News / Poland-EU: Positive and negative features? [45]

And start paying more taxes to develop the country? Or to support loss-making parts of the economy? No, thank you! Enough is enough. You don't have to pay 48% income tax, do you? By the time you do, you will say the same thing.

News / Poland-EU: Positive and negative features? [45]

Paying high taxes to help out countries, either because they don't have their budgets on order, they need to build motorways, their farmers need help, etc ... etc ... . I pay (yes I still do, but not for that long anymore) 48% taxes. At the end of this month my holiday money comes in. Officially it is 8% of ones yearly wages; but as soon as it is paid out only 52% remains. The rest goes to the government.

In the Netherlands every person, so including babies and the elderly, pays about €2.500 a year in taxes to the EU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Far, far, far too much. And when these peeps in Brussels also insist on traveling to Stassburg once a month (which apparently costs 1mln each time), I really have some problems with that.

And now that some countries want to increase the EU's budget while there is an economic crisis going on, I wonder where those that are in favour of an increased budget have been living in the last couple of years. On the dark side of the moon maybe?? Every country has to implement budget cuts and then some finance idiot in the EU (we all know who we are talking about) says he wants to increase the budget. Well ... no FVCKING way! I agree completely with the English and the Dutch (and other) governments to stop increasing EU's budget. Not now.

And don't enlarge the EU even more. It's enough; well, to be honest it already went to far.

Pros ... free movement of persons (although there are countries questioning that principle - and rightly so if you ask me), goods and services.

Work / (IT field) moving from India to Poland -Wroclaw in May '11 [46]


And for many more years to come if it'd be up to me. Not because they are Turks, but simply because I am dead against further expansion of the EU. So no Turkey, no Iceland, no Ukraine, no Georgia, no Serbia, Croatia, Montenegro, etc ... .

Hell, there are even ideas to grant North African countries EU membership statuspolsis.bham.ac.uk/news/2011/03/eu-membership-enlargement.s html !

Who's next ... ? Azerbaijan, Armenia, Syria, Iran perhaps?

News / Achievements of the Tusk's Polish government [532]

You are no doubt correct, gumishu ... but I just wanted to show that it is possible. Although one would have to adapt the way of teaching children.

News / Achievements of the Tusk's Polish government [532]


Well, I would throw military service in the mix as well, but that shouldn't come as a surprise when you look at where I come from. But, I agree with you ... let young people do something for society after their education, either after secondary school or after university or whatever. And they can choose what they want to do themselves.

It builts character, gives some sense of responsibility and sense of duty ... things a lot of young people nowadays are desperately lacking.

Jee ... I sound like an old grandpa ... ;)

News / Achievements of the Tusk's Polish government [532]


Either reinstate conscription or let young people choose what they want (a kind of alternative or social service, like working in health service, or assisting in class rooms, sweeping the streets for all I care). I think it would definitely benefit society, and show young people that from now on life isn't all about oneself, that one has duties, etc ...


Short sighted idea, pawian. Your motherland has no use for dead soldiers. The problem with dead soldiers is that they can't fight anymore. Furthermore, it lowers the moral in the ranks AND in the country itself. Stay alive ... much more useful!

News / Achievements of the Tusk's Polish government [532]


Doesn't matter, gumishu. At age 6 and 7 I went to a Montesorri-school in Amsterdam. No problems at all.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montessori_education


If you want to stay alive for a little longer, I'd suggest a longer training, pawian.

News / Achievements of the Tusk's Polish government [532]


BS ... over here they go to school at 4. We don't have very many pupils with learning difficulties. One can even choose to send ones child to school at two-and-a-half, something that over 30 years ago was already possible in Belgium for example. No learning difficulties because of that! Or psychological problems.


No ... but as I have stated here before ... I don't discuss things about Polish politics, because I don't know enough about it. I don't live there (yet) and therefore I feel I should listen, ask questions when in doubt and not comment. However, since you brought up your number 10 of which I know a lot about, I felt compelled to argue that re-organizing ones armed services into a professional one, doesn't necessarily give positive results.

News / Achievements of the Tusk's Polish government [532]


Start another thread and I will tell you (from first hand after 22 years of experience) about the pros, but mainly cons about having a professional army. And it isn't what Torq says.

Real Estate / Stan deweloperski vs stan surowy [developing or undeveloping property state] [36]


Great SeanBM, thanks a lot.

I can see that also in this case one would have to find the time to keep on top of things to avoid being left with some shoddy workmanship.

But I got a good idea. Thank you!

Real Estate / Stan deweloperski vs stan surowy [developing or undeveloping property state] [36]


Ahh ... sorry. Misunderstanding. No, it already crossed my mind that I shouldn't expect a lot of people speaking English in these parts. But that's OK ... that way it's even more important for me to learn the lingo asap.

Real Estate / Stan deweloperski vs stan surowy [developing or undeveloping property state] [36]


Good point, frd. I have noticed some adds where this was specifically stated. So definitely something to keep in mind!


Why? Are they that bad?

Real Estate / Stan deweloperski vs stan surowy [developing or undeveloping property state] [36]


Thanks SeanBM, for this rundown. Very interesting indeed. I think this "surowy-state" is out of the question. We simply don't have the time (or the experience) to handle all the aspects of finishing a house. Maybe next time.

We are looking for something around Wroclaw. We've seen some nice properties in Długołęka and Oleśnica, but yesterday we fell in love with a kind of (almost finished) B&B annex beergarden in Sobótka.

It's still early days and at the moment we are not in PL, as I am still packing all my stuff. The fact that we are still in the Netherlands makes it difficult because I can't have a look at the property or the surroundings. A house can look great in pictures, but if it turns out there is some car body shop next door, my hope of peace and quiet might be in serious jeopardy.

On the 29th we will drive to Poland so from that moment on, we can seriously start looking for something.

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]

Warszawski gave me the idea to post some more links so people can make an informed choice when wanting to work over here.

We have an association of temporary work agencies (ABU). If you are employed by such an agency, better make sure they are a member of the ABU. The ones who aren't will be either made to become a member and adhere to their statutes or they will be banned from operating in the Netherlands.

Here is something about the ABU in English - abu.nl/abu2/talen.asp?pagkey=98165

Here is something about the ABU in Polish - abu.nl/abu2/talen.asp?pagkey=98183

Here are the leaflets and brochures they have translated into English - abu.nl/abu2/talen.asp?pagkey=98166

And here are the leaflets and brochures they have translated into Polish - abu.nl/abu2/talen.asp?pagkey=98184

Together with my links in post #112 on this page, you should be able to find enough information about what your rights are in the Netherlands and avoid becoming another statistic of someone who is abused by some lousy employer.

Hope it will help.

Real Estate / Stan deweloperski vs stan surowy [developing or undeveloping property state] [36]


That is really valuable advice. Thank you, warszawski. I appreciate it.

Real Estate / Stan deweloperski vs stan surowy [developing or undeveloping property state] [36]


But there is a difference if I need to for example plaster the walls or put in some door or if I need to put a whole heating system in. The first I wouldn't mind, the second wouldn't exactly be on my list of preferences ... .


Ahh, so different developers have different definitions?

Language / Polish was chosen the HARDEST LANGUAGE in the world to learn... :D [1558]


Gumishu, we would say "ik zoek werk". "Arbeid" is old-fashioned and reminds us a little too much of the Second World War ... ;).

But the result will be the same: the partner in your conversation will start blabbering away leaving you completely speechless ... ;)

Polonia / Anyone travelling from Warsaw to New Delhi willing to take some of my belongings (photos)? [30]

123z ... I really suggest you call UPS or TNT or who ever.

I wouldn't even carry someone's jeans in my luggage on an airplane. If I don't know the person that is, of course. There have been cases where for example heroin is washed INTO a jeans. The person who is carrying the thing doesn't notice, but some sweet, cute little cuddly dog on the airport does. It starts scratching its paws on the suitcase and the one whose name is on it, gets a rather nasty interrogation in a small office on the airport by some people who don't seem too happy with the person in question.

Well, that's only the beginning. We can all imagine the outcome.

Polonia / Anyone travelling from Warsaw to New Delhi willing to take some of my belongings (photos)? [30]


Not with the carrier I use. If I book my ticket online and check the checkbox "Yes, I carry luggage for someone else", they don't let me continue with my booking.

Polonia / Anyone travelling from Warsaw to New Delhi willing to take some of my belongings (photos)? [30]


Sweetheart, the chances of anyone being as daft as that (i.e. taking a package belonging to someone else on an airplane) are as good as zero. And so they should be. This sort of "kindness" in the past, has ended people up in jail on drug trafficking charges or even blown up at 40.000 feet.

For your information: it is even illegal to take something with you on board that belongs to someone else.

So I suggest you already plan for a different way to get your package, cause I am sure there won't be anyone on PF who will do you the favour.

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


Just from the point of view of a foreigner: sometimes it gives quite ridiculous results. A couple of months ago I saw some advert in Wroclaw. It said something about James Bond and because it was declinated, it said "Jamesie Bondzie" and if you pronounce it in English (or Dutch) you end up with "Jamesy Bondzy", which doesn't sound macho at all ... ;).

For a foreigner it is really weird to see proper names being declined. It sometimes even gives rise to problems with regard to determining the correct sex of someone. For example, for most of us a name ending in -a means the person is a woman ... in Polish one can be completely wrong-footed ... ;).

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]

May I remind you, Grzegorz, that it is Poles who willingly go and work abroad? You make it sound like "the West" comes over to Poland and snatches people from their homes. Don't make it anymore dramitic than it actually is, will you?

You forgot to mention IKEA by the way. I heard that it celebrated its 50th or 60th birtday a couple of weeks ago. Can I remind you also, that all of these companies employ a lot of Polish people, like LG/Philips in Wroclaw for example. Or Raben transport, to name just another Dutch company. Hey... if you don't like these companies ... then boycot them and buy your stuff at your local Piotr I Pawel or Zabka or any other Polish store.. It's your perogative to do so. But remember that these foreign companies employ thousands of Polish workers as well, also in very well-paid jobs.

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]

Just one last thing.

For those Poles who feel screwed by their Dutch employer or knows people who think they are, there is a leaflet written by the Dutch government.

It tells you what your rights are regarding minimum wage.

Maybe it helps people who are thinking of working over here without running the risk of falling victim to lousy employers.

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]


Sorry it is in Dutch, SeanBM, but I will translate the relevant passages:

ontslag-krijgen.nl/voorwaarden-voor-een-ww-uitkering.html:

1) you have to be insured against unemployment through your employer (which is pretty standard)
2) you have to be unemployed (which is obvious)
3) you have to be immediately available to accept work
4) in de period before your unemployment you have to work at least 26 of the 36 weeks, not necessarily fulltime; even if you have worked only one day in this last 26th week, it counts as a whole week. If you are an artist, filmmaker, musician or support technician (I guess in the art world), you only have to work 16 weeks of the last 36 weeks before you became unemployed.

5) you don't get unemployment benefit if you became unemployed due to a fault of your own (like theft from your employer, fraud, physical violence, or when you handed in the notice yourself).


As I mentioned before, warszawski ... when you want to start your own limited company (BV), you can be the only shareholder. Only in case of a PLC (NV in Dutch) you need at least two shareholders.


Sorry ... I did become a little nasty to you. I am sorry for that.

Thank you warszawski ... I come back to you at the beginning of September to ask you about importing a car from Germany, cause I gather you are quite an expert in that. I'd like to make use of your experience. Take care.

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]

Whatever warszawski, think what you like.

You were wrong on multiple fronts, you know it, but you don't want to accept it.

And you were wrong about this limited company as well, and all the rest for that matter.

Go one and live in your little world full of your preconceived ideas. You have never lived here, know probably one or two Dutch people (if at all), have never had any (long) discussions with them, never studied the country and its society, etc ... etc ... etc ... .

Well done, warszawski. I will let you win the argument. You should be proud of yourself.

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]

Sorry SeanBM, yes I was wrong about BP ... mea culpa!

Geert Wilders is someone who just voices some opinions that really originated after 9/11. Every muslim was a terrorist. He's a populist as there are populists in many different countries. I don't care much about his views, but I do think he should be allowed to say what he thinks, and not be prosecuted because of it.

I don't worry, SeanBM. When people who have never studied a country as such, or have never lived there for a substantial amount of time, start passing moral judgements, the only thing I do is laugh at them. I will try to educate them a little and if they don't accept that, then I will just let them be and hope they will be happy with their delusions.

Narrow-minded people are everywhere I guess. One can only try so much as to try to enlighten them, but if they choose to keep to their unfounded preconceived opinions, then let them be ... . I know better.

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]

Warszawski ... please !!



From 2001 to 2003!!!!!!!! The world has changed!!!

Come on ... how stupid do you think I am. You really think I wouldn't read it?!?!.

Wrong again, warszawski!! :D:D

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]


No, you can set up a limited company with only you as a shareholder. Again ... you are wrong. For a joint stock company you need at least two. Otto Workforce is a limited company (ottoworkforce.eu/nl/over-ons-bedrijf-otto/over-otto/otto-raadv ancommissarissen: "Sinds 2008 kent OTTO Holding BV een Raad van Commissarissen...".

One of the operational directors is Karolina Swoboda, a Pole. So as I said ... a Polish woman exploiting her own countrymen and women.


You yourself said on page 3 of this thread:


I showed you it wasn't. Wrong again. Besides ... you should also remember the time in which this was what you call a hit, namely around the Carnival-period in the south of the Netherlands. Therefore it was a "sing along". Again, warszawski, you know nothing about our society, therefore you should refrain from making moral judgements.

We have the same kind of songs and cabaret about Germans, English, Belgians, French, etc ... etc ... etc ... . This discussion is on the same level as we had on this forum before about people feeling insulted about some television programme. You know how I think about that.


It isn't racist at all ... I didn't know Poles were a race on their own.
I am sure that there is some Polish song or cabaret ridiculing Germans, Russians, or whoever. And that one wasn't banned either. So you are wrong again.


Try to educate yourself who is doing the anti-semitism in the Netherlands and then come back to me again.

News / 2011 Netherlands discuss Polish deportation plan [118]

I am ... look at my discussions with warszawski.

The thing I am hammering on is that if people don't know enough about some topic, they should refrain from passing moral judgements. I don't live in Poland (yet), so I will not give a moral judgement about Polish societal issues.

You and warszawski don't have the full picture what is hapening over here, so I suggest you adopt the same policy. Warszawski claimed this "song" was a hit: it wasn't. He claims that OTTO is in the hands of a Dutch national, but he forgets to mention that his wife is the other shareholder and she is Polish, in #23 he claims we have problems with Russians, which we don't. Or with former yugoslaves, which we don't. He was wrong about the terms of our social welfare system, he didn't know which companies were Dutch multinationals, about long term illness figures, he tries to show with a couple of extreme cases that the whole of the Dutch labour market is unfair and such, and I can go on and on and on.

Do you see me commenting about the Polish welfare system? Or even Polish labour market? No. Because I don't know anything about it. So therefore it is wise for me to shut up and listen. The same goes for you guys when passing moral judgements about things happening over here.

With my limited experience on the Polish labour market I would be inclined to say that it is EASY to find a job. I wrote ONE application letter, I got two interviews, a psychological test, they hired me and the pay is more than good. So when someone says to me that it is difficult to find a job and that the pay is crap, I would be inclined to say (with my EXTREMELY limited experience) that what they say is not true. Instead I know that my experience is limited and probably not representative and I choose to keep quiet.

Only a wise man knows when to shut up ... think about it for a minute.