History / What are Poland's pagan roots? [62]

Unfortunately as the Poles had no writing while pagan, and thus we know very little about the peculiarities of their faith. We do know the names of several gods and goddesses but, as Georges Dumezil wrote on this topic, a list of names is not a mythology. The so called "Book of Veles" has been exposed as a fraud.

That being said the familial resemblance of the various Indo-European cultures is apparent in their mythologies as well. By examining less obscured branches of paganism one can make assumptions about Poland's. Dumezil inferred that the Slavs resembled the Germans having a mercurial god head their pantheon. This would be Svarog who thus corresponds to the Nordic Odin, and the Aryan Varuna. Etymology shows clearly that the name Svarog is of Iranian origin, and so the Sarmatian ancestory that Poles claim may be in fact be the case.

Poland's former partner Lithuania being the last country in Europe to abandon paganism has much more known about its indigenous faith, snake worship and all!

History / Poles should emulate Jews? [153]

Polonius3 assumes erroneously that the "nationhoods" of Poles and Jews are similar enough for the former to benefit from emulating the latter. Poles have been a multi-ethnic multi-denominational nation since the pagan Polanie tribe began incorporating surrounding peoples. Judaism is a religion which has adherents amongst many nations and to which the members of any nation may convert.

Polonius3 is not advocating the conversion of Polish Gentiles to Judaism (presumably no one would be caddish enough to come onto a Polish discussion forum and tell the male Gentiles of Poland to mutilate their genitals) but he is advocating that the Poles emulate the Jews in developing their intellect. However developing one's intellect was never the exclusive purview of the Jews. In the context of the intellectual development of Poland we see that Polish Jews founded yeshivas and honed their intellect on the interpretation and disputation of their bronze age Torah and its various commentaries, but it was Non-Jewish Poles who founded the venerable Universities at Krakow and elsewhere in the Poland, and these were places devoted to universal learning rather than the merely theological variety, thus when it comes to truly valuable intellectual development Polish Gentiles have their own models to emulate and they don't need Jewish ones.

Emulating Jewish nepotism and usury are plainly horrible suggestions, as is taking Poland down the racist ethno-centric path that the "Jewish State" in Palestine is on, and as for that entity's soldiers they are indeed pussies. They wear so much gear that they look like scared clowns when they go about enforcing their Jewish supremacy upon the Non-Jewish natives. Poles shouldn't emulate Jews, but the Arabs of Palestine should follow the Polish trajectory which will lead to their liberation in a multi-ethnic state where people of all religions have citizenship and equal rights.

History / Poles should emulate Jews? [153]

The "Jewish" state is placed upon a land that was christian, muslim and jewish. Hundreds of thousands of Christians and Muslims were forced out to make the place majority Jewish. Those people are going to come back. The "Jewish" state needs to follow the example of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and accept the multi-denominational character of the area.

History / Poles should emulate Jews? [153]

This argument-- that multi-denominational equality would be ideal for Palestine, but the Semites are too quarrelsome and bloodthirsty to cooperate with each-other-- is essentially the same as the one used by Germans, and others, to argue against the viability of the Rezpublica during the time of partition.

USA, Canada / Poles in America: How do you pronounce your Polish surname? [128]

In America only large intimidating people with Polish surnames, like Larry Csonka, get them pronounced properly.

USA, Canada / Any Poles in Orange County, CA? [40]

There are Polish-Americans in Orange County such as myself, and there is some Polish History here as well. Our Saddleback Mountains contain a Modjeska Canyon so named for the famous Polish actress who lived there and was visited by many Polish notables including the illustrious author of the Trilogy, Henryk Sienkiewicz. Several paintings of Panna Modjeska are hanging in the lobby of the courthouse at our county's seat, the city of Santa Ana.

Orange County is indeed named for its once numerous orange groves. At the time the name was chosen the county was initially going to be named for what was then its largest settlement, but upon reflection "Anaheim County" was rejected for sounding "too German."

History / Poles in the Crusades to the Holy Land [75]

Regarding the crusades the historian Adam Zamoyski (scion of the former masters of Zamost) quotes a letter from a Polish noble to the Pope which says that Poles weren't interested in going to the holy land because they'd heard there was nothing to drink there. Ah but i see now other posters have already cited this letter.

History / Poles in the Crusades to the Holy Land [75]

The failure of the crusades in Palestine did in fact lead to the redirection of Christian military zeal against the heathens in the Baltic lands, which in turn led to the militarization of Lithuania and its subsequent expansion all the way to the Black Sea. When the Lithuanians did finally convert late in the 14th century they did so in a political union with Poland rather than in submission to the hated Knights of the Cross. Thus the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth is arguably a far flung result of the crusades, and perhaps the Commonwealth's relative religious tolerance was reaction to the fanaticism of the crusader enemy.

Genealogy / Americans of Polish descent. How many of us are on Polish forums? [216]

All of my great-grandparents came from Poland. My mother's side emigrated legally from the Prussian part of the partition near the end of the 19th century. My father's side emigrated illegally shortly before the First World War, via a ship that docked in Baltimore, from the Austrian and the Russian parts of the partition.

History / Roman Dmowski-Patriot, Nationalist, Anti-Semite? [251]

Surely Roman Dmowski wanted to be a Polish patriot, but he should be judged not merely by his aspirations but by his acts as well. During the Russo-Japanese War when Piłsudski had gone to Japan to tell the Japanese to let their Polish P.O.W.s join them in fighting the Russians, and to garner aid for an uprising in Poland itself, Dmowski also went to Japan to oppose this. Moreover during the 1905 Polish insurrection his forces aided the Russians in putting it down.

Dmowski had his reasons and we can only speculate about what would've happened had the Second Polish Republic gotten an earlier start, but it must be pointed out that Dmowski's pro-Russian actions put him in accord with the Polish Jews who also opposed violent attempts to throw off the Russian yoke. (These Jews felt it was better for them to be in a state where both they and the Polish Gentiles were minorities rather than a state with an emboldened Polish Gentile majority.) In retrospect one must admit that Dmowski's pre-1914 belief that Polish independence could be attained gradually under Imperial Russian tutelage is made highly suspect by the decades of Soviet Russian domination that followed the Second World War.

If Polish Nationalism is defined as a belief that an independent Poland should favor ethnic Poles above all others then Dmowski was undeniably Nationalist, but such a stance is also unpatriotic in a multinational place like Poland. Piłsudski's vision of a Poland for all its citizens be they ethnically Polish, or Jewish, or Tartar, or Lithuanian, or Ruthenian, etc. is the truly patriotic one.

History / Roman Dmowski-Patriot, Nationalist, Anti-Semite? [251]

If Dmowski was an "Antisemite" it is rather ironic that his advocation of ethnic nationalism in a multi-ethnic place can be seen as a model for Zionism in Palestine.

Life / Polish authors, books & literature. [95]

Of course Lem and Gombrowicz are among the best Polish writers of the last century but if one goes back even farther one meets Jan Pasek who's fantastic stories never fail to amaze. His sucessful scheme which used a small obnoxious wedding guest as a weapon to knock out a large obnoxious wedding guest is not only entertaining but instructive.

News / Sikorski doctrine - Eastern Europe under threat. Poland's foreign policy. [171]


South Ossetia declared independence in 1990. The Ossets were attacked by the Georgians. It is shameful on a Polish discussion forum for people to side with the Georgians rather than the Ossets when the Ossets are the direct descendants of the Sarmatians.

News / Sikorski doctrine - Eastern Europe under threat. Poland's foreign policy. [171]


No the South Ossetian people are not Georgians. They are an Indo-European people not a Turkic one like the Georgians. They declared independence but the Georgians wanted to continue to dominate them. So what if South Ossetia was part of Georgia during the time of the Soviet Union? The borders of Soviet republics are sacrosanct? No I think not. The South Ossetians were discriminated against in the newly independent Georgia and they had every right to declare independence. It is truly a boon that an unadulterated remnant of the great Sarmatian nation survived in those mountains, and if they want to be free they should be, and it is well and fitting that another nation with Sarmatian roots helped them.

News / Sikorski doctrine - Eastern Europe under threat. Poland's foreign policy. [171]


The South Ossetians awarded themselves independence by declaring it in 1990 and fighting for it since that time including weathering a massive attack by the Georgians in 2006. Perhaps you should ask the wounded Ossets how easily awarded their independence has been. Indeed Russia should let the South Ossetians unite with their Northern brethren, and yes Russian behavior elsewhere in the Caucasuses has been despicable, but their coming to the aid of the Ossets was not. Georgia should be condemned for its brutality towards Ossetia just as Russia should be condemned for its brutality towards Chechyna. This is called being consistent. Those of you who condemn Russia when it brutalizes a legitimate independence movement, but defend Georgia when it brutalizes a legitimate independence movement are being inconsistent. I suspect it is a reflexively anti-Russian attitude that accounts for your lack of consistency.

History / Tuchola in Poland - roots of Katyn? [220]


Witold Gombrowicz was a Gentile and an atheist. Calling this great Polish writer a Jew is very stupid.

Life / Babcia or Busha - any social class difference? [359]

[quote=polishmama]I have a question, to those who use Busia, are you all in the east coast, or Chicago or another specific place?[/quote

Busia was the term used by my family for my great-grandmother in Detroit, and here in California I once met another Polish-American who used the word when referring to his grand-mother.

Life / Babcia or Busha - any social class difference? [359]


All of my paternal great-grandparents snuck into the USA via a German ship that docked in Baltimore. Busia and my great-grandfather lived briefly in West Virginia and then Ohio before settling in Michigan.

Life / Poetry and Poets of Poland [58]

Being very fond of blondes, flowers and hemp I cite two of my favorite passages from Adam Mickiewicz's Pan Tadeusz:

The mass began. The little sanctuary could not contain the entire throng; the folk kneeled on the grass, gazing at the door of the chapel, and bared their heads. The white or yellow hair of the Lithuanian folk was gilded like a field of ripe grain; here and there a maiden's fair head, decked with fresh flowers or with peacock's feathers, and with ribbons flowing loose from her braided hair, blossomed among the men's heads like a corn-flower or poppy amid the wheat. The kneeling, many-coloured throng covered the plain, and at the sound of the bell, as though at a breath of wind, all heads bent down like ears of corn on a field.

In that thick, green, fragrant growth around the house there is a sure refuge for beasts and men. Often a hare, caught among the cabbages, leaps to find surer hiding in the hemp than in the shrubbery, for among the close-set stalks no greyhound can catch it, nor foxhound smell it out because of the strong odour. In the hemp a serving man, fleeing from the whip or the fist, sits quietly until his master has spent his wrath. And often even runaway peasant recruits, while the government is tracking them in the woods, are sitting in the hemp. And hence at the time of battles, forays, and confiscations, each side uses immense exertions to occupy a position in the hemp, which commonly extends forward to the walls of the mansion, and backward until it joins the hop fields, and thus covers their attack and retreat from the enemy.

Life / Babcia or Busha - any social class difference? [359]


Use of the word "polack" in English is not merely an American thing. See William Shakespeare's Hamlet: Act 1: Scene 1: Line 63: "He smote the sledded Polacks on the ice."

UK, Ireland / Polish and Irish people are related? [137]


The Irish are not Slavic but Celtic. There may have been Celts in ancient Poland that went West hence the both Poland and Spain have a region called Galicia.

UK, Ireland / Polish and Irish people are related? [137]


That is the great historical difference between Poland and Ireland. Not only is Poland "younger" than Ireland, having been formed politically and baptized centuries after Ireland, but Poland's continental situation allowed it to expand, as did Poland's rather interesting "marriage" with Lithuania which was a quite huge place at the time. This situation led to a certain amount of Oriental splendor in Polish history of which Ireland cannot boast. It is said that Jan Sobieski at the battle of Vienna had to order his polish infantry to wear straw catafalques on their heads so that their German allies could tell them apart from the Turks. In other words Turkish haircuts, winged hussaria atop of horses dyed blue and red, and "Sarmats" in turbans and fur are totally alien to Ireland which is after all Europe's most Occidental island.

Life / Do Russians and Poles get along? [53]

Taras Bulba has one or Taras' sons joining the Poles because of a beautiful Polish maiden. Taras duly kills this son and Gogol thinks this filicide is justified because his sympathies were wholly on the side of Russia. Now that the Ukraine is no longer under Russian suzerainty it would be interesting to know how this novella is judged by the Ukrainians of today.

Life / Why Polish people should be proud of being Polish? [370]


I am a Polish-American and I am very proud of my blond moustache.

Life / Why Polish people should be proud of being Polish? [370]


Calling all Polish-Americans racist scumbags is a gross generalization for which you should apologize.


Making Poland guilty of colonialism by counterfactual assumption is totally ridiculous you should apologize as well.

Life / Why Polish people should be proud of being Polish? [370]


I can acknowledge that the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth did mistreat Ruthenia, but your claim that the Poles are somehow guilty of the sort of imperial colonialism exercised by Western European states in the 19th and 20th centuries remains ridiculous and you have now also shown yourself to be a mannerless cad.

Life / Why Polish people should be proud of being Polish? [370]


To get back to the topic of the thread I'd like to say as a Polish-American the lives of normal people being normally lived in today's Poland do not really interest me in the least. The Poles I am most proud of are the artists. People like Witold Gombrowicz and Stanislaw Lem, both brilliant writers and both atheists (All Polish-Americans are not reactionaries, nor are they all religious fanatics. In fact out here in California many of us are members of the "Liberal Elite"). And of course the glorious history of Renaissance and Baroque Poland interests me but not because the Poles fought "heathens" but rather because the Poles had religious freedom in their exceptional commonwealth, and not because Poland was somehow culturally "pure" but because of the Poles' eclecticism in which, to give a couple examples, they freely adopted aspects of their dress from Asiatics and aspects of their architecture from Italians. I am also proud of the Polish reputation for bravery and drinking prowess, and I am also proud of the beauty of Polish women.

Life / Why Polish people should be proud of being Polish? [370]


The Ukraine was actually conquered by the pagan Lithuanians and it was after Poland's alliance with the converted Lithuanians that this territory came under Polish sway.

History / Was Daniel Fahrenheit a Pole? [138]

Fahrenheit looks like a Germanic surname.

History / Was Daniel Fahrenheit a Pole? [138]


It should be noted that although Arthur Schopenhauer was born in Danzig his family moved to Hamburg when he was a boy and they moved because Arthur's ultra-rich merchant father didn't want to live in Prussian ruled Danzig without all the freedom from regulation and taxation that the Polish had allowed. The Schopenhauers were quite cosmopolitan having chosen the name Arthur for their son because of its internationality. I know rabid nationalism is a pastime for some in this forum, but claiming a thinkers like Schopenhauer, or even Fahrenheit, for a nation such as "Germany" is really pointless. Arthur himself compared the Napoleonic wars that ravaged "his" nation to a barroom brawl between louts that was beneath his concern. Great thinkers are a nation unto themselves.