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E.U. Funds 2013-2020 for Poland


SeanBM 35 | 5,808
10 Jul 2012 #1
I thought we could discus the E.U. Funds 2013-2020 for Poland.

It is expected to be 80 Billion Euros

"More than 40 percent of investments taking place in our part of the continent are co-financed by the union. Without EU funds, there would be no investments,"

said Janusz Lewandowski.

But due to the crises and self interested countries it might not be that much :
wbj.pl/article-58942-poland-to-lose-out-in-next-eu-budget.html - Poland to lose out in next EU budget?
sanddancer 2 | 58
16 Jul 2012 #2
We'll see how well the Polish Economy is doing once the fund is scrapped!
sanddancer 2 | 58
16 Jul 2012 #4
delphiandomine

really keep telling yourself that. The EU is under pressure from all sides Germany, France and the UK to reduce the budget of the EU. The 80 billion for Poland would be a good amount to begin with. They will cut funding that wont directly effect their own! sorry Poland! Now it's time to fend for yourself!
Ziemowit 13 | 4,535
16 Jul 2012 #5
Funds 2013-2020 for Poland. It is expected to be 80 Billion Euros

This is a mere 8 bilion euros a year for Poland.

The EFSF --> ESM fund is 700 billion euros. The Italian public debt amounts to 2,000 bilion euro. So 1,400 billion euros is missing for Italy only. And what about Spain and Greece?

We'll see how well the Polish Economy is doing once the fund is scrapped!

We'll see how well the eurozone is doing once the debt crisis blows up to its peak.
sobieski 107 | 2,128
16 Jul 2012 #6
OK...Would we have the A2 without these "mere EU funds"....Or the refurbishment of Warszawa Centralna? Show me any public investment in Poland where there is no EU money involved...

Of course the ones on this forum of a Americanist-Polonist persuasion think of the EU as the devil...but what do they know?

In the recent past Poland was the the Trojan donkey of McDo in Europe, this thankfully has changed.
Meathead 5 | 470
17 Jul 2012 #7
It's astounding to me how little some people have learned in this financial crisis. Poland has to maintain the integrity of it's currency or it's bye bye sovereignty, hello Greece. Instead of looking for more EU funny money the Poles should seriously think about paying back the EU grants and loans and learn to fend for itself and "grow up" as a nation.
Ziemowit 13 | 4,535
17 Jul 2012 #8
There is a great disrepancy between the posters' views. If it's

Instead of looking for more EU funny money

"funny money", how could it have helped? So, according to that logic, if the EU funny money is scrapped, then the Polish economy could at last start to breathe in full!

.Or the refurbishment of Warszawa Centralna? Show me any public investment in Poland where there is no EU money involved...

I remeber you were complaining here once that you could never find your way in Warszawa Centralna railway station due to the refurbishment works on the site (other foreign people said they easily could, however) without saying a word on its co-financement from the EU. You were furious that the works were taking place there! Now that it's all over and things have returned to normal, you praise the EU for particpating in causing you all those troubles!
hague1cmaeron 14 | 1,377
17 Jul 2012 #9
This issue is quite well covered in a radio interview: thenews.pl/1/6/Artykul/105817,Diplomatic-Bag-Poland-takes-over-Visegrad-leadership

Poles should seriously think about paying back the EU grants and loans

These are not loans, so there is nothing to payback.
sanddancer 2 | 58
17 Jul 2012 #10
We'll see how well the eurozone is doing once the debt crisis blows up to its peak

Exactly, I'm no fan at all of the whole 'Socialist Europe Mess!', the British government is in debt and will cut public spending on essential services and will still continue to fund 'road building' schemes in Poland. But for how long? The British public are getting nervy and are asking with a louder voice for a referendum on European membership. I for one will vote against membership and the UK can become like the Swiss. I don't know anybody in the UK that want's to keep handing money over hand-ove-fist to this useless ideal.

For those that think that Poland is getting cash for nothing take a look at the PIGS and see how many 'puppet' government the Germans have put in place. In Poland the mose anti-euro government all perished in a plane crash... coincidence... i think not!
delphiandomine 88 | 18,455
17 Jul 2012 #11
really keep telling yourself that. The EU is under pressure from all sides Germany, France and the UK to reduce the budget of the EU. The 80 billion for Poland would be a good amount to begin with. They will cut funding that wont directly effect their own! sorry Poland! Now it's time to fend for yourself!

They won't, because Germany, France (especially France!) and the UK also benefit massively from these funds. Scotland, particularly the Highlands also gained a massive amount of cash compared to the amount of people living there. France don't want to reduce the budget because the CAP will come under renewed fire, and Germany is paying this money to have access to nice stable export markets.

It may not be 80 billion, but all proposals on the table suggest they'll get at least 80% of that. And if you knew anything about the EU and how it's funded, some of that cash comes from Poland too.

Poland has to maintain the integrity of it's currency or it's bye bye sovereignty, hello Greece

No, it's not. Many Eurozone countries are doing just fine - Estonia, Slovakia, Luxembourg, etc.

Instead of looking for more EU funny money the Poles should seriously think about paying back the EU grants and loans and learn to fend for itself and "grow up" as a nation.

What, and end up with a drop in living standards of about 15-20%? Are you insane?

and the UK can become like the Swiss.

What, tied to the EU through non-negotiable treaties without a say and paying for the pleasure of it? Yes, I can't wait!

For those that think that Poland is getting cash for nothing take a look at the PIGS and see how many 'puppet' government the Germans have put in place. In Poland the mose anti-euro government all perished in a plane crash... coincidence... i think not!

Anti-Euro government? May I remind you that President Kaczynski failed to remove Poland from the EU despite having the mandate to do so?
sanddancer 2 | 58
18 Jul 2012 #12
Anti-Euro government? May I remind you that President Kaczynski failed to remove Poland from the EU despite having the mandate to do so?

And we know what happened to him! But it's easier now for the Poles to blame the Russians or the Pilots then the forces that were really behind his death! Do you need a list of 'EU victims'?

And if you knew anything about the EU and how it's funded, some of that cash comes from Poland too.

The UK has been a nett contributor to the EU every year since it joined bar 1975. (The year of the UK referendum). How does any cash injected by Poland into the coffers cover the amount injested by the CAP and European regions development funds? The UK does gain some cash from the CAP and a small amount from regional development but if the UK were to leave the EU this amount would be covered by central government. What makes you think that I know less then yourself on EU funding? What makes you think the average German or Frenchman on the street is happy giving money hand over fist to the EU? Look at the trouble the Germans are having at the moment.

Many Eurozone countries are doing just fine - Estonia, Slovakia, Luxembourg, etc.

Luxembourg, Estonia and Slovakia are also nett gainers from EU funds, you cant look at these coutries as being especially successful.

What, tied to the EU through non-negotiable treaties without a say and paying for the pleasure of it? Yes, I can't wait!

Do you work for the EU? The UK god willing will have a referendum sooner then later and the people and not the EU will decide on the future of the UK. And for your information (Miss 'i know more then you about the EU') there is a clause in the Treaty of Lison (TEU article 50) which states that "Any Member State may decide to withdraw from the Union in accordance with its own constitutional requirements." What part of this is non-negotiable? There are also acts of parliment in the UK which states that no laws made outside of the UK can overtake UK laws. If the UK decided to leave it could. Unless you know different?
delphiandomine 88 | 18,455
18 Jul 2012 #13
And we know what happened to him! But it's easier now for the Poles to blame the Russians or the Pilots then the forces that were really behind his death! Do you need a list of 'EU victims'?

I'd be interested to hear how the EU made the Captain go below minimums. Do they have some sort of mind control device?

What part of this is non-negotiable?

The part when the EU told Switzerland "sign up for Schengen, Dublin, etc or we tear up all other treaties that were favourable to Switzerland". It wasn't for negotiation - in fact, I remember it being made very clear that a rejection of Schengen would result in Switzerland losing much of the privileges that they have. What Switzerland has simply isn't on the table - EU withdrawal means being treated the same as Australia/etc. Not really good in today's Europe, is it?

I'm also sure the average Brit would love to be subject to the 90/180 day Schengen rules, especially all those Brits in places like Spain who have never bothered complying with the requirement to register their residence. Not to mention going back to the old days of one litre of alcohol and 200 cigarettes.
sanddancer 2 | 58
18 Jul 2012 #14
I'd be interested to hear how the EU made the Captain go below minimums.

Thats what the EU led Polish investigators want you to believe!

I'm also sure the average Brit would love to be subject to the 90/180 day Schengen rules, especially all those Brits in places like Spain who have never bothered complying with the requirement to register their residence.

Not good for the UK? are you crazy? Do you know how much the UK gives to the likes of Germany and France in trade deficit? If the UK left the EU they would just stop trading with the UK!!!.. get real! As for cigarettes the importation of cheap cigarettes from the EU wouldn't exactly hamper the exchequor! Try again!
delphiandomine 88 | 18,455
18 Jul 2012 #15
Thats what the EU led Polish investigators want you to believe!

See, this is why we work and you don't.

Of course, the Russians found exactly the same cause. Are they led by the EU, too?

If the UK left the EU they would just stop trading with the UK!!!.. get real!

They'd certainly trade on less favourable terms. All it would take would be one simple financial transaction tax and London would come crashing down. In fact, the fear of an EU financial transaction tax is one of the things that keeps the UK in the EU - right now, they can veto it. If they leave? Game over - and with it, much of the cash flowing through London. It would be perfectly possible for the EU simply to tax non-EU financial transactions for much of the business to flood out of London and straight into Frankfurt.

Then again, you'd still be on the dole regardless, so...
sanddancer 2 | 58
18 Jul 2012 #16
Of course, the Russians found exactly the same cause. Are they led by the EU, too?

What makes you think that i don't work? Wrong again!

It would be perfectly possible for the EU simply to tax non-EU financial transactions for much of the business to flood out of London and straight into Frankfurt.

Less favourable terms! How would that work..we have a massive trade deficit with them already? WE BUY MORE FROM THE EU THEN WE SELL!! UNDERSTAND??

As for taxing London they keep trying and failing! Face it the EU would collapse if the UK left and they will try to use all kind of threats to keep the UK on their 'socialist nightmare of a gravy train'!

Face it most of the UK's positive balance comes from trade comes from the US and trade with Commonwealth countries. We don't have to rely on the EU as much as other countries do. If we left we could sort out the deficit and industries that are suffering because of EU legislation could recover. (Fishing, Manufacturing etc)
delphiandomine 88 | 18,455
18 Jul 2012 #17
What makes you think that i don't work? Wrong again!

The fact that you've spent days upon days on here under various usernames ranting about Poland, perhaps?

Less favourable terms! How would that work..we have a massive trade deficit with them already? WE BUY MORE FROM THE EU THEN WE SELL!! UNDERSTAND??

And where will the money come from to buy when a financial transaction tax sucks the life out of the UK economy?

As for taxing London they keep trying and failing! Face it the EU would collapse if the UK left and they will try to use all kind of threats to keep the UK on their 'socialist nightmare of a gravy train'!

Collapse? Hardly. In fact, one of the first actions would be to launch a financial services tax - you know, exactly what Cameron vetoed. Boom - UK is in trouble overnight.

A tax of a mere 0.5% on non-EU financial transactions would cripple London. A bloc of 380 million people (and more on the way) could quite easily bully the UK into begging for membership for a second time.
sanddancer 2 | 58
18 Jul 2012 #18
And where will the money come from to buy when a financial transaction tax sucks the life out of the UK economy?

Really? Keep telling yourself that.. i'm sure the European companies and citizens based in the UK wouldn't allow that to happen. If that was the case why hasn't the eu clamped down more on the fiddle that is swiss bank accounts?

Collapse? Hardly. In fact, one of the first actions would be to launch a financial services tax - you know, exactly what Cameron vetoed. Boom - UK is in trouble overnight.

A tax of a mere 0.5% on non-EU financial transactions would cripple London. A bloc of 380 million people (and more on the way) could quite easily bully the UK into begging for membership for a second time

Keep telling yourself that the EU needs the UK less then the UK needs the EU. Nobody in the UK believes you. 380million people trade less with the UK then the UK does with them... it's a loss! we can do without it! and the 6% rise in the annual EU budgets!
Avalon 4 | 1,068
23 Jul 2012 #19
A Brussels ruling has frozen billions of euros in free carbon allowances that Poland was claiming for 30 high-emitting but as yet non-existent coal plants, under the little known '10c derogation' from the EU's Emission Trading System.

A EurActiv investigation earlier this month revealed that one of the 30 plants - £ęczna, near the Ukrainian border - was a phantom installation, currently being used by local farmers to grow maize crops.

euractiv.com/climate-environment/eu-rules-climate-funding-polish-news-514051

Anyone reminded of the non-existent olive trees in Greece?
Meathead 5 | 470
24 Jul 2012 #20
They won't, because Germany, France (especially France!) and the UK also benefit massively from these funds

That's the whole problem. These Euro funds are not in Poland's interest. Germany yes, but not Poland.

Face it most of the UK's positive balance comes from trade comes from the US and trade with Commonwealth countries. We don't have to rely on the EU as much as other countries do. If we left we could sort out the deficit and industries that are suffering because of EU legislation could recover. (Fishing, Manufacturing etc)

Exactly. England should stick with the Commonwealth. Canada, Australia, South Africa and India have a much brighter economic future for England than the Continent. Everytime England get's involved in the Continent it get's it's fingers burnt. The Empire is buried at the Somme.
sanddancer 2 | 58
24 Jul 2012 #21
:
They won't, because Germany, France (especially France!) and the UK also benefit massively from these funds

The three countries listed don't benefit at all. They give MORE to the EU then they take. doh!!
OP SeanBM 35 | 5,808
19 Oct 2013 #22
Publication date : 12.03.2013
Poland to get nearly EUR 106 bln from 2014-2020 EU budget pool - expected impact on the Polish economy, chances and challenges

The value of total European Union funds allocation for particular EU member states, according to the EU budget for 2014-2020, as agreed during the EU summit in Brussels on February 8, 2013 (source: The Chancellery of the Prime Minister (KPRM))

polishmarket.com/181555/Poland-negotiates-4-rise-in-EU-funding-for-2014-2020.shtml

Poland negotiates 4.2% more E.U. cohesion funds.
50%Polish
21 Oct 2013 #23
really keep telling yourself that.

I don't think so. As long as the funds are creating power for the elite in Europe, they will be invested. This isn't about your homeland, this is about creating more wealth no matter what the cost or where it is spent.

In our country, no one (elite) cares about what you can do for the people of your nation. You take their jobs, their income, their hours, and their soul. This isn't about country, it is about using the global infrastructure for vested interest. That is it. German elite will sell its own people out sooner than later, as will other nations if the price is right in Poland, China, Africa, or anywhere else in the world.

If the margin is in Poland, the money will flow.

its not their money either, it is the tax payers. Much easier to spend. Use other peoples money to get rich, it is magical, and the money falls like rain.
Monitor 14 | 1,820
22 Oct 2013 #24
Popular economic view on this topic is that the country should rather stop having more budget deficits and provided any GDP growth, the debt in relation to GDP will drop (like in Spain before 2008), without the country suffering GDP drop (which can cause public debt stagnate or grow in relation to GDP)

Exactly, I'm no fan at all of the whole 'Socialist Europe Mess!', the British government is in debt and will cut public spending on essential services and will still continue to fund 'road building' schemes in Poland. But for how long?

I am quite sure that even if Britain leaves the EU, it will be obliged to pay it's share of EU budget money until the end of 2020. After that they say Poland will not get much anyway. And if they want to keep favorable FTA with EU then they'll have to pay it's share of cohesion founds too, like Norway does for example.

For those that think that Poland is getting cash for nothing take a look at the PIGS and see how many 'puppet' government the Germans have put in place.

If Greece had German puppet government, then it was not doing what Germany wanted. Did Germany plan to pay back Greek debt? Because this is what they're doing.

Do you know how much the UK gives to the likes of Germany and France in trade deficit?

It's not called giving, but buying. If they chose not to buy from Germany then buying from elsewhere or producing themselves will not be cheaper.

If the UK left the EU they would just stop trading with the UK!!!.. get real!

There is no reason to abandon Free Trade Agreement with UK while leaving EU. But probably it would be altered.
Norwegian 5 | 56
22 Oct 2013 #25
My business is suffering quit a lot of this.
In my industry it has been very popular to get founding from the EU, and that has created the second best to specialice in getting fonding from the EU, and in the short medium run be able to compete and maybe also beat more helthy companies (like my own).

I am looking forward to the day when these moneyflow is stoping where non helalthy businesses stay alive and destroy for others.

My company is very good at what we do, not so good at sending papers to the governemnt asking for co-founding from the EU!
In 2013 my 3 biggest competitiors has recived a seven diget number (in pln) from the eu-founding project, and we have to compete first with these companies before we can aim for the international market.

EU - Please stop the moneyflow into Poland. Poland dont need a set of not competitive companies destroying for the few that actaully are!
sobieski 107 | 2,128
22 Oct 2013 #26
Maybe it could be instructive to walk across Plac Zamkowy here in Warsaw these days. There is neat little exposition about for which amount and percentage the EU is funding projects in Warsaw. And that's only Warsaw. Very instructive.

The Treaty of Rome ensured stability and economic growth for over 40 years. It ensured peace in Western Europe. It ensured that historic antagonists started to work together.

Btw I cannot wait for the moment the UK will leave. Good riddance and not many will regret it. De Gaulle (although I am not a big fan of his) had it right all the time, blocking UK access. Though I guess Scotland will come back.
Harry
22 Oct 2013 #27
Good riddance and not many will regret it.

Other than the million Poles who live and work in the UK....
p3undone 8 | 1,135
22 Oct 2013 #28
Harry,is the UK going to pull out of the EU,and what will this mean for the Poles that work in the UK?
Steveramsfan 2 | 306
22 Oct 2013 #29
Most British people are arrogant and have an over inflated opinion of themselves and their country.

Britain used to be Great but is now trying to live on its past, the country wouldn't survive on its own as no one will deal with it.

Staying within the EU and re-writing the Maastrict and Rome Treaties is the way ahead.

The whole idea of these grants is to help the weaker countries get to the same level as the strong countries as soon as possible.

It is better for all the countries if there are no weak countries within the EU.

A strong EU can control the world economy, at the moment too much National Pride is stifling the EU potential.

I don't really care what the UK does as I have moved to Poland. I have had enough of British people still thinking they are great because they won so many wars!!
Monitor 14 | 1,820
22 Oct 2013 #30
Harry,is the UK going to pull out of the EU,and what will this mean for the Poles that work in the UK?

That means that if some government in the future will want to stop immigration from Europe to UK, then he will have possibility to do that.


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