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Future of Polish-Ukrainian relations


Vlad1234
5 Feb 2022 #151
Personally, I don't have something against Poles and believe they are our Slavic brothers.
Novichok
5 Feb 2022 #152
Ukrainian civilians are now even training with wooden guns:

Hey, as long as they shoot wooden bullets...
Vlad1234
6 Feb 2022 #153
I think that both movies "With fire and sword" (1999) and Taras Bulba (2009) are outstanding. So much to think for those who are interested in history.
yjmbestboy
15 Feb 2022 #154
@Vlad1234
Poles are not Slavs, Poles come from caucasian Dalmatian descent, while Ukraine originates from the coarse and ugly Slavs of Northern Europe, Poland and Ukraine are two peoples of completely different origins.

@Oathbreaker
The Russian barbarians are not worthy of the Orthodox Church at all, they have only been in the Orthodox Church for the last one or two hundred years, the Spread and Development of any religion was forbidden during the Soviet Period, the Russians have no faith, and most of them still do not believe in the Orthodox Church until now.
Crow
15 Feb 2022 #155
When we are at it, stupidest Russian thing was to declare themselves as Third Rome, when we all know that Rome committed enormous genocide on Slavs (ie Sarmatians).
yjmbestboy
15 Feb 2022 #156
@Crow
The Sardinians were not Slavs, they were like the Romans, the Aryan descendants who came out of the Caucasus thousands of years ago (the Romans were earlier), the Romans of the Caucasus Aryans established the Roman Empire in Italy, the descendants of the Sarmatians who migrated to Central and Eastern Europe established Poland, they shared common ancestors, they were all messengers sent by God from Orion to the earth, and they had a very close and strong relationship with God.
Crow
15 Feb 2022 #157
Why have urge to mock facts? Have some mental problems?
pawian
4 Apr 2023 #158
Russian propaganda claims Poland is waiting for the right moment to gain control over Western Ukraine.
How do they explain Polish extensive aid to Ukraine??
With amassingly twisted logic. Masterpiece of lying propaganda, indeed.

So, Russians insist the Polish government believes that the collapse of Ukrainian statehood as a result of a military defeat is a condition for the implementation of this idea. That is why the Polish authorities do not want and are against a peaceful resolution of the conflict and therefore provide constant assistance to Ukraine.

Do you understand this "logic"? Polish aid to Ukraine is supposed to lead to the collapse of the Ukrainian gov. hahahaha

BTW, Mr President of Ukraine is coming for an official visit tomorrow.
pawian
5 Apr 2023 #159
BTW, Mr President of Ukraine is coming for an official visit tomorrow.

Today, President Duda awarded Mr President Zelensky with the Order of the White Eagle, the highest and oldest Polish distinction, established in 1705.





zxcv
9 Apr 2023 #160
why? shouldn't be the other way around?
pawian
15 Aug 2023 #161
Our invaluable poster Paulina provided a link to the Ukrainian channel showing Polish Army Day parade in Warsaw today. I am reading comments, mostly by Ukrainian. All of them are incredibly grateful to Poland and Poles. Ukrainians thank us for material and moral help and support.

Glory to the Polish Army and the entire Polish people, for the support of Ukraine

Glory to Ukraine!

youtube.com/watch?v=mSrWw0DJSRU
pawian
15 Aug 2023 #162
All of them are incredibly grateful to Poland and Poles. Ukrainians thank us for material and moral help and support.

I mentioned these comments to prove to Bobko that his endeavours to sow ferment between Poles and Ukrainians are completely futile. A few days ago Bobko told me that Ukrainian forums are full of anti Polish opinions. I replied it is the dirty work of putinist trolls who are doing their best to fuel conflicts between tow nations.
Novichok
15 Aug 2023 #163
I mentioned these comments to prove to Bobko that his endeavours to sow ferment between Poles and Ukrainians are completely futile.

Bobko is your friend who is concerned that you are cuffed to drowning fanatics. Or, if you don't like metaphors, that you are foolishly spending money on a lost cause.
pawian
15 Aug 2023 #164
you are foolishly spending money on a lost cause.

I think different. This money is a good investment into Poland`s safety. The weaker Russia gets, the better for us. You must admit that each day of war weakens Russia.
Novichok
15 Aug 2023 #165
You must admit that each day of war weakens Russia.

Actually just the opposite. Until Feb 2022, Russia needed a lot less stuff that kills. Now, Russian factories are producing stuff that kills 24/7. Your predictions that Russia will soon be out of ammo not only were false but happened to the warmongering West and its supply of artillery shells.

This money is a good investment into Poland`s safety.

Maybe. Why then are Poles against guns for personal use? The likelihood of needing one is actually higher than that Russia will attack Poland.
pawian
15 Aug 2023 #166
Russia will soon be out of ammo West and its supply of artillery shells.

Both sides have problems. Russians have run out of their gigantic supplies and have to be more economical now. Ukrainians use 8000 shells daily while Russians 10.000.

As for private gun ownership, sorry, this would be off topic. :):):)
Adam Levsky
31 Aug 2023 #167
Merged:

What are the perspectives of the Polish-Ukrainian relations?



The Russian invasion of Ukraine has united the countries of Europe in a strong desire to help the Ukrainian people defend the values of freedom and democracy. Discussions about the crisis of the European Union and its imminent disintegration have lost their relevance. The strong support of the Ukrainian people and their government against Russian aggression has only strengthened the European Union. Moreover, the close unity between Europe and Ukraine has led to the emergence of prospects for the formation of a fundamentally new European political reality.

From the very beginning of the war in Ukraine, Poland has assumed the key role of a conductor and regulator of NATO's policy of providing comprehensive assistance to Ukraine. As noted by assistant professor at the University of Wrocław Dr. Jakub Bornio in his article "Poland: Ukraine's Crucial Hinterland" for the American think tank Jamestown Foundation, Warsaw views the ongoing Russian large-scale military operation in Ukraine as a threat to the national security of the Polish state. Thus, Bornio emphasized the critical importance of Poland's geographic location for the security of NATO's eastern borders and the West's collective efforts to support Ukraine.

The Polish society provides support and care for Ukrainian refugees forced to flee from the bloody conflict. Millions of Ukrainian citizens have been able to find a safe haven precisely in Poland.

Poland's active and selfless support for the Ukrainian people has opened a new era in the relations between the two countries. At present, the two states are rapidly overcoming political, economic and cultural borders. Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said this, in particular, during his visit to the Polish capital in April 2023.

This circumstance has given a new impulse to public discussions around the possible transformation of Ukrainian and Polish statehood into a single union. We cannot rule out that Polish-Ukrainian cooperation, based not only on common historical traditions and achievements, but also on joint hopes and aspirations directed to the future, may evolve into something more, into a much closer format of interstate integration than the current good-neighborliness. Thus, very soon we may become witnesses and living participants in a new political era of European civilization.

To read the whole article get the following link: frontnews.eu/ua/news/details/64561
Adam Levsky
31 Aug 2023 #168
must be read
GefreiterKania
31 Aug 2023 #169
possible transformation of Ukrainian and Polish statehood into a single union

Not very likely. Even after the war is over. Czechoslovakia didn't work, Yugoslavia didn't work, there's no reason to think that Polkraina/Ukropolia would work.

The best way for Ukraine would be to pursue the EU membership. Poland officially applied for membership in 1994 and it took us 20 years to fulfill all the conditions and adjust our law and economic system to EU standards, before we finally joined in 2004.

Ukrainians are a TurboNation, so it will take you 10 years, maybe 15 at most.

Good luck.
GefreiterKania
31 Aug 2023 #170
it took us 20 years

OK, there's apparently something wrong with my maths today. xD

It was 10 years for us, so probably 5 for Ukraine.
mafketis
31 Aug 2023 #171
Poland officially applied for membership in 1994 and it took us 20 years to fulfill all the conditions and adjust our law and economic system to EU standards, before we finally joined in 2004

Might wanna look at that math again.....

I agree that some kind of Polish-Ukraine union is a very dumb idea.... The best result would be something like Sweden and Norway, mostly friendly sovereign countries with similar but distinct languages with provisions that make work/education in the other country especially easy.
GefreiterKania
31 Aug 2023 #172
I agree that some kind of Polish-Ukraine union is a very dumb idea...

Definitely. The idea, however, has been mentioned also by Polish politicians including the one and only Andrzej Duda.

There is something fishy about it. I think that it is just a crafty intrigue to compensate Ukraine for the inevitable loss of their eastern territories. In case of such "union", some part or even the whole of so called Закерзоння would be passed under Ukrainian administration (what's the difference if it is within one country, right?). Of course every union can be broken and then Poland would be left without Przemyśl, Rzeszów and Chełm. Call it paranoia but I would be very careful with such ideas.
mafketis
31 Aug 2023 #173
the inevitable loss of their eastern territories

Not inevitable at all...
GefreiterKania
31 Aug 2023 #174
Not inevitable

Well, the Ukrainian offensive has been rather moderately successful so far, hasn't it? Do you think Russia will just give those lands back?
jon357
31 Aug 2023 #175
Well, the Ukrainian offensive has been rather moderately successful so far

Over the past few days, they've done rather well, and of course the orcs are depleted now to an unsustainable level.

will just give those lands back?

Will r*SSia have any choice?
GefreiterKania
31 Aug 2023 #176
depleted now to an unsustainable level

I've heard that before. Russia is never as weak as she seems to be.

any choice?

There's always a choice and should Russians decide to defend those lands at all cost, they will be defended. Whether it would be a wise choice is a different matter.
pawian
31 Aug 2023 #177
Закерзоння would be passed under Ukrainian administration

Why?

Call it paranoia

Definitely it is paranoic musing of yuors. :):):)
GefreiterKania
31 Aug 2023 #178
Why?

To...

compensate Ukraine for the inevitable loss of their eastern territories

pawian
31 Aug 2023 #179
Stop evading in this paranoic way. :):)

You know what I mean. Why should Eastern Poland be passed under Ukrainian administration?
mafketis
31 Aug 2023 #180
rather moderately successful so far, hasn't it?

listening to russians again.....

It's been slow because the west hasn't seen fit to give Ukraine sufficient air coverage and Ukraine doesn't do russian style meat assaults.... russia would just sound thousands of soliders into mine fields to clear them....

But...

twitter.com/Heroiam_Slava/status/1697289861361815858

Along with russian mismanagement of lines of defense (I posted an analysis earlier) things are slowly picking up.

And.... Ukraine is brining the fight to russia and russia has no answer beyond it's usual tactic of blindly firing at civilians....

Supposedly a big mobilization is going to be announced in russia in a couple of weeks (sending people with debts to the front).... how are they going to train and arm them?

why does russia hate its own citizens so much?


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