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Israel opposing potential new Polish law to criminalise term 'Polish death camps'


NoToForeigners 10 | 1,032
2 Feb 2018 #211
@Casual Observer
Still didnt answer my question.... What about AN ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF JEWS CONSIDERING THEMSELVES POLES. To me we can easily count their souls to the amount of POLES who lost life to Germans .With those it makes the POLISH CITIZENS a GREATEST VICTIM of WW2. Why on Earth ISRAEL has ANYTHING to say about it when it is ARTIFICIAL COUNTRY THAT DIDN'T EVEN EXIST during WW2?

copy-paste
Casual Observer
2 Feb 2018 #212
Still didnt answer my question.... What about AN ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF JEWS CONSIDERING THEMSELVES POLES.

Well, you didn't clarify your question by showing that this claim was true.

Ok, let's assume it is. Then, yes, Polish citizens were the biggest nationality in the camps. But that still doesn;t negate the fact that the biggest group of all were Jews, the policy was aimed at Jews. It was incidental that a person in a camp was Polish, it was DELIBERATE that they were Jewish.

Why on Earth ISRAEL has ANYTHING to say about it

Well, like I said, Israel was founded by Holocaust survivors. And, let's be honest, the reason that many of them are even now so touchy about Poland is because a lot of those founders were survivors who couldn't return to Poland because of the actual or perceived hostility from Poles (e.g. Kielce massacre).
dolnoslask 6 | 3,074
2 Feb 2018 #213
No, he wanted them as a slave labour workforce.

Generalplan Ost (GPO

In ten years' time, the plan effectively called for the extermination, expulsion, Germanization or enslavement of most or all East and West Slavs living behind the front lines

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost
Casual Observer
2 Feb 2018 #214
Poland in 1916-1939 was one of the least homogenic countries in Europe. Why don't you say anything about that?

I'm happy to agree with that.
Casual Observer
2 Feb 2018 #215
Generalplan Ost (GPO

Yes, I fully agree, but that wasn't the Holocaust, was it. It was a future imminent Holocaust that was yet to happen (or was not yet fully enacted, unlike the Jewish Holocaust).
NoToForeigners 10 | 1,032
2 Feb 2018 #216
the reason that many of them are even now so touchy about Poland is because a lot of those founders were survivors

uwazamrze.pl/artykul/995313/jak-zydzi-kolaborowali-z-niemcami

If you can read in Polish that is. It works both ways but in Poland NO ONE SAYS JEWISH DEATH CAMPS!!! (regardless if some of them were actually run by Jews).
Bieganski 17 | 896
2 Feb 2018 #217
PiS openly considers its' neighbour Russia as a threat, one has to question the wisdom of alienating its' allies like this.

So according to you Article 5 (Collective Defense) of the NATO treaty is meaningless. If Russia attacked NATO member Poland then America would do nothing if Poland was not in good standing with Israel which isn't part of NATO.

Do all you Zionists suffer from hereditary mental illnesses involving delusions of grandeur?
NoToForeigners 10 | 1,032
2 Feb 2018 #218
Anyways. The legislation is about punishing all that bad name POLISH NATION for collaboration etc. Poland was the ONLY OCCUPIED nation where there was NO GERMANY IMPLEMENTED TEMPORARY GOVT (Like in France) so blaming Poland and Polish Nation for collaboration IS A CRIME. You can name and blame individual Poles that sold out Jews AND OTHER POLES if that is a historic fact. But as opposite to Germany Poles didn't vote for an oppresive govt. Germans had ALL THE SUPPORT from society and that makes GERMANS AS A NATION (NOT JUST NAZIS) guilty of WW2 and all the cruelty it involved.
Casual Observer
2 Feb 2018 #219
So according to you Article 5 (Collective Defense) of the NATO treaty is meaningless.

Trump implied that it might be, undermining the meaning of the pact.

The undeniable fact is that there are a lot of Israel supporters in the USA, and so it carries a lot of US support. Trump has responded to this with his policy of moving the US embassy to Jerusalem, regardless of the conflict and danger it has caused. Being seen to support Israel is THAT important to him and his followers. Trump even threatened the United Nations against criticising the embassy move (and was humiliated when they ignored him).

So don't underestimate the pro-Israeli lobby in the US. Poland is playing a very dangerous game by kicking that wasp nest.
dolnoslask 6 | 3,074
2 Feb 2018 #220
Due to recent events (Right or Wrong) from what I am reading in Jewish press the Jewish people really do hate us and and see us complicit to the holocaust, I don't know how relations could ever be fixed sad.

israelnationalnews.com/Articles/Article.aspx/21629
johnny reb 31 | 6,311
2 Feb 2018 #221
Heck just look at some of the nasty and hateful remarks the Jewish Members on this forum have made about Poland and the Polish people.

It's really not a secret that Zionist Jews have resentful & hateful complexes towards us 'goyim' even though neither of us experienced or were responsible for the Holocaust.

In my opinion it is time to let it go and move on.
Crow 152 | 9,747
2 Feb 2018 #222
It all went too far. I am really surprised that Israel that much complicate. Somethings wrong. Great disturbance in world politics.

hope we get those patriot missiles from USA in time.we might need em soon

I wouldn`t rely much on USA.
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,802
2 Feb 2018 #223
Israel whining? Nooo never

@Casual Observer

Israel was NOT founded as a direct response of the holocaust. It was created during ww1 in the balfour declaration when the brits two timed the saudis and the zionist rothschild said hey well get israeli lobby to start a propogamda war in us to get america into ww1. Thats how israel was created. Thw actual creation was merely postponed till after ww2. Israel is the biggest hypocricy and blemish of the modern western world amd the accompanying war on terror the biggest scam pulled on american taxpayers. All these liberals including jews rag on about human rights, diversity and all thid bs but time amd time again in the us israel gets a free pass. Obama tried and failed to put israel in its place but i find it funny both far right and far left reject israels actions un violations etc but nonetheless they have too much political support. So much for america first
johnny reb 31 | 6,311
2 Feb 2018 #224
Poland already has American missiles and troops on Poland's soil.
Isn't it weird that throughout the world America's flag and our culture offends so many people but our military protecting them doesn't ?

All these liberals including jews rag on about human rights

I don't find this true with the older ones WHO HAVE EXPERIENCED the suffering, seems only the younger greedy spoiled opportunist offspring are the ones that want something for nothing that they call "entitlements" which they certainly have not earned and do not deserve.
Frapol
2 Feb 2018 #225
Here is an English version explanation of the Poland-Israel conflict on youtube. Seems more or less accurate, considering it's a short video.

youtu.be/EEHU1ARzUb0
Lyzko 32 | 7,924
2 Feb 2018 #226
Poland's Ambassador to the US, Piotr Wilczek, wrote a strongly-worded, forceful op-ed piece in today's NYT in which he vehemently protests claims of Polish complicity in the Holocaust, placing blame squarely on Nazi Germany.

Figured you might be interested in it. You can of course always read it on line.
Frapol
2 Feb 2018 #227
Interesting. Wilczek had an Israeli visit postponed after this diplomatic mess.
G (undercover)
2 Feb 2018 #228
israelnationalnews

Have you just discovered that ? These people are psychos and liars. Screw them. Just ignore them totally.
Crow 152 | 9,747
2 Feb 2018 #229
What is this with Israel now? I just got hope that Israel chooses a path of peace with Slavs. Why this? What is this? I don`t like this. I am upset.

K***a politika.
Casual Observer
2 Feb 2018 #230
Thats how israel was created. Thw actual creation was merely postponed till after ww2.

I'm not disputing your timeline, but I think we all know the reason why Israel's "creation" (your word) or "founding" (mine) got off the ground after WW2, after being kicked into the long grass since WW1.

the us israel gets a free pass

Because those Holocaust survivors who didn't end up in Israel tended to end up in the USA, forming a significant lobby group. There's the geopolitical aspect too, of a 'western' ally of the USA in the Middle East.

I'm no zionist (not at all) nor a defender of Israel, I'm just aware of the realpolitik of Israel and the USA. It's pretty naive of Poland to not realise that their domestic posturing wouldn't have wider ramifications with their most important defensive ally.

Israel is a paranoid state, for lots of reasons, so it's diplomatically stupid to go anywhere near any issue that might get Israel crying to its major ally, especially when the current USA misgovernment has clearly flagged its priorities only last month (embassy).

USA will happily take a massive sheet on anyone in defence of Israel, because it is important to USA to *be seen* to be in defence of Israel.
shockedInpoland
2 Feb 2018 #231
It's pretty naive of Poland to not realise that their domestic posturing wouldn't have wider ramifications with their most important defensive ally.

The guilt of Nazi Germany in the invasion and occupation of Poland and the Holocaust is not 'posturing'. Don't you think the death of 6 million Poles is more important than 'ramifications' from an ally?
Tacitus 2 | 1,452
2 Feb 2018 #232
Don't you think the death of 6 million Poles is more important than 'ramifications' from an ally?

I'd argue that it depends on which kind of diplomatic strategy the Polish wants to rely. So far it looked like PiS wanted distance itself from Western Europe and follow more closely the USA. Fair enough. But now risking that close relationship with the USA for domestic reasons seems a bit shortsighted. At least nobody should be surprised if Poland ends up somewhat isolated in the future.
idem - | 132
2 Feb 2018 #233
I think you are not far from true. I am not sure if PIS wanted to distance yourself from Western Europe if think that they just lack diplomatic skills....
kondzior 12 | 1,242
2 Feb 2018 #234
WW2 is our fault, if we didn't exist, then Germs wouldn't invade us and gas Jews on our land, we should import 5 million Muslims to repent our sin of existence.
Lyzko 32 | 7,924
2 Feb 2018 #235
Yes, that's right, Frapol.

What I've read of Wilczek, he's quite accomplished and has authored any number of academic historical texts in both Polish as well as English!

It's all a question really of accurate nomenclature and the fact is that "POLISH" death camps is inaccurate, therefore misleading.
Crnogorac3 2 | 477
2 Feb 2018 #236
What is this with Israel now?

youtu.be/u3vYjqlQXU0

Maybe this will make it clear for you.
Do you know when such discussions could take place anywhere im the West? Maybe in some underground bunker, but openly like this as in Serbia? No chance.
Casual Observer
2 Feb 2018 #237
The guilt of Nazi Germany in the invasion and occupation of Poland and the Holocaust is not 'posturing'.

73 years after the end of Nazi Germany, with nobody responsible left alive, and after gaining Pomerania, Prussia and Silesia etc, maybe it is.

Don't you think the death of 6 million Poles is more important than 'ramifications' from an ally?

Not just an "ally", but Poland's secutiry guarantor. How is undermining the future security of Poland going to help 6 million Poles who have been dead for 73+ years?

All for the sake of semantics?
NoToForeigners 10 | 1,032
2 Feb 2018 #238
WW2 is our fault, if we didn't exist, then Germs wouldn't invade us and gas Jews on our land, we should import 5 million Muslims to repent our sin of existence.

Hahaahhaa. I know it's irony but it describes a leftists mind accuratelly.
Casual Observer
2 Feb 2018 #239
At least nobody should be surprised if Poland ends up somewhat isolated in the future

Seems to be exactly what is going on, and is exactly what suits Putin. It's so odd, and so strange a diplomatic agenda, that one wonders just which levers are being pulled behind the scenes to create this result. I mean, can it really all just be accident and coincidence that Poland isolates all of its major security allies and becomes isolated? I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but if Russia were somehow embedded in Poland or manipulating from outside to achieve their own aims, then it would look almost exactly like this.
NoToForeigners 10 | 1,032
2 Feb 2018 #240
Nukes over Nagasaki and Hiroshima weren't American. Those were Japanese Nuclear Bombardments! lololol


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