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Poland's post-election political scene


delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
19 Feb 2016 #991
It's amazing to think that incompetence on such a scale is even possible.

It gets better. The draft budget passed assumes inflation of 1.7% in 2016. In 2015, inflation was on average at -0.87%.

It's also worth pointing out that the budget assumes a deficit of no more than 57 billion złoty. So far, debt has increased by 20 billion. These economics are very much PiS-onomics. Don't worry, PiS voters, you'll be free of the factory soon, mainly because the factory will cease to exist.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
19 Feb 2016 #992
It gets better

To PiS-bashers all, sundry and garden variety alike:

All we are saying is -- GIVE PiS A CHANCE!
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
19 Feb 2016 #993
GIVE PiS A CHANCE!

Why? They've increased Polish debts by 20 billion in less than 7 weeks, they've failed to pay our farmers on time (despite PO/PSL managing just fine) and they've turned Poland into an international laughing stock.

By the way, you do realise that it's mostly Germans that have been buying Polish debts? What was that about foreigners running Poland?
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
19 Feb 2016 #994
Why?

Because every new govt deserves a period of grace, usually 100 days. PiS not only did not get it, but the kosherites were spewing their vicious bile even before they were elected and a few days after election there were pre-KOD-ites saying idiotic things like: They seized (?) power and haven't done a thing so. When the government and Sejm soon started enacting legislation, the nitpickers changed their tune and said they were going too fast. Meanwhile, the subversive trough-defenders created an artificial crisis by internationalising Poland's internal rows through their shameless sntichery. Overall, an excellent setting for any government to function in, innit?

That's the way it was. But I'm sure it's not in sync with the prejudiced, vitriolic distortions you repeatedly spew on this forum.
mafketis 24 | 9,387
19 Feb 2016 #995
PiS not only did not get it,

Maybe taking a dump on the constitution and rule of law had something to do with that....
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
19 Feb 2016 #996
Have you noticed that there's always an excuse with them? It was the same with the free medicine for over 75's that they promised - they turned round straight after the election and said "we didn't say how much medicine would be free". Likewise with the retirement age - "we didn't make a hard commitment". Or with the higher tax free amount - "actually we think it's not a wise idea".

I hope all those PiS voters choke on their broken promises.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
19 Feb 2016 #997
the constitution and rule of law

Those issues have already been resolved. Let's not forget the constitution was the baby of ex-PZPR Central Committee member Kwaśniewski whose propaganda machine deceived Poles into backing it in a referendum. Little did they know they were voting to entrench the PZPR-KOR-collaborationist Solidarność clique in the service of foregn interest groups. It should definitely be amended or a new one should be promulgated.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
20 Feb 2016 #998
Devastating poll just released :

wyborcza.pl/1,75478,19650405,tns-49-procent-uwaza-ze-sprawy-w-polsce-ida-w-zlym-kierunku.html

49% of Poles think that the country is going in a bad direction, while only 31% think that Poland is going in a good direction.
Wulkan - | 3,250
20 Feb 2016 #999
Devastating poll just released :

Devastating is the source you gave: wyborcza has zero credibility.
mafketis 24 | 9,387
20 Feb 2016 #1,000
Those issues have already been resolved.

Yes. There is no functioning constitution and there is rule of party rather than rule of law.

deceived Poles into backing it in a referendum

You realize, for a soi disant Polish patriot you make Poland seem like the most pathetic country in the world and Poles like the biggest dupes - constantly oppressed and deceived and exploited (and PiS does't want it any other way) why would anyone want to be associated with such a huge lot of losers is beyond me.

Fortunately I live in a different place - which has had and continues to have problems but which is mostly developing pretty well.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
20 Feb 2016 #1,001
Latest story :

It transpires that Mariusz Błaszczak, Minister of the Interior from PiS appointed to the position of Chief of Police - a person that is already under investigation by the BSW, the Office for Internal Affairs in the Police. He was under investigation for corruption. The problem lies in that the BSW answers to the Chief of Police. Błaszczak knew about the investigation, yet still appointed someone to the job who was nicknamed "Beria" by colleagues for his attitude towards them.

Within two months, the new Commander Maj fired the entire management of the BSW (as in those that knew about the investigation) as well as all the district and provincial commanders. He then proceeded to resign himself last week. The police are now in a state of chaos and uncertainty.

The corruption within PiS continues relentlessly. Just like all good Communists, they accused and then proceeded to do exactly the same thing themselves. Interestingly, Błaszczak is also a member of the PiS inner circle with Bierecki.
Harry
20 Feb 2016 #1,002
Latest story :

No, it isn't the latest. Earlier this week Blaszczak was calling suggestions that he should resign "the result of hysteria by the opposition". However, that was the same day it came out that The Dear Leader Chairman Kaczynski had been to hospital, so it very much appears that distraction story worked, for a couple of days anyway.

Frankly the PISlamic State is screwing up so many things and making so many blatantly wrong decisions that it's almost impossible to keep up.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
20 Feb 2016 #1,003
I'm pretty sure that story about the hospital was completely fake.

As for keeping up - I read the other day that KOD are actively compiling and keeping track of everything that this government is doing for future reference. There won't be any easy escape for this bunch of criminals. The best part? Kaczyński is getting on in age, but most of his henchmen are all very young men.

Nothing to say about Błaszczak appointing a man he knew to be under investigation for corruption to be the Chief of Police?
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
20 Feb 2016 #1,004
Nothing to say

One cannot follow every single thread with so much going on. Only brainless PiS-bashers constantly consult websites monitoring every time an MP or other or belches.
Ironside 50 | 10,940
20 Feb 2016 #1,005
There's long been a healthy contempt for the behaviour of the church, and the RCC in Poland is currently very problematic.

Nah, you seemingly filed to understand that relation between the RCC and Poles that has nothing to do with religion per se. I'm talking about something that Poles have in common a certain consensus about the role of the RCC in the Polish culture and history.

Those who don't partake in that consensus are a foreign implant in the Polish culture, mainly of the soviet origin. That break is visible in every sphere of activity and correspond with political divide in Poland.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
20 Feb 2016 #1,006
KOD are actively compiling and keeping track

Their snitchery knows no bounds. When will they strike again and try to drag Polands' internal affairs into the international forum to blacken their country's image. They've tried to involve the EU amd otehr euro-bodies in the rumpus. Now maybe they'll want to embroil the UN. I wouldn't put it past them. Once they stopped their still but national image-damaging marches, the złoty strengthened and has kept well below the $1 = 4 zł mark.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
20 Feb 2016 #1,007
A very nice article here :

There is no money for pre-election promises. And PiS knows it.

polityka.pl/tygodnikpolityka/kraj/1651586,1,nie-ma-pieniedzy-na-przedwyborcze-obietnice-i-pis-dobrze-o-tym-wie.read

The article goes on to explain why the 50 billion 'hole' in VAT simply didn't exist and the government have gone quiet about it. It also explains why Deputy Prime Minister Morawiecki said that 8,000zł tax free isn't going to happen and why even 5,000zł tax free is unlikely to happen.

Later on, it explains why Duda's bill to help Swiss Franc mortgage holders is being ignored because it's financially wreckless and that the NBP + KNF have said that the cost is likely to be around 44 billion - which would completely destabilise the banking system and the złoty, so it's also unlikely to happen.

Finally, the retail tax - PiS are backing off on it, because it's now becoming obvious that the Polish suppliers stand to lose a considerable amount of money because of it. The bank tax has resulted in higher fees and commissions - and banks have completely ignored the threats from the government.

The article ends with -

PiS wants, but cannot.

gumishu 11 | 5,605
20 Feb 2016 #1,008
The article goes on to explain why the 50 billion 'hole' in VAT simply didn't exist

the article does not explain anything of that kind

polskieradio.pl/42/4393/Artykul/1542599,Nowa-ustawa-o-VAT-ma-uszczelnic-system-podatkowy-Ale-czy-ulatwi-rozliczanie

this article explains a lot about the VAT problem - except for why PiS suspended the introduction of a new VAT law (the article is not so recent)
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
21 Feb 2016 #1,009
the article does not explain anything of that kind

I mean that the article explained why PiS have given up trying to find this imaginary hole - it simply isn't there.

The new VAT law was a mess - lawyers looked at it and found that it appeared to have been written by a child. It was full of mistakes and had plenty of provisions that were incompatible with the EU VAT directives. The 200zł fee to change business data also aroused a lot of anger from small businesses. The other problem was that the Urzad Skarbowy simply weren't able to implement a new law like that - these things take a lot of time and planning, and the government couldn't afford to have people using the new law to their benefit due to the legal problems that it contained.

Any plan to solve problems with VAT should attract cross party support. It's an obvious thing that everyone will support, but you can't just rush a law in without discussing it properly and allowing everyone to have their say.

Fantastic article in the Financial Times about Wałęsa - blogs.ft.com/the-world/2016/02/who-in-poland-benefits-from-walesa-allegations/

It explains it nicely - the whole attack on Wałęsa is clearly to try and discredit the opposition to PiS. TVP is being openly used for anti-Wałęsa propaganda, but it seems that PiS have forgotten one thing - this is exactly what the Communists tried to do to him. If Soviet-backed Poland couldn't destroy him, what hope does a bitter man and a bunch of opportunists have?
Librarius - | 91
21 Feb 2016 #1,010
Fantastic article in the Financial Times about Wałęsa

... like many of Poland's friends in western Europe, Walesa is deeply troubled by the government's effort to seize control of institutions such as the constitutional court and the state broadcasting system. Walesa has called PiS a threat to Polish democracy and has called for early elections. [...] In this context it should be kept in mind that the Institute of National Remembrance, the state investigative agency that released the latest documents in the Walesa affair, is politically close to PiS.

This leaves no room for unexpected events like seeking money 'poor Mrs Kiszczak,' selling needless documents from 'the private archive' of the late Mr Kiszczak.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
21 Feb 2016 #1,011
Fantastic article

You seem to suggest that he is right who shouts the loudest. The lefty-lib narration like that spewed by the Michnik clique gets quick and easy play in the West's leftstream media, but does that make it right. That corelation is what has enabled KOD to cause so much damage to Poland's image through their unending PiS-bashing rants.
mafketis 24 | 9,387
21 Feb 2016 #1,012
but does that make it right

Yes. Yes it does. Thank you for asking. You may now put this useful knowledge to use.

unending PiS-bashing

I don't think PiS will govern well because they're too obsessed about getting revenge for past slights (real or imagined) and they realize their supporters are largely economic losers who might stop voting for them if they became economic winners.

Reasoned criticism or bashing?
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
21 Feb 2016 #1,013
past slights

Past slights? The PO-built hate indsurty has never been put on hold. It continues to turn over at 8000 rpm 24/7.
All we are saying is: GIVE PiS A CHANCE!
The Duda-Kaczyński-Morawiecki-Szydło quadrumnvirate will eventually prevail and pull Poland out of the mess created by the PZPR/KOR/KOD clique in the service of foreign-interest groups.

ŻEBY POLSKA BYŁA POLSKĄ!
gumishu 11 | 5,605
21 Feb 2016 #1,014
the article does not explain anything of that kind

have you read the article I posted - its lengthy but worth reading - and yes the article says there is a lot of VAT abuse in Poland
jon357 66 | 17,078
21 Feb 2016 #1,015
I don't think PiS will govern well because they're too obsessed about getting revenge for past slights (real or imagined

This seems to be a real theme for JK and those around him. He really does wish that it was he and not Lech Wałęsa who was the hero of the Solidarity movement.

and they realize their supporters are largely economic losers who might stop voting for them if they became economic winners.

Bingo. It suits them to keep people impoverished and bitter.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
21 Feb 2016 #1,016
have you read the article I posted - its lengthy but worth reading - and yes the article says there is a lot of VAT abuse in Poland

Unfortunately, the real level of abuse seems to be much lower than PiS were talking about. A new VAT system will go into place in the next few months which will reduce fraud dramatically, but the expectation is that around 16 billion will be found. The 50 billion seems to have been a figure made up to justify their promises, nothing more.
Ironside 50 | 10,940
21 Feb 2016 #1,017
This seems to be a real theme for JK

Yeah, Kiszczak's widow as a prominent PiS agent. whew...
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
21 Feb 2016 #1,018
VAT abuse

They even tried to explain it onTV. A company issues an invoice for non-existent goods and then exchanges it with another company's invoice for non-existent goods and then both sides somwehow collect VAT on the non-existent transaction. Does that make any sense?
jon357 66 | 17,078
21 Feb 2016 #1,019
Yeah, Kiszczak's widow as a prominent PiS agent. whew...

WTF?

Perhaps you should wait until she (if she ever does) explain her motivation. I suspect the good general's widow might be acting out of more than just a pecuniary motive.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
21 Feb 2016 #1,020
A company issues an invoice for non-existent goods and then exchanges it with another company's invoice for non-existent goods and then both sides somwehow collect VAT on the non-existent transaction.

Yes, it's a huge problem in the EU, and it's caused by the idiotic way that VAT rates are not harmonised across the EU. The logical thing would be for a single EU VAT rate, set at the average of the current 28 rates. But because member states are idiots, we have the situation that the VAT system is wide open for abuse.

This article explains it, but it's a bit technical - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missing_trader_fraud

PO started working on this, and PiS should finish the job - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAF-T - which essentially makes the job of the tax office much easier. The estimate I've seen suggests 15-16 billion złoty will be saved when the system comes into full use in 2018. Essentially, it means that businesses have to provide financial data in a set format - that the tax office can then use standardised tools to spot potential frauds. For instance - anyone importing small, high value items (let's say mobile phones) will have to also supply sales invoices. Let's say that in the tax office, an inspector notices that some new company in Lublin started up and bought 2 million złoty worth of mobile phones. The system doesn't find any evidence of sales to customers, but rather the phones were sold to a company in Poznań. The inspector can then check the Poznań company - and if the phones were then sold to someone in Germany, it's highly likely that there's VAT fraud going on.

PO closed a lot of the common frauds, such as steel and electronics. The problem with the new PiS VAT law was that there were several very bad ideas - for instance, businesses would no longer be able to apply for binding rulings on VAT issues. The law also introduced liability for businesses that might have had no idea that they were part of a scam - which was madness.

Personally, I think PiS could do very well by introducing an always-online system. There's no reason why there can't be a permanent data connection between the kasa fiskalna and the tax office - likewise, no reason why companies issuing fatkury can't automatically transmit them to the tax office. It's a lot of work in the beginning, but it would mean that the tax office has all the relevant information instantly. It would be nearly impossible to commit fraud in this case, because systems could be set up to alert inspectors instantly of suspicious behaviour.

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