Israel opposing potential new Polish law to criminalise term 'Polish death camps'

Your blood references sound frighteningly close to Nazi talk, Dirk! You should be aware of that.

Only an ignoramus believes that blood and ethnicity are in any way connected. Sure, the blood of an AIDS patient to be certain will be tainted.....because he has AIDS, never because he happens to belong to a particular ethnicity!!

Ilness knows no national distinction; it's an equal opportunity destroyer.

to answer you to that i will tell you a story about the whole polish and ukrainian intellectuals ,professors ect.were murdered in most horrific manner by jewish nkvd in Lvow prison.just one day before wermacht marched into city.

people were kissing their hands from joy after what they went through horrors of jewish nkvd leadership

yes, it's unfair as there's plenty of jews, muslims, blacks, etc. that aren't like that. nonetheless, when some action that relates to a stereotype is constantly repeated, well then that idea/stereotype is continually reinforced. break the stereotypes, change peoples' opinions, and hten gradually such stereotypes will disappear.


Aboslutely. And I've repeated this numerous times on the forum to our friends here that reside in Poland. Go ask a bunch of WW2 survivors - soldiers, civilians, whoever. I guarantee you the vast majority will tell you, as certain members did here as well, that the treatment under the Nazis was FAR BETTER for the average Pole than under the Red Army, NKVD, and collaborators like UB


When Nazis come into a village and give adults bread and milk, and chocolate to the kids, don't destroy anyone's homes, while Jews hiding in the forest loot their homes whenever the residents were gone, soviets come in and burn homes, rape wives and daughters, and steal everything inside of the home and then even after the war UB agents come and kill people accusing them of being in the AK - who had helped jews thoughotu the war in numerous ways - and this type of story is repeated over and over and over gain by Polish ww2 survivors, what would you think?

Ever asked yourself about the other side of the story, gregy, or did you just jump on the bandwagon like nearly everybody else? What was their motivation?

Was it justifiable or merely malicious?

The answers might surprise you.

never quite understand this jewish motivation in murdering poles or russians.
there was one guy russian historian who studied documents from nkvd court and their prosecuting procedure for 30 years
he said what stroked him most that there was no logic no pattern in who they were killing and why? it seems like they were murdering people just for the sake of killing. completely random,sometimes villager sometimes young student.no evidence no motives.

You too if you were a polish ww2 survivor would also say that the treatment under the Nazis was far far better than that under the Soviets, UPA, or the UB agents that terrorized anyone who fought on behalf of the legit Polish government and the armies (AK/NSZ) that they commanded - which helped jews in numerous ways.

Wouldn't you too be upset? You help a group of people, the jews, then they turn around and join the enemy and after the war kill people who served in the army that did the most out of anyone to help the jews?


They didn't really kill Russians - if anything they were allied with the Russians/soviets. The jews killed Poles I believe either for 'revenge' or simply because the soviet establishment told them to eliminate any threats to the communist system, which Jews overwhelmingly supported over the legit democratic government in exile. They performed the soviets' orders with brutal efficiency murdering thousands of AK fighters who had helped them even as recently as months or year before. I believe for most Jews it was a mix of desiring power and taking revenge - it's likely that the soviets propagated things like that the AK killed Jews (which the NSZ actually did but AK did not) to help convince the Jewish UB agents, judges, etc. that they were doing a good thing. The fact that they were already leaning more towards the commie governments certainly helped them believe that they were doing the right thing.

by the millions,,Russian culture wiped out,churches burned down and looted..6 million starved by artificially initiated famines,millions in gulags

The figures were actually for ethnic minorities, not Jews alone so my mistake there. By a directive of High Command ethnic minorities should not comprise more than 10% of the total forces and 5% of Non Commissioned Officers. This was in late 1941 when about a quarter of the army was Jewish. There were to be no ethnic minorities recruited for airborne units and only 5% fpr armoured units. It's quite specific.

Of course. Me too. It's tedious at times with all the plastic sets and presenters. but I get annoyed at being blatantly lied to as if I am a total idiot, so the only alternative, the state broadcaster, is a big no,no.

Well if you don't like being lied to, that rules TVN out.

It is very interesting to watch Douggy showing signs of getting red-pilled, didn't expect it is possible at this age.

The only thing that annoys me about TVP is the almost daily 'look how well PiS is going in the ratings' and 'TVP info was the most watched news channel again.' Aside for the shameful self promotion, the news is usually more or less accurate.

TVN on the other hand, I get the impression they just make up as they go along and could spin anything, even a rabbit eating a carrot, in to how PiS is evil.

Yet they couldn't even fill that.... there were at most 5k Jewish officers in Polish forces. The reason why is because the majority of Jews were not on the side of the legit Polish government and the AK. The two Jewish groups fighting under AK command were tiny. The largest Jewish group was the AL which first fought against Nazis and later turnbed their guns on Poles and AK members - as directed by the Jewish commie leaders in PL and those in Moscow.

The truth is when the Soviets came in from the east they were welcomed by the Jews, especially as communism was the prevalent ideology especially amongst intellectual Jews. The Communist Party of Poland had a lot of Jews in it, not to mention the AL. While the USSR brought communism into Poland and established a puppet regime, the Jews certainly helped them a ton in their efforts. They were the foot soldiers and administrators of the commies - killing Poles as they saw fit especially AK members. Even the Bund and Zionists (despite Zionism being against Commie ideology) were far more loyal to the soviet commies than the Polish state. They straight up COLLABORATED with the soviets to take over Poland and had NO QUALMS about it - even though the AK/Zegota helped them against the Nazis. The jews, as a reward for their loyalty in suppressing Poles fighting for freedom from both Nazis and USSR, wre given high positions in schools, PZPR party and PL government, and especially the UB and as prison officials. Hence, zydokomuna - which is no fairy tale. A Jew, Berman was responsible for overseeing propaganda and the implementation of communism - which the Jews were more than happy to bring about.

Here is some info on Berman - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jakub_Berman for every one famous person like Berman, there were tens of thousands of communist Jews that were more than happy to kill AK members, steal average Poles' homes and property, all with the approval of their commie bosses and UB which was disproportionally run by Jews (along with the government as a whole). Anyone who argues that zydokomuna was not the reality in Poland after the soviet invasion and the early years of PRL clearly don't know about Polish history during this time period.

They sold Poland and the AK out - plain and simple. Every Pole must be aware of this collaboration with the Soviets and betrayal of Poland and AK, despite their help. If they were true patriots and cared about Poland they would've fought against the Soviets - not collaborated with them to murder thousands of Poles. The fact is they killed scores of patriots fighting on their behalf and setting up zegota to save their sorry jewish asses, all because the soviets promised them money and power plus they already had an inclination to communism and hatred towards Poles for whatever reason. Polish historian Chodakiewicz explains that thousands of Poles were killed by the Jews alone - not counting the tens of thousands the soviets killed i.e. katyn, gulags, exile to Siberia, etc. The historian explains that Jewish admins and officials later adopted new Polish-sounding names to cover their murderous tracks and appear as a poor innocent jewish ww2 survivor who would never betray someone fighting to save their life - which many continue to have to this day - for example politician Dorn, which was previously called Dornbaum.

Indeed, this section of Churchill's essay can also be applied to the Jewish subversion of Polish society during and after WW2:

fpp.co.uk/bookchapters/WSC/WSCwrote1920.html

yea..especial torture and murder of August Emil Fieldorf by jewish prosecutors was hideous.he was Polands greatest hero

The UB, who's leadership was at least 50% filled by Jews, arrested 300,000 Poles and killed 6,000 which were deemed to be AK members. If this is the thanks Communist Jews and Zionists give to Poles who actually risked their life for them, imagine what they'd do to a Pole who does something bad to them?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zgoda_labour_camp - run by Commie Jew Morel
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ministry_of_Public_Security_(Poland)#Soviet_control_and_political_penetration - run by Commie Jew Berman

Bastard escaped to Israel who REFUSED to extradite him even though he was directly responsible for killing at least 1,000 people
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armia_Ludowa
'Jewish partisans instead more often joined the Armia Ludowa of the communist Polish Workers' Party and Soviet guerrilla groups, which increasingly clashed with Polish guerillas, contributing to yet another perception of Jews working with the Soviets against the Poles'

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanis%C5%82aw_Radkiewicz another Jewish hater who loved to destroy churches
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Ochab - another Zionist scum who sold Poland out to the Soviet Jews

but of course no such thing as zydokomuna....

Hopefully Poland will one day finally create a museum or day of remembrance to all those who suffered due to the Jewish/Zionist collaboration with the Soviets. While yes, there were Jews who supported the AK - I'm not denying that. Nonetheless, the majority sided with commies and Soviets.


Indeed. He was klled by Jew Helena Wolniska-Brus and other Jewish collaborator scumbags. This must've been a nightmare for him. Being such a patriot trying to save Jews yet he's prosecuted by a Jewish prosecutor, sentenced by Jewish judge Maria Gurowska, and sent to a prison system run by Jews like Morel...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helena_Woli%C5%84ska-Brus
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maria_Gurowska

This is what Poland helped the Jews for? To have our most patriotic AK members killed? NEVER AGAIN!

prosecutors were :
Beniamin Wejsblech i Paulina Kern both jews
main judge - Maria Gurowska -jewish
other judges : Emil Merz, Gustaw Auscaler i Igor Andrejew all jews save igor-russian i think


not o mention that he created the only europe organization helping jews zegota

Well the court systems, the UB, indeed all the state organs that had the power of life and death over people were disproportionately jews. The sad thing is, oftentimes Stalin and his regime only singled out the top echelons of the AK to be killed. But the Jews weren't satisfied with just killing a few dozen, or even few hundred of the top leaders... No they wanted thousands upon thousands of dead goys.


The sad thing is that most young Poles aren't aware of all this - the older generations are but so much of this has been glossed over, perhaps intentionally. An information campaign explaining the facts (no need for embellishments or exaggerations, there's plenty of facts) behind zydokomuna, the collaboration between soviets and 'polish' jews, the UB and courts crimes against Poles, etc is desperately needed. Most Poles believe that it was all Soviets doing this to Poles. The reality is that the 'polish' jews were the ones carrying out the killings - a lot of which weren't even ordered by the soviets yet they felt like killing the most patriotic Poles, AK members, and even average poles - especially if they wanted to appropriate their house, or farm, or merely out of sheer hatred for Polish Catholics, despite the fact that Poles tried to help them in countless ways. That meant nothing to the communist Jews or Zionist though, they just wanted to kill Polish goys and instill a reign of terror which the vast majority of Polish survivors will tell you was 100x worse than what the Nazis did to them.

It's not your fault Wulkan, because you wouldn't know, but as it happens I have just lost my one and only sibling to dementia, and it's a terrible disease, so less of the wisecracks about personal health topics if you don't mind:) It's very upsetting.


Thje thing that annoys me is that they leave out the news that they don't like, and report what happened to Mrs Kowalski, with her ducks having 25 chicks, instead. Not news, especially when Duda vetoing legislation was the news of the day one would have thought:))

The thing that annoys me about TVN is that they take an event that has happened and then tell their audience that something completely different happened.


Duda vetoing legislation? Are you referring to the veto from half a year ago that they did cover?

Under PiS the mission of TVP is the same as it was in the PRL, to glorify the government and not mention things going wrong and to strengthen the perception that people who are unhappy with the government are very wrong and/or very evil. People that find that to be an acceptable format for digesting news are announcing they don't care about truth, just their side.

TVN has its faults but is more likely to report on failures as well as successes.

Someone who cares about news (as a way of finding out about the world) uses a variety of difference sources and is critical of all of them.

Yeah, unless those successes are by PiS.


Yep, and I'm sure a lot of folks do. It's just, TVN is a very bad one.

It's a very plausible one. It's clear that Daniels was shocked by the resolve of Morawiecki and Duda here, because his Twitter started suddenly being a lot more sympathetic towards the Polish view of things once it was clear that they weren't going to back down. But...what is he doing here? Why would PiS even let him into their inner circles? What does he offer them?

Bear with me on this one, but I'd like to see if you agree with this:

Daniels was sent to Poland when it became clear that PiS were heading for electoral victory at some point. He turned up in 2014 (coincidentally, when Tusk left and PO weakened), with the task of getting into the inner circle of PiS - and to act as a go-between PiS and the US/Israel. The Americans knew they couldn't get an American to do the job because it wouldn't be plausible, but Daniels operating a foundation and pulling off high profile PR stunts relating to Jewish issues gave him the perfect cover.

So - why would PiS entertain him? Well, as a go-between, he was there to make it clear that America wanted to put a stop to the Polish-German-Franco axis and return Poland to the pre-2007 situation where Poland was much more orientated towards the US. In return, the Americans would turn a blind eye to the activities of PiS domestically as long as they were on good terms with the Israelis too. America would also use their massive soft power to keep Poland away from the EU, which is safe enough given Poland's hostility towards Russia. It suits the Americans (the EU has been increasingly an issue for them, especially the Euro as a reserve currency), and suits PiS perfectly.

It makes sense to me - the Americans have never particularly cared about the model of government as long as the country was allied to them, and it would suit them perfectly for Poland to distance herself from Germany, which also suited PiS domestically.

Of course, the question is this new law. It seems that Daniels was caught off guard by it, which makes me wonder if it wasn't Kaczyński asserting himself and making it clear that such cooperation had its limits, especially once it was becoming publicly obvious that Morawiecki was way too close with Daniels and Israeli interests for comfort. It would be a smart move by PiS to remind Daniels that they weren't going to bow down to anyone, and the reaction by Israel is because they were assured by Daniels that PiS would be on 'their side' (especially after abstaining in that UN vote recently).

Thoughts?

and here some true polish jew example,to change mood:
When, after the war, at a conference in California, where the United Nations was established, there were no Polish representatives . Polish pianist and composer of Jewish origin - Artur Rubinstein, indignant, played "Mazurka Dąbrowskiego" and ordered to stand up to delegations.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Rubinstein
yea,there were plenty of polish patriots of jewish roots as well.

Still my favourite TV recording of Chopins' 2nd Piano Concerto, Andre Previn, LSO. A true force of nature.

Although I don't recall their names, a number of non-Jewish (Polish and German) Holocaust historians, at the risk of being vilified by their own, have come out and stated that any insinuations that somehow Jewish acts of violence aka "war crimes" (in the words of PiS supporters) against Polish gentiles displaying anti-Jewish collaborationist hostility or Nazis and their sympathizers might be equal to their converse, are tantamount to revisionist history and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent possible as inciting hatred and bigotry.

Comments from the peanut gallery?

i think all this ,was a result of nations being subjected to extreme circumstances where humanity was degradation to the point of animal instinct of survival.

to some,at the cost of decency.many didnt pass the test of humanity.
but then again,wonder if todays critics of Poland would pass it.
reminds me of days of Londons riots few years ago and peoples behavior.wonder what would Londoners humanity end up looking like if those people were forced in such harsh conditions and terror for years like in EE

True, gregy!

The Jews of wartime Europe had no place to turn. The American Jewish Congress and Rabbi Dr. Stephen Wise should have been ashamed of themselves for looking away at a time when such auxilliary organizations and the US Jewish Community could have been of tremendous help.

Roosevelt too was not at his best either, I'm ashamed to admit, caving in to Sen. Long and ordering the SS-Missouri not to stop in Havana but instead return to Europe. SHAMEFUL!!

Yet, what could he really have done? He didn't want to be assassinated now, did he? A truly great American president nonetheless.

He speaks no Polish (in the few interviews I was able to find on youtube) and everything about him screams 'fake' and 'conman'


All too true about the government


they can't stand the idea of Poles not feeling guilty? plus... Netanyahu is an Israeli Kaczynski who wants to create a siege mentality among the population - "they all hate you, only I can protect you"

Bibi's got some control issues, that's for sure! He's supposed to have a fearsome temper and is known to be quite abusive in private life.

Another plausible sounding theory. The key and most intriguing question is who exactly sent him and what exactly his mission is.

Prediction - sent by American Jewish lobby and the main aim is to extract as much money from Poland as possible. S.447 is supposed to help with that. Many people think the Israeli outrage over the Polish law trying to 'alter the past' or 'deny the Holocaust' is just a tool for the American Jewish lobby to get their money. It's harder to get Poland to pay up if they were also victims and this law frightened the organisation into believing Poland was trying to relieve themselves of any responsibility. Of course the USA and Israel are so closely linked, that they money [if they ever got it - I hope they don't] would probably end up in the pockets of various different Jewish organisations in the USA and Israel. Of course none or very little would likely go to families of victims.