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Should Poland exit the EU immediately?


Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163
13 Dec 2015 #271
Trump wants to sell out Ukraine and make friends with Russia.

Ukraine was sold long time ago. By your beloved EUnuchs.

Please keep to the topic
Crow 139 | 8,609
14 Dec 2015 #272
Far away in Serbia, it may be difficult to imagine how is it like to live in crash zone.

add to Polish situation, Islamic and Turkish hostile intentions and you would understand how looks like Serbian situation. Its far worse then Polish situation. In any case, i am sure that are Poles and Serbs on the edge of extinction. i mean, as a Slavs. West of Europe, in coordination with USA and Islamic powers, killing us softly.
befranklin 1 | 41
14 Dec 2015 #273
Poland will again be a middle player between two big factions Russia to the east and to the west the "Land of Islam" Western Europe, it will have no choice to leave the EU in order to stay a sovereign nation of it's own people.
Crow 139 | 8,609
14 Dec 2015 #274
it will have no choice to leave the EU in order to stay a sovereign nation of it's own people.

but how? Poland can`t make it alone. Duda, player that suggest Intermarium is being attacked right now in demonstrations. And what it means when protesters against Duda says (citation): ``This isn`t Hungary!``

This sound me as somebody deliberately wants to destabilize Poland and to secure Poland`s close ties with western Europe (ie EU).

Or who knows, Poland is maybe already sold by her politicians.
jon357 63 | 15,214
14 Dec 2015 #275
secure Poland`s ties with western Europ

They don't need securing since support for the EU within Poland is extremely strong, and strengthening ties yet further would be the opposit of your "destabilising".
Crow 139 | 8,609
14 Dec 2015 #276
So, jon357, you also thinks that organizers of demonstrations wants to secure Poland`s loyalty to EU and to scr** Duda in `time`?
jon357 63 | 15,214
14 Dec 2015 #277
Crowie, the wonderful demonstrations on Saturday have nothing to do with Poland's successful EU membership.
Crow 139 | 8,609
14 Dec 2015 #278
Then, what? Duda made real mistake or maybe he intentionally made mistake to ruin idea of Intermarium? It would mean that Duda sold Poland. If not him, who? Somebody blackmailed Duda? reminded him on destine of Lech Kaczinsky?
jon357 63 | 15,214
14 Dec 2015 #279
Duda made real mistak

He's an irrelevance. His role is a non-executive one; he does not form government policy. And nobody is interested in any 'intermarium' idea. Approval ratings for the EU are very high in Poland and there is zero chance of Poland leaving either the EU or NATO.
Crow 139 | 8,609
14 Dec 2015 #280
Poles are happy that they have Serbians. By definition, we Serbs are Poles who are aware. Kind of 300% Polish.

What i want to tell you, just wait that EU finally annex Serbia. It would be same as with Austro Hungaria.
nothanks - | 640
18 Dec 2015 #281
The Spinelli Group calls for a European Border and Coast Guard, a Single European Asylum System, a European Intelligence Force and a European Police Agency

spinelligroup.eu/article/dont-sacrifice-europe-illusion-national-security-better-schengen-answer-migration-and

Intentions are starting to become clear. Allow if not downright manufacture a crisis and then convince European nations they have no other option but to give up more sovereign rights to Brussels
mafketis 23 | 8,404
18 Dec 2015 #282
Many years ago I read an offhand remark that describes some of the worst aspects of EU officialdom. The idea is they think of the project of European integration sort of like a shark, if it's not constantly moving forward it will die.

This is why they have a single response (more integration) to any particular stimulus.

The problem is that all across the continent the momentum among citizens is moving and growing in the opposite direction. This leads to one of my rules for understanding politics and the world: When the agenda of political leaders is too far away from the mood on the ground - then bad things happen. You're already starting to see this in normally staid populations turning to violence (like the Dutch recently). I don't condone violence but unless the leaders of EU countries start giving priority to what citizens want then it will just get worse (what I expect to happen). Sermonizing about fascism and calling people bad names won't work to stop it either.

If these Brussel-sprout headed idiots don't back off then the whole thing will be rejected and sooner rather than later.
G (undercover)
18 Dec 2015 #283
Intentions are starting to become clear.

That's why they manufactured the whole "refugee crisis". What's next ? War to push forward "EU army" ? I wouldn't be surprised. These people are madmen.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,266
18 Dec 2015 #285
The Spinelli Group calls for a European Border and Coast Guard, a Single European Asylum System, a European Intelligence Force and a European Police Agency

Very good idea. It means we can work together on common European threats, and means that policing is more effective. Right now, there are some joint initatives (such as in Kudowa and Świecko) - but more would be better. Criminals don't respect borders, so why should we?

For instance, there's really no reason why the Russian/Belarusian border can't be defended by a joint border guard force - the Baltic countries would get help from Poland, and Finland and Norway's experience would be very useful indeed.
mafketis 23 | 8,404
18 Dec 2015 #286
Very good idea. It means we can work together on common European threats

No, it's a terrible idea the perceived need for which stems almost entirely from decisions made by leaders out of touch with their electorate.

The basic problem is that there is a political class following their own agenda with no regard for what citizens want - this is always a recipe for disaster whether it's "refugee" policy or battles over the TK.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,266
18 Dec 2015 #287
No, it's a terrible idea the perceived need for which stems almost entirely from decisions made by leaders out of touch with their electorate.

Do you not think that it makes sense to pool resources though? For instance - a common Baltic border guard to defend the Russian/Belarusian border makes a lot of sense, not least because resources can be deployed to where they're needed.

I always think of the Polish university sector here as a good comparison - where you have multiple departments for Finnish throughout Poland and none of them are particularly good, when the logical thing to do would be to have one Finnish department that is very very good.
G (undercover)
18 Dec 2015 #288
it makes sens

People like you used to carry water for Hitler and Stalin.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,266
18 Dec 2015 #289
Don't worry, people like you tended to lead Poland into ruin.
mafketis 23 | 8,404
18 Dec 2015 #290
Do you not think that it makes sense to pool resources though?

In some cases, yeah, that's a far throw from a single force under Brussels control.

More importantly, no one's trying to convince the public about any of this - it's the old technocractic approach favored by the communists, the leaders roll out their plans and the masses are (conventiently) satisfied and if they're not then it's their job to shut up and appreciate how well the party is working. It's one big reason that communism failed (not the only one but a big one).

I always think of the Polish university sector here as a good comparison - where you have multiple departments for Finnish throughout Poland and none of them are particularly good, when the logical thing to do would be to have one Finnish department that is very very good.

That sounds like central planning (and obsession over international rankings that are mostly hogwash). I don't know how many Finnish departments there are in Poland but three would sound about right so they can both work with and compete with each other (and competing with each other is a better goal than competing internationally). Just having one is a recipe for stagnation.

The bigger problem in Poland is that universities are too insular, one of the few (very few) good things about Bologna is that there's more movement by students between universities now (though more is needed as is movement of faculty). One Finnish department and the faculty has zero options for movement, again not healthy.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,266
18 Dec 2015 #291
In some cases, yeah, that's a far throw from a single force under Brussels control.

I suppose I'm very much of the view that a lot of things are unnecessarily duplicated in the EU - for instance, although there's now the "one-stop" border on the Croatian border with other EU countries, there's still police from both Slovenia and Croatia at every crossing. It would make much more sense if there was a single common border guard, and it would allow Croatian resources to be deployed more effectively elsewhere (especially on the porous Bosnian border).

At the same time, I'd like to see countries such as Germany using their resources to help defend the Baltic borders - it's not exactly a big secret that Russia can move people in/out of the EU pretty freely there.

And most of all, it would be nice to have a common EU border guard so that practices such as France not even bothering to control American flights (used to happen frequently at CDG) could be stamped out, or the Greeks refusing any and all offers of help.

how many Finnish departments there are in Poland

There are departments in Poznań, Gdańsk, Warsaw, Krakow and possibly more. It's just madness - to me, I don't see much reason to have so many when none of the departments are particularly good. But again - I see the competition being with other EU countries, not just within Poland.
G (undercover)
18 Dec 2015 #292
More importantly, no one's trying to convince the public about any of this

"Peasants have nothing to say" claim the "elites". What's funny is that some lower middle class useful idiots work for it thinking that will make them part of the elite.
jon357 63 | 15,214
18 Dec 2015 #293
The idea of a country where EU membership is strongly supported and which is the largest net recipient of EU funding leaving is bizarre.
G (undercover)
18 Dec 2015 #294
It is "strongly supported" as much as a guy working for 1500 PLN a month "strongly support" his job when there's no better position opened at the moment.
Roger5 1 | 1,458
18 Dec 2015 #295
That's right. There is no better position for Poland to be in. That's why there's overwhelming support for it among real Poles in Poland.
jon357 63 | 15,214
18 Dec 2015 #296
Yes, it is strongly supported (no matter how you may personally dislike it) - in fact approval ratings for the EU are particularly strong in Poland.
Harry
18 Dec 2015 #297
a guy working for 1500 PLN a month

I do love the way that PISites know so little about Poland that they don't even know what the minimum wage is.
G (undercover)
18 Dec 2015 #298
minimum wage

~1290.
Harry
18 Dec 2015 #299
For 2015 it was 1,750zl and in two weeks it becomes 1,850, as per the announcement of the previous coalition. thenews.pl/1/12/Artykul/221310,Poland-to-see-minimum-wage-hike-from-start2016

If it's currently 1,290zl, that's something else the Pathetic Insane Sect needs to answer for.
jon357 63 | 15,214
18 Dec 2015 #300
I do love the way that PISites know so little about Poland that they don't even know what the minimum wage is.

Figures and statistics are just another topic that they can only lie about.


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