% vs 54% for the centrist-left opposition.

With these levels of support, there are serious questions over whether this government can even survive 4 years.
Wulkan - | 3,250
3 Apr 2017 #2,414
centrist-left opposition

So now it's centrist-left? LOL
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
3 Apr 2017 #2,415
It gets even better. I've just discovered the seat distribution based on the above results.

IBRiS polls:

PiS: 180
PO: 168
K'15: 41
PSL: 26
N. 25
SLD: 19
MN: 1

Centrist: 239
Right: 221
Wulkan - | 3,250
3 Apr 2017 #2,416
It gets even better.

Amazing! could you do the count down of the days to the next election? It would keep excited and in faith.
Wulkan - | 3,250
3 Apr 2017 #2,418
Such a shame the election day is not tomorrow is it? :-)
Ironside 50 | 10,939
3 Apr 2017 #2,419
Exactly what PiS is doing

Actually, if they do it, they're doing it on considerable lesser scale and what more corruption is not their unofficial standard policy like it was in the case of PO.

"unqualified dolts"
All governments for the last 30 years in Poland put those unqualified dolts in the position of power. That is weaved into the fabric of the political system and still there due to a social-economical dynamic reality in Poland. Al those factors do not change with the change of a government.

"Good change?!?"
Change takes time. Its too early to say with any dose of certainty if is it a good change or not.

Not sure why you call them "centrist"

He calls them centrist because even leftie progressives split into fractions. That is until they reach they ultimate goal - a totalitarian regime in power.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
4 Apr 2017 #2,420
can even survive 4 years

Poll resutls have absoltuely no bearing on parliamentary arithmetic. As long as PiS, usually with Kukiz support have a majority, all is well and the good changes can proceed apace,
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
4 Apr 2017 #2,421
glad to be rid

Poland will be glad to be rid of Kwaśniewski's post-commie constitution which was adotped in a referendum when no-one (except the movers nad shakers of III RP) had any idea of how it would operate in practice. Now it is onbvious that it has petrified the round-table clique and served no more than about one-fourth of hte nation. For the rest it has meant a de-polonised economy with dead-end jobs at home or menial labour abroad for non-clique members -- the vast majority of Poles.
mafketis 24 | 9,372
4 Apr 2017 #2,422
Poland will be glad to be rid of Kwaśniewski's post-commie constitution which was adotped in a referendum

Horrible, horrible democracy. How you must hate it!

Now it is onbvious that it has petrified the round-table clique and served no more than about one-fourth of hte nation

What about purple flying unicorns? Or the tooth fairy union? As long as we're talking about made up fantasy creatures.

a de-polonised economy with dead-end jobs at home or menial labour abroad for non-clique members

I'll say it again. Any growing business goes through a phase where there's too much work for the founder(s) but not enough to justify hiring people. Many businesses fail to break through that and either fail or limit their operations to stay at manageable size.

A national economy is similar, there will come a time (during growth) where old salaries aren't enough but businesses cannot realistically pay more. It's frustrating but rather than find a way to work through it and get ot a stage where salaries can be increased pay many Polish people (and some non-Poles like you) have decided to retreat into PRL ghettoization and blame their problems on non-existent bogeymen. So sad.
Ziemowit 13 | 4,279
4 Apr 2017 #2,423
all is well and the good changes can proceed apace,

To support Pol3's claim, here is a short poem. The poem is in Polish, so it will loose in translation to English, thus I'm quoting it in Polish as it reflects pretty well what Polonius3 is telling us about the'good change'.

To wie każdy ziomal z mego PGR-u,
że czeka nas świetlana przyszłość z Kaczyńskim u steru!
Na każde dziecko po 500 dają,
a za szlugi i wino akcyzy nie podwyższają!
Kraj ten słoniną i wódką płynie! Jarosław jest Bogiem,
tak twierdzą wszyscy w mej gminie!


The language of this forum is English, in future provide a translation
mafketis 24 | 9,372
4 Apr 2017 #2,424
A very free (and Americanized) version

All the folks round my place, they need a New Deal
And the future looks bright with Kaczynski behind the wheel,
For every kid you make, he gives a hundred bucks a pop,
And as for smokes and booze he's made the taxes stop!
It's the land of lard and vodka, under Jaroslaw the Great,
That's what they're all a' sayin' around my garden gate
Ziemowit 13 | 4,279
4 Apr 2017 #2,425
free (and Americanized) version

Wow, I am truly amazed that you are so good at translating Polish rap poetry into American English. Chapeau bas ! Szacun!
mafketis 24 | 9,372
4 Apr 2017 #2,426
you are so good at translating Polish rap poetry into American English

It's my gift...... and my burden.... (lowers head and stares at floor).
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
4 Apr 2017 #2,427
non-existent bogeymen

--The legions of non-lustrated SB types that got above-average salaries for a quarter-century while their erstwhile victims sffered poverty;
--Michnik and other with KPP family roots and various supportive wannabes (Lis, Kraśko, Żakowski, etc.) calling the shots and serving as "enlghtened" pundits for a quarter-century;

--Selling off domestic assets and creating an economic dictatorship of foreign banks, retails chains, phamaceutical firms, etc. in exchnage for hefty kickbacks;
--A judiciary indulgent and lenient towards scams and indiviudal conmen robbing the country of millions whilst jailing someone who threw a cream torte to protest against leniency towards the commie gestapo;

--Purveyors of anarcho-porno-libertine ("anything goes"), anti-Catholic lifestyles alien to the traditonal Polish way of life;
--The liberal-leftist media monopoly passed all the above off as proper, modern, pluralistic, global, etc., etc., called the post-commie roundtable clique III RP and for 25 years convinced much of society that this is how things had to be....until many Poles finally realised they were living in a foreign country and rebelled at the polls in 2015.

These are not bogeymen but the one-quarter of Polish society who have benefited from transformation.
mafketis 24 | 9,372
4 Apr 2017 #2,428
--The legions of non-lustrated SB types that got above-average salaries for a quarter-century while their erstwhile victims sffered poverty

If there were "legions" of them then Poland never would have exited communism peacefully.

Selling off domestic assets

no one says the transfer was handled perfectly, but most of the assets sold were sinking in debt and could not be made to be profitable

Purveyors of anarcho-porno-libertine ("anything goes"), anti-Catholic lifestyles alien to the traditonal Polish way of life

Anything goes is a founding principal of western civilization (it's at the heart of it and science and technology would be impossible without it). Would you prefer the tender ministrations of Russia instead?

many Poles finally realised they were living in a foreign country and rebelled at the polls in 2015

The same ones that "supported socialism" back in the day?
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
4 Apr 2017 #2,429
Anything goes

Anything goes means no morals, no ethics, no restraint, no right and wrong, only money talks, might makes right, the survival of the fittest and a dog eat dog world.
Harry
4 Apr 2017 #2,430
no morals, no ethics, no restraint, no right and wrong, only money talks, might makes right, the survival of the fittest

The only difference between what you rant about above and the PiSlamic State is that the PiSlamic State is all about the survival of The Dear Leader Chairman Kaczynski.

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