Sarmatism in Poland

Crow has tendency to exaggerate or dramatise that is why when he is in 60% right it is easy to win over him just because 40% of his statements are magnified. Stonehenge seems Celtic ;-) don't worry.

Ok I see BB is gone :) so I am going to do something interesting

let Italian scientist Mario Alinei answer on this... [my favorite quotation]

continuitas.com
continuitas.com/intro.html


see also... Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika


That is of importance. Science suggests that Slavs remembered true meaning of Svastika.

Svasika was spread on vast territory, same as Proto Slavs, same as ancient Sarmatians, old Slavs and modern day Slavs.

And I showed you before that Alinei is a lone nutter who is shunned and proven wrong by the mainstream historians and scientists....you really should look to someone better suited to support your points (if you can find someone that is)....but I can understand why you would feel so attached to him.

"Some of his main linguistic contributions related to ideas of "paleolinguistics" have been widely rejected by mainsteam historical linguistics, such as the Paleolithic Continuity Theory, which contends that the Indo-European languages originated in Europe and have existed there since the Paleolithic."

Why don't you bring some other historians and scientists to prove your points? Some more respectable names and works? That would help you greatly to gain more credibility...


And there is a difference if you say "Slavs borrowed and used Swastika" or "Slavs invented Svastika/Swastika is of slavic origin" - a huge difference!


Apropos Stonehenge....they found another one in Germany (or kind of), near Leipzig:

:)

ananova.com/news/story/sm_49311.html

"German Stonehenge predates British site

Archaeologists say they have found the site of a German Stonehenge which is even older than the British one.

The series of rings in a field near Leipzig in the east of the country are said to be at least 7,000 years old - 2,000 years older than Stonehenge.

Archaeologists say it was the site of a stone-age temple where they believe people and animals were sacrificed to the gods.

The 120-metre diameter rings also have gates, one of which works like Stonehenge to direct the sun's rays onto a central point at sunrise on mid-summer's day.

In contrast to Stonehenge, the rings were not made up of giant rocks but of thousands of oak-wood stakes which have not survived the passage of time.

Only the marks in the ground where the stakes once stood have remained - and have now been discovered by the archaeologists."

(but maybe it was the Slavs???)

:):):)

What about the sky disc of Nebra? The slavs too???

"German experts on Thursday hailed Europe's oldest astronomical observatory, discovered in Saxony-Anhalt last year, a "milestone in archaeological research" after the details of the sensational find were made public."

dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,942824,00.html

dw-world.de/popups/popup_lupe/0,,942824_ind_1,00.html

Perhaps people were more advanced at telling the sun and moon cycles across the board than previously thought. Why on earth do archaeologists ALWAYS say the past people always killed things, each and every time!? And every time they find a goddess statue, they call it a freaking FERTILITY statue!? That is sooo lame.

Bratboy, I like thinking of you as a blonde Conan.

There is much enjoyment in this, for the Samaritans, and I'll take the King Arthur Legend for Poland, for the WIN!

I do also rather enjoy the link of the Amazons to moi. THAT is rather amusing, and fits my attitude to a 'T'.

Just so you know....it also appears in Native American culture in the US. This is an ancient symbol......older than we can imagine. :)

What is sure Svastika was Slavic symbol the same as other tribes ... I am not going to argue who invented it, I am sure not Germans. In old Slavic mithology it is connected with God "Svarog" and it symbolise "Fire"


Now instead of trying to respond on facts I posted you try to catch me in "Crows" trap of maginfieing something. LOL Find my post about Sarmatians or Slavs which was untrue... or try to debate instead of trying to tell I posted that Stoneheadge is Slavic ...

I think it is just lack of arguments...

Honestly when we have new tools to make researches, Germans and their XX century ideologies look more and more pathetic ...

From sources online:


everything2.com/index.pl?node=swastika

- I can go on and on about it; it is more than 3000 years old, to be in Ancient Mesopotamia!

Saxony-Anhalt??

good luck of Net surfing abandened you Wurst and plus, you and me know very well that it has anything with luck

Isn`t it the same region from where originated Russian Emperess Cathrine the Great which was of Sorbian (Slavic) origin?

Catherine II of Russia

arikah.net/encyclopedia/Catherine_II_of_Russia


`German Stonehenge` was found in ancient Slavic region- in Danubian cultural area- which population was germanized, not so deep in past.

So much about `German` ```contribution``` to global civilzation in antiquity. Man, five Hitler`s won`t be enough to consolidate your false heritage.

Builders of Stonehenge found


more facts...

Archaeologists find 'Russian Stonehenge' (UPI Science Report)

Publication: UPI NewsTrack
Publication Date: 28-JAN-05


Another Stonehenge Found in Russia?

By Jennifer Viegas, Discovery News


news from one more Slavic country...

Macedonian Stonehenge in the village Kokino


more in case with dilemmas about Arthur...

Historian: King Arthur Was From Russia

By Kevin O'Flynn
Staff Writer

THE MOSCOW TIMES

LOL Crow....I will save your post and show it around. Why should only I have a good laugh! Thanks man! :)

Is there anything you DON'T attribute to your miracle people, your Überslavs??? ROFL

Interesting you mention this city...

HISTORY
Leipzig was the crossing place of two of the Roman Empire's most important trading routes and gets its name from the Old Sorbian word for lime tree, which is still today one of the most common trees found in the city. The religious reformer Martin Luther (1483-1546) was active in Leipzig. Music thrived through the genius of Johann Sebastian Bach, who lived and worked in Leipzig for 27 years until his death in 1750. The movement to tear down the Berlin Wall started in Leipzig.

Even BB cannot possibly deny this? ;)

Boy...as this holy site was build there didn't exist a Leipzig....we are talking 7000 years back...no city in Europe existed back then! LOL

You where not even near! :)


Let me guess, the "lime tree" makes Leipzig slavic regardless of Luther or Bach, right?

You people are really weird....

Funny, always thought that the Swastika was the Sanskrit sign for the Sun, symbolising the rise of power and goodness...Easily proved as well....

M-G

Actually, I have some more funny news for Crow, our hysterical Slavic nationalist: Did you know that the name "Slavic" actually literally comes from the fact that the Romans kept these ppl as slaves? The Romans saw them as slaves and the name Slavic is literally derived from this fact.

M-G

OK I see instead of discussion about Sarmats we have discussion about the same. Bratwurst post his crap maps where Poland is occupied by Germans and Crow has his world as well.

Thank you Julia for your link with with Swastika forms :

There is more Polish Coat of Arms based on Swastika form :





In Poland it is widely considered Swastika and some other symols come from Sarmats.
Now we have question where are Sarmats now.

There are 3 theories:

1) Sarmats = Slavs (Crow supports it and this time he is in majority ;) )

2) Sarmats = Slavic and Baltic mix

3) Sarmats conquered Slavs and later assimilated.


it is about Sarmats ... this time they were living on landsof todays Russia some time before were living somewhere near near India (like half of todays European nations)

Later they moved on west.

When we look on origin of Swastika (India, Iran or generaly middle east) and on tribes who could bring it to Europe ... and on DNA in European nations (new interesting tool very useful especialy in discussions with German Scientists and their theories) there is no doubt that It is Sarmatians job.

Look on Drogomir Coat of Arms and now look on one of English coat of Arms (Man Island) :

Wrong way round. That Latin word's origin is Slavic.

exactly

In Polish: Slavic is Słowiański ... and slave is niewolnik ...

yes, thank you sister Julia


listen, if Germany is democratic state, many germanized Slavs would simple come back to mother Slavia. But no, Germany isn`t democratic and even today tend to assimilate as much as possible Slavs.


God bless fact that Poles preserved alive memory on Sarmatian schlachta. I admire to Poles because of that

You see now, thru practical example, why i always telling to you that Poland is piedmont of Slavdom and last core of Sarmatia.

just, please sc*** Tusk political career for me


so nicely and precisely said

This is just an example of completely false propaganda.

They are from a medieval Latin word Sclavus and its slightly later form Slavus, both of which referred first to any person who belonged to the large group of peoples of central and eastern Europe who spoke Slavonic languages. Medieval Latin borrowed the word from the Slavs' own name for themselves. In Old Slavonic, Slovene was the word for a Slavic person. It means literally "speaker" from Old Slavonic slovo, "word." They were the people of the word; that is, they spoke a Slavonic language.

Slavs have named Germans for example Nemci or in translation = "people who do not speak the tongue" so what?

MareGea why dont you concentrate and worry about what people from your own country are called? Why do you disturb yourself when clearly you have limited knowledge and try to discredit others - from your perspective foreign countries?

I think the Byzantines first called them Sklavinoi in the 6th century.A lot of Sklavinoi were captured in the wars and sold as slaves,so the name Sklavos came to mean the slave.

Pffff ...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavic_peoples

(I like part about Germans ;) )

Vikings and their Ukrainians allies captured Consatntinopol ... so I don't know who was Slave ...

When did Slav come to mean "slave"? In the tenth century, during the eastward expansion of the Franks under Otto I (AD 913-973), many speakers of Old Slavonic were in fact conquered and enslaved. The change in meaning from Slav to slave occurred a little later in Italy , after the raids made by Venetians upon Slavonia(a province in present day Croatia) during the time of the Crusades.

Basically, MG tried to insinuate that Slavic was derived from the word "slave" which has no relation with reality, and is against common sence, but on this forum it is not surprising because it is possible to find even more problematic posts.

So MG educate yourself before you make such tendencious comments. You only discredit yourself with so called (easily refuted) "facts".

Who? where ? which nation ? I don't know Serbs history. I know Polish and only durring WWII we can talk about slavery of Polish people (like a lot of european people)...

Poles for Scandianvians were Vends. Poland was Venland. For Germans Polen, On east we were Lachs.

Hahahaha, Lukasz, this is one of the most funny remarks I have ever read here...Thanks!

PS: I don't mind Crow and his little depraved world, as long as he does not turn into a serial killer :)

M-G (has just posted the B-side of his new single on MySpace => go have a listen!)

My statement about being racist was very impulsive. I just wanted to point something out ... (post about Jews look) In my opinion you should be more careful with your judgments ... like slav= slave. I haven't noticed statemnts like Jews =rats.


Serbia has traumatic past and I consider them victim, the same as all Balkan countries. They are just after the war ... so you know.


I don't sides are not the best idea on forum ... sometimes I just feel that some people judge Poland based on stereotypes and sometimes our contr-reactions here strenghten this stereotypes.

When?

I did not write where the word Slav came from.Probably Slavs called themselves like this.I commented how it came to mean the slave.

This is false. The only Vikings to step foot into Constantinople while it was under Byzantine rule, were merchants, and men who made up the Varangian Guard, an elite unit under the emperor.

Where do you get your information from?

Bubunoic Plague (Black Death) in middle ages:



AIDS in europe



Drugs

Does it really matter either you have such glorious ancestors or not? It’s of far more importance who you are in the present or the newest history. As far as I know, the Poles did not hold whatever similar reputation during their history. It’s funny, but mostly insignificant nations try to provide themselves with the background of glory heritage.

I've read a portion of this thread and plan to finish it when I have more time

Recently I've been informed that after high resolution Y-DNA genetic testing that I may trace my ancestry from Polish R1a1 to the Sarmatians. My family is from Poland and I've been able to find out some very interesting things, such as possible Polish viking ancestors (with near matches in England) in addition to this new Sarmatian possibilty. Someone before asked if anyone could trace their family back. Well I may be able to.

it's long

I went through the discussion and there are some side issues. But every forum does the same thing about the original subject matter.

My introduction was more on the lines of using genetic genealogy to determine deep ancestry. So far testing through Family Tree DNA has provided me with information regarding my deep ancestry. Y-dna testing may provide any male with insight to their deep ancestry. If you know that you are related to Szlachta from Poland, then it would be good to take a test. However, just having the surname does not necessarily make one noble. People changed their surname in the 1800's to emulate noble names. Mine for instance is referenced in two herbs: Junosza and Korczak, but until I can establish a blood relation, I have no title to either.

However, I can discuss my genetic ancestry and based on near matches on large databases I can infer historical context based on genetic distance. Genetic distance - the changes noted when comparing haplotypes (your genetic roadmap); one can calculate distance to most recent common ancestor. Although I have no real close matches; those with moderate distances are found or originated in Scotland, England, Poland and India. By estimating the distance you can then turn to historical information to look for a reason for the movement of peoples to far off places from their homeland including Polish Vikings and Sarmatians

ftdna.com I recommend joining the Polish Project first to get a discount. go with the highest reslution test that you can afford. You might be surprised what will turn up.