Feeling ashamed of my Polish heritage.

There are millions of Ukrainians on the doorstep who are more than ready to join the millions already in Poland.

What can Indians and Pakistanis provide which Ukrainians can't?

Well...now and in the near future it's every man for himself (or country).

Germany's labor market is even more starved than Polands, after all Germany has an already huge economy to keep running. And since the Ukrainians can now choose to work in the EU, not only Poland anymore, Germany needs and wants their share.


Expectations! South East Asians don't expect as much as even Ukrainians now do, their standards are lower than anywhere in Europe, they are (still) happier with less wages and living standards. And they won't leave Poland so quickly for Germany since they don't have what Ukrainians now have, to be able to look for work in the whole of the EU.


emerging-europe.com/news/poland-faces-increasing-competition-for-ukrainian-workers

Polish recruitment agencies operating in Ukraine have reported that competition for Ukrainian workers is growing in Europe, particularly in the Visegrad countries and Germany.

According to Polish daily Rzeczpospolita, Poland's attractiveness for Ukrainian workers is decreasing. Ever-increasing numbers being employed by Czech and Slovak companies offering higher salaries and two-year contracts.

"Czechs are recruiting more and more workers from Ukraine and soon a large proportion of professionals will leave for Germany," said Marian Przeździecki, the head of Ukrainian branch of recruitment agency Work Service.....

I suppose that it may boil down to whether Poland is willing to be poor if that is necessary in order to remain Polish, or would rather begin the slow but sure destruction of the Polish ethnicity for the sake of pursuing short-term economic gains.

....and I think this answer has been already given.

If Poles would really prefer to stay poor but polish they wouldn't walk all over Europe in search for work and better shores. They would stay home, poorer but as Poles in polish Poland.

You should always be proud of who you are and you can do this while still realizing the flaws in your country. Work for better.

Some people go abroad to save money for their future in Poland. It does make a lot of sense.

What's Polish ethnicity? Plenty of Polish people have German last names, just as many Germans have obviously Polish last names.

A very misleading statement.
The Poles with German surnames were mainly ethnic Germans that lived in German areas that is now Poland.
The Germans with Polish surnames were mainly ethnic Poles that moved to Germany.
Both had ethnicity.

It's a little more complicated than that. Poles with German surnames could also be descendants of early settlers from the Teutonic Knights era, descendants of soldiers from Saxony who stayed in Poland after the wars with Sweden, or descendants of settlers that were invited to Poland decades before the partitions. Polish/ German (Prussian) history dates back many, many centuries with territory changing hands multiple times.

So actually,it's not "a little more complicated than that",because you more or less said what I said.
German surnames in Poland belonged to ethnic Gemans and Polish surnames in Germany belonged to to ethnic Poles.
It really doesn't matter how far back it goes.

Yes, it is a little more complicated than that, because you are overlooking one important aspect. When a male, ethnic German in Poland some 500 years ago married a Polish woman, are their descendants ethnic Germans in your eyes or Polish? What if they all married Poles after the initial German/Polish marriage? How long does ethnicity then "last" in your opinion? The male descendants might carry on the German surname for hundreds of years.

Yes, time matters...there is such a thing as mixing, intermarrying through the centuries...you know :)

I call them "Germoles"! :) Only separated by politics. Some of them have german surnames, some of them have polish surnames, some of them grew up as Poles, some of them grew up as Germans, but their ethnicity is forever mixed. There must be millions of them by now...a whole new country!

@delphiandomine
So all that makes someone Polish is having Polish citizenship?

Well why don't you give your definition of what being Polish means ? That will also be easy to knock down in any argument - whatever period of time you lick there has been o,entry of other genes in the mix - Swedish, Lithuanian, Jewish, German.

My friend has a very German name. They traced it back, and they were clear Poles at the time of the partitions. The family oral history also doesn't mention anything about them speaking German, and there are some records showing that one of them was a Polish trader. Yet obviously one of them was German, so what does it make her?


Most people would say citizenship and a genuine understanding of the culture.

I would add an emotional connection.

Imagine a football game (or any other team game you love)...let's say its between Germany and Poland....whom are you cheering for?

That is always a good question for any kind of immigrant....there are lots of Turks in Germany who have grown up and lived here in the now third generation (with german IDs by now) and still cheer for the turkish team when it comes to play Germany.

Citizenship is an official act, the culture you can learn about in school, but all that does nothing for the heart!

That's actually a really good question!

Not forgetting the Mongols who invaded Poland three times!

All that makes someone British is having a British passport.... I find it strange that when I meet Poles in my home town and they as me why there are no British people around, I have to explain to them that all these Pakistanis are actually British.

I prefer to call myself English, since I don't recognise such a thing as a British nation.

So is Trump American or is he Scottish / German ? He is about the same connection with Scotland as your average Bradford Muslim has with the Punjab - his parents are from there, he likes the food, he follows that religion and he sometimes goes there for a holiday.

The clue is in MAGA.

British Pakistanis prefer to fly Pakistani flags rather than Union Jacks and have no interest in traditional British traditions and customs. Many of the can't even speak English.

His family is of german heritage:

Donald Trump's paternal ancestry is traceable to Bobenheim am Berg, a village in the Palatinate, Germany, in the 18th century. Johann Trump, born in Bobenheim in 1789, moved to the nearby village of Kallstadt where his grandson, Friedrich Trump, the grandfather of Donald Trump, was born in 1869.

But I'm fairly sure he identifies fully as USian...

@bolek_tusk
Those Pakistanis are British in terms of nationality, just as Steven Seagall is Russian and Serbian.

Only in sport; and why not.BTW, they (except for the oldest housewives) speak English.


It's how you identify that matters more than anything. Where someone's grandpa moved from is neither here nor there unless someone feels it's personally important to them. To others, it's none of their business.

That is simply not true. Many Pakistani kids start school unable to speak English. They have no need to speak English. They live in Pakistanis ghettoes. Their parents, grandparents and siblings speak Urdu, Everyone in the street speaks Urdu. They watch Pakistani TV. English is a foreign language to them, and British is a foreign culture.

Remind me what schools are for.


Not for long, and no problem at all. People's identity is entirely up to them.


Most actually don't, although I doubt that interests you.

You simply don't have a clue.

These Pakistani ghettoes simply grow and grow taking over neighbourhood after neighbourhood.

I've watched it happen first hand for decades.

I have to back bolek here.
Other immigrants have this problem too but the Pakistanis seem to be the worst along with Somalians.
I shouldn't talk though,as I couldn't speak English when I started school.....

Like tumors and cancer....
When is the funeral? I will deliver the eulogy.

Really?


Ghettos? Do you have a problem with people living in particular neighbourhoods?