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POLAND: EASTERN or CENTRAL European country?


Ironside 50 | 10,939
3 Oct 2011 #571
ike some big huge identity crisis.

see fuzz even you can!
FUZZYWICKETS 8 | 1,883
3 Oct 2011 #572
ironside wrote:

see fuzz even you can!

that's it. i honestly can't take it anymore. you honestly make absolutely no sense with every response. it's completely painful reading it.
Ironside 50 | 10,939
3 Oct 2011 #573
gee fuzz ask cricketer:D

Obama - yes we can - fuzz an American -he can too :D

big huge identity crisis.

Bingo, yes I agree with you on that fuzz.
pawian 176 | 14,299
3 Oct 2011 #574
Do you mean that Fuzzywickets is a llama???
Steve Lixandru - | 1
11 Oct 2011 #576
I've read this thread like twice or trice. And yet still many arguments for me are unconvincing.

Have a look:
-Poland has a Western-type culture
-Polish launguage uses Latin script
-Poland has in fact more in common with Germany than with... even Ukraine for instance

The statistics are mercyless. The standard of living in Poland is like 25th in the world, which is a really nice result. When I stand in a random point and look around myself I think: "If this is the poor Eastern Europe, so how the hell the marvellous "Western Europe" looks like ? They live in palaces ??" The wages seem to be low, but only due to fact that the exchange rate between USD or EUR and PLN is high. So if a German gets 2000 euros a month it means more-less the same for a Pole earning 2000 zlotys.

The vast majority of stereotypes are outdated or concerning Polish immigrants... who are often nothing but rednecks (don't say there's no fusty villages in "Western" Europe). I've notice,d that since some time the stereotypical lifestyle of "Polacks" (vulgar word) has been moving to Ukraine (being somewhat a twin of Poland) so to the actual Eastern Europe.

Conclusion: Since the beggining of it's existence in 966 Poland was a Central European country with a temporary Soviet occupation (1945-1989), thus being an Eastern one. Recently it returned to the "First Wolrd" (of the "West) and is now a developped country with a high standard of living. Wealthiness ? Better than moderate. Immigrants ? Don't worry this will end soon. Poland has its own problems with immigrants (Gypsies, Vietnamese, Ukrainians) so states like UK or France shouldn't think Poland is that uniform in terms of nationalities.

Verdict: Central Europe alongside with Czech Republic, Slovakia and Hungary (in the narrowest possible definition). Furthermore Germany, Austria and Slovenia.
Natasa 1 | 580
11 Oct 2011 #577
There is no final and absolute criteria to resolve this vital question :)

This discussion is distasteful.
It is humiliating for Poles, regardless which of the positions is defended, pro or contra - all of the offered options. West, East or Central.

Boycott!
Seanus 15 | 19,706
11 Oct 2011 #578
OK, this goes out to everyone.

Is Cottbus Western Europe? Is Gorzów Eastern Europe? Thanks!
Natasa 1 | 580
11 Oct 2011 #579
Is Cottbus Western Europe? Is Gorzów Eastern Europe?

Just playing a bit Seanus :)...:

Yes, no ....Poland is Western or Central european country
Yes, Yes....Poland is East European country
No, no.....Poland is Central or Western european country
No, yes...Poland is East european country
;)
I'm afraid we have a stalemate. Poland is either:

a) Eastern europe
b) Central
d) Western Europe
e) Poland is not country
f) this is meaningless, my attempts to emphasize the absurdity of the discussion are futile, but the underlying motives of the posters in this thread are pretty transparent and real conclusion can't be drawn.

now, seriously:

Poles who like the bait of the dominant political discourse will insist on arguments that will surely prove Central or Western descriptions, while non Poles (belonging by birth certificate to the dominating part of the world) tend to behave in two distinct manners, those with the need to debase Poles will insist on East, and those who have some family ties will insist on Central. What is the point of the discussion? Or to paraphrase one of the researchers (US, social psychology) on the topic of attitude change who concluded one of his chapters where he presented various experiments that deal with direction and possible methods of change of political attitudes with this words: ' When did you see the last time that discussion (arguments) changed somebody's opinion truly?'

And there are few other posters, those who refuse to use offered categories.
Wroclaw 44 | 5,386
11 Oct 2011 #580
Is Cottbus Western Europe?

west

Gorzów

all the Polish places carrying this name would be in central europe.

as defined by this forum over many long hours.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
11 Oct 2011 #581
But is Cottbus in the West and Gorzów in the East?
Natasa 1 | 580
11 Oct 2011 #582
No, Cottbus is East (Germany), Gorzow is West (Poland) ;)
Wroclaw 44 | 5,386
11 Oct 2011 #583
But is Cottbus in the West and Gorzów in the East?

erm! i said central

cottbus - west

gorzow - central

no matter, if one is spitting distance from the other.
Natasa 1 | 580
11 Oct 2011 #584
I think Seanus wants to say the same thing, it is completely arbitrary categorization.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
11 Oct 2011 #585
And towns bordering with Ukraine, e.g Przemysł and bordering with Lithuania and Belarus?
Wroclaw 44 | 5,386
11 Oct 2011 #586
to my mind anything over the eastern border is 'east'
Seanus 15 | 19,706
11 Oct 2011 #587
So Przemysł is Central Europe and the immediate border town opposite in Ukraine is Eastern Europe?
Wroclaw 44 | 5,386
11 Oct 2011 #588
to my mind, yes.

what is the point u are trying to make ?
Natasa 1 | 580
11 Oct 2011 #589
Yes, Seanus, and according to that same map I am not from Europe. I am uncharted, I don't exist, a phantasm:)
Seanus 15 | 19,706
11 Oct 2011 #590
The point is if classifications exist by country or by specifically drawn lines on a map.
Wroclaw 44 | 5,386
11 Oct 2011 #591
classifications are set in the minds of people according to their age and education.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
11 Oct 2011 #592
That would appear to be subjective and not objective, Wrocław
Wroclaw 44 | 5,386
11 Oct 2011 #593
when learning english and one is not sure... copy what the other person said.

the same when talking about east, central and west.

if u say cottbus is west, that is good enough for me.
KingAthelstan 9 | 142
12 Oct 2011 #594
According to the independent ( the most left wing, liberal, pro immigration ponce rag in the country) you are in Eastern Europe.

Low-skilled workers from Eastern Europe are heading to the UK in their droves to look for work as net migration hit its highest level in more than five years, figures showed today. The number of low-skilled workers, such as some of those in the retail, hospitality and catering sectors, coming from outside the UK has more than doubled in the last nine years.

independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/rise-in-eastern-european-workers-2289345.html

Be not ashamed of where you're from.
Wroclaw 44 | 5,386
12 Oct 2011 #595
Be not ashamed of where you're from.

i'm not.

nor am i ashamed of where i am.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
12 Oct 2011 #596
My point is that people should be clear before labelling.
modafinil - | 418
12 Oct 2011 #597
That would appear to be subjective and not objective, Wrocław

I'll use an example to expand on my post #472 regarding the subjective and contextual use of Central and Eastern:

John says "F'ing East Europeans, nicking our jobs!"
Jane says "Ohh, Central Europe, such exquisite landscapes!"

In these cases I know Poland is included in both terms.

It isn't objective but relational.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
12 Oct 2011 #598
Eastern Europe is definitely more ideological and associated with communism. People mistakenly believe that most Poles chose that system. Ignorance!
KingAthelstan 9 | 142
12 Oct 2011 #599
PS I don't associate eastern Europe with communism anymore ( I think that's what you think people in the West associate Eastern europe with), I associate it with Polish plumbers and barmaids, Romanian gypsies scrounging benefits and selling the big issue, borscht, vodka,more vodka, Eastern Europeans drinking vodka on my town centre park benches, cold grey bleak tower blocks.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
12 Oct 2011 #600
You've just described England very well ;)


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