History / Sarmatism in Poland [119]


It depends what time period you're talking about. Gernally, though Iran has always been the center of the Persian empire except for the periods it was under Macedonian and Mongol control and also conquered during the Islamic conquest of Persia.

Median/Archaemenid/Pathian/Sasanian empires stretched from Afghanistan/Pakistan regions to Turkey but always included modern day Iran.

Generally though, Persia = Iran... Persians = Iranians..

Yes, R1a is not that common in Iran but subclade R1a1 is. R1a is thought to have originated from that around the Iran-Pakistan-India area, went through Central Asia, Russia, then finally Eastern Europe. There are many Poles and East Germans that are R1a1 as well as Pashtuns, Bedoins in Kuwaits, many Turks, and Iranian - however R1a isn't found there except for a small incidence in northern Iran. There's not many Europeans west of Poland that have R1a - most people in like France, Spain, Britain, etc. are R1b.

The largest R1a presense is seen in West Bengal Brahmins and north Indian Brahmins (technically castes) from India, Krygyz, certain Tajiks, Poles, Russians, and Ukranians. R1a-M458 is especially common in modern day Poland, Czech, Slovakia, Austria (surprisingly), and Ukraine. It's highest prevalence though is in the area of Poland, Czech Republic, part of S.E. Germany, and Slovakia - especially near rivers going to the Baltic. M458 however does have a small incidence in Turkey and the Caucasus.

History / Sarmatism in Poland [119]

Here is a distribution of Halpogroup R1a. 50%+ of Poles have this halpogroup in the DNA. It is widely believed that R1a originated from Iran.

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History / Sarmatism in Poland [119]


Sorry meant Elam which was basically the parallel to Sumer - general Mesopotamia area. You're right Sumeria was more Iraq near the Tigris and Eurphrates with Ur I believe being their largest city. However, much of the info that we know about proto-Persia actually comes from Sumerian writings like the Sumerian Kings List. Elam later became the Archamenid empire and later the Median empire. This general area was very very civilized compared to the rest of the world, especially Europe which was still mostly living as hunter gathers with no fortifications,


I know - I'm talking about the people who existed in those times in pre-966 Poland.


Partially true. There is a bit of debate in this. The culture that would've existed in Poland, again going by modern day borders, would've been the Lusatians which were all over Poland, but developed originally in Lodz, and later became the Pomeranians that lived between the Odra and Wisla which mixed with the Przeworsk culture (contained tribes like the East German Rugians and Lemovi) that was already there. Also, the Veneti, which became modern day Wends/Wendish culture, lived from the Wisla to the north up to Gdansk and are thought to be a Germanic/Batlic people. However, again, this is debatable because most of the tribes like the Gepids, Rugerians, Veneti (Wends), Goths, Vandals were all Germanic tribes. There is a lot of debate on what the ethnicity of the Lusatians is (the culture before the Pomeranians) but it is said that they developed from the earlier Trzciniec culture which is proto-Baltic-Slavic. However, it is said that the Lusatians, which the Trzciniec culture developed into, had many influences from Northern and Western European lands like the Nordic culture and also La Tene culture (ancient Celtic culture) which is more pre-French/Swiss/German.

Some tribes were allied with the Huns and fought against the Romans and other local tribes while some tribes were allied with the Romans and fought against the Huns. Like the Gepids constantly fought the Huns, but then allied with them around the time of Attila. When the Roman empire fell and the huns gained power there were many tribes who migrated westward out of fear resulting in further mixing and assimilation of tribes in Poland/East Germany. The Gepids for example though, like the Rugians, are thought to be a Germanic people and either related to the Goths or a subgroup of them, and they lived in lands that are modern day Poland.

There really isn't too much written records about the slavs aside from Romans and Greeks describing the people who would've lived in Poland. The writing they had aren't too good either - could be propoganda - but we were described as very violent, leaderless people, that were rather disorganized but nonetheless endured hardships and refused to be conquered and subjugated. Our looks included fair to lightly tan skin, very tall and strong, often blue eyes and a wide range of hair colors from blonde, brown, to red.

So in summary, there were a lot of influences on Poland before 966 - Scandinavian (possibly?) Goths, East German Vandals, possibly local Przeworsk (included East Germanic people like the Rugians - who originally came from Norway - means Rye in old norse and similar to rzyto in Polish), Scandinavian Jastorf who's languages became modern day Germanic languages, the Basternae (thought to be a Germanic people originally from northern Poland - lived in the Carpathian mountains as their northern borders and mostly around Dacia which is mostly modern day Romania, they had language similarities to the Sarmatians and were thought to be a tribe or subgroup of the Sarmatian Scythians - could be correct but could also be due to assimilation)

Due to the lack of written records of this time period (unlike say Sumeria, Elam, Egypt) it is difficult to determine ethnicity for certain of these cultures. Researchers can only go by archaeology and cultural influences. Like for Lusatian culture we know they had Nordic influence by the types of bronze weapons and tools discovered but also possibly La Tene culture because of the decorative items and similarities of urns discovered in Poland were similar to those found in France, Austria, Germany, etc.

Here is an excellent source with a timeline of Poland history that goes from 9000 B.C. to the present:
historyfiles.co.uk/KingListsEurope/EasternPoland.htm#Vidivarii

If you are interested in learning more about Sarmatism in Poland there are many books on the topic. There's one called 'Sarmatians In The Polish Past'

As as Poland's pre-966 history, Tacitus and Ptolemy are probably the best written sources. Even they couldn't figure out the exact ethnicity of the people who lived in Poland (again, going by the modern boundaries) at the time but stated that they were similar in culture to the east Germans.

Here is a brief exerpt from a website:


everything.explained.today/Sarmatism

Here is an article from Tacitus around 100 AD describing the people that would've inhabited Eastern Europe - granted a bit east of Poland as during the 1st century most of the people that would've lived in modern day Poland would've been Vandals, Goths, Gepids, Rugians, etc. The Fenni and Veneti/Venedi lived a bit further east in Russia/Belarus but would've come closer to Poland throughout the european migration and also as the huns gained power.


The Romans, and especially the Greeks, didn't like the slavs very much because they'd constantly pillage their cities and destroy everything.

Ptolemy classes the Veneti/Venedi as being more closely located to the Baltic in the areas of Poland up to the Wisla in the 2nd century. A later author, Jordanes, states that the Veneti are the ancestors of Slavs and originated from around the Wisla and migrated outward.

There is so much mixing of tribes and movement in Poland from around 500 B.C. to 800 A.D. that it's nearly impossible to determine a single common ancestral group. The Veneti are oftentimes the most accepted - but even they, along with most of the others, are East Germanic people.

History / Sarmatism in Poland [119]

Crow, ancient Iran was Persia and before that was Sumeria. The Scythians/Sarmatians were one of the many groups thay migrated out of this land.

The map above shows Poland in the 1st/2nd century c.e. The Sarmatians are located more near Ukraine, Hungary, etc. I'm sure there were some Sarmatians that came to Poland but they weren't the majority. Perhaps this thought and influence became more prevalent during the Commonwealth because Poland expanded to areas that use to be Sarmatian lands.

If anything most of the influence on pre Christian Poland during the migration period after the fall of Rome were Vandals, Goths, and other East German/Scandinavian/Baltic tribes like the Rugerians, Veneti (Wends) as cited by Ptolemy, Gepids, etc. Many of these tribes would end up fighting against the Huns and later allied with them during Atillas time.

The issue is that there is not much study into pre Christian Poland. Most Poles regard this as a dark pagan period, although Arianism was somewhat popular. Furthermore, there is not much archaeology aside from the Biskupin fortress and some iron tools left by the Vandals and Goths.

Crow I am familiar with the Etruscans, Thracians, Gauls, Kievan Rus, etc. I studied Latin for four years in high school and most of our lessons included translating historical texts, speeches, decrees, war diaries, etc.

History / What are Poland's pagan roots? [62]

I don't know why that one particular post got put in here because I don't think it has much to do with Poland's pagan roots - if I recall it was a response to Pol Attorney regarding something about priests...

Anyway, I wrote a pretty long article explaining Poland's pre-Christian past in the 'Sarmatian' thread. If you want to know more about proto-slavs, the tribes that lived in Poland prior to 966, the migration of cultures and groups in and out of Poland, check it out.

The way Poland's history as far as religion went is as follows:

pagan (people were mostly cremated - inhumations are rare) -> Arianism /pagan mix till 966 (different from Aryanism which is a racial ideology. Arianism is an early Christian belief that basically states that Jesus, as the son of God, is obedient to God the Father. Arianism faced much backlash and all but ended during the Council of Nicene which effectively eliminated Arianist beliefs under the threat of death) -> Christianity in 966 when Mieszko I converts from paganism to the version of Christianity as the Vatican dictates. This was widely a political move since it united the various tribes, prevented other Christian nations from attacking, and would serve as better ties among the more advanced nations in the area. Some Jews began to enter Poland since they were kicked out of almost every European country around the time of Kazimierz Wielki. He reaffirmed an old law passed nearly 100 years ago that prevented forced Christianization and Baptism of Jews, but it wasn't under Kazimierz Wielki that the Jews settled in massive numbers. Jan Matejko painted a famous painting of this. Then, some Tatar Muslims that were very loyal to Poland entered around the time of the Commonwealth. Poland had a huge Jewish population till WW2 when most were deported or killed. Presently, Poland is majority Catholic with small pockets of Jews, Protestants, and Tatar Muslims.

History / Sarmatism in Poland [119]


That's because the Sarmatian were Iranian of descent.

So yes, modern Poles do have Iranian blood in them.

This is something that Hitler and the Nazis studied a lot and led many excavations into Persia, Pakistan, Iraq, India - those areas. That was the basis of their proto-Aryan race theories - which does have a lot of scientific and archeological backing.

See the thing is, migration spread throughout Europe as metallurgic technology spread. Poland and Germany was actually quite behind in this - we were entering the middle/late bronze age while the Turks and Romans were already in the Iron age.

Modern Poles consist of a mix of a bunch of different ancient groups. Some of the ones from pre-Christian Poland that existed in the late Bronze/early Iron age of that area included the Vandals, Goths, Gepids, Rugians, Vendi, Huns, Sarmatians (which lived in the western part of Scythia), Nordic cultures, Celts, etc. who then formed city-states/tribes like the Polans, Pomeranians, Veneti, Sorbs, Wends, Slovans, etc.

I'm sure there could have well been a Sarmatian revival during the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth as the Scythians were probably the largest and most powerful of the ancient cultures that were a part of modern Poland. There were a lot of revivals of old cultures during the Renaissance, Baroque, and Victorian periods. In Italy, the locals revived the old culture of their ancestor's - the Romans - in their art, writing, philosophy, architecture, etc. In Victorian England, it was fashionable to have Egyptian decorations in your home and even have a mummy in your living room. Perhaps Poland was trying to revive their old culture as well and they may have thought it would be better to emulate the Sarmatian Scythians than the Gepids who were thought of as lazy rowers or the other cultures that may were a little behind the times as far as metallurgy is concerned anyway.

However, when you speak of Sarmatians in general to most people that is an ancient culture that existed around the end of Rome' reign. They would've been more on the south eastern borders of Poland and I'd imagine the Sarmatians probably had more influence on countries like Ukraine, Serbia, Hungary, etc. I do know that the Hussars of Hungary shared a lot in common with the Hussars of Poland. To my understanding, the first Hussars were actually Serbs that fought under the banner of the Hungarians. Maybe Sarmatism became more popular as Poland's boundaries during the commonwealth stretched more towards the Black Sea - although I'd imagine this was most likely the nobles of the day that they had a proud, ancient culture.

I'm not an expert on pre-Christian Poland. However, the books and articles that I have read on this topic it would seem that the Vandals, Goths, Nordic, and East Germanic tribes had a bit more influence on the lands that include modern day Poland.

Again though, if I were a king in the commonwealth and doing some d**k sizing with Poland's neighbors, I'd pick the Sarmatians as my ancestors over a meandering group of barbarians such as Vandals, Goths, etc. too.

Here's what Poland would've looked like around 100-200 A.D. - keep in mind by the time of Mieszko I, and even the semi-legendary Popielec dynasty, these tribes would've intermingled and be known as the Veneti (north Poland), Polans (center), Pomeranians (Odra and Visla, anywhere near water - their name comes from 'of the sea' or people from the sea' - morze is modern day Polish for sea), Silesians/Sorbs (Silesia), etc.

The migration of these times is very impressive - if you look at this map you'll notice the Burgundians in Poland during this time period but several centuries later they were given their own kingdom in southern France/northern Italy - even known to this day as modern Burgundy.

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News / Poland directly threatened by ISIS. Do Islamists planning terrorist attacks in Poland? [390]

I think they'd have it better in Guantanamo than a Polish prison...

For once a Muslim in modern Europe will have to adopt to the native Christians... this could be the start of something wonderful..

I'm sure the gryspers will be more than happy to cook you a kotlet schabowy in a frying pan in exchange for a cigarette or two ... halal kotlety? I don't think so :D

I could just imagine if you told a Polish guard that you demand halal food - ja ci kurwa dam halal, ty jebany darmojad. If he realized there's no such thing as halal pork, be prepared to get the bottoms of your feet beaten with a stick - won't leave any marks but you won't be able to walk without pain for a week. That was a favorite of the commie cops.

Poland does not need more Muslims - quite frankly, I'm happy that there is a small peaceful community of Tatars around Bialystok and Eastern Poland. I have no issues with them and I consider them to be part of Poland's society. Many of these guys fought against the Russians during the Polish-Bolshevik war and other powers too. They've defended Poland in many wars ever since the Commonwealth. Poland does need a little flavor - but importing terrorism and refugees with a totally different culture that refuse to assimilate and will live off the government and demand that the people adapt to them... no thanks...

News / Poland directly threatened by ISIS. Do Islamists planning terrorist attacks in Poland? [390]

Also, that's pretty fact that Albanian's stole people's organs. I think everyone's heard of the 'yellow house' before.

China still does this - they take the organs out of death row inmate and send them to Japan and other wealthy countries.

Islamists get most of their financing from drugs - especially opium and heroin, rich donors, weapon sales, government financing, extortion from locals, etc.

The Albanians run all the heroin and a good portion of the outdoor grade marijuana and hash in Europe as well as brothels, car theft rings, human trafficking, etc. A lot of the Albanian mafias would give funds to the KLA who later became heads of the Kosovo government, including Thaci.

Sorry Crow but really this is nothing new.

Stick to the topic please

News / Poland directly threatened by ISIS. Do Islamists planning terrorist attacks in Poland? [390]

Oh boy, just wait till the liberals see you post something about Alex Jones, David Duke, Pamela Gellar, Glen Beck, Brother Nathaniel or any one from that crowd.

I find Alex Jones entertaining, but not the best source of information on many topics. Some of the things that he says are true and he uses good sources, but not always and sometimes his theories are just nuts and lack credible sources.

I'll still take Alex Jones over Al Sharpton anyday though.

News / Poland directly threatened by ISIS. Do Islamists planning terrorist attacks in Poland? [390]


Yeah i heard that on the news too. I thought it was Gdansk too but I guess it's Gdyna (it's the tri-city area). Didn't know they were from Holland but yeah, they were definitely there to buy guns. It is very easy to buy weapons in Poland from handguns, to AK's, to even RPGs and if you know someone and have the cash old soviet tanks.

trojmiasto.pl/wiadomosci/Areszt-za-probe-zakupu-kalasznikowow-n99872.html

People who aren't Polish stick out like a sore thumb in Poland. Even though I'm white, brown hair and blue eyed, still people would stare at me and I know they could tell that I'm from another country - Polish yes but that I've been living abroad.


Yeah exactly that's what I mean. It's most likely census data.

History / Sarmatism in Poland [119]

What about it? Those are two different topics - Poland never really had an empire and the most amount of land they had was in the 1500's to 1600's. The period of Sarmatians and Scythians was nearly 1,000 years before this time period. Empire of Poland when I think of it is the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth - that was the largest Poland ever was and at the time was the 4th largest country in Europe. Poland, stupidly, did not have any colonies in Africa, Asia, or other parts of the world which would've made them far richer instead of just relying on their agriculture based economy.

The Sarmatia to me is more the lands of like Ukraine, the Balkans, Hungary, Russia, etc. That era is way before Poland became an official country and was baptized in the 966. Sarmatian and Scythian culture existed around the end of the Roman empire and into the period right before Poland became a country. The Sarmatians and Scythians were one of the Iranian ancenstry groups that moved around during the great migration - of whom yes many settled in Poland, Germany, Hungary, etc.

There aren't too many records and few historical artifacts from pre-Christian Poland. In the B.C. era, like 3,000 B.C. to 2,000 B.C. most commonly Poland at the time was thought to be populated by the corded ware/battle ax culture - most of this was still stone age technology. Then came Trzciniec Culture in Poland during the early Bronze age. Then followed the Lusatian culture from around 1,000 B.C. to around 500 B.C. which would've been the middle Bronze age in Poland. The migration period in Europe began with Rome's decline and lasted from the the 1st century A.D. to around the 9th century A.D. - that's when you start seeing cultures like the Sarmatians and Scythians showing up in Poland. The area of Poland had a lot of different groups, including many foreign during the migration period, but due to the lack of artefacts or written records, there is a lot of uncertainty and debate in this topic.

Here is a brief timeline of some of the groups that are thought to have lived in Poland prior to 966 are as follows:

Battle Axe, Corded Ware Culture - 3,000 B.C. to around 2,000 B.C. - specifically the Globular Amphora Culture occupied the areas around modern day Warsaw. Mostly stone age.

Trzciniec culture - 2,000 to 1,000 B.C. - early Bronze age in Poland - more advanced domestication, farming, some very early metals arrive like gold, silver, bronze

Lusatian culture - 1,000 B.C. to 500 B.C. - middle Bronze age in Poland - pottery, fortifications, increased trade for metals like bronze from the south for Poland's amber along with some increased domestic production of copper/bronze

Here's where it starts to get confusing because of the migration of people from Rome, the migration of people from the Nordic countries, and the migration of the Scythians/Sarmatians, who are Iranian in origin: 500 B.C. to about 800 A.D.

Migration of Germanic and Nordic tribes in northern Poland (Goths) and Germanic tribes in Western Poland - around 500 B.C. to 100 A.D. all the way to further south by the

300/400 A.D. Period - this is where you see an intersection of cultures that arrived from Sweden and Germany mixing with those during the migration period after the fall of Rome along with the Scythians/Sarmatians and Vandals which arrived in Poland around 200-100 B.C. You begin to see cultures like the Oksywie (northern Baltic Poland to the Wisla - includes the Rugians), Wielbark (eastern Poland - Germanic - Goths, Veneti), Przeworsk (southern Poland - Vandals, later Burgundians) cultures. From the Wielbark culture you see other subgroups like the Goths, Rugians, Veleti, Veneti (which became the Wends from Pomeramia and are considered early Germanic-Slavic people) because they shared many of the same lands in northern and eastern Poland near the Wisla. These were mostly Germanic/Baltic cultures that were in Poland aside from Okyswie (which had some La Tene Culture characteristics, Central and Western Europe like from France to Czech, but north of Alps with some Celtic influence, and also later mixed with the Rugians and became the Pomeranians) who also mixed with the Przework culture which included the Vandals. This becomes very complicated because all these cultures intermingled quite a bit like the Oksywie (north of Alps, Central Europe) mingled with the German/Danish Rugians from the Wielbark culture and also mingled with the Vandals/Burgundians who were almost constantly on the move so it gets to be very complicated. Then come the Huns and Scythians from lands like Hungary into Poland too around the 300-500's mixing with the Burgundians - another mobile traveling group of people. Even the Roman emperors were confused as to what exactly the groups living in modern day Poland were because their culture was similar to the Germans but their language was different.

Migration period - 100 AD to 700/800 AD - Vandals (come from Scandinavia around 1st century AD, begin to form settlements in S.E. Poland/Czech/Silesian areas near the Odra) , Burgundians (around 1st century AD start showing up - formed part of Attila the Hun's army in 400 AD) but then later are given a kingdom near northern Italty/southern France... there was a ton of people on the move at this time in Europe, especially in the lands of Poland, the Kievan Rus, Germany, the Balkans, etc. There wasn't as much movement in France or England when compared to Central and Eastern Europe around this time period.

Around 800-1000 A.D. this group becomes collectively known as the Lechites (of which there is about 6 main groups and around 20 sub groups - all living in or around modern day Poland in various city-states and tribes) and the culture and language becomes more universal in modern day Poland. The piast dynasty, many of whom were pagan up until Christianization and also were named 'Lech' which is still a popular Polish name, and even the name of a Beer, united the tribes and city states of various lands like those in Silesia, Pomerania, etc. and hence that is how the name 'Lech' came from Lechites. This is where modern Poland begins to show up but again it really depends on what part of Poland because the culture in East Poland may differ from that in the north which would differ from that in the West. These cultures were mostly pagan up until Christianity spread and Poland became Christianized.

Hope that helps... when you speak of Sarmatians and Scythians that is a broad topic and that's just one of many groups and cultures that migrated into Poland during pre-Christian Poland.

Language / I need advice - how long does it take to learn Polish? [70]

For beginners, I highly recommend children's books, poems, etc. for anyone who is in the beginning phrases of learning a new language.

Once you have a basic grasp of the alphabet, grammar, and some vocabulary, the next best thing to do is to immerse yourself in the culture and live in the country, or at least spend a bit of time there. Learning a language is a lifelong experience. I scored a 32 on my high school ACT in English (which is like 97% percentile out of 99%) and I still learn new words and phrases all the time. I also took Spanish for 4 years in college and I learned more Spanish vocabulary and grammar living in Mexico for a few months than I would've spending a couple hours every week for a year in a classroom.

Classrooms are great for learning the alphabet, grammar, and some basic vocabulary. Another great way is to read children's book and gradually move up in difficulty - that's how I started learning Spanish and Russian (which I am still learning). Immersing yourself in the culture, watching Polish movies/TV, reading newspapers would be your next step after you learned the basic. Before long, you won't be breaking up words into smaller syllables and reading with your finger and you'll sound like a native Pole!

Study / Is there racism in Poznan and hate crime against coloured people (students)? [59]

Poland is quite xenophobic due to it's history and the fact that it's been for many years rather isolated. However, an increasing amount of people, especially the young that seem keen on more integration with western Europe, are more tolerant of others.

Poland is a very homogeneous country - the vast majority are Roman Catholic Polish people. It's not a mixed society like England, France, Belgium or the US. A lot of people have preconceived notions about certain races and religions and may come off as xenophobic or stereotype because they just simply aren't as exposed to other cultures as other countries' citizens.

Again though, that is changing pretty rapidly with the population. If you're in a large city like Warsaw or even Poznan you should be fine. Just stay away from the bad neighborhoods and avoid the soccer hooligans, many of whom are neo-Nazis and you won't get beat up.

In the university though people are going to be much more open and you may actually find that you'll make more friends and be more popular as a foreigner since again the society is homogeneous. If you do encounter racism, it might be like someone shouting at you from a car as they pass by or stares from older Poles, but it's unlikely that you'll encounter violence unless you like walk into certain neighborhoods and are hanging around the bloki where neo-Nazis are known to reside.

Overall though, I doubt you'll have a problem with safety in Poznan, especially as a university student.

News / Poland directly threatened by ISIS. Do Islamists planning terrorist attacks in Poland? [390]

Poland is very mixed if you're going by technical specifics and measuring mitochondrial DNA, haplotypes, etc. then no, Poland is not pure Polish. The reason for this is because of it's geographical position and the history of that area. Poland has faced the Swedish Deluge, the partitions, world wars, forced Sovietization and had one of the largest nations in Europe during the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. so if most Polish people took got their DNA tested there would most likely be German, Austrian, Swedish, Russian, Lithuanian, Ukranian, etc. Poland for Poles who have at least 50% mitochondrial Polish DNA just doesn't have the same ring ; )

It's like the city of Lviv - Lwow. Yes, it's a Ukranian city now but many of the people are actually Polish as it was a Polish city before WW2. They may identify as Ukranian but chances are in many cases they have Polish blood. I'm from Wroclaw which throughout it's history has switched hands between Poland and Germany lots of times but I identify as Polish even though I'm sure I have some German blood.

I think that if you identify as Polish and have some Polish ancestors - yes, then you're Polish. There's going to be a tiny minority of people that pretend to be another nationality - like that white girl who claimed she was black, but again, that's a tiny minority. People ought to be proud of who they are.

Also, Easter attack in Pakistan leaves 70 dead and 300 injured. The terrorists were purposely targeting Catholics during an Easter celebration... smh...

Love / Turkish girl is going to meet her Polish boyfriend's family - needs tips. [47]

Let us know how it went - I'm sure a lot of us are curious

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]

Yes I was raised in the US but I will be returning to Poland in the very near future. I actually just came from a 2 month trip to Wroclaw, Walbrzych, Konin, Poznan, Rychwal and Dortmund - where I found out my aunt lost her job of 10 years because the government confiscated the hotel she use to work at and turned it into a migrant shelter. She has to worry about finding a new job and paying the rent while the migrants get to live for free in a 4 star hotel and enjoy the pool.

Anyway, ethnicity and faith does shape a lot of one's wordlview, values, morals, customs, and personality even. A Muslim women will have different views and such than a Catholic woman.

The US is a huge mix of migrants and although yes many do intermarry I would say much more people marry people of the same nationality. Mexicans with mexicans, poles with poles, jews with jews, etc. It's more the Americans that are irish, italian, croatian, native American and like 4 other nationalities, when you ask them what their nationality is, that are more inclined to intermarry.

Personally, I wish Europe would've remained the way it was before this whole migrant mess, but now it's past that so hopefully Poland, the Visegard 4, and the East European countries unite and resist EU hegemony and interference in their affairs.

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]

The other I have dual citizenship, speak 4 languages, have an international business degree, lived in 5 states in the US and have travelled to at least 30 countries in North America/Carribean, Europe, Asia, and the Middle East for both work and leisure. I have spent many summers in college backpacking through Europe and Latin America. I have lived in Poland, US, Germany and Mexico - amd by lived I mean rented a place not just stayed in a hotel or hostel for a while.

EDIT:
Forgot to add Holland to the list... I studied abroad at the University of Maastricht for a semester.

Although the majority of my travel has been in N. America and Europe, I have experienced more cultures and met more people from all walks of life in my short life than most average people will their entire life.

If I were dating someone, no culture and nationality wouldn't matter. However, as the saying goes you marry into the family and I think quite frankly it's simply easier and would has less tension than marrying into the same nationality or atleast a very similar one.

Look at all the threads with people freaking out about being turkish, indian, etc. And meeting their significant other's Polish parents and worrying if they'll accept their nationality, religion, or even not like them because of it. Even in a recent one, a Turkish girl wrote that her father is the patriotic type and hopefully in time he'll accept the Polish boyfriend. Yes, everyone gets nervous when meeting in laws but these issues and concerns about accepting culture and religion don't arise when two people are the same. Then there is the issue of raising the children: Muslim or Catholic, who if anyone will convert, do you celebrate Muhammed or Jesus or both, etc.

News / Poland directly threatened by ISIS. Do Islamists planning terrorist attacks in Poland? [390]

Crow,

Do you know where these soldiers are stationed -is it in the capital Pristina by any chance? I do know northern Kosovo is majority Serb and over 1/3 of Bosnia identifies as Serbian. Well Crow, I am with you as is my family. What NATO did to Belgrade was sad and their propping up of Thai is a mistake

Dougpol, it doesn't take a genius or a police statistician to see all the rapes that are being committed by these Muslim refugees. There's countless videos of women, camera crews, charities, and Catholics leaving church getting accosted and attacked by Muslims. There are even Sharia patrols in London and Belgium this is public knowledge. No Poland should not allow in Muslim refugees because we don't want our women to get raped and fondled by Muslims like they did to women in Sweden during concerts and in Cologne on New Years Eve. What's worse is that the media and the police try to cover these events up to protect their liberal politicians.

Actually, Poland helped out Ukraine quite a bit during the recent conflict with Russia. They allow Ukrainians to come into Poland too, I believe around 1,000 refugees were let in. I totally support that because those are our neighbors and have a similar culture, similar values, similar language and similar religion. Even Pilsudzki allied with Ukraine against the Russians in the past. These people are very similar to us but the Muslims are not. It is a totally different culture and not only does the majority of Muslim migrants not integrate and instead set up ghettos, they threaten the local society and local citizens through things like sharia patrols, rapes of women like mentioned above, torching shelters and tents paid for by charities and taxpayers, and shoot at police like we say in Belgium just a week or so agp when some French and Belgian cops tried to serve a warrant in one of these Muslim ghettos popping up all over Europe. I don't know if you were born in Poland, have property in Poland, and have nearly your entire family in Poland but I do so I am going to do whatever I can to totally resist my country and my family from being endangered and corrupted

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]


I have experienced plenty in the 27 years of my life (I'll be 28 in a few weeks). Anyway, I've experienced enough of life and dated enough women to know that I have more in common with someone of the same culture, faith, customs, traditions, and even mindset. I find that my personality and way of thinking even better matches than a Polish girl than a Mexican girl for example. Furthermore, I wish to raise my children as Polish Catholics and teach them the language, culture, history, etc. - that is much easier to do when your partner is also Polish.

Like Crow said, I'm fine with dating someone outside of my culture and religion too. However, I want to have children someday and want those children to be brought up a certain way and learn about their homeland, their ancestry, etc. That is a consideration I have to make when chosing a wife, as I'm sure the wife too would want her children brought up a certain way, taught certain customs, perhaps learn a 2nd language, etc. There's going to be less disagree on what language to teach the kid, what customs and traditions to celebrate and when, what religion to raise the child if two people are of the same nationality and faith than two totally different nationalities and faiths. It'd even be easier for a Pole and a Serbian to get married since they have similar traditions, similar customs, and a similar faith than say a Pole and a Japanese or Malaysian.

That is why I said: number 1 - Polska dla Polakow... I also stated I don't mind having foreigners come to the country and cited the Vietnamese in Wroclaw as an example. They contribute to the society (many own restaurants), pay taxes, and most of the ones I met even speak Polish. However, even this group married their own kind - the husband and wife would run the restaurant together.

However, having 'refugees' come in, march down the street with Sharia 4 Poland signs, torching tents and shelters provided for them by the government, tax payers, and charities, throwing out clothes and food like the ungrateful refugees in Calais because the thought the charity worker was trying to give them expired food and proceeded to break into their truck and start stealing stuff, vandalizing sings and pushing dumpsters into traffic disrupting people's daily lives, shouting that their God is the greatest, and groping and assaulting our Polish women is something that I will never support and is my number 1 concern for Poland right now since Germany is right next door and all these issues are happening there. Eventually, Germany and Sweden are going to be too full and these 'refugees' may start looking elsewhere. Germany is their first choice because the welfare system is so great that they can live off the government and not work but still have food, housing, and money and spend their days complaining about the German locals - kind of like the welfare, section 8'ers in Chicago complain about how the white man is holding them down even though it's the white man supporting their lazy non-working lifestyle. Eventually, they're going to look at 3rd, 4th, 5th, etc. choices and I'm willing to bet that life in Poland is a lot better than Afghanistan or Iraq for the average person.

News / Poland directly threatened by ISIS. Do Islamists planning terrorist attacks in Poland? [390]

Crow,

Many of the people that were fighting against the Serbs on the side of the Bosnians were hardcore jihadists and mujahideen/mujahireen.

Many of the leaders in the KLA are now running Kosovo - like the PM for example. There's been some investigation into the 'yellow house,' organ trafficking, and revenge killings but Europe and NATO were more concerned with Bosnia and propping up Kosovo at the time. Russia was rather weak at the time so it couldn't really help the Serbs out a whole lot. I bet if a similar situation occurred now you can bet that the US would be scared to intervene.

I've read many statistics that actually as many as 40% of the 'refugees' trying to escape to Germany, Sweden, etc. are actually from Kosovo, Albania, and other poor Balkan countries. It wouldn't surprise me if some of these individuals were jihadis in the 90's. Many of them have popped up in Syria and Iraq and were highly prized fighters, as well as the Chechnya's because of their combat experience.

Like Donald Trump said - Mexico isn't sending their finest people to the US. Well, neither are the 'refugees' the cream of the crop from their countries. Furthermore, whenever I see pictures or videos of these boat people - the majority is military aged males.

News / Germany After the EU and the Russian Scenario - future of the European Union and Poland [310]

See Poland is a bad geopolitical spot. Poland has a long, complicated history with Russia which has included dozens of wars throughout the centuries. Poland just got out of Russian communist rule - even when I was living in Poland it was still Communist. (Quite frankly, we had it very good under Communism and never lacked for anything. If anything, life for us was more difficult in the years after Communist but that's beside the point.) Poland is weary of Germany also, because like Russia it has had many wars throughout history.

After the USSR collapsed and Poland was no longer a satellite nation, it chose to ally with NATO. Then Poland joined the EU. So Poland is now allied with the same neighbor that invaded it just 70 some years ago and the same countries that promised to help Poland but did next to nothing. This was smart at first because Poland needed new trading partners now that the USSR was dissolved and sought military allies so it kind of made sense. They basically picked the lesser of 2 evils. However, now Poland is a very wealthy nation - the 21st largest economy by GDP worth over $1 trillion. Yes, the EU helped with it a lot but Poland gave up a lot of it's political decisions and sovereignty in return for EU funds. Now Poland has to decide whether to continue to give into the EU's demands or forge it's own path. I don't think that Poland will totally back out of the EU because of all the trade with EU countries. I'd like to see Poland form stronger economic, political, and military ties with the Visegard 4, Serbia, Slovenia, Croatia, Ukraine, the Baltic states, and even perhaps Russia. Poland ought to focus more on its neighbors, especially those that are resisting EU hegemony. There's a lot of potential with trade between Poland and Russia especially with the sanctions. However, I feel that the EU would prevent Poland from taking advantage of the situation. The EU really has Poland by the balls but the governments of Poland, the Visegrad 4, and Russia are realizing that the EU, France, and Germany are in decline - especially because of this whole migrant mess.

Germany, France, and Belgium can't even protect their borders and their citizens anymore yet they dictate to Poland and the Visegard 4 what they should and shouldn't do.

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]

Unfortunately, thanks to Merkel not only does it endanger the EU and the Schengen Zone but also she's irreparably damaged Germany's culture and demographics.

In 30 years, there's going to be millions more Muslims in Germany just from the ones that arrived in the past 5 years since they have way more kids than the local Germans. 3 kids for a Muslim family is considered a small family - many of them have 2-4 wives and like 6-10 kids.

In Holland already 50% of the school children are Muslim. Imagine what's going to happen when those kids grow up and then have their own children who they send to school, then that generation will too have it's own children that attend grade school, and before long 40-50 years have passed and now 3/4 kids are Muslim.

These populations are going to continue to grow at an exponential rate and it's only a matter of time before they outnumber Catholic Europeans in certain countries. Then, these Muslims are going to get political ambitions and start to run for public offices. Since the population will be so big, there's going to be tons of Muslim votes who are going to vote for their own kind. Then, you're going to see these politicians enact policies and laws that help their own kind out to the detriment of the white Christian European.

Perhaps one day, my grandchildren or great-grandchildren (if I live that long) will have geography lessons which include Belgistan and the Emirate of Holland.

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]

Exactly! When the Swedes invaded Poland and intermarried there was a lot of tension - but at least these cultures were fairly similar. You can't expect hundreds of thousands of individuals from other continents with totally different lifestyles, religions, and customs to suddenly enter Europe and everyone sings kumbaya together. It's not going to happen.

What upsets me the most is that these parasites come to Europe from Morocco, Syria, etc. because they're escaping war or poverty, the host country provides them with shelter and food while the liberals in the society welcome them and try to integrate them, yet they commit horrible crimes on the same people that accepted them and are trying to the help them. It's not even biting the hand that feeds you - it's chopping it off.

Love / Turkish girl is going to meet her Polish boyfriend's family - needs tips. [47]


Yeah she definitely didn't pick the best time of the year to come by lol. Even Christmas would've been better than this week.

Yes, I am explaining that if she does encounter the conservative, hard-core Catholic Polish type of older generation, what she should be prepared for and what my recommendations are. I think we both know that as a Turkish Muslim there is going to be suspicion but I explained how she should divert the focus from that and show her best side by offering small gifts and showing that there's more to her than just being a Turkish Muslim. The fact that she said the parents wanted to meet her is already a good sign - if they were the ultra-conservative type and would never accept a foreign girl for their son, they would've already said so and not sent an invitation to meet her.

I'm just explaining a worst case scenario IF the parents are hardcore Polish Catholics like many are. My parents are the urban sophisticated type and deal with all different races and nationalities so if I brought a Turkish girl home, they'd most likely welcome her as normal. However, if we spoke of marriage, they'd be accepting and all but of course they'd prefer that I marry a Polish girl. Nonetheless, if she is a good woman, educated, smart, well mannered, and has all the attributes of a good wife then they'd be totally supportive of the marriage.

However, to my grandparents, who are much more conservative and not as open-minded, the girl's race and religion would be as important as her personality. Since it's a first impression, it may not go that well because they'd see right away that she is not Polish and most likely not even European for that matter. When you first meet a person, you make physical observations so they'd notice right away she's not Polish. Later on, they'd get a better idea of who she is. In due time if they see that she will become a great wife they will most likely come to accept her and race will matter less - but again, with time. The race concern may be brought up once again later in the future though if the couple wishes to have children. The more conservative Poles will be concerned the baby is of a mixed race. However, in time, just like with the wife would most likely come to love the child since it is family after all.

The very very closed-minded nationalistic type may never accept the girl, the marriage, or the children. These people are far and few in Poland though. More than likely either one of two things will happen - either it won't be a big deal at all and it won't even cross the parents' mind if they are the liberal, open minded type OR they will be concerned with the girl being from a different race and religion although that concern will pass with time as they get to know her and see that she will make a good wife and mother. Eventually, they will accept her as family.

Just don't show up wearing a burqa or niqab, kissing the elders' hand, and leave your prayer rug at home if you want to make a good first impression. Offer a handshake or hug, bring flowers/chocolate for the lady of the house, alcohol for the man, and Turkish coffee or halva as a general gift for everyone and that will make a wonderful first impression regardless whether they are the liberal type or conservative type.

Don't be surprised too if after a few drinks they start asking more personal questions. If they really like you they may even start hinting at marriage - that's a good sign!

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]


That is EXACTLY why I am against intermarriage. Thanks for pointing that out. My loyalties and my family's loyalties lie to Poland and Catholicism - NOT the EU and they never will. I am totally against a Europe that is 1 country comprised of the EU nations run by one government that totally dissolves individual European country's sovereignty. Nationalism and patriotism are two different things by the way. There are many patriots who stand up for their country without undermining other groups. Not everyone who loves their country is a racist. I don't have an issue with immigrants coming to Poland as long as they contribute to the society, don't mock or try to change the existing customs and traditions, and arrive legally. I am happy that there are many Vietnamese in Wroclaw as they contribute to the society by providing employment (many own restaurants), pay taxes, and most of them even speak Polish as they've been here for generations. However, nearly every single Vietnamese I've met is married to someone of their own race - not a Polish person. I am against Poland accepting the 'refugees' we're seeing in Europe now because we have seen from Poland's neighbors that they are not integrating or contributing to the society - they are disrespecting existing religious institutions and customs of the host nation, stating that the local women deserve 'real' men, living off of the generous welfare benefits, and committing crimes such as sexual assault, rape, vandalism, and arson.


Date, yes. Marry, no since like the above example I do not want my children to be Polish Roman Catholics and not Polish-Indian, Catholic-Hindu, White-kind of Caramel colored.. I want my children to understand that they are Polish, born in Poland, raised on Polish traditions, and pray to God as Catholics. I will show them the family tree and family records in Krakow so they can understand their genealogy and hopefully carry it on. They can make their own decisions when they're older and hopefully they'll continue the same beautiful traditions that have been in my family since as far as we have been able to trace which is actually to around the 1200's from my father's side (granted there were a bit of gaps from 1300-1600) and 1700's from my mothers. We have had Hungarian, Ukrainian, Russian, Lithuanian, and German influence throughout our family tree but it has always been concentrated in Eastern European lands and Catholicism. It's a bit difficult too to determine if certain family members were actually German, Russian, etc. because of the Partitions - whether they were actually Polish or took a more 'local native' name.

Many Poles feel this way too - I don't know if I can say for certainty that the majority do but I feel that would be true for older generations. My generation, not so much. Poles don't have as much issue marrying someone from one of the neighboring countries like Germany, Czech Republic, Lithuania or even in some cases Ukraine and Russia. However, it's because those nations are European and share similar religious beliefs.

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]

What's wrong with marrying someone of your own nationality and religion? I want to be able to communicate with my wife in Polish, teach it to our kids, show them the country they come from, have them meet their ancestors, etc. It makes it much more difficult to have a child understand his or her heritage and faith if one parent is a Catholic from Poland and the other a Hindu from India or another country that has a way different culture.

I'd like to add:
A recent poll showed that 29% of Germans support an open-fire policy on the border to keep the refugees out.

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]


Unfortunately yes. However, many Poles including myself will not marry anyone outside their faith and ethnicity. It's not me being racist - I just want my children to grow up in a Polish home, raised on Catholicism, and celebrate things like Wigilia, Wielki Piatek, Trzeciego Maja, etc. in the same way that I have. My family is nearly entirely Polish with the exception of my dad's mother. However, she's lived in Poland all her life, speaks Polish, and raised her children - my father and my aunt - with Polish traditions.

From CIA World Factbook:

Ethnic groups: Polish 96.9%, Silesian 1.1%, German 0.2%, Ukrainian 0.1%, other and unspecified 1.7%
note: represents ethnicity declared first (2011 est.)

I hope that Poland remains at least 90%+ Polish. Thankfully, most Poles see what's happening next door in Germany and they don't want the same to happen to them. They don't want foreigners marching down the street demanding that crosses and other 'offensive' religious articles be removed, they don't want women to be fondled at concerts, they don't want their money going to housing refugees which end up being torched (dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3411748/The-Jungle-burns-Migrants-torch-Calais-camp-violent-protests-police-evict-hundreds-slum.html) (pamelageller.com/2015/10/video-muslim-migrants-burn-down-refugee-camp-take-selfies.html/) and they don't want their tax money to help economic migrants. A lot of the 'refugees' that came to Poland ended up going to Germany anyway because they know they'll get more money from the Germany government whereas in Poland they'll actually have to work and integrate into the society.

I believe that every nationality deserve it's own country whether it's the Israelis, the Palestinians, the Kurds, etc. Multiculturalism has not always been a good thing. Look at even the US, arguably the most multicultural country in the world. There's plenty of racial tension. You can't expect people to just live with others that have totally different customs, traditions, and religion and expect there to be no conflict.

Love / Turkish girl is going to meet her Polish boyfriend's family - needs tips. [47]

Yeah I hate to break it to you, but if the boyfriends' parents are the conservative, nationalist type you're not going to have it easy - at least not at first. IF they are the very conservative Catholic type they may even go so far as telling the boyfriend not to marry you and that they don't want to have a mixed baby. Many older Polish generations are very much against marrying into other races or religions - especially against Muslims. I don't mean to offend you I'm just being honest with the thinking behind some of the older generations. I know my grandparents would certainly be concerned if I brought a foreign girl home, but then my parents who are more open-minded, not so much... One of the major sources of pride for Polish people is the Battle of Vienna and ever since then Poland has been very weary of Muslims which is now further exacerbated by the migrant crisis. Fortunately though, most modern Poles look to the Turks more favorably than the other Muslim countries like Saudi Arabia for example. Since you are Turkish, and possibly Muslim (don't know if you are or not but I know Turkey is a majority Muslim country), you're may have more difficult time than say if you were German, Swedish, French, Spanish, or Russian.

It depends really on how conservative they are though - they may be the more liberal type and this may not come up at all. However, IF they are the more conservative anti-race mixing type, then just make sure they get to know you for who you are and there's a good chance they will eventually form a more positive outlook.

Again, I could be totally wrong - if the boyfriends' parents are rather open minded this won't be an issue and hopefully they'll just judge you for who you are which is what I hope happens.

Polish people do like Turkish coffee - it's actually all that my parents and my grandma from my mom's side and I drink (Aroma brand). Flowers, chocolate, and alcohol are acceptable gifts. Alcohol is a very very popular gift and highly recommended - especially for the man of the house. Vodka is most popular and enjoyed by nearly all Poles so you'd be safer presenting a bottle of Vodka, or even some wine or brandy, than say Arak from Turkey. Also, much of the older generation would exchange crystals and give them as presents like crystal vases, cups, etc. However, this would be more of a gift idea for a later meeting - not the first time.

As far as kissing the hand, I wouldn't do it - that will set a very bad first impression. Polish people don't really do that - the only time that happens is when a man kisses a lady's hand in a formal setting as an introduction and even that's becoming less common. A handshake or hug would be most appropriate then followed by presenting a small gift like flowers or chocolates for the boyfriend's mother and alcohol for the boyfriend's father.

News / What kind of Poland do most Poles want? [101]

1. Polska dla Polakow!

News / Poland directly threatened by ISIS. Do Islamists planning terrorist attacks in Poland? [390]

Dougpol you realize that the majority of migrants are NOT refugees fleeing war bur rather economic migrants? The majority of migrants aren't even from Syria or Eritrea.

I don't see you posting any sources to back up your claims...

Israel sticks it's nose in everything it possibly can. The English Defense League is even sponsored by Israel and has its own Jewish division. The reason for the Israeli flag is most like so people remember that Isreal is also facing terrorist attacks from Palestinians in the form of rocket attacks, stabbings, etc. However, aside from perhaps Vice news, there is little to no reporting on IDF crimes against innocent Palestinians. Comparing apartheid in Israel to South Africa is a big no no even thougg the Palestinians have ot just as bad if not worse than the blacks did in South Africa. The amount of Jews killed by Palestinian terrorists and hamas vs the amount of innocent Palestinians killed by IDF doesn't even compare.