Oh no no no! You have no new material? Here they are again...The Stalin Jews! That link to that column I have seen pass by for about 500 times by now. Is this the only source there is for....The Stalin Jews! ? Also, everybody knows that there were loads of Jews in Poland. Question is why relationships detoriated since the 1600's. Yes - it's not sth that just came to be in the 20th century, no! It's already 400 years old! So of the 700 years the Jews were in Poland, about 300 years were happy and peacefully with no friction whatsoever. Then sth must've changed as they weren't friends anymore for the biggest part of that time. Under Pilsusdki they were pretty much emancipated again, but after that it was party time again with Endecja and all the fun that happened in the 1940's and after. In the 20th century a new script came into play: the Jewish Communist! This was a new club, mainly alive in the heads of non-Jews, who looked in envy to the better-off individuals of "THEM". Nobody really knows where this myth comes from, but it is assumed that this pamphlet by the White Armies of the Russian Civil War lays at the bottom of it:
It was an invention of the White Anti Communist Propaganda who abused the fact that Leon Trotski was of Jewish descent in order to put a nice new flavour to the war: random killing of Jews. And it happened: tens of thousands of Jews were randomly murdered during the Russian Civil War, as well as with the Polish - Soviet War, which of course was a part of the Russian Civil War. You have to hand it to the propaganda machine of the Whites: they did a very good job; nearly 100 years later ppl still believe their story.
Your referral to Gross' book is proof that he is as neutral as can be - so Neighbours and Fear weren't such lies after all? Or is Gross only a good guy when he writes convenient things?
The elite in Poland has long admitted that the things at stake here were committed by Poles, now only the common man has to admit it and we can go all smilingly through one door. Here's another part from Gross:
An insulting debate was conducted over the semantics of a new monument to replace the old one that held the Nazis responsible for the crime; the inscription that was finally decided upon honors the dead but does not name their murderers, despite complaints from Jewish groups and the Israeli ambassador. The commemoration ceremony was boycotted by almost all of Jedwabne's residents, who posted signs reading "We Do Not Apologize" and "Let the Slanderers Apologize to the Polish Nation." Also not in attendance were any representatives of the Polish church: not the local priest, Edward Orlowski, who had claimed that "what happened in Jedwabne also happened all over Europe," or Cardinal Józef Glemp, who said in a statement that the Jews should apologize for collaborating with the Soviets.
What is really sick minded is when a nation of people have to virtually get on there knees and beg for some kind of forgiveness from Jews especially when that nation gave Jews (who weren't always angels themselves) more relative freedoms and opportunities to develope their families and culture when virtually every other nation was hostile to Jews.
Nobody is asking anybody to go on their knees. Only open admittance that it happened and was perpetrated by Poles. Not by Soviets, Tommy James and the Shondells, Eskimos or alien invaders from the 3rd moon of Jupiter. Only thing you have to do, and what the entire world wants from you, is to say: "yes, it was us. We did it and we are deeply ashamed of it that we have done so." Nobody will kill you for it. Nobody will humiliate you for it. Example: the Dutch have admitted many times that they invented the slave trade of black Africans to the Carribbean, North- and South America. Nobody killed us for admitting that and we're doing pretty well ever since this admittance. But they will keep killing you if you keep blaming others for it. Luckily the group ferociously denying it or blaming on some other group or on the group themselves is getting smaller and smaller. Thank God for progress.
Anyway, I would write more, but I have a report for work to finish tonight and I have to do some other stuff as well. It has been fun for today, come again, all of you. I'd be happy to rebuke all of the myths and other nonsense used to justify the murder of innocent survivors of history's biggest organised killing. But that was the quintessential point of this discussion anyway: Kielce as a precendent as to why the whole world thinks Poles are notorious anti semites. Too bad the example started to lead a life of it's own and that not has been focused on the mechanisms I posted in that respective post.
But feel free to spill some more. It's been very entertaining so far, I'd love to see more of it :)
Well, I guess the best way is to educate people in a calm and not agressive manner.
True, but a good way as well is to use humour :)
Edit 2: Doctor! Doctor! Come quick! Ender is doing it again! He needs his medication!