Poles and Americans, what do you think, are we friends or enemies?

Ah, those Americans with their naive questions, generalizations and divisions. Why do you ask it? Is there anybody supposed to speak for the entire nation?

None of the first and very few of the second.


But a hęll of a lot are and do.


A weird thing to say.

"Knock it off". What's weird about it?

If you need to ask that...

Naive is buying into Communism, which... you did. Hmmm.. instead of "what can I do for me".. it's "what can the state do for me".

Naive? We don't have as many illusions as you guys. We don't expect anything from anyone else.
We work hard to achieve what we need and want.

Generalizations? It's not us who call one entire nation stupid and fat (etc.) like many of you guys on PF.

Divisions? Explain yourself.

why are you including all Americans then ya hypocrite.


if your gonna call people out then at least do it right duhhhhhhh.

Americans are ambivalent about affairs outside their immediate world. Most of don't even know that there is a civil war going on in Mexico. It's not just Poland, it's the entire world. As for Poles...you know as well as I do that Poles don't kiss anyone'sass. Actually if they would learn a little "brown nosin" they may have avoided an invasion or two.

No truer words were ever spoken. At the turn of the century, America was a Nation on the rise.
America was a nation of immigrants.. Most came from Europe. It was a real melting pot. People from all nationalities lived in harmony.. Almost every one was from the poor working class. Compared to what they left behind in Europe, America was the promised land.

People gathered in enclaves of their own nationalities.. We the First generation Poles had our own Polissh Catholic Parochial schools.. The same went for other nationalities. There were close ties to the Families left behind in Poland.. American Poles sent packages and money back to those that could not make it to come to America.

America was involved in two World Wars.. After WW2 Americans prospered.. By now the 2nd generation of baby boomers arrived on the scene. With their new found wealth. they started to move out of the cities and into the suburbs.. With the new wealth , kids started to go to college ond a lot under the GI bill of rights.

This was the decline of association with Poland.. The old people died off. The Polish speaking households disappeared.. Along with the Polish language. This was the begining of the new breed of so called Polish Americans.

By 1960 along with globalization a new breed of Immigrant arrived on our shores.. This was the begining of Americas decline

How do I know this? I lived thru this experience. My kids and Grand kids no longer recognize anything other than America.

Quite a lot of people think that all Americans are egocentric retards. Well, let's face it - most of them are, but some are pretty much normal.

On the other hand many Americans believe that Poland is a third world country full of idiots. I can understand that - most of the people who emigrated to the USA were not educated and/or were religious ;-)

But again, not all poles are retards and/or religious fanatics.

I thought this subject was already covered, but since you were playing hooky that day let’s refresh this topic so it has a chance to sinks in. Buying into or was it Sold into? Ah the freedom loving Americans with their grand illusion of themselves. Ignorance is bliss.


These days; American philosophy is more along the lines of corporate welfare "What can the state do for corporations", priority is not quiet the way you describe it or even in that order but hay it's the belief in that illusion that counts. Individual is a distant second to that of the state and big business, a necessary evil and nuisance at times to the ruling class but you (the individual) do come in handy to pay for the mistakes of the rich and powerful.


True, difference being. Deep down inside we know it, it’s the hope that makes those illusions naive, while you believe every word of it, hence no illusion, no problem.

I myself lay no claim to fame. But it takes all kind of people to make a world. It's true, America has a lot of idiots, but in turn we also have a lot of brilliant people. I tend to believe that most of Europeans are better educated than Americans. I admire how most Europeans speak a multitude of languages. But this might be to the fact that you all live in such close proximity to each other.. Whereas in America, we are seperated by two oceans.

As far as the original Polish immigrants go. Yes it's true.. They were poor uneducated people, a lot of them were Peasants. They were no more religious than present day Poles.

The way you put it, it almost sounds like the reason for our American nowadays problems is your "decline of association with Poland."


So if someone is religious is automatically an idiot, LOLOLOLOLOLOL
You made my day man :-)


That's the point, we don't believe any word of it (or most of it anyway).


Why not just say that anywhere you go it is that way, not only in America.

Disagree with you on that one. Here in Toronto I've had the pleasure of meeting some western Europeans (Austrians, Germans). One Bulgarian. A Swede at one point. All in my house actually because it's a student house. Anyways, they appear to be very egocentric and ignorant. No better than the stereotypical "American". I'm a Polish Canadian and they didn't know much about Poles even though on the map we are quite close. Maybe it's human nature to be ignorant and just know your own kind.

You're obviously right. Ignorance is present any place you go and has nothing to do with any particular country. I wish they finally realize that but I guess it will never happen. Some people know it, some learn it later and some never will.

A perfect example of ingnorance , are your replies. To me you appear to be a person with brain damage. I see now why people refer to you as a TROLL

And to me you appear like a "backward" Pollack (unlike many intelligent Poles around here), not able to determine anyone's ability to think at all.

Look what you wrote, "This was the decline of association with Poland.. The old people died off. The Polish speaking households disappeared.. Along with the Polish language. This was the begining of the new breed of so called Polish Americans.

By 1960 along with globalization a new breed of Immigrant arrived on our shores.. This was the begining of Americas decline"

Don't even try to get out of it, you clearly wrote that as long as it was old Polish immigration, with all of their habits, everything was fine in America and now facing non-Polish immigrants, America is in decline. How stupid is that. Do you even realize what you're saying?

It's like our welfare in the states depends on nothing else but on the old Polish immigration.

what Americans know about Europe:

these maps by Tsvetkov are pretty cool... made based on stereotypes...

see here the 7 maps of Europe by Yanko
alphadesigner.com/project-mapping-stereotypes.html

Yeah.. you would know mf'er. We weren't the ones standing in line for toilet paper on freezing winter afternoons in the 50's - 80's.

You scarcely rebelled against that commie sh.t sandwich at all and you have the balls to call somebody "naive". LMFAO. Half of you want to go back to it too.

We even tried to give you some of the Marshall Plan funds.. YOU TURNED IT DOWN!

Is the US in decline? Sure to a degree. Who's fault is it? It's ours.. and we'll fix it. However, you don't see us saying we were sold out or boo hoo the British abandoned us or whatever. What a f.ucking joke.

If anything you prove my point with that statement that actually was a constant reminder of the paradise that the system was creating for everyone; we lived it, its effects experienced by virtually everyone. Making everyone conscious of the reality in the process, while you lived and still live a sheltered existence. Deprived of this experience you’re blind of the reality that surrounds you, gullible and easily manipulated. You swallow every piece of propaganda fed to you as if it was some kind of a tasty morsel that only you are privileged enough to have. If anything it’s those freezing winters that thought us skepticism, to be weary of the government and those in power ready to do anything necessary in order to stay there, even if it meant betraying their country and fallow man in the process, selling it off bit by bit, a healthy dose of it too. It’s precisely this shock therapy that allowed us to throw off the yoke that bound us for so long. Perhaps you should try it, it will restore your sight and it will finally allow you to see that illusion for what it is. Contrary to your belief, it won’t make you less patriotic but it just might set you free.


When you’re right you’re right. To be naïve one has to assume a person is incapable of his own thought and opinion, he would have to let the others do the thinking for him. Hard to believe that such a thing can even be possible in the U.S, I mean the best education money can buy, top notch universities that go with it, that national myth of individualism you have and at this day and age? No, definitely not; it’s not the naivety that blinds you to the reality that surrounds you.; it’s your stupidity.


Sure I do, you and your kind constantly boasting you save Europe, you rebuild Europe, that if it wasn’t for us etc. Funny thing is you actually believe every word of that crap. Like it was you who liberated us from communism. By your own admission you did diddly squat for us yet expect us to be grateful for your imaginary help and act like we owe you something in return. What a f*cking joke.

When reminded of the facts suddenly it’s all lies. How could that be? It’s in direct conflict with what you’ve been thought all your life. That national myth you build for yourself (an illusion if you will) when in fact it’s your actions that created that post war reality in the first place, the hell we had to lived in, and here we are; you throwing a tantrum for those words shatter your illusion of America the just, grow up.

Good post but pointless since he will never get it.The level of propaganda in the US is simply unbeliveble.Many of them live in mobile homes and hoop around in 20 years old junk yet still belive they live "American dream" and are way better off than anybody living outside US.

I know that this is the common opinion by most of the Polish PF members but I may disagree with you guys. Even though we didn't directly help Poland but we shipped lot's of war equipment to the Soviet Union and they "liberated" Poland , so indirectly we did help you.

Here's the link: o5m6.de/Numbers.html
The outcome of the "liberation" by the Soviets, that's another story. It's a known fact that you guys weren't really free and had to suffer under, practically Soviet occupation.

Do you see the Irony in your statement? Let’s just pray that the day when U.S is liberated by Mexico and run by one of those Central American military juntas never comes. Let’s hope that if that day ever comes we won’t supply them with weapons, that we’re somehow better than that. Honestly do you see it as a good deed on your part?

So now you blame America for delivering the military equipment for the Soviets because they turned around and used it to "occupy" Poland, right?

Well, I don't take that blame. The WW2 was long and cruel. Everyone was fed up with it. Actually Patton even suggested to go east but Roosevelt wouldn't listen to him.

It's time to quit blaming each other. The war is over. Enjoy your freedom and move on guys.

It all depends on who you deal with and that person,s mentality and what they are like and what they know.

WHO THE HELL SAID WE HAD TO DO ANYTHING FOR YOU?? I don't expect you to be anything.. I never implied that. I could care less. You're a non-entity half the time. I don't care if you get out of Afghanistan.. I don't care if you support us overtly or indirectly.. either way you're going to complain like a 5 year old. So be it.

Why don't you give us another thread how the British abandoned you.. DIDN'T TAKE CARE OF YOU. Baww haww. You had 40 divisions when the Nazis came calling.

No, it's not our stupidity. In America you're allowed to fail. This includes the politicians. Also we (Americans) know two things: we have nowhere else to go and we're armed to the teeth. If we take to the streets we realize it'll get bloody in a very short time and if we throw the bums out who replaces them???


Myth. In 1920-22 Poland was invaded by the Russian Bolsheviks and promptly kicked them out. If Poland was opposed to communism after the German occupation they would have done the same thing in 1946 like they did in 1922. The fact is, the Polish people embraced communism in the 1940's. The Poles lived under Polish communism not Russian communism.

Well, I'm not so sure about that, Stalin's army was pretty strong to that time, kicking them out could have been pretty tough.


Hm, I thought that the directives came from Moscow.

That's what I used to think until i ran across these stories:

The Polish Soviet war of 1920: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish%E2%80%93Soviet_War

And the murder of an army medic after the German occupation: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danuta_Siedzik%C3%B3wna

She was murdered by Polish communists not Russians. This must have been going on all across Poland. Must have been a civil war of sorts. The communists on one side and who on the other side???

Poland is only loyal when they get paid. They kiss up to America so they can come here illegally, don't obey our laws then complain they can't get a green card or a visa.