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'Fort Trump' Military Base in Poland


Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,884
5 Oct 2018 #241
Begs the question whose "captive" Germany then truly is...
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,481
6 Oct 2018 #242
Well germany joined nato, no one forced them.
Spike31 2 | 884
30 Oct 2018 #244
Merged:

Fort Trump and American military bases in Poland. What's your opinion about it?



theguardian.com/world/2018/sep/18/fort-trump-us-military-base-poland-russia
OP johnny reb 18 | 3,802
30 Oct 2018 #245
My opinion is that Poland seems to be the only appreciative E.U. country that is actually paying their way and offering to make some concessions for the United States Military protection against Russia's aggressions.

The rest of the E.U. has been on a free ride from the U.S. thinking it is the U.S. responsibility and expense to protect them ever since 1945 for some reason.

Trump has said the buck stops here, time to pony up and start taking care of yourselves militarily.
Poland is just being proactive with their offer of building an American Military base in Poland to do what they can to help the U.S. continue to give them this military protection.

It is mostly the expats living in Poland who have never served, sacrificed or given back to their home country or Poland to enjoy the freedoms that America has given them by sacrificing their lives and paying huge taxes for their freedom that they enjoy daily that are doing the howling.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,819
30 Oct 2018 #246
Trump has said the buck stops here, time to pony up and start taking care of yourselves militarily.

If he really meant it he would cut the US military budget and start withdrawing from Europe as a warning that he means it. Instead, he asked for and got even more money to add to the already bloated DoD.

That base in Poland is crazier than a monkey on drugs. It sends a bad message to Russia that NATO is a monstrosity that, like any western bureaucracy, has no intention to ever quit growing.

An equally bad message to Germany is that before the Russian tanks and artillery reaches them, they would have to roll over the Americans in Poland. That means a nuclear war in which case what Germany spends on defense means squat, so why bother.
Miloslaw 6 | 2,585
30 Oct 2018 #247
and offering to make some concessions for the United States Military protection against Russia's aggressions.

And The UK.......
Spike31 2 | 884
30 Oct 2018 #248
bad message to Germany (...) That means a nuclear war in which case what Germany spends on defense means squat, so why bother.

That's the reality check. If the US and Poland will also make Germany a target for a possible Russian aggression the whole picture in Europe changes. Germany won't be able to play both sides. Germany should stop doing shadowy deals with Putin and start being more reliable as a NATO member.

It was exactly the same with INF treaty regarding intermediate-range nuclear rockets. Poland is already in range of Russian [short-range] rockets due to close proximity of Kaliningrad. Russian rockets could reach most targets in Poland.

Obviously, Russians had intermediate-range rockets up and ready and they could also launch them from their ships (which wasn't specifically banned by the INF treaty) but it wasn't official.

And now it is official. With INF possibly revoked the whole Europe is in range and needs to deal with a Russian threat. No more pretending that the threat isn't real.
Tacitus 2 | 889
30 Oct 2018 #249
and start being more reliable as a NATO member.

There is hardly any country that could be deemed as more reliable within Nato than Germany.

Fort Trump will not have any impact on this.
Miloslaw 6 | 2,585
30 Oct 2018 #250
But Germany does not meet the NATO spending requirements.....that's what is annoying The Yanks.
Tacitus 2 | 889
30 Oct 2018 #251
It still fullfills all NATO obligations. Germany is the 2nd largest contributor for NATO missions and plays now a leading role in bolstering the defence in Eastern Europe.

Which is why there are not many countries who can claim to be more reliable.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,884
30 Oct 2018 #252
But Germany does not meet the NATO spending requirements.....that's what is annoying The Yanks.

It's not "The Yanks"...it's Trump!

Once he is gone, that whole dreary topic will be gone again too..
OP johnny reb 18 | 3,802
30 Oct 2018 #253
Wrong B.B.
I as one Yank would sure like my tax money spent defending my own countries borders instead of paying to defend some dead weight country that is not paying their fair share that doesn't even like us.

What have you ever given me ?
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,884
30 Oct 2018 #254
My undivided attention? :)

It's always difficult to answer (and speak) for a whole country...
TheOther 5 | 3,891
30 Oct 2018 #255
What have you ever given me ?

The V2 and Wernher von Braun?
Spike31 2 | 884
30 Oct 2018 #256
Once he is gone, that whole dreary topic will be gone again too..

Instead of wishful thinking you better prepare for a second 4-year term :-)


Joker 1 | 1,163
30 Oct 2018 #257
.that's what is annoying The Yanks.

Bingo!

Why should my hard earned tax dollars go to pay for the defense of the Krauts?

We should keep that money in the USA for better usage, instead of throwing it away on ppl that dont appreciate us.

I as one Yank would sure like my tax money spent defending my own countries borders

Or spend it on infracture, anything is better than giving it away to Germany.

It's not "The Yanks"...it's Trump!

Wow, you are way off! Please, stop speaking for us.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,884
30 Oct 2018 #258
That's why I named Trump and not "The Yanks"....duh!

Or spend it on infracture, anything is better than giving it away to Germany.

I didn't know the US is giving Germany any money...
Spike31 2 | 884
31 Oct 2018 #259
All the money that Germany doesn't have to spend on its military thanks to the US protection is a direct benefit for Germany's budget and the national economy
Joker 1 | 1,163
31 Oct 2018 #260
I didn't know the US is giving Germany any money..

Paying for freeloading Germany is essentially like throwing away our money. Im glad Trump got you tightwads to belly up to the table and pay your fair share, just like Poland and the UK does. What was Germanys sad excuse again?

That's why I named Trump and not "The Yanks"....duh!

Ya, and its backwards

It's not "The Yanks"...it's Trump!

It is the YANKS! Millions of us were sick and tired of Germany taking advantage of NATO! Trump was finally the first President with enough balls to say what we have been thinking for many years. duh

Again, Please don't speak for us, you do not know what your are talking about.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,819
31 Oct 2018 #261
The bottom line to me is that protecting others should be profitable for the "world cop" like the US. Yet, we are stupid to do it for free. And when the subject is raised here, I get this bs that the US protecting Europe is for our benefit, so what's the beef.

Considering our desire to be the world's dumbest cop, I am willing to bet that the US still pays both South Korea and Germany for allowing us to have our bases there.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,884
31 Oct 2018 #262
Paying for freeloading Germany is essentially like throwing away our money.



thesun.co.uk/news/6745786/nato-contributions-country-who-pay-most-least-2-percent-gdp-target-trump/

Oh boy...how many refugees we could feed with 45,472 Mio Dollar....

It is the YANKS! Millions of us were sick and tired of Germany taking advantage of NATO!

I doubt that....that started all with Trump...and it will be gone with him!
OP johnny reb 18 | 3,802
31 Oct 2018 #263
The V2 and Wernher von Braun?

No, I am talking about money out of his pocket as I sacrificed out of mine for him and for what.

I didn't know the US is giving Germany any money...

That shows your ignorance in taking the U.S. for granted.

Trump was finally the first President with enough balls to say what we have been thinking for many years. duh

Exactly why Trump didn't shake hands with your two timing loser of a leader.
ENOUGH ALREADY !
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,884
31 Oct 2018 #264
That shows your ignorance in taking the U.S. for granted.

Well...do you have a number about how many money the US gives Germany?

That will be long 7 years...but they will be over one nice day too...I'm so glad the US has a term limit!
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,819
31 Oct 2018 #265
NATO should be fully paid for by Europe alone. It was created to protect Europe and still exists to protect Europe today. Europe will never protect the US in the US. Period.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,884
31 Oct 2018 #266
NATO should be fully paid for by Europe alone.

Nah...that won't be NATO anymore...that will be the European Defense Force! :)

If there will be coming something good out of Trumps reign for Europe it will be the realization that Europe needs to take care of itself...I'm sure here Trumpists and european nationalists can agree...

Germany might even open it's purse some more for that.

I wonder where that will leave Poland though...
OP johnny reb 18 | 3,802
31 Oct 2018 #267
Europe will never protect the US

Hell no they won't and we know it.
They have been nothing but a bunch of milk soppers on easy street.

...but they will be over one nice day too..

If it will be so nice then tell Mama Merkel to end it today.
It sure would be a blessing to the Yanks pocketbooks and disgust.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,884
31 Oct 2018 #268
If it will be so nice then tell Mama Merkel to end it today.

Trump's rule? I think that has to run it's course...
TheOther 5 | 3,891
31 Oct 2018 #269
Paying for freeloading Germany is essentially like throwing away our money.

How much of our defense budget is spent exclusively for NATO? Are you sure it's 2% of our GDP? Many American bases in Europe aren't 100% NATO, but to project worldwide power. You'll have a point once the US stops to waste money playing the worldwide cop and once the agreed deadline for spending 2% is reached. That would be in 2025 and not earlier. If Trump thinks NATO is a waste of money, let's leave.
OP johnny reb 18 | 3,802
31 Oct 2018 #270
let's leave.

Great idea and I will buy your Commie ass a one way ticket to Germany the land you love so much.
You don't belong here.

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