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Polish DNA? Poles have the most genes in a group includes Balts, Macedonians and Greeks.


Nick the Greek
28 May 2011 #211
Like the Poles, the Greeks have Pride of Place, comfortable in the knowledge that it was their ancestors who set the standards in so many academic fields and disciplines, the pursuit of all universal knowledge was the driving force which compelled ancient Greeks to want to learn from others, from nature and from the arts and the sciences which they themselves were uniquely developing. Modern Greeks are Proud of that...so Proud, they have become overprotective of their ancestral heritage in the face of crude and crass Revisionism and Pseudo-History found emanating from some Turkic and Slavic sources.

The Idea that the Slavic Tribes were Indigenous to the Haemus [Balkan] peninsula still lingers in the minds of some SouthSlavs but it absolutely resonates in the minds of ex-Yugoslavs. The Vardar Slavs were Indoctrinated by Slavist philologists, seeded with the Idea that their so called "Macedonian" language, whilst recognizing that it is both Satem and Slavic, is Indigenous to the Haemus peninsula.

Florin Curta and Mario Alinei are often cited as a serious academics on this subject because both of them postulate the Slavic Tribes being Native and Autochthonous to the Haemus peninsula. In reality the Slavic Tribes were Exogenous to the Haemus [Balkan] peninsula...this is an academic reference point.

Those who advocate a revised version of the long established mainstream historical record are burderned with having to provide more than just Theories Ideas and Conjectures to back up their claims. Producing a Theory which differs from the mainstream does not automatically halt or detract or put on the pending shelf, the existing version, it is this existing mainstream version which actually carries in scholarly and academic circles, above and beyond that of unproven Theories Ideas or Conjectures, merely producing an opposing view which puts into question the validity of the mainstream historical record does not automatically shelving it, halt it or put it on the pending shelf in anticipation when those Theories Ideas and Conjectures are given time and space to be proven.

In reality...No serious academic(s) have ever backed the Theories of Florin Curta or Mario Alinei, so there is no need to shelve the existing current view, the long established mainstream normal view that Slavs with their Satem Sloven language(s) are Indeed and in fact Exogenous to the Haemus [Balkan] peninsula, this is where we are at in the academic world, where it is considered a reference point, a marker point in history from where other peoples histories multiplex into the mainstream, where everything matches, is consistant and compatible with the mainstream version of our common European history, no conflicts and no clashes!

The one thing Revisionist Pseudo-Historians can not consolidate with the International academic community is their Indoctrinated obstinacy and insistance that the SerboBulgarian language they developed is actually native and Autochthonous to the Haemus peninsula!
Nick the Greek
29 May 2011 #212
The Polish people are proud of their ancestry, respect their Slavic genealogy, cherish their history and their heritage. The Polish People would not change a thing, I mean they change nothing, not even one iota about themslves or their origins and the Greeks are no exception. The Greeks value their inhertance, their cultural and liguistic legacy and rightly so, they have much to proud of and pride

would never permit Greeks to accept alterations to what was passed down to them from generations past.

Unlike Polish People and Unlike Greek People, some SouthSlavic people have accepted changes and alterations, I mean stuff they inherited from their original ethnic-racial, cultural and linguist ancestors...for example:

Serbians and Croatians speak a common language called SerboCroatian and quite rightly so, No Conflict here, but when Serbians and Bulgarians speak their common language they do not call it SerboBulgarian, instead they call it "Macedonian."

Some SouthSlavs from the ex-Yugoslavia speak a hybrid mix of Serbian and Bulgarian...a concoction, developed specially for them in 1944 which Slavist philologists perversly named "Macedonian" and this is worrisome to Slavic Intellectuals because No other proud, learned or sophisticated peoples would have accepted a change of name to their original genetic language, the one which was passed on to them genealogically from mother to daughter and from father to son, the one they inherited from their distant ancestors.

Acually the Macedonian language was indeed and infact the Greek Hellenic language, a Centum Indo-European language as opposed to the Satem, SerboBulgarian language Slavist philogists developed specially just for the SouthSlavs of FYRoM.

Proud People would never have permitted such changes or alterations to their original genetic language history or heritage in the way
some ex-Yugoslavs so readily accepted, much to the detriment of the Greeks!
southern 75 | 7,096
29 May 2011 #213
the Greeks have Pride of Place, comfortable in the knowledge that it was their ancestors who set the standards in so many academic fields and disciplines, the pursuit of all universal knowledge was the driving force which compelled ancient Greeks to want to learn from others, from nature and from the arts and the sciences which they themselves were uniquely developing. Modern Greeks are Proud of that.

Modern Greeks are actually very sad that our ancestors were so vastly superior in any aspect than their descendants.This heavy heritage is too much to carry.

It is true that Slavomacedonians try to identify themselves with the ancient Macedonians who were not Slavs.On the other hand we have heard that Homer was a Turk,Sokrates was Black and so it is clear nonsense.
Nick the Greek
29 May 2011 #214
Modern Greeks are actually very sad that our ancestors were so vastly superior in any aspect than their descendants.This heavy heritage is too much to carry.

Agree...We only have ourselves to blame for permitting the Turk to rule for so long over GrecoRoman Imperial dominians. The Ottoman Turk was responsible for converting eastern and southeastern Europe into a poor and backward place where it has remained up till today, in comparison to the western part of Europe that is!

The eastern asiatic oriental Musulmen Turks destroyed a civilization and a way of life which endured as a bastion of Greek thought wisdom and sapience for Millenia. The Turk found himself in command of GrecoRoman and GrecoSlavic populations so enlightened, I mean so knowledgable in all of the academic and scholarly disciplines he knew not what to do.

The Turk found himself in charge of a region so rich and wealthy in comparison to the Western part of Europe he knew not what to do or how to deal with his situation, so he did what the Turk does best...In just a short period of time, his governance over the region, the Turk converted the most enlightened part of Europe into the most backward part of Europe, he converted the wealthiest and richest part of Europe into the poorest part of Europe and that has remained the case up till today. From since the Turk was relieved of his command over the region, the place and the peoples of it have remained poor and backward...In comparison to the Western part of Europe.

The Greeks have done well since they ejected the Turk from their place but they can not progress...The Greeks are disadvantaged by geography, handicapped for residing in a region of the world where Hellenism and it's Ideals mean little. The numerically superior Slavic element and Turkic element sometimes in alliance, vie for their own self Interests. Greeks and Hellenism can not compete in such an environment, in their own region...I mean Hellenism is disrespected and so are modern Greeks to the point where Slavic and Turkic Revisionist Pseudo-Historians advance Theories Ideas and Conjectures which for all Intents and purposes are designed to belittle Hellenism.

Greeks and Hellenism are lucky to have Western European admiration for their achievements...had it not been for their continued support of Hellenic Ideals and Core Values modern Greeks and their Homelands would have been devoured by now, in the same way their own backyard [the Haemus peninsula] was devoured a very long time
southern 75 | 7,096
29 May 2011 #215
The ottoman influence was devastating of course(Turks and Mongols are the two nations which bring evry region they conquer backwards instead of advancing) but now the causes of decline have to do more with the national character than the turkish influence(and ancient Greece declined at some moment and was swallowed by the Romans so we are not invulnerable).
Des Essientes 7 | 1,291
29 May 2011 #216
The Vardar Slavs were Indoctrinated by Slavist philologists, seeded with the Idea that their so called "Macedonian" language, whilst recognizing that it is both Satem and Slavic, is Indigenous to the Haemus peninsula.

You are right Nick this is indeed ridiculous pseudo-philology. For it to be true, given the similarity of all the Slavic languages which indicates that they didn't diverge from proto-Slavic until around the start of the Common Era, then the Balkans would have to be the original Slavic homeland, which it clearly isn't because we know who was living there at the time and they weren't Slavs.
southern 75 | 7,096
29 May 2011 #217
Actually Slavomacedonian and Bulgarian are mutually intelligible in over 90% to the point that Bulgarians regard Slavomacedonian as a simple bulgarian dialect.(they refuse to use interpreters).
Nick the Greek
29 May 2011 #218
You are right Nick this is indeed ridiculous pseudo-philology.

But this is what Greeks have to contend with and it has alienated or distanced them from SouthSlavs.

We need to hear your comments coming from higher academic Slavic sources to stamp out the revisionism and the pseudo-history and the anti-Hellenic propaganda.

Propaganda must be Exposed Callenged Confronted and then Corrected...Greeks are in No mood to have their history and heritage perversely corrupted , we shall defend and protect what is ours by historic and hereditary right...

...Come Hell or High Water!

The ottoman influence was devastating of course(Turks and Mongols are the two nations which bring evry region they conquer backwards instead of advancing) but now the causes of decline have to do more with the national character than the turkish influence(and ancient Greece declined at some moment and was swallowed by the Romans so we are not invulnerable).

The National Character of the modern Greek has been portrayed as being somewhat lazy and unproductive but this is the Germanic view which has spilled over into mainstream...German tourists who worked so hard all year to earn their two week vacation appear to get incensed watching laid back Greeks laze around, you see to the Germanic, the work ethic still prevails and unless you put in eight solid and productive hours in a factory producing anything from cars to broomsticks is considered lazy!

To the Germanics, the laid back southern mediteranean lifestyle they can not comprehend, it appears lazy to them, they want to see the Greek sweat eight hours a day in a manufacturing factory producing something, thats the only way the Germanic brain works, where a worker gets up in the morning, sweats eight hours in some factory, goes home, eats, sleeps and wakes up to do it all over again!

The Greeks by nature are entrepreneurs, they have proved themselves time and time again, more outside of their homeland than inside, so the problem is one of gevernance...Greek politicians I have no time for, but I do have faith in the Greek character, durable dominant and resiliant and given the right environment can outperform Germanics but not in factory work, nobody can beat the German here...he is a natural factory worker where that, would simply Kill the Greek stone dead!

The Greek needs to duck and dive in the sunlight, nearby a Taverna if yoiu know what I mean!

Enterprise and Greeks go together but Greek politician and good Governance are somewhat distanced!
rock - | 460
29 May 2011 #219
Do not blame Turks for your current situation.

Greeks are one of the laziest nations of the world.

They always wait help of West Europe and they just sleep, eat, dance and speak speak speak. lol
NomadatNet 1 | 457
29 May 2011 #220
The Greek needs to duck and dive in the sunlight, nearby a Taverna if yoiu know what I mean!

I know what you mean. I have had several Greek business friends. Some of them were travelling daily to Ayvalik town here from Greek Lesbos island. Had eaten fish and drink much with them there. Their way of doing business was to talk business in such athmosphere while my other visitors from other part of Europe preferred to visit factories and talk business there. One of Greek businessman asked me to travel to factories and we drove to many towns for a week. I had paid his hotel costs, meals and drinks. At the end, he returned back home saying he'd be ordering some containers of goods, but, he ordered nothing. [If I see him one day, I'll have him to have me travel, eat and drink in the same way and I won't pay him anything. (btw, for those who don't know, Lesbos is the name of an island, near Turkey Aegan coast. It is said to be there were lesbians living there in that island, but, I don't know its present stiuation.)]
Des Essientes 7 | 1,291
29 May 2011 #221
Lesbos is the name of an island, near Turkey Aegan coast. It is said to be there were lesbians living there in that island, but, I don't know its present stiuation.)]

People from Lesbos are still Lesbians. Their title became synonomous with girl on girl eroticism because the ancient lyric poetess Sappho, who composed verses on this theme, was from Lesbos.
NomadatNet 1 | 457
29 May 2011 #222
They always wait help of West Europe and they just sleep, eat, dance and speak speak speak. lol

But, they are smarts as well.. There is a rumor that says Greeks are hiding much gold and they are requesting help from Germany, etc showing themselves as poor. This must be reason why Greeks work less and entertain much.

People from Lesbos are still Lesbians. Their title became synonomous with girl on girl eroticism because the ancient lyric poetess Sappho, who composed verses on this theme, was from Lesbos.

Really? Are you Greek? Those people from Lesbos island often travel to Ayvalik town of Turkey daily for shopping, etc and return back when the day is over. Most of people who do this daily trip I saw there in Ayvalik were women, but, I haven't looked at them carefully as I was alyways there to meet a Greek businessman. Rock, Lesbos island is Midilli adasi. Ayvalik streets and shops on days are full of those Midilli people there.
Nick the Greek
30 May 2011 #223
They always wait help of West Europe and they just sleep, eat, dance and speak speak speak. lol

I replied to this post yesterday and the thread dissapeared [Censorship] for reasons [Forum Rules] to do with keeping on topic!
The Topic here is Polish Dna...Apparently Poles have the Most Genes when compared to Other Ethnic-Racial, Cultural and Linguistic groups. The group listing is Interesting because in it are Greeks and Macedonians...as if the two are seperate and distinct!

Macedonians have always been Greek Hellenic people, right from the start and the very beginning, from time immemorial...They are Greek, not different to Greeks or seperate race from Greeks, they are Greek, in the same way the Spartans are Greek or the Corinthians are Greek or the Athenians are Greek, etc, etc, etc!

This is what Riles the Greeks...The clever way in which the term Macedonia(n) gets distanced from Greek or Greece as if to show that they are seperate and distinct.

Macedonia(n)...This is an ancient and archaic regional-tribal name used to describe the northermost geographic region of Hellas, The Hellenic Republic, where Macedonians have lived since time immemorial.

Today, the term has almost been usurped by SouthSlavic people wanting it to describe their New country, Nationality, Language and Ethnicity, in fact they want the name the symbols and the regalia assocoiated with it, plus, they want the history and heritage, the legacy of Alexander the Great and the ancient Macedonians from antiquity...They want all this whilst at the same time, ridicule and humiliate modern Greeks and Hellenism.

Greeks like me, wont permit SouthSlavs to usurp Greek Hellenic things...If they want Greek Hellenic things, they should Re-Hellenize themselves Willingly and Volunatarily and return back to the Fold!

Peace to the Moderators...If the contents of this post are found to be offensive, or flout the rules, delete it, and explain the reason for doing so but there is No need to delete this whole Thread because of my participation in it!
Nick the Greek
31 May 2011 #224
The academic disciplines of Geography and History, Anthropology and modern Genetics can map and apply, with some degree of certainty those elements Native and Idigenous, Original and Autochthonous characteristics to modern populations. The Indigenous and Autochthonous status of modern Greeks has been sealed using the criteria above but there are forces out there which attempt

to downplay this important fact, this academic reference point. Combinations of Revisionism Pseudo-History and Propaganda, three powerful political tools, elements which if used properly, in unison and in conjunction with each other could cause your oponent very serious damage. FYRoM used all three of these powerful political tools against Greece in their bid to oust The Hellenic Republic from ownership of certain elements of it's cultural heritage.

Revisionism Pseudo-History and Propaganda, very powerful political tools, used by Slavists to persuade their peoples that FYRoM's ex-Yugoslavs are Macedonians and that ancient Macedonians were Slavs. There were guidelines but these were often misinterpreted by the factions using them, a patchwork of politicized organizations and committees both at home and abroad in the diaspora. They all unite around the theme, "Macedonia for the Macedonians" wherever they are in the world but to what depth and to what degree was often open to that factions interpretations of the revisionism the pseudo-history and the propapanda. Their intentions to work for common purpose and for common cause often caused them to contradict themselves, misinterpreting and overstepping the guidelines issued to them, for example:

Slavist school taught Slavic children pupils and students that ancient Greeks expired, died out and modern Greeks are not real Greeks but an amalgamation of all the peoples who passed through their lands and decided to settle on it, to lay down roots...which included the Slavic tribes who mixed with the ancient Macedonians ???

Can you see the contradiction...Ancient Greeks expired, died out but ancient Macedonians survived to mix with the Slavic tribes when they arrived in the region in the 6th Century A.D. and it is through this union FYRoM's ex-Yugoslavs become more deserved of the history and heritage of Macedonia, more so than the modern Greeks who are not real Greeks but a creation of the West, created to cheat the Slavonic peoples out of their true history and heritage in the Haemus [Balkan] peninsula!

Revisionism contradicts the Pseudo-History and the Propaganda contradicts the long established mainstream historical record...I say stick to the mainstream. Macedonians have always been Greek Hellenic people, right from the start and the very beginning whilst FYRoM's ex-Yugoslavs have always been recorded as Slavs either Serbian or Bulgarian in all the Census accounts, Demographic statistics, Ethnographic repots and in Population studies that were ever officially commissioned!
PolskiMoc 4 | 324
31 May 2011 #225
Also, the biggest percentage of R1b is in Wales (82 %!). Does this mean that Wales are the most Celtic? Wales are followed by Ireland (79 %), Scotland (72.5 %) and England (67 %). Very high percentage. It seems quite logical as Welsh, Irish, Scottish and English people live on islands and therefore there was little mixing.

Basques have even higher R1b at 86 percent.

R1b people in their pure form are Basques

I haplogroup people intheir pure form are Bosnians

R1a haplogroup in their pureform in Europe are Poles & Sorbs.

I think it is clear that we are the master race.

Sorbs have 63 percent R1a & Sorbs are only 50,000 people! a tiny population!

But! a Sorb was Gotfried Leibniz who invented Calculus, the Mechanical Calculator & Binardy code used in Computers.

Now, How many populations of 50,000 have someone as great as Leibniz?

Shows that we R1a people are the master race!

Look at Poles. Both in Russia & Germany Poles are WELL over exegerated as the Greats.

With Polish rootGermans like Nietzsche,a great philospher Rudolf Virchow who founded Modern Pathology, Thoedor Kaluza one of the best German physics of all time, Max Skladanowsky who founded Cinema in Germany, Charles Bukowski, Gustav Kirchoff, Paul Nipkow who invented Television ect

In Russia Polish roots with Konstatine Ciolkowski who invented Rocketry, Igor Sikorsky who invented the mass produced helicopter bomber jet, jet air liner, Doestoeysky one of if not the greatest writers of all time. Nikolai Gogol a top writer, Igor Stravinsky a top classical musician ,Aleksander Mo┼╝ajski who invented the first airplane 21 years before the wright brothers ect

Take Konstantine Ciolkowski he invented Rocketry.
Both Korolev & Wernher Von Braun used Ciolkowski's work to put rockets into space. They literally took Ciolkowski's blue prints for Astronautic theory, Rocket Propulsion, Jet fuel ect ect

& they put into Action.

Funny that Wenher Von Braun was born in Polish lands & Korolev born in Western Galicia on Polish lands as well.

How come the most superior Germans are typically from East Germany & or are mixed with Slavic? Typically the most superior Russians are from West russia & or mixed with Polish?

It is clear that you have to be mixed with Polish in order to be a superior human.

Even German Anthropologist Theodor Poesche came to the conclusion that the Blonde haired & Blue eyed Aryan race started in Eastern Poland.

Think about it. This means just about all of Europe with Blonde & Blue eyes is mixed with Polish!

We are clearly the Aryan master race.

Look at the British Isles the highest R1a Haplogroup is in Scots who are the most intellectual progressive proportionately.

Look at the Balkans Albanians have the least R1a in the Balkans & are the biggest sub humans in the Balkans.

Look at Scandanavia Finns have the lowest R1a in Scandanavia & are the lowest Scandanavians.

Basques have the lowest (No ) R1a in Iberia & they are the lowest in Iberia.

It is simple. You have to be mixed with Polish to be an Aryan master race.

Basques have no R1a & Basques don't speak a Indo- European language. They have the highest R1b. They have no Intellectual achievements.

They have alot lower B & ABblood types thananywhere in Europe because they are not mixed with Poles who have high R1a & AB & B blood type.

Even look at Jews! Ashkenazi Jews have more R1a than R1b while Sephardic jews ( The dumb Jews) have more R1b than R1a. Ashkenazi Jews did not become Intelligent untill they came to Poland.

Even at that the Polish population maybe the highest Iq scoring population in the world.

The Polish American iq was 109 in the 1970's. While Poland had a 99 iq. Of course East Germany had a 95 iq & West Germany the highest iq in Europe of 103.

Which shows that under the same circumstances we did better.

Now, Western Ashkenazi Jews scored a 114 iq. Compare to a 94 iq to Israel . You pretty much have the same difference.

Considering that Jews are extremely ambitious.

Considering the most recent iq test of Poland is 106. This puts Poles to the top of the Iq list

I think Poles are by far the most Intelligent high iq scoring population on the planet by nature!

Polish Americans scored a 109 iq while White Americans scored a 100 iq & Asian Americans scored a 97 iq.

Today White americans score a 103 iq & Asian Americans a 107 iq.

Who knows what Polish Americans score on the iq test. White Americans jumped about 3 points in 30 years & Asians jumped 10 points in 30 years.

But, Even with Asians Americans having a 107 iq they are still behind the Polish American iq of 109 in the 1970's!
George8600 10 | 637
31 May 2011 #226
Greeks are one of the laziest nations of the world.

No they aren't....I bet you're one of those people that looks at pictures of Greece and sees all the tourists doing that and assumes it's them.

According to Forbes and other sources Greece is among the top 10 hardest working countries:

Hours worked: 2,052

Legal allowance of vacation days: 20 days

Public holidays: 12

GDP per capita: $30,500

GDP composition by sector: Agriculture 3.2%, Industry 20.6%, Services 76.3%

Population: 10.72 million

Labor force: 4.94 million

along with Poland:

Poland

Hours worked: 1,985

Legal allowance of vacation days: 20 days (26 days after 10 years of employment)

Public holidays: 12

GDP per capita: $16,200

GDP composition by sector: Agriculture 4.1%, Industry 31.9%, Services 64%

Population: 38.5 million

Labor force: 17.01 million

and Turkey:

Turkey

Hours worked: 1,918

Legal allowance of vacation days: 14 to 26 days

Public holidays: Seven

GDP per capita: $9,400

GDP composition by sector: Agriculture 8.9%, Industry 30.8%, Services 59.3%

Population: 71.89 million

Labor force: 25.27 million (about 1.2 million Turks work abroad)

just because you see the rich and politicians exploiting the system does not mean that all the people are like that...
Ogien 6 | 245
31 May 2011 #227
With Polish rootGermans like Nietzsche,a great philospher Rudolf Virchow who founded Modern Pathology, Thoedor Kaluza one of the best German physics of all time, Max Skladanowsky who founded Cinema in Germany, Charles Bukowski, Gustav Kirchoff, Paul Nipkow who invented Television ect

You have a source stating that Nietzsche and Kirchhoff had Polish roots?
PolskiMoc 4 | 324
31 May 2011 #228
Germany is a great nation, only because its people have so much Polish blood in their veins.... I am proud of my Polish descent. I remember that in former times a Polish noble, by his simple veto, could overturn the resolution of a popular assembly. There were giants in Poland in the time of my forefathers.

Quote Friedrich Nietzsche:

The idea lay dormant for 40 years. Gustav Kirchhoff (born in 1824) was an energetic Polish physicist who barely stood five feet in height. Through the mid-1850s he focused his research on electrical currents at the University of Breslau. In 1858
Ogien 6 | 245
31 May 2011 #229
That quote does seem to be shown in many sources when you search it on Google.

It's really odd considering of all the biographies I've read about Kirchhoff, I have never once encountered anything written about him being Polish.
southern 75 | 7,096
31 May 2011 #230
Look at the Balkans Albanians have the least R1a in the Balkans & are the biggest sub humans in the Balkans.

An interesting interpretation.
Des Essientes 7 | 1,291
31 May 2011 #231
You have a source stating that Nietzsche and Kirchhoff had Polish roots?

Nietzsche claims Polish roots for himself in his book Ecce Homo.
As for the amateur ethnologist PolskiMoc's claims, it does seem probable that given the linguistic and genetic affinity of the Aryans (Indo-Europeans who went into South Asia) and the Slavs that they do indeed share the same ancestors, but in claiming that the Aryans were exclusively blond and blue-eyed he has bought into Nazi lies. THe blondest people on earth are not even Indo-European at all but rather Finnish. The Proto-Indo-Europeans were not from the extreme North but rather Anatolia or the Pontic Steppes in Southern Russia. When they migrated into northern Europe they interbred with the indigenous population and it is that indigenous population that was very blonde and red-haired. The darker Poles are more "Aryan" than the fair ones.
Nick the Greek
31 May 2011 #232
Wise men became wise, not through of the matrix of the haplogroups in their biological make-up but through the adoption of a want to learn, to pursue all universal knowledge.
legend 3 | 664
31 May 2011 #233
Amazing (good and bad). I can say I am somewhat skeptical about this but somehow parts of it make sense. I think the whole Master Race stuff is kinda ****** regardless if its Polish, German, Jewish, etc.

I mean real Aryans are from Iran. Blonde hair seems to be quite popular with Germanics as well though (even those without Polish/Slavic blood) for example Danes, Swedes.

I am curious where are you getting these IQs from?

I have seen some sources which really downgrade countries IQs and others exagerate them as to high.
The only study that makes sense Ive seen is that Germans, Dutch and Poles have the highest IQs in Europe.
PolskiMoc 4 | 324
1 Jun 2011 #234
Look where Proto Indo-Iranians come from.

They come from the Andronovo culture in Central Russia. They were Proto Indo-Iranians. Genetic studies concluded that 60 percent of the Andornovo culture were Light haired & Light eyed.

The Andronovo people came from Kurgans from the area of Ukraine, Poland & russia.
The Kurgan Expansion where Indo-Europeans spread out of Ukraine & Moved to Russia &then were the Aryan Invaders to India & Persia bringing indo European languages & cultures with them.

The True Aryans were more lke Russians, Ukrainians, Poles ect than like Modern Iranians.

Scythians were an Iranic speakers who were closest to the Proto Indo Iranians. Greeks Depicted Scythians as largely Blonde haired & Even Whiteh aired.
Scythian Burials also generally show blonde hair.

Scythians were in Russia & Central Asia & Sarmatians a scyhtian tribe in Ukraine. Some think Slavs are Sarmatians or Slavs directly stemmed from Sarmatians.

You also had Tocharians in Western China who were Indo-Europeans & Were depicted by Chinese as light haired & blue eyed. The burials of the Tarim Tocharian mummies show Light haired Caucasoid mummies that look rather Russian.

There are multiple links that show the Aryans came from Poland & Ukraine & Moved to Central Asia.

For Example the First Wheeled Wagon evidence in Poland is the Bronocice pot 5,500 yrs old. The First Wheeled cart 5,300 yrs old found in Ukrainian Yamna Culture.

First True chariot in Andronovo culture 4,600 yrs ago (The Aryans Proto Indo Iranians)

Also there are Links with Swastikas. As the Swastika can directly show the path & spread of Indo-European languages.

The Oldest Swastika 12,000 yrs old found in Ukraine on a Mammoth bone.

Then, The 2nd oldest Swastika found in the Vinca Culture in the Balkaqns about 8,000 yrs ago

In Central Russia there are Swastikas about 5-7,000 yrs old found where the Andronovo culture (Aryans) are.

Before the Swastika was found in India! Hinduism is a Indo-European religion & they use the Swastika.

swastikas are central to Slavic Indo-European paganism too like Receboga, Wheel of Svarog. ect

There is even Writing evidence in Ukraine of the first examples of writen language. The evidence suggests writen Language spread from the Ukraine along with Indo European languages & Kurgans

But, Poland & Russia are also connected to these people

Ukraine Writing 24,000 yrs old Kamyana Mohyla - Megalithomania 2009. Tim Heatherlee Hooker
Nick the Greek
4 Jun 2011 #235
It is said that Genes and their Geographic location blend in with other peoples in close proximity, so if applicable, Polish people share Genetic attributes with Eastern Germans and Western Baltics, BeloRussians and Ukranians whilst to the south, they share Genetic attributes with Czechs and Slovaks...Question:

If relatedness to ones neighbours is Proven...Would that relatedness entice Polish People to adopt or usurp elements of their neighbours
cultural heritage in the same way SouthSlavs usurp the history and heritage of Alexander the Great and the ancient Macedonians from antiquity.

There is no natural process known to man or science which could make or transform Greek-Hellenic people into South-Slavic people over the course of time, but there exists a process which could transform Greek speaking people into Slavic speaking people over the course of time known as Slavicization!

FYRoM's ex-Yugoslavs declaring native and Indigenous status to the Haemus [Balkan] peninsula, harbouring feelings and collective memories to Alexander the Great and the ancient Macedonians from antiquity may well be rooted, If proven, to their relatedness to Greeks, I mean their ancestors may well have intermingled and crossed fertilized [[by force][by free will]] with the incoming Avars Bulgars and Slavs during the barbarian Incursions of the 6th Century A.D.

Slavicization like Hellenization, if carried out willingly and voluntarily are quite natural processes!

FYRoM's ex-Yugoslavs may well be related to Greeks, Romioi Greeks of the Byzantine empire and probably through the Maternal [mtDna] Mitochondrial side, rather than through the Paternal side...which would make them cousins to Greeks proper!

From the 6th Century A.D. till now, that relatedness to Greeks would have broadened and widened, from first cousins they are now so distanced and diluted from the Greek core, their rights to Greek things mean little and count for nothing!

FYRoM's ex-Yugoslavs coveting the rights to that Macedonian name mean little and count for nothing in hereditary terms, they are not Macedonian, not in the Greek sense of that word, they can only ever be Macedonian in the regional sense and geographic context, they could never be ethnic or national Macedonians...This is Anathema for Greeks, simply unacceptable!
PolskiMoc 4 | 324
4 Jun 2011 #236
cultural heritage in the same way SouthSlavs usurp the history and heritage of Alexander the Great and the ancient Macedonians from antiquity

Oddly enough Mycenaean & Macedonian Greeks have more R1a haplogroup than do (Fyrom) & Serbia. North Eastern Greece is in the 20 -30 percent R1a haplogroup range.

It is stated that Mycenaean & Macedonian Greeks were mostly R1a Haplogroup

It was probably bought by the Aryan Indo-Europeans from Poland & Ukraine.

It is thought that Proto Greek came from Poland & Ukraine down to Northern Greece.

With the First evidence of Writing in Ukraine 24,000 yrs ago

Then, the 7,250 year old Dispillio Tablet in Northern Greece shows a direct Link to Ukraine.
alexw68
4 Jun 2011 #237
It is stated that Mycenaean & Macedonian Greeks were mostly R1a Haplogroup

It was probably bought by the Aryan Indo-Europeans from Poland & Ukraine.

It is thought that Proto Greek came from Poland & Ukraine down to Northern Greece.

<Weasel words: citation required>
PolskiMoc 4 | 324
4 Jun 2011 #238
Two R1a haplogroup maps show R1a is higher in North Eastern Greece than in Macedonia & Southern Serbia

volgagermanbrit.us/documents/R1A_map.jpg

upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/94/R1a1a_distribution.png

Eupedia haplogroups shows under R1a Macedonian & Mcyenaean Greek

eupedia.com/europe/european_y-dna_haplogroups.shtml

Which I believe why the most superior Greeks were Macedonian / Mcyenaenean

Like Aristotle & Alexander the Great.

Also both maps show Scotland has the most R1a in the British Isles which is why I think Scots are the most intellectual progressive in the British Isles.
Nick the Greek
4 Jun 2011 #239
It is a Mistake to assigne ethnic-racial attributes to haplogroups...R1a is Not a Polish or Slavic genetic marker as Turkic peoples and Kurdish peoples posess this R1a haplogroup at significant frequencies also!

Macedonians were Not Slavic people...They were and still are, Greek-Hellenic people, they always have been Greek-Hellenic people, we know this because as soon as they learned to read and write, they expressed their Greekness in ways which are still apparent even today!

R1a on it's own is Not Slavic in the same way R1b on it's own is Not Celtic...The Greek-Hellenic genetic signature is clearly depicted and Illustrated in the works of Luigi Luca Cavalli-Sforza, the worlds leading Geneticist. Greeks are native and original, Indigenous and autochthonous to the Haemus [Balkan] peninsula!

The Poles carry in their biological make-up the same stuff [haplogroups] but in different quantities to other European peoples. Blood and Dna are not correlated to ethnicity...the measure of which, apparently is in feelings, archived with consciousness for memory back-up!

I can prove what I say...The Greeks have known from the beginning, since antiquity that blood and Dna are not correlated to ethnicity!
When the ancient Macedonians Hellenized the ancient Thracians, the ancient Thracians adopted Hellenism, they became Greeks willingly and voluntarily, and the most fervent of Greeks at that!

Hellenization adopted as the culture of choice made Greeks out of NoN Greeks...Genes [blood-Dna] played No part here and if carried out willingly and voluntarily is a completely natural process!

Macedonians Hellenized many peoples and made them Greeks, in a nice way...Macedonians have always been Greek Hellenic People, from the dawn of time until now. Since the beginning Macedonians have been Integral to the Greek-Hellenic collective of Peoples. Today's Greeks are the sole and legal modern representatives of the Hellenic legacy, no other modern people on this planet are closer to the ancient Hellenes and their legay than todays modern Greeks. The history of ancient Macedonia defaults to Hellas, Greece, no serious accredited scholar could deny their Hellenic Identity, the history of Macedonia is just one part of Greek history as a whole...Macedonians are Greeks by default.

Greeks take seriously their moral and legal obligations towards Hellenism, for this reason Greeks jealously guard their cultural heritage from Slavist revisionist corruption which attempts to de-Hellenize the ancient Macedonians in order to make them Slavic. The Hellenic Republic reserves the right to protect it's cultural heritage, using all the necessary political and academic tools at it's disposal. It must be noted that Greeks are determined to keep Macedonia Greek.

Macedonia, this story is scratched into the Greek-Hellenic peoples psyche, their collective consciousness like a lazer beam burning and etching that image through thick layers of photo-receiptive materials, that latent image of Macedonia permanently stored into the Greek peoples collective memory archived into their mind body and soul, precisely the reason why Greeks can not permit NoN Greeks to adopt or usurp that name for their country, nationality, language or ethnicity, Macedonia(n)...when this name is used, it refers to Greek-Hellenic people by default.

Macedonians have always been Greek-Hellenic people, since the dawn of time until the present, most learned people know
and it is difficult for them to understand the reason or the motives behind FYRoM's want of a Greek-Hellenic name to Identify with. The Onus is on FYRoM to compromise in order to find a suitable more proper name for itself...a name which properly describes it's peoples and their history, a name to be proud of...This is what the Greeks are asking for, this is what global politicians expect and this is what the world is waiting for!

FYRoM's Slavist revisionist Mind Architects must stop their silliness, they must also stop their pretensions to the Macedonian name, that claim is a farce and the learned world can see right through it!
George8600 10 | 637
6 Jun 2011 #240
..Macedonians have always been Greek Hellenic People, from the dawn of time until now.

we get it for the 50th time that you've said it....this is POLISH forum...go bloat about that stuff on topix forum or something...

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