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Poland's post-election political scene


pweeg3
6 Mar 2016 #1,291
On the one hand it would be difficult to sell my land.

On the other, there will be loads of cheap farmland available with nobody but me able to afford to buy it. My neighbours are old and would like to sell up.
dolnoslask
6 Mar 2016 #1,292
" My neighbours are old and would like to sell up." Everything sells at a fair market price.
The trouble is that some farmers (Including some of my neighbors) have been hanging on to their land (Speculating) or advertising it at crazy prices in the hope that 2016 would open the floodgates to rich foreign buyers that will pay the silly prices that they want.

Some of these "Poor farmers" openly boast to me about how much they get from the EU to do nothing with the land, some of the sums quoted are a tidy little earner for doing nothing.

Now the government has effectively put an end to their greedy speculation things may improve.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
6 Mar 2016 #1,293
On the other, there will be loads of cheap farmland available with nobody but me able to afford to buy it. My neighbours are old and would like to sell up.

It will only end in people connected to the Party leasing large farms for a minimal price so that they can profit. The ANR will be the only buyer in some of these places, and so they'll be able to put together large collective farms so that Piotr the Party member can cash in from the CAP that rewards larger farms.

All in all, very obvious and blatant.
pweeg3
6 Mar 2016 #1,294
Some of these "Poor farmers" openly boast to me about how much they get from the EU to do nothing with the land, some of the sums quoted are a tidy little earner for doing nothing.

The EU money is tiny (1500pln for 2.5 ha for example).. I find it unlikely anyone thinks its a viable living depending on EU money rather than farming as well.
dolnoslask
6 Mar 2016 #1,295
(1500pln for 2.5 ha for example).. I agree the locals farm a swell as pocketing the cash.

But think about it ,If I took the 1500zl it would pay my agricultural rates and bin collection for the year 500zl the 1000zl left over would buy me 6 cubic meters of dry firewood. if I had another 2.5ha it would cover the electricity and food.

So for an investment of (30,000zl (going price per ha class 3) x 4.5ha) = 135,000zl aint bad to have the basics covered, I think this could be tempting for the poles who have made some capital abroad and wish to return.

If the land speculators got in to the market , the above may not be a option in the future.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
6 Mar 2016 #1,296
I think this could be tempting for the poles who have made some capital abroad and wish to return.

The problem with this whole system is that it ensures that anyone who doesn't meet the criteria to be called a 'farmer' will no longer be able to get into it. It's stupid and ridiculous - there's so much land in dolnoslaskie that could be used more productively. For instance - adoriavineyards.com/en/?ts=1457285718 - the slopes of Dolnoslaskie are perfect for wine, and the guy that started this is an American professor. Now - anyone wanting to join him won't be allowed to do so, which is madness.

If there is to be a restriction, the best restriction would be to require farmers to live on the land.

(anyway, I've stuck an offer in for some land not far from me. Might as well get in there before the law changes)
dolnoslask
6 Mar 2016 #1,297
Delph If Under a hectare i think you would be ok after May
pweeg
6 Mar 2016 #1,298
So for an investment of (30,000zl (going price per ha class 3)

That's cheap. The advertised prices I've seen north of Krakow start at 8 pln m2 and rise to much more.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
7 Mar 2016 #1,299
these large farms

Have you forgotten how PO/PSL and other governments had invited huge foreign corporations like Smithfield and enabled them to take over and devastate huge chunks of farmland for the raising. The resultant concentration of highly toxic pig manure caused an ecological disaster polluting ground water and the atmosphere for miles around.

But no matter. The proper ministers got their under-the-table kickbacks.

PO/PSL

The president's near-accident is turning up signifcant details on how the post-nomenklatura clique operated under the supportive blind-eye of the PO/PSL regime.
BOR (Government Protection Service), responsible for the safety of prominent officials, were long rumoured to have effectively functioned as an SB II, a safe haven for former PRL security types. Now it turns out that BOR had enlisted the services of a company called Konsalnet, set up by former communist secret police and military intelligence officers. Konsalnet have derived great benefits from cushy government contracts, some of which ended in scandal. These are the kind of people the KOD mob are defending.

wsieci.pl/firma-bylych-sb-kow-w-bor-pnews-2709.html
dolnoslask
7 Mar 2016 #1,300
I have driven thousands of miles in BMW's with standard equipment run flats and never had a blowout, Its not like having a nail go into the tyre, there must have been some kind of catastrophic failure of one huge piece of shrapnel in the road.

Which brings the question, if his car was armored the tyres would be special manufactured to take the weight and armor piercing bullets.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
7 Mar 2016 #1,301
Which brings the question, if his car was armored the tyres would be special manufactured to take the weight and armor piercing bullets.

Knowing the Poles, probably the tyres were bought off the shelf from Paweł's kwik opony.

Another day, and more megalolz.

Following the emergence of a security services file allegedly pertaining to actor Jerzy Zelnik, the 70-year-old has released a statement asking for "forgiveness"[...] Zelnik had been a staunch supporter of the so-called 'lustration' process that has long been championed by the Law and Justice party.

Bwahahha. The hypocrisy among PiS supporters is hysterical.

thenews.pl/1/9/Artykul/243661,Kaczynskisupporter-tainted-by-security-services-files
dolnoslask
7 Mar 2016 #1,302
The Man said "facing the truth is the best solution."

Fair enough
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
7 Mar 2016 #1,303
Another day

Another day and another round of boringly predictable PiS-bashing. Some blokes just ain't got no imagination and are incapable of anything creative innovative. Everything's got to be according to one run-of-the-mill stereotype.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
7 Mar 2016 #1,304
Just to close the day, another example of corruption and fraud in Kaczyński's Brave New Poland.

bbc.com/news/science-environment-35720335
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
7 Mar 2016 #1,305
Just to close the day

Just to close the day, now it's official, The "freedom-loving" Tusk regime sent their secret services to spy (bugging, billing checks and other surveillance techniques) on dozens of Polish journalists who wrote articles unfavourable to the ruling group.

Meanwhile, PM Szydło has on her desk a report on the audits carried out in various PO/PSL-era ministries. They project a dismal, at times downright criminal image of Poland.

wiadomosci.dziennik.pl/polityka/artykuly/514233,pis-audyt-koalicja-po-psl-rzad-raport-rzeczpospolita-opozycja-podsumowanie.html
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
8 Mar 2016 #1,306
Polonius, those "audits" aren't worth a thing.

When companies in the real world do audits, they get people unconnected to the company to do the auditing. They don't do it themselves. Notice how they're already threatening PO/PSL with the prosecutor - as I said, it's all about creating a climate of fear. Put a few people through a long and protracted legal battle with a prosecution service that's completely under the control of the government, and you've got the perfect intimidation.

If you don't see anything wrong with the prosecution service controlled by PiS going after members of the former government, then you must have been delighted in the PRL era when the government subjected members of Solidarność to show trials. The two are exactly the same - abusive and undemocratic.
gregy741 4 | 1,204
8 Mar 2016 #1,307
it's all about creating a climate of fear.

nah...its called :"Law and Justice"

PRL era when the government subjected members of Solidarność to show trials

the ones that were subjected to PRL prosecutions are fully supporting PIS now, in bringing SB and commies collaborators ,PO thieves to justice ...
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
8 Mar 2016 #1,308
nah...its called :"Law and Justice"

As if. It's called "eliminating political opposition". It's also called "trying to bury the bad news about the Venice Commission's report".

There's nothing Law and Justice about PiS - if there was, they wouldn't be appointing people suspected of corruption to top jobs. More to the point, they wouldn't be putting a guilty criminal in charge of the CBA.

Mind you, given that you openly supported corruption by PiS, you probably think that it's entirely acceptable for the government to abuse members of the opposition. Just wait until it's a family member that gets arrested on false charges after he refuses to sell his land to a PiS member ;)
gregy741 4 | 1,204
8 Mar 2016 #1,309
As if. It's called "eliminating political opposition". It's also called "trying to bury the bad news about the Venice Commission's report".

i think you should check dictionary.
"creating a climate of fear"- i do understand such words like law and justice alone,will spread fear and terror among PO thieves.this is not surprising
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
8 Mar 2016 #1,310
"creating a climate of fear"- i do understand such words like law and justice alone,will spread fear and terror among PO thieves.this is not surprising

Don't worry Gregy, when your PiS boys are all languishing in prison after a popular revolt, we promise not to laugh at them ;)

Having said that, watching Kaczyński attack KOD personally seems that he's very, very afraid. Wonder why? If KOD were as meaningless as PiS supporters claim, why even mention KOD?
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
8 Mar 2016 #1,311
languishing in prison

Sooner the PO/PSL mob will be behind bars after consequences are drawn from the already completed, ongoing and planned audits of their numerous misdeeds and scams. Get set to take them a cake (with a file inside).
gregy741 4 | 1,204
8 Mar 2016 #1,312
watching Kaczyński attack KOD personally seems that he's very, very afraid.

no fear detected.nobody is afraid of some mob of grumpy pensioners shouting insults trough their Dentures.Soros dollars not gonna help much in this revolution.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
8 Mar 2016 #1,313
Sooner the PO/PSL mob will be behind bars after consequences are drawn from the already completed, ongoing and planned audits of their numerous misdeeds and scams.

So you're effectively admitting that PiS intend to try and imprison members of the opposition using evidence that PiS themselves have created. How very...PZPR.

In the meantime, in the real world, there is a flu epidemic, and I am one of it's victims.

I think you should demand an investigation to punish those responsible. It's what Duda would have done.
Dougpol1 32 | 3,245
8 Mar 2016 #1,314
an investigation to punish those responsible

Yeah. If it were an opposition leader and the accident had resulted in injury the driver would have been done for speeding. Obviously there is more to this accident than we know.
milky 13 | 1,657
8 Mar 2016 #1,315
no fear detected

Maybe, you are blinded by hate!
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
8 Mar 2016 #1,316
Another day, another excellent example of the "good, change". This is an article talking about how the bank/insurance taxes have hurt us considerably.

natemat.pl/173587,jak-program-500-zlotych-na-dziecko-skubnal-mnie-na-79-zl-w-ubezpieczeniach-kolejny-efekt-pis-drozeja-polisy

There drivers who paid low OC of 350 dollars per year, and now pay almost 600 zł. The premiums we pay once a year so "good change" is immediately visible. The account of the bank I had 8 increases, unfavorable for the customer. It is also the result of PiS.

Good old socialist economics. In exchange for bribing part of society, everyone loses out in the process. I've got my insurance renewal coming up in a couple of weeks - and I've already just found out that the "good, change" has resulted in my European car breakdown cover going from just over 100zł/year to 300zł - and that's with PZU, the state-controlled insurer.

Meanwhile, this government is going around appointing all their friends and supporters to top, high paying positions - people that won't care if it costs them 300zł instead of 100zł because they're all on ridiculously high salaries. It's communism through and through.
Ziemowit 13 | 4,279
8 Mar 2016 #1,317
another excellent example of the "good, change"

I've already just found out that the "good, change" has resulted in my European car breakdown cover

What the hell is this comma in "good, change" for in your both utterances? You don't understand basic Polish or is it just playing with words? The Polish original is "dobra zmiana", so this should be translated into English as "good change" without any comma between them. The adjective "good" is a qualifier to the noun "change", so no need for a comma there.
Ironside 50 | 10,939
8 Mar 2016 #1,319
The hypocrisy among PiS supporters is hysterical.

What hypocrisy? Are you struggling with the meaning of that word?

a popular revolt

In your dreams those footie KOD supporters would revolt, majority of them is in their late 50 and 60. Unless you are talking a coup financed from abroad. That wouldn't work in Poland.
Ziemowit 13 | 4,279
8 Mar 2016 #1,320
"dobra, zimana" is used by the opposition.

I wonder why it is. If so, the opposition is rather silly here because it would imply that PiS has simply made a change of people in government only and not a change in the practices of government. And if the nature of that present change is judged bad (which is a normal practice for any opposition), the same should be said about the nature of things as they had been carried out before that change, that is at the time when the present opposition was in government.

No, Delph, you should be much more careful in choosing your wording because the "dobra, zmiana" phrase isn't the lucky one here and is disrespectful for the present opposition really.

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