What should Poland do with the problem of Belarus?

It will always be as leaky as a sieve, if it gets built at all.

Your country, BB, doesn't have much coastline; the country I come from is all coast. France, Spain, Italy, Greece don't lack coast either. That is the where the weakness will be.

Building iron curtains is never going to be much of an answer.

Immigrants storming into Europe in masses like that meet a european population whose willingness to take them in decreases rapidly....and the EU has the money, the pressure is rising.

Look what tiny poor Greece build on their border to Turkey, alone!



There is nothing leaky about it....


Yes, but they all want to come here....."Germoney"!

Yeah, because no refugees or migrants are making it from Greece to Germany....

They just sail around the wall. The risk of death by drowning is for them worth taking.

Marine barriers and patrol boats to send them back (by force if need be)


Lack of judgement, poor future orientation, in other words they have little chance of being anything but criminals or welfare recipients if they ever do reach Europe.

As if nobody's thought of doing that...


Lack of hope.

If all that energy would be used to change things at home we all would be better off!

Did you never ask if that flight movement has the same function as a pothole? To take out pressure out of the "pot" so that the dictators can rule on abit longer without angry young men who might disturb them?

That's why Afghanistan was such a painful lesson....all these young men had all the support of the whole world...they had more men, they had the logistic and military support, they had more and better weapons and still, they run away from a few Taliban on sandals! Run away directly to Europe!!!

I don't buy that "lack of hope" anymore...they just don't want to fight....they prefer western soldiers to fight....they want what the West has without doing **** for that....if they don't care about their own countries, why should we feel guilty?

Good! They know what to do! It will cut Greek unemployment as well.


If there's a lack of hope in Iraq still.... then that's Iraq's problem and not Europe's.

Only one thing that is going to stop them and it sure the hell ain't the Bleeding Heart Liberals idea's.
Take a look at Liberal California with over 11 million illegals (on the books and many more that are not) that cost that one State alone over $30 Billion a year !

They have taken over and White people are leaving in droves.
Where are the people of Poland going to go when they get run out of Poland ?

Drown people?


There's barely a functioning state there.

Sounding off online like a Bild-reading fishwife doesn't solve anything. If answers were that easy, there'd not be a problem.

But seriously....do you think it will get better when Europe is taking all their young men in?

I doubt anything will get 'better' for a long time.


'Europe' is trying to take as few people as possible. And as we can see, not doing very well in that endeavour.

Good point, if it were easy for Polish people to leave in the 1960s and 70s then Poland would be like Belarus (or worse) today.

Making Iraq liveable is something only Iraqis can do. If they don't want to bother, then what makes anything think they'll put themselves out for some new country?


Preferably not women and children.... but at some point force is going to be needed. More people want to live in Europe than Europe can let in (without becoming a third world dump as well).


Not with that attitude it won't.

Preferably nobody. There are reasons humans try to avoid killing other humans.

@jon357

If you had a say in Brussels, what would you the EU have to do?

At some point aggression has to be met with aggression.

Migrants forcing their way past closed borders is physical aggression (especially since a non-trivial number of them go on to kill citizens once they reach Europe).

Does it? Aggression is something to generally avoid. In fact, the Polish authorities are trying to avoid harm at all cost.

As I said earlier, if the answer was that easy, there wouldn't be a problem.

Exactly how aggressive migrants want you to react.


But escalation has to be met with escalation.

As if those who actually have to deal with the problem (rather than jaw about it in the pub) haven't thought of every option.

Lithuanian authorities report that migrants are being transported from Polish to Lithuanian border. I said that this would happen - they will cross Lithuanian border more easily and head towards Lithuanian-Polish border, stretching our forces. If the same thing happens on Ukrainian border it will require doubling the forces at least. :-/

This will cost billions and the EU is blocking Polish funds, because we are "undemocratic". Brilliant...

The only option you seem to have thought of is letting them all in and hoping for the best... which is a very crappy option.

I hope not....Lithuania is already warned and prepared!


lrt.lt/en/news-in-english/19/1537044/lithuania-moves-to-declare-state-of-emergency-on-border-with-belarus



Concertina razor wire along the Lithuanian-Belarusian border

it's not for you or for me to "think of options". It's a matter of geopolitical importance with very sensitive military issues involving Vladimir Putain's long-term strategy, the interests of NATO, the territorial integrity of Ukraine, Poland's relationship with Europe and other matters of importance that affect security and safety over the next few decades.


Whatever happens over the next few weeks or months, we can be very sure of one thing; that thousands of the people you call "them" will certainly enter Europe one way or another.

@BB

We already have razor wire and state of emergency, as well as throngs of Army/Police at the border (more than the entire Lithuanian Army), and still some of them manage to get through. This is not looking good...

Will Europe be better off for it? I severely doubt it.... let's just hope for the best!

Yes. It's looking ******* awful.

Hating on those desperate people being used as pawns (as some here do) does not advance the issue in any decent or practical way.


Agreed, however geopolitically we have dark times ahead.

@jon357

Exactly. The entire anger should be directed at Belarussian traffickers and their Russian overlords.

Poland thinks about asking NATO for help:

....Poland is meanwhile considering calling on NATO for help in the border conflict. Polish deputy foreign minister Pawel Jablonski told the Polish radio station Zet on Tuesday....

berliner-zeitung.de/politik-gesellschaft/woher-kommen-die-migranten-die-nun-ploetzlich-in-die-eu-draengen-li.193874

...Warsaw has been in constant contact with NATO for weeks and does not rule out a specific request for help if the situation at the border escalates. The former EU Council President and Polish opposition leader Donald Tusk had already discussed such a step on Monday: According to this, Poland could initiate the activation of Article 4 of the NATO treaty. This leads to direct military consultations if the territorial integrity, political independence or security of one of the parties is at risk. Article 4 has been activated repeatedly over the past few years. Turkey made particularly frequent representations to NATO in connection with its activities in the Syrian war. Article 4 is the preliminary stage to the alliance case, which is activated via Article 5 and was activated for the first time after September 11, 2001....

This is the heart of the issue.

There is an interesting piece on Onet about this written by someone I know. His and my political outlook aren't identical however his observations are reliable and well thought out.

I've said here before that key to this issue is the question 'what is Putain's next step?'

The article below suggests that the refugees may next be sent to Ukraine.

onet.pl/informacje/onetkielce/kryzys-na-granicy-ekspert-wylicza-bledy-polskiego-rzadu/7m2063q,79cfc278?fbclid=IwAR3e-61fFCS9FO_tNhMmR80Qc8f1GpH521BR2H45IZzVgiJyzkYG8Ey1vQo

That has been obvious for a long time, a raised the exact point a week or so ago... if the EU isn't already making plans for that entirely predictable option then it's not fit for purpose (or the leadership isn't).