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Laws on walking a dog in Polska


Dougpol1
24 Jan 2014  #1
I live in a metropolis - a very quiet one - that Smurf aptly named Katowice by the sea.
I have a questionairre for PF - yes or no.

Now I was walking my 4 month old lab in the forest behind the old gaffe and some young female around 30 who ambled into the forest from the road on a fitness spurge was upset when dog jumped up at her in spite of my best efforts to dissuade him. She had seen me with my dog and elected to walk on our path when she did have the choice to avoid us. I mention he3r age because if she was my age she would have had a point in my dog being over-energetic.

First she said that my dog has to be on a lead ("Rzeczpospolita regulamin"), then when I snorted derision, she said that the forest admin could shoot my dog if he wasn't on a lead.

I replied that I would pay a hitman if they did that.
Then she produced a gas canister and fiddled around with it (my lab was ambling around wagging his tail - he's a fukking labrador for God's sake.

She said she would use the gas, so I said please don't because I would follow you home and burn your house down.

Who is right here? If you can't walk your dog in the forest where the hell can you?

I know this is not the way to make friends but she was a Tri-city pretty biatch and flared my nostrils.
jon357 63 | 14,122
24 Jan 2014  #2
She sounds like a silly cow and such people are best ignored. Just be thankful she isn't your next door neighbour.
Nathan 18 | 1,363
24 Jan 2014  #3
Just be thankful she isn't your next door neighbour.

I am. It will probably take me a while to be able to go to a forest again :)
f stop 25 | 2,513
25 Jan 2014  #4
wait, on the public path, you could not control your dog, so she's the unreasonable one?
Sheesh, dog license should require a short common sense test.
jon357 63 | 14,122
25 Jan 2014  #5
It was four months old and probably very cute - I for one would be happy for it to run up to me. If it was a 3 year old Amstaff with anger management issues it would be a different matter.
peter_olsztyn 6 | 1,098
25 Jan 2014  #6
Who is right here? If you can't walk your dog in the forest where the hell can you?

In Olsztyn recently an old prick killed the dog in such situation so it was widely discussed.

Dopuszcza się zwolnienie psa ze smyczy jedynie w miejscach mało uczęszczanych przez ludzi oraz na obszarach oznaczonych jako wybiegi dla psów, pod warunkiem zapewnienia przez właściciela lub opiekuna pełnej kontroli zachowania psa.
InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
25 Jan 2014  #7
She said she would use the gas, so I said please don't because I would follow you home and burn your house down.

Do you speak Polish? I get some cheek thrown my way at times here, I often wish I could verbally slap them in Polish. Sorry to hear of that aggro, btw. Silly moo, sounds like some Brits I know in the UK. I suppose in her defence she might have been bitten before or as a child. I have met at least two Poles here who have been attacked and scarred by dogs as children. Brit postmen will also tell you that what seems like a cute, family dog can turn very nasty when they visit a house to bring mail.
milawi - | 60
25 Jan 2014  #8
First she said that my dog has to be on a lead

She was right about that. I don't think that forester has a right to kill your dog but you may pay a fine if you get caught walking your dog without a leash in a forest.
poland_
25 Jan 2014  #9
dog jumped up at her in spite of my best efforts to dissuade him

I have a dog as soon as she started to jump up at people I joined a dog training club here in Warsaw. No matter how we dog owners consider our dogs friendly, others see it simply as a behavioral problem. Getting emotional and threatening to burn peoples house down is not really a way to make friends and influence people :-)
cms 9 | 1,272
25 Jan 2014  #10
The forester I think does have a right to kill your dog if it is endangering the ecology - not the case here.

But its also clear that you have to keep your dog under control at all times as Peter states - you have no leg to stand on and actually I have a lot of sympathy with the jogger.

One of my kids has a bad phobia of dogs (his own fault - once he wound one up and got bitten !) so I have this situation with "he wouldn't hurt a fly" dog owners several times a month.

I am fine with people letting there dogs off the leash if there is nobody around. What disgusts me about Polish dog owners is that they so openly let their dogs foul the pavements and parks. Much worse than other countries I have lived in and I think exacerbated by the fact they often don't have gardens. I seem to have to scrape their faeces off my kids shoes two or three times a week.
dhrynio 5 | 97
25 Jan 2014  #11
If you want real opinions then here ya go. You are an ass. An aggressive selfish ass.

I love dogs, but I know several people who are scared to death and even a cute lab puppy would have them scared stiff.

You DO need to have your dog on a leash period. My answers in bold.

Now I was walking my 4 month old lab in the forest behind the old gaffe and some young female around 30 who ambled into the forest from the road on a fitness spurge was upset when dog jumped up at her in spite of my best efforts to dissuade him. No, your best effort to dissuade him would have been a leash and you keeping control of your animal

She had seen me with my dog and elected to walk on our path when she did have the choice to avoid us. I mention he3r age because if she was my age she would have had a point in my dog being over-energetic.It is not "your path" it is a public path for humans, you do not get ownership of it because you have a puppy.

First she said that my dog has to be on a lead ("Rzeczpospolita regulamin"), then when I snorted derision, she said that the forest admin could shoot my dog if he wasn't on a lead.I see why she got short with you, she mentions something that is pretty much common sense and you snort at it. You set the nasty tone of this entire interaction

I replied that I would pay a hitman if they did that.Yup, an aggressive ass
Then she produced a gas canister and fiddled around with it (my lab was ambling around wagging his tail - he's a fukking labrador for God's sake. You just told a scared alone woman that you would call a hitman, you are a maniac and should be treated as such.

She said she would use the gas, so I said please don't because I would follow you home and burn your house down. Well aren't you a winner. Seriously jackass, do the world a favor and never leave home.

Who is right here? If you can't walk your dog in the forest where the hell can you? You CAN walk your dog in the forest, on a leash under your control all the while realizing that you are not the only one there

I know this is not the way to make friends but she was a Tri-city pretty biatch and flared my nostrils.That was not flaring nostrils, those were threats.

peterweg 36 | 2,316
25 Jan 2014  #12
My wifes father is the Forest ranger and hunter at a government forest. Their rule is to shoot any dog more than 150meters from a house without a lead/collar (not quite sure which, its not important). The forest is a the source of income and food for a lot of people and they protect it and the 'wild' animals (which are in reality fed by and paid for by the hunters. Pheasants are farm reared and released for hunting).

There are quite a few hunters who will live and work in and around the forest and may well be armed at any time, my father in law routinely carries his rifle and will stop to shoot pests as he drives around.

Dogs are commonly abandoned in forests, they tie them to trees to starve and freeze to death in winter. One turned up at the parents house over Christmas so they adopted it as its a cute puppy, christening it Bigos (Hunters Stew).
DominicB - | 2,672
25 Jan 2014  #13
You are an ass. An aggressive selfish ass.

Couldn't agree more. Your responsibility as a dog owner is to make absolutely sure it doesn't go anywhere near anyone else unless they specifically invite you to. Regardless of what you may think, a four-month-old lab puppy can inflict a lot of damage on a human, and even kill. Furthermore, it can inflict a lot of damage on the wildlife of the woodlands you selfishly chose to use as your dog's toilet and playground. The forester not only has a right, but a duty to exterminate the animal to protect the park.

EVERY civilized country has a leash law, including Poland. Unless your dog is on your own securely fenced-in property, your dog must be on a leash by law, and it is certainly not ever allowed to run free except in specially designated dog parks, which are few and far between in Poland.

An irresponsible and selfish jerk such as yourself has no business owning a dog. You invaded that woman's privacy. She has the right to use the park as intended without having to worry about being attacked by a dog or stepping in the dog $hit which, without a doubt, a selfish jerk like you doesn't bother to pick up.

You are 100% clearly in the wrong.
monia 3 | 212
25 Jan 2014  #14
The forest is a the source of income and food for a lot of people

Haha it sounds that a lot of people go to the forest instead of the store in searching for food. Hilarious .

Dogs are commonly abandoned in forests, they tie them to trees to starve and freeze to death in winter.

Why such a nasty picture of a host country . You know it is just a lie . Commonly in Poland people love dogs .

Dear Dougpol1 - I never went for a walk with my Golden Retriever on a leash in the forest ( it is rather medium dog ) . She has had always only visible collar with our address and name. Sometimes we met strange people who resented our dog when she greeted them . But I always apologized and never had problems.

None hunter or the more an employee of state forests will not shot the dog , even wandering alone in the woods when someone is with him .

He has a duty to call the special unit under the law of hunting - 29 X. 52, (item . 300/52 and 108 /55) in spite of the fact that there is a certain provision allowing them to do that. - in art. 11 which states: employees of state forests are allowed to kill wandering dogs or cats in the circuit who are not hunting dogs , but only those unsupervised .

The persons mentioned have the right to seize and stop hunting dog , wandering in the circuit hunting , notifying the Presidium of the municipal council , in the area where the dog was captured .

Dog running slow even in the hunting field , but being available within his guide can not be regarded as a wandering dog .
So even if entitled to exercise hunting Law state forest emploee will not be entitled to kill the dog or even stop him.

Dear OP don`t feel scared or intimidated by some answers and feel free to take a walk with your puppy even in a deep forest without a leash .
jon357 63 | 14,122
25 Jan 2014  #15
Dear OP don`t feel scared or intimidated by some answers and feel free to take a walk with your puppy even in a deep forest without a leash

For once I agree with Monia. Animals are a part of life.
peterweg 36 | 2,316
25 Jan 2014  #16
and feel free to take a walk with your puppy even in a deep forest without a leash .

Go ahead, just remember someone with a rifle is free to shoot it.
Harry
25 Jan 2014  #17
I'm told that the usual practice is to simply remove the collar from any dog shot while wearing one.

But if you just keep your dog under control, that won't be an issue.
jon357 63 | 14,122
25 Jan 2014  #18
But if you just keep your dog under control, that won't be an issue.

Exactly. Mine was never a problem. It still didn't stop some nutters making a fuss even when he was on his lead. Some people just like to be awkward.
InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
25 Jan 2014  #19
One man and his dog -- many diametrically opposed views.

I had always thought CS doesn't work on dogs, lately I've been advised that they're sold here specifically for that purpose.
OP Dougpol1
25 Jan 2014  #20
Thanks a lot everybody for the comments. I must admit I threw a mardy but it's hard to explain really. I specifically chose the calmest of 8 puppies, who was sitting to one side of the pack, reading an invisible book on " Humans, and how to train them".

To the person (Warszawki) who kindly pointed out that I need to train the dog - well yes - after a week of ownership (at ten weeks old) the dog sat for 20 seconds, and came when called. Now he can do everything, but I am sure Monia will back me up - training your dog not to jump up is very hard - and only done by positive re-inforcement - that is - rewarding him when he takes the titbit offered while standing or sitting at your feet. If he jumps you turn your body so he misses his target.

This takes up to 3 months in some boisterous puupies - and of course some equally boisterous humans positively encourage it - which slows the process even more.

I appreciate that a lot of people do not want to interact with my dog. I don't blame them! :)

And to Peterweg I think it was, who was kind enough to give the Christain Democrat or Neo-Con version of all this, I would say this.

I answered the woman in a polite formal manner (Polish in my idiotic old school Polish, in the correct way )- but she didn't address me, but immediately started banging on about forest rangers and what they would do to my dog - who must be on a leash at all times!. Thank you Monia for the support on this tpart of the story.

I must admit I said what I felt - and lost it a bit when she took the gas out. of course if somebody hurt my dog for absolutely no reason other than their phobia (and she came towards me, I didn't approach her) I would take retribution. I learnt the concept of that in Bible classes as a nipper :)

Dog is under control at all times anyway and always wears a muzzle in town/ on transport - although he doesn't know how to bite people. Of course when he's older his protective instincts will kick in so I hope he shows his fangs to this snotty cow if ever our paths cross again. :)

I shall post a pic of said forest and the supposed offender - well, the dog, not the woman.

Cue Peterweg to say I am the offender.

Oh, as to dog **** and other - of course outside of the forest I ALWAYS 100 per cent clear up. My dog would expect it. He gives me great companainship and I am his custodian. In that role, yes I would protect him against any mace wielding person, doesn't matter what size :))

Whoever said the dog cannot **** in the forest knows fukk all about ecology!

I am sure your father in law knows his business Peterweg, but he would be a dead father in law if he were in Tri-City and had the perverted sexual urge to shoot my dog. But on a note of ecology:

Farmers and foresters everywhere shoot "vermin" as you rightly state. But in some cases it just suits their personal trigger happy minds and it amazes me that they chose the outdoor life in the first place.

Shooting foxes and badgers goes way out of proportion in some cases in the UK,a nd thanks christ the RSPCA do prosecute in casess of cruelty (mostly perpetrated by the very people who are supposed to be caring of wild life...call me naive - but why would a country dweller want to harm the beauty all around them.

Walking in the splendid forests of Katowice I would often come across adders bludgeoned to death. Only one person could have done that - the forest worker - under the control of the forest admin.

Unspeakable people, and to be avoided. If at all possible - but if I saw one trampling on an adder I swear I would go for him.
f stop 25 | 2,513
25 Jan 2014  #21
had the perverted sexual urge to shoot my dog

It's obvious that you love your dog very, very much.
To balance that, it would be good if you had some empathy for people that might be scared sh!tless by a 40 pound dog running up and jumping on them.
peterweg 36 | 2,316
25 Jan 2014  #22
but he would be a dead father in law if he were in Tri-City a

You would attack an armed man doing government business?... sure you would.

in the UK,and thanks Christ the RSPCA do prosecute in cases of cruelty

You are not in the UK, so don't try and use their laws and principles.

Cue Peterweg to say I am the offender.

As I said, the woman was right and you wrong. The dog could be shot and it would be your fault.

Thank you Monia for the support on this tpart of the story.

Your definitely screwed if you believe anything she says. She's with the fairies.
OP Dougpol1
25 Jan 2014  #23
Again Peterweg, and we'll leave it at that....

It is clear to any reasonably level headed person, that as others here have stated, it is desirable and logical to be able to exercise your dog in a reasonably controlled manner, off the leash, in a state forest.

I demand my rights to do so, whilst agreeing to tether my dog when required to do so by a state official.
Some dolled up busy body woman has no right to order me to do so.

QED. Thanks for your attention and stating the law as you see it, but I like to think your father in law would say you are talking nonsense. But I'm not impressed by those who think they lord over the lands they are employed to preserve.for a stable environment and the enjoyment and recreation of the populace, and that happens to include dog walkers.

Oh and the poster known as Monia's alright with me - if she has a retriever she is clearly a girl with some taste :)

It's obvious that you love your dog very, very much.
To balance that, it would be good if you had some empathy for people that might be scared sh!tless by a 40 pound dog running up and jumping on them.

Thank you f stop. Will try harder! :)

It was the gas that got me hopping mad! Bang out of order and it freaked me out for the rest of the day. So glad it isin't 1812 because it would have been pistols at dawn!

PS - I owe you an apology Peterweg - it was that other poster who gave a list of why, when he/she is president I should be sent back to Blighty with dog, - Dyjynio - or whatever name Kaczynski is posting here as.

I unequivocally apologise becuase I got you mixed up with that weird control freaks' post and acted accordingly. Will pay more attention in future.
InWroclaw 89 | 1,915
25 Jan 2014  #24
Some dolled up busy body woman has no right to order me to do so.

Although I understand where you're coming from, bear in mind that what you said to her (rightly or wrongly) could've landed you in hot water, especially if she was a dolled-up off-duty police officer, and stranger things can happen, especially as she may be keeping fit for a reason. Anyway, tomorrow's another day, enjoy your dog walking and put the whole thing down to a learning exercise which we all have both at home and abroad. On the subject of dog health, there is this worrying and mystery disease in the UK at present, be on guard for lesions etc (fatal, possibly Alabama Rot)

telegraph.co.uk/health/petshealth/10586412/Dog-owners-put-on-alert-of-killer-disease.html
OP Dougpol1
25 Jan 2014  #25
Thank you very much InWroclaw, I will check that out with the vet on Monday morning and report back here to other canine friends.
jon357 63 | 14,122
25 Jan 2014  #26
Watch out for ticks (kleszcz in Polish), especially in the forest. They can make a dog very I'll.
monia 3 | 212
25 Jan 2014  #27
Your definitely screwed if you believe anything she says. She's with the fairies.

Dear Pweg - begone !

See Dougpol1 , it seems that you and me are great dog lovers. But not everybody is like us , which is sad.
Dogs were always man`s greatest friends . Even if dogs harm people sometimes I strongly believe that it is always human`s fault. If the dog is treated in a proper way , given love and care he would never do anything wrong in any circumstances . As a child , 6 years old , I was bitten by a dog, but I never blamed that dog .I knew that it was the fault of the people who treated him badly . It breaks my heart when I hear in the media about someone who is cruel to animals. I must admit that some people are primitive cruel bs***rds . Look at the case of the lion named Christian . This is an example who lion can become if treated with love and care. There is a movie in the internet about this special love .

This primitive woman`s behavior in the forest has no words to describe .
The dog controlled by his owner has the same right to free running in the woods just like everyone else and everybody should respect that and it is guaranteed by Polish Law contrary to what PWeg says . In the parks there are signs to keep a dog on a leash . But it is not a case in the woods .

I wonder if a child ran up to her and violated her privacy zone ,would she use this gas spray also ? How could she say something like that seeing a tiny puppy, unbelievable .

The worst people in Poland are the rats from the corporations . She was probably this type of a person .
BTW , the campaign against killer drivers is under way in Poland now . One doctor from the ambulance service with 20 years of experience said that the biggest killers on the roads are 30 something women , corporate rats, who in court explain with no emotions that it was the fault of the victim , because he / she dared to cross the road when they were driving .

In my everyday life I see more and more people like that . I thankfully don`t have to deal with them .

So , my point is just ignore such rude people ( it is better not to argue with them , just leave them alone ) , always put a collar ( even with big red scarf around the neck ,to keep a dog visible from a great distance ), have your puppy within your sight You can even keep in your pocket certain provisions of Law with you , just in case . Many people in Poland are legal illiterates , but they have big mouth ,the less they know the biggest cry they stir up :).
f stop 25 | 2,513
25 Jan 2014  #28
Anthropomorphism - that's attributing human characteristics to animals. We get started on that with childrens' stories and grow out of it, mostly, as we get older.

Every time someone tells me their dog is their best friend, I think to myself "you should keep that a secret...".
Your dog will protect you, and try to do what you want to the best of its ability because you are its meal ticket.
If that what one requires of a best friend.. then no wonder so many people get more worked up by hearing about abused animals than about abused people.
OP Dougpol1
25 Jan 2014  #29
Every time someone tells me their dog is their best friend, I think to myself "you should keep that a secret...".

LOL that's good. He's good company and gets me out the house (and into the forest hehe); that's as far as it goes though, as I know he'll be trying to slurp my beer when he's older and my back's turned!

Anyway, the story of Christian the lion is a good parable for all ages and much more valid in a humanistic world than the traditionalist religious one that we in the UK grew out of in the 1950s.

So I don't look at Monia's reference to animals in this context as being a childish one. And the French's attitude of the English as "being more fond of animals then they are of their people" is a slur, from a country thaat net migrating birds by the tens of thousands and were roundly mocked by such a cultural icon Jeremy Clarkson no less :) So there!
peterweg 36 | 2,316
25 Jan 2014  #30
Although I understand where you're coming from, bear in mind that what you said to her (rightly or wrongly) could've landed you in hot water,

Publicly admitting his guilt by confessing it here could still 'land him in hot water'.

It is clear to any reasonably level headed person.

You go ahead and make up any law to suit yourself, you are obviously smarter than everyone else.


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