Polish church music versus African-American gospel

Polish church music is kinda boring, out of that church organs are impressive as is the church choir, but other than that it is dead boring. Compare that to African-American music which is hip and fun. If in Poland we tuned it up a bit , it would be more interesting and more ppl would come to church.

Spot On !
The Evangelists here in America have done this in the last decade to get the younger people coming to church.
The old, How Great Thou Art and Blessed Assurance are outdated now.
Now when you walk in the drums are BOOM BOOM BOOM and the microphones have wailing women screaming in it with electric guitars and you think you just walked into a bar someplace downtown at midnight.

But if it draws the younger folks in.........what the hey.
I just don't go in until the la la la is over because it hurts my ears.
God understands.

Something like this would do nicely and bring something new to most village churches.

There is no Polish church.

Gospel music is for protestants anyway (at least for the ones who don't worship Israel).


Older and now retired generations wanted churches to be entertainment venues. Many of them were thrilled when "Godspell" hit Broadway and became a film. In practice though the "clown masses" were never going to deliver in increasing attendance. The use of "Pride" flags finally drove the few remaining congregants away to those churches offering the Tridentine Mass or into Orthodox churches.

Indeed, for young people today those who are interested in faith want solemnity.

Why is the Latin Mass so popular with young people?

- first, that the Latin Mass provides a sense of community with other young Catholics that's missing elsewhere, and second, that young Catholics today want doctrinal orthodoxy and clarity.

- It's counter-cultural in a way that is deeply authentic.

- The world is increasingly secular, woke, authoritarian, humanistic, fake, modernist, ugly, and persecutorial. Young people know this. They see the signs and they want something that is very far from this world. The TLM is ethereal and stable. The Novus Ordo is banal and much more worldly, and far less reverent. It often does not remind us of Heaven. The TLM does.

reddit.com/r/Catholicism/comments/v3bvcv/why_is_the_latin_mass_so_popular_with_young_people/


Do a pilot project in your synagogues and mosques first.

@ jon357
Yeah , something like this , but with better beat.


Who cares, there is music played in Polish churches and that is my point , oh sorry Vatican churches borrowed by Poland for a while.

If gospel music is only for protestants then Catholics should copy it, sounds faking good and kids would like to come to church if some ****** jumped up on the desk and danced for the Lord. Instead we have white crap funeral music.

American gospel music came in two flavors (though the two were a bit mixed until the 1920s)

White gospel music was similar to country (but group oriented and with more percussion) a pretty typical 1970s example might be the Happy Goodmans

youtube.com/watch?v=PY6GN5tXd2s

Black gospel music came from spirituals (which originated in the period of slavery and which deal with a longing for freedom and/or heaven and/or alienation).

Later these mixed with secular music like ragtime, blues and jazz.

Arizona Dranes was something of a precursor.

youtube.com/watch?v=83VydN-q8e0

By the 1940s gospel music was firmly established among African Americans with stars such as Brother Joe May

youtube.com/watch?v=h7ExcTBYpBU

The integration of elements of gospel music with rhythm and blues produced Soul Music (many performers of which began in gospel like Gladys Knight)

youtube.com/watch?v=iwivWKsL65c

By the 1960s white audiences where listening and gospel performers were making appearances on mainstream tv...

youtube.com/watch?v=VrrlU2Njt7I

Aretha Franklin recorded a double album in church in the early 1970s and by the early 1980s a pair of theatrical documentaries (gospel and say amen somebody) brought the music to wider secular audiences.

At the same time the line between white and black began to blur and some white churches adopted some black gospel songs (and some performance practices)

it should be noted that part of the role of churches for African Americans has traditionally been stress release.... worshippers give themselves up to their emotions and vent them freely during church and then go back to business as usual Monday.

Also it should be noted that almost all African American culture is based on dialogue (which is the basis of the call and response pattern found in black churches).

There are choirs in Poland that perform gospel music (both on stage and in church) though call and response or emotional abandonment are not traditional Polish practices.

Gospel music has almost universal appeal both to the religious and to non-believers. It's no surprise that some in Poland like it.

If Catholics in Poland wanted to become protestants they would have centuries ago. There is nothing stopping them from converting now either.

However, many young Poles aren't interested in any religion and would rather spend their time and money going on holidays overseas than tithing and jiving in some local church (whatever the denomination is).


Okay, Szlomo. Care to share your stories about the music, song and dance crisis plaguing synagogues, mosques and temples around the world and how they are using African-American cultural influences to overcome it?

Many did, however they weee dragged back according to the political affiliations of their local magnaty.

Surprising you didn't know that...


Not a song you'd hear much in Germany...

I became protestant a few years ago after I noticed to my utter bewilderment how the black mafia supported PiS.
I strongly protest against it!!!! And waiting for their collapse. Hence I can be called protestant.

Wrong as always.

Most prods on Polish territory were German-speakers.

Nowadays they are Nigerians.

As far as Polish nobles they had no religious burdens up until the 18th century. It was these nobles during the 1500s (when the Reformation happened in Germany) who decided to follow protestantism. The majority of Poles living on their lands remained Catholic by choice or due to simple local peer pressure (no different than when someone in a Jewish family (even today) wants to "marry out").

Unsurprisingly, you don't know any of this.

I'd say what is banal is the misuse of the Novus Ordo. The liturgical changes that occurred post-Vatican II were not the intention of Vatican II. The document on liturgy even states that the organ is to be the prime instrument, latin should be preserved, and Gregorian chant is best suited for liturgy.

So in fact you don't know. We are talking about Polish people. Germans were less likely to have to flip flop according to their landowners.


Magnaty? Some changed affiliation several times during the reformation.


This is key. It varies from place to place.

But the changes made were intentional and brought about the Hippie Generation of priests taking over parishes and moving up the clerical ranks.


It didn't matter. The Boomers were never interested in maintaining traditions but hoped to replace them with their own.

Priests don't "take over" parishes. They are sent there by their diocesan Bishop.

Of course they do. To take over means to become responsible for a task in succession to another even if assigned to it by someone else.

But then again you are British so no one would expect you to understand how expressions are used in English.

Anyway, like the infrastructure throughout the Western world which went neglected for decades thanks to the self-absorbed Boomers who were left in charge of things, the traditions in Catholic Churches also went neglected or changed for no other reason than to satisfy Boomer vanity.


Yes, overwhelming Roman Catholic followed by Orthodox.


There you go again. Spinning falsehoods because you don't know what you are talking about, were called out on it, and now you are trying to save face.

Poles were never compelled to become protestants because those who owned the land were.

At best there were enough Polish nobles in the late 1500s in the Sejm who were protestant and they pushed through the Warsaw Confederation which ensured freedom of religion in Poland and Lithuania. It never worked in their favor anyway.

He is but you are not Polish either.


Your spelling gives you away.

Take over from. Not take over, little Cherry Pie...


Not during the reformation. As mentioned, there was a great deal of flip flopping. On a parish level, the illiterate serfs wouldn't have noticed. On a national level, the horse trading lasted for two generations.


He can't hold a conversation in the language and has never lived in PL or can even afford to visit.

The thread is about church music though, not an incel's Lefebvrist fantasies. He probably doesn't realise how much more traditional the Sunday worship is in PL that he's probably used to. This is in part due to JP2's key role at Vatican 2 when he was the Bishop who most strongly promoted the idea of the local church and partly because of the Iron Curtain being up during the peak period of liturgical experimentation. That and the rural/urban split.

Nevertheless less, radical groups like the NeoKats are very big in PL, especially in the cities.

Szlomo? What the fak you bittch? Your vagina is szlomo. I have foreskin longer than your uglyass nose.

Youth is not interested mainly because the church is so gloomy. Studies show that church attendence picks up when mass and church activities are more lively and engageing. How do you engage average youth with prayer wallowing aka precisely what your favourite club serves: synagogue hits like punish me Jewish God, hit me with bad luck and fak me up for the sins of my family. Church music in Poland in many ways resembles the sounds uttered by Jews during their mass, why?

Because we are brothers and sisters in faith?????

What is the wallowing about then? Stretchng out the vowels is said to have come from Middle Eastern culture. At least African-Americans don't do that, they are too happy ppl to do that.

Polish church is BORING!!! That is why so many youths don't want to go there. African Americans like going to church, these ppl are fun. Polish love misery in church. No wonder more and more younger wankers leave church and even if parents force them to go , once they turn 18 they show it the finger and rebel against it.

If that is boring for you stick a dildo up your ass b'tch . Looking for excitement geez! Shallow like a puddle.

There is no Polish church.

If the abrahamic god actually existed then no place of worship would be boring and you wouldn't need humans to put on a show to make it exciting.


It's simply a case of demographics. There are fewer young people. They are outnumbered by older generations who have a lot more time, money and fear of death to keep them in the pews.




No they don't.

Black Americans See the Biggest Shift Away from Faith

christianitytoday.com/news/2022/february/black-american-nones-faith-unaffiliation-nothing.html

If they do then increasingly it isn't christian.

Black Muslims account for a fifth of all U.S. Muslims, and about half are converts to Islam

pewresearch.org/short-reads/2019/01/17/black-muslims-account-for-a-fifth-of-all-u-s-muslims-and-about-half-are-converts-to-islam/


They have a routine: Saturday night sinners and then Sunday morning saints.


The women mostly return when they are older hoping to find a husband or when they are really old to make sure they can get a funeral and proper burial.

At that point you aren't going to see and hear entertaining services. It is just a bunch of hags who were male-hating feminists for most of their lives now shrilling praise to a male god figure. If the spectacle of that isn't entertaining enough for you then nothing will.

In church I don't want iron pee pee up anywhere near my body, but you are welcome after the mass, nearby the church, so much rolling on the grass we could do....That would make my Polish church mass a little bit more bearable.

However, not everyone has ironside by his side and then on the inside, so realistically Polish church - oh sorry Poloniusz me again, allow me to correct mystupidself for you Jewish asswipe. So, the non-existent Polish church... with its non-existant church goers is driving people away from itself, we live in different times grandpa and we need readjust the way some institutions operate, including church. Yes, contemplation is all nice, but what contemplation are you going to generate by younger church goer if all the friking kid is thinking is when the mather faking boring mass will end! There is a great need for excitement and new ways of communicating the doctrine or whatever.

This one is for you - an undiscovered gem that you probably never stumbled across during your days in the Emerald Isle. We had to sing this in the convent school 'joyfully now girls, joyfully, joyful and sprightly!' Sister Anne, beaming from ear to ear - as we squeaked our way through. The nuns always took the hymns in too high a register. I suppose they fondly imagined we sounded like angels :))

Is mise an Tiarna, Tiarna an ghrá - I am the Lord, the Lord of love :)

If this doesn't have you and the Missus leppin' around the kitchen table, nothing will ;)

Thank you Ms. Atch
You just put a smile on my face for the day. 😊

And it translates as:

"I am the Lord
I lived with you;
Raise your heart, it will be as it was
The day will pass, the reason will be explained.
I am the Lord, the Lord of love."

A metaphor for the end of the forum perhaps!

grammar question....

Is there a difference (grammar? semantics? style?) between

'is mise' and 'táim / tá mé'? Could you say "Táim an Tiarna"?

Fun song that sounds like it was a lot of fun to sing.

It reminds me of this forgotten feel food gem, self-recorded by an all nun pop group (Nun-Plus). The name of the album is Ljubimo (Croatian for Kocha(j)my) as one of the members was from there IIRC

No you couldn't. You use 'is mise' to refer to who you are but you use 'Táim with adjectives ' for example 'Táim tuirseach' I'm tired, Táim saghas bodhar, I'm a bit deaf.