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What should Russia and Poland do to become if not friends, then at least not enemies?


Dirk diggler 9 | 4,475
2 Apr 2018 #181
I know this is too complex for you to grasp, but the main reason why I am so against Poland having a bogus ABM system that costs billions yet isn't effective BECAUSE I'm a Pole born and raised who is ready at a moment's notice to die for my country should it ever be invaded. I've had family members perish in WW2 because of the Soviets and Russians so don't call me a ******* kremlin troll or traitor. If just one nuke gets through - that's it its utter devastation AGAIN. As a Pole who cares about my country and its people I want to avoid that.

Putin will OBVIOUSLY respond in kind - just as he has done whenever there's additional troops on NATO's eastern flank (whether it be the Baltics, Romania, Poland, etc). That means he'll have more missles to counter the patriot system. If one of those missles that gets through happens to be a sarmat, that's it it's over for Poland - tens of millions die and the country becomes another Chernobyl only 1000x worse.

theamericanconservative.com/articles/u-s-missile-defense-not-as-effective-as-we-think
nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/why-americas-enemies-fear-the-patriot-missile-defense-system-19833
Crow 137 | 7,756
2 Apr 2018 #182
I agree to all you said. But don`t expect many to support you publicly. That is madness.

I can only add that in any case that leaves Slavic West without Poland, its the end of Slavic West. In turn, it would make Slavic South even more vulnerable and its also our end, too. We are all connected by subtle balance and that balance is best Poland`s protection from Russia. That balance suits Russia for Russia`s own interests and Russia won`t ruin it if not forced to do it. It would again in turn harm Russia itself.

Not to say that in case of war, I clearly can imagine NATO itself detonate nuke in Poland and accuse Russia for it. It would be perfect opportunity to destroy Slavic world once and for all. Be sure that Anglos won`t miss that opportunity. Theresa May style. Millions of dead Poles and Slavs in general sound always very good to them. I have no words to describe how I feel.

Its all very sad. But, essentially there won`t be winner if war goes globally nuclear.
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,475
2 Apr 2018 #183
Crow idc whether it's a popular position or not. The older generation of Poles are so anti Russian, and for totally understandable reasons, that it will be generations before the relationship is at best amicable. Pis constantly exploits anti Russian sentiment in poland. I know there were tons of atrocities committed by russians against poles, ukranians, etc. However the last thing the slavic world needs right now is in fighting. If all the Slavs united wed be unstoppable - wed have the most land, the most nukes, the largest economy in Europe, and a larger population than the us. Perhaps after Putin Russia will be more open to its slavic neighbors and this brother against brother war in Ukraine finally ends.

That's funny you say that because jus recenrly korwin mikke said the whole poisoning in UK looks more like a cia false flag. He does say outlandish things but there really isn't any concrete evidence that it was russians atlwast not by the standard of innocent until proven guilty. Russia has been treated as guilty till proven innocent and even then the us refuses to work with russia to see who actually caused the chemical attacks in syria. One things for sure whenevr the white helmets pop up you know whatever attack will immediately be blamed on Assad Iran and russia. Doesnt really matter though - Assad won the war, the shia axis is strengthened and israel hates it lol.
Crow 137 | 7,756
2 Apr 2018 #184
What I worry most are malevolent Anglos or even Germany. They would hardly miss opportunity to ruin relations between Poland and Russia, once and for all. Best thing to do it is to cause a war and then everything is possible. Even if Russians somehow manage to avoid to nuke Poland, Anglos would detonate it themselves and then blame Russians.

I worry for Poland seriously. Sure, not that are Serbs in perfect situation when it comes to security. Far from it.
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,475
2 Apr 2018 #185
I dont worry about them ruining relations between poland and russia as they're already bad. What i fear more is eu trying to drive a wedge between poland and hungary. They know article 7 is doomed to fail so it is likely theyll bribe one country to go against the other.
mafketis 21 | 7,464
2 Apr 2018 #186
Traitor or a Kremlin Troll, same thing.

The type who would have convinced himself in 1944 that the Russians were Poland's future...

An ingrate who doesn't appreciate anything the west has to offer Poland (and despite its many flaws it has more to offer than Russia has because all Russia can offer Poland is a return to PRL style vassaldom...
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,475
2 Apr 2018 #187
Ha and what exactly has the West given Poland besides headaches, homosexuality, and threats because Poles dont want to turn into a multikulti socialist hell and be in charge of our own destiny? Not to mention appropriating 2/3 of the polish economy. Thats what were supposed to be thankful for? I guess they did build us roads, only to take away our banking and media sectors. They couldnt even honor a defense treaty when Poland was invaded and send meaningful help... some 'allies'. Even when kraski informed the world of concentration camps the west sat on their hands. Most Poles expect the same thing to happen should Russia invade - Poles know that once again our European so called allies would be on the sidelines and at best wed get some help from the US. That is why Poles are looking more and more to the v4.
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,671
2 Apr 2018 #188
, homosexuality,

you are very interested in that , aren't you?

multikulti

so a bit like the rich country where you were raised then?
kaprys 2 | 1,915
2 Apr 2018 #189
That's the point really. As much as some despise the EU, I doubt many would suspect any Western European country to invade Poland. As for Russia, well ...

There's a thick line between a country's culture and politics. The same applies to the mentality. Polish and Russian mentalities are different.
Culturally, Poland has also always been slightly different from Russia, different religion, different alphabets etc.
mafketis 21 | 7,464
2 Apr 2018 #190
Ha and what exactly has the West given Poland besides headaches, homosexuality, and threats

What else does Poland want?

They coulsnt even honor a defense treaty when Poland was invaded and send help... some 'allies'.

Yes, they didn't respond when Germany invaded while the Soviets liberated Poland! Long live the eternal friendship between Poland and the Soviet Union

friendship
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,475
2 Apr 2018 #191
Yes exactly like the US - atleast Trump is one person the Poles might be able to count on should Russia attack.

Poland wants to be left alone to sort out our politics for ourselves. The majority of Poles including myself never thought the eu would become a far left political institution that seeks to shape polish society into their mold. We had rule from a capital thousamds of kms away - we hated it and that's what's happening now again. For now Poles support the EU because of the free movement and the money. But now thay the EU is sticking their nose into Polish affairs, a total double standard as they did nothing to intervene in Spain during the Catalonia protests or when PO fired critical journalists as well as plenty of other examples... but no poland gets threatened with sanctions for cleaning up our house something that is none of the eus business.
Velund 1 | 435
2 Apr 2018 #192
a total double standard as they did nothing to intervene in Spain during the Catalonia protests

There is a few grades of "europeans". Highest grade is allowed to do things that is not allowed for a lowest.

youtube.com/watch?v=RIgwoLCZ9Uc
Crow 137 | 7,756
2 Apr 2018 #193
I dont worry about them ruining relations between poland and russia as they're already bad.

Then you should worry. Always can be worse. I clearly can imagine British Theresa May ordering detonation of nuclear bomb on the soil of Poland, just in order to be able to use it in propaganda war against Russia. Woman is lunatic no less then that Hillary Clinton. Where they just founding all those b******

But sure, don`t panic.

What i fear more is eu trying to drive a wedge between poland and hungary.

Oh, but they must. In that plan only Poland is destined to burn. That for one. Its about securing safety of Hungary, while sacrifice Poland. I wouldn`t do it better if I wanted to do it. Give sane politics to Hungary and insane politics to Poland. Then, when sh** happens, Anglos would declare `crazy Slavs did it to itself`.

Second reason for isolating Poland from Hungary is similar to reason why isolate Poland from Serbia. That is, Anglos and Germanics knows that influence from those countries directly affect Polish nationalism and patriotism. From different reasons but, always had and have serious effects. So, if Poland is isolated from Hungary and Serbia, effects are prevented and both, ruling position and opposition of Poland can sell out Poland and f*** Poles in the brain.

Merkel and Theresa gets orgasm after orgasm due to this Poland`s situation.
peterweg 36 | 2,316
2 Apr 2018 #194
I know this is too complex for you to grasp, but the main reason why I am so against Poland having a bogus ABM system that costs billions yet isn't effective

Patriot is primarly an anti-aircraft system, its anti- ballistic functions are secondary (only for the US Army). The US uses THAAD for ballistic missile defence.

Poland need it to defend its air bases, without it there will be no Polish airforce in Poland, they will have to move to Germany or be destroyed on the ground.

This alone is reason to buy Patriot (or MEADS). The Israeli Skyceptors may well prove effective against Russian missiles, but the alternative of accepting defeat and certain nuclear obliteration isnt acceptable to Poles.

"That means he'll have more missles to counter the patriot system."
He has already installed as many nuclear missiles as he can\wants, but he's limited by cost and treaty agreements.

"happens to be a sarmat"
Thats a ICBM not the short range missiles in Kaliningrad. Whether is exists is doubtful

what exactly has the West given Poland besides

If you insist on spouting pure unadulterated Kremlin propaganda then you are a Kremlin Tool, no matter where you claim to be born.

.
Crow 137 | 7,756
2 Apr 2018 #195
Would this Patriot function in case of NATO attack on Poland, to paraphrase brat Jan Lopuzansky from right wing Catholics in Polish Parliament, that asked something like it back in 1999?
peterweg 36 | 2,316
2 Apr 2018 #196
Patriot is primarily an anti-aircraft system, its anti- ballistic functions are secondary (only for the US Army).

Thats wrong.The US emphasises ballistic defense because, recently, that's the only sort of weapon that has been used against it. It can shoot down aircraft very effectively, but expensively.

Poland's Patriot system is fundamentally different in that the SkyCeptor missile (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David%27s_Sling) is cheap enough to be used against ALL targets.
Crow 137 | 7,756
2 Apr 2018 #197
peterwege, you now talk to yourself. Did you finally lost your mind?
Slavictor 7 | 195
2 Apr 2018 #198
Merkel and Theresa gets orgasm after orgasm due to this Poland`s situation.

Hahahaha.... thanks for that one.
Crow 137 | 7,756
2 Apr 2018 #199
Its not funny people. Let us pull out Poland from that western European madness. It all went too far. Move on streets people to demand Poland out of NATO and then let us expand Visegrad group and rename it into Intermarium. Let us do it while lunatics didn`t kill us all
Velund 1 | 435
2 Apr 2018 #200
I hope you do not plan to visit EC countries soon? I fear to see the note about your arrest for something forged-on-the-go in the news.

Anglos cannot peacefully coexist - they must dominate. In the past anglos solved their major problems by war, not always direct. Now we have a major crisis, as their major competitors - Russia and China - taking enough strength to become nearly invincible, if they act together, and there is no military solution for a lot of problems that anglos need to solve. If attacked separately, both countries still vulnerable but the price agressor will pay will be really horrible. In 20-30 years China will become invincible by itself. Russia probably will reach it even faster, at least from purely defensive point of view - it is much cheaper. So, anglos have very narrow time frame, but anyway does not ready to pay the price of direct conflict, and still looking for stupids who will be ready to suicide attack to weaken opponents. Chechens was found as internal insurgents in Russia, but ended up pretty fast - one of clans take over and nearly stopped any hostile activity. Attempts to activate muslim guerilla in Tibet also was suppressed by China quite fast. So, panic and attempts to make as much harm as possible...
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,475
3 Apr 2018 #201
USA and the wests time is over. Their empire is in decline and more and more countries are shedding their influence. The future belongs to the China Russia Shia axis. China is the new colonizer you go to any continent in the world or even any country just about and there is chinese influence and chinese business - especially in Hungary as far as Europe is concerned and Polamd seeking closer economic ties with China.

The west is destroying itself because while it is strong economically and militarily, it is being eroded from the inside through far left ideologies which turn hunderds of millions of otherwise healthy minded people into whiners who are offended by everything and want safe spaces because their feelings arenhurt. These people are the wests future and that's sad and quite scary. Even the high school dude whos now some anti gun internet celebrity couldn't even get into college yet hes giving speeches to try to.sway us policy. Utter garbage
ShockedInPoland
3 Apr 2018 #202
USA and the wests time is over.

You live in the West, Poland is in the West and you want to see our downfall? Who do you want to take its place? China? Russia?
cms neuf - | 1,022
3 Apr 2018 #203
But like the NRA (who also don't often go to college) this guy is merely exercising his right to free speech for something he believes in. That is something he could not do in China or Russia, where the way to influence politics is either via coercion or corruption. Without some level of freedom then the potential of those big countries will always be limited and living standards for the masses will be below the West.
Tacitus 2 | 889
3 Apr 2018 #204
Besides, as the current president clearly demonstrates, you don't need intelligence to convince others to follow you.
dolnoslask 5 | 2,560
3 Apr 2018 #205
I think the last one also proved this point.
Tacitus 2 | 889
3 Apr 2018 #206
You mean the one before the last one?

One can criticize a lot about Obama, but it is obvious that he is a highly intelligent man. Bush Jr. on the other hand... .
Velund 1 | 435
3 Apr 2018 #207
You live in the West, Poland is in the West and you want to see our downfall?

Poland is Poland, not as rotten as some lands to the west yet. And Poland can do little to prevent the processes of decay that affected those who try to rule.
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,475
3 Apr 2018 #208
@ShockedInPoland

Poland is nothing like western Europe. For one we are a homogenous Christian country with a constitution that protects the institute of.marraige, where nationalism is encouraged, where the vast majority is against migrants from me and africa and half against even ukranian migranys which i personally don't have a problem with, where Christ is King, where we have rosary prayers around our borders as a symbolic gesture that well fight against islamization - western Europe has given up that fight and allowed islamization to occur. Instead of promoting law and order and european culture theyve allowed no.gos and sharia courts to sprout up while spending more money to help parasitic economic migrants than the entire education budget
ShockedInPoland
3 Apr 2018 #209
You Ruskies have a funny view of the world.
Velund 1 | 435
3 Apr 2018 #210
Meanwhile, today....

img5.eadaily.com/r650x400/o/495/f1fe1b21bfca83695bce2639a0e0e.jpg


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