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Planning to move to Poland - Need Idea about expenses/salary


GD1410    
7 Nov 2016  #1
Hello all

Now this may be the millionth time that it is being asked in this forum..but believe me i have read quite a few posts before posting this :)

I have received an offer of 15260 pln gross for a position in krakow. I tried to calc the net salary using calculla - and it estimates it to be 10700 pln.

I will be coming with my wife and baby (9months).

I plan to live a modest life- not too frugally also not spending too much.

Will it be possible to cover my expenses with 5000pln per month ( everything including rent ,food (mostly Indian), a bit of local sight seeing, baby expenses)

Also how is the weather? What are the typical seasons?.

How is the culture..are foreigners welcomed or being seen as job eaters :) ?

I am from India (smart ones must have inferred already 😊)...so any Indian community around..

The imp q...can veggies survive..
Rales2    
7 Nov 2016  #2
Hello..initially congrats. Which role fetch you that salary?
All mentioned bills can be easily adjusted in 5000zl.
Fyi..
Do note reduction after 8 month onwards.
English medium school/kinder for your kid
OP GD1410    
8 Nov 2016  #3
Thanks for the reply Rales2. Appreciate you and all others who take time out to reply to the numerous queries posted here.

I have got a position as a Data Scientist.

Yes..i did notice the drop in net sal towards the end of the year..not sure what extra taxes/contributions are levied at the end of the year.

Any idea about , availability and prices of Indian food..

I have read here that english medium schools are expensive..
OP GD1410    
8 Nov 2016  #4
Hey guys...any site to book long term rentals flats in krakow poland....in general what to expect and what to take care of while taking a flat on rent..any upfront expenses..such as rent agreement..deposits..maintenance charge etc...
peter_olsztyn 6 | 1,100    
8 Nov 2016  #5
Also how is the weather? What are the typical seasons?.

Winter is coming. It is -1'C today. Cars are frozen. Windscreens are white. They say winter will be harsh this time. I bought a spare battery and keep it in warm in my flat. Jumper cables and windshield de-Icer found and ready for action ;)

How is the culture..are foreigners welcomed or being seen as job eaters :) ?

being seen as pierogi eaters.
OP GD1410    
27 Nov 2016  #6
Hey guys...any site to book long term rentals flats in krakow poland....in general what to expect and what to take care of while taking a flat on rent..any upfront expenses..such as rent agreement..deposits..maintenance charge etc...
DominicB - | 2,639    
  27 Nov 2016  #7
Not really any sites like that. Those that exist would be quite expensive.

Book an apartment for one month and look for an apartment once you are in Poland.

You will absolutely need the assistance of an older, experienced Polish colleague to find an apartment. You won't be able to do it on your own without speaking Polish. All the ads are in Polish,

The older, experienced Polish colleague would know far better than you whether the apartment is in a good location, and whether it is in good shape. They can also haggle to get the right price. They know what to look for. For example, whether transportation and shopping is within easy reach, and whether the windows in the apartment are good. Bad windows can drastically increase your heating bill in winter, and decrease comfort. Make sure the kitchen is adequate, as a small kitchen can be completely useless.

Plan on spending a total of 2000 to 2500 PLN a month for a small no frills 45 to 50 square meter one-bedroom apartment in an average neighborhood PLN for each additional bedroom. That's all inclusive: rent, administration fees and utilities except TV/phone/internet. You can easily double that if you expect more comfort, especially in Warsaw.

Can you keep expenses down to 5000 PLN a month for a family of three? No way. You forget an important expense: the cost of relocating to and back from Poland for three people and of getting your residence permits. Divide the total cost by 12 and deduct that from your monthly earnings.

Also, you are going to have to pay to keep your wife from going crazy. She will be alone with a baby in a small apartment with nobody to talk to. There are essentially no other Indian women for her to associate with, or every, very few indeed. There is no Indian community in Poland to speak of, and most of the Indians in Poland are transient single males who stay a year or two and then either move on or move back. Especially during the winter, your wife might go a bit stir crazy as it will be a chore to leave the apartment.

It will cost you to cook and eat Indian food. You will find the selection of fruits and vegetables in the stores very limited and of poorer quality than you are used to. You will have to special order ingredients such as spices. It would be best if you could adapt as much as you can to local eating customs using locally available ingredients, including produce in season: potatoes, noodles, cabbage, carrots, onions, pork, chicken and bland fish.

Lamb is hard to get and expensive. Warning: you use as much spice in one meal as the average Pole does in a year, or even a lifetime. Polish food is very, very bland, and the only spice used is black pepper. Not that it's bad. It can be quite good, in it's way. But definitely a far cry from the spicy diet you are used to.

Eating at home can be cheap if you can adapt. Meals, snacks and beverages outside the home are not cheap, though.

Clothing is particularly expensive in Poland, especially baby clothes and accessories. You will have to outfit your family with warm clothes for the winter, including good shoes that can stand up to the snow and slush. Late winter/early spring can be a bit messy as the snow starts to melt and there is slush everywhere.

Overall, you could do it on 6000 to 7000 PLN a month. Don't count on saving more that about 3000 PLN a month, and nothing at all or less if your wife insists on going back to India to visit. You really have to pay attention to her mental health, and make sure she has enough entertainment and diversion to keep her from going off the edge.
OP GD1410    
1 Dec 2016  #8
Thanks DominicB!!

That was quite a reply !!...but very insightful!!

I will be getting a relocation amount along with my first salary which would cover my flights to poland and first month's rent.

The only caveat is ..my employer is not providing any accomodation as such...that i have to manage upfront.

The winter will be a big worry though!! Need to adapt to that.

I am also planning to roam around so that will keep my wife sane!!

All in all...if i can manage my expenses within 5000 pln...then its worth coming...else no monetary benifit and no savings
jon357 64 | 14,254    
1 Dec 2016  #9
I think it's worth doing, an dthe package sounds ok for Poland. You should be well aware (check the search function if you have any doubts) that DominicB only really comes here to try and put people off coming to Poland - long cut and paste posts saying much the same thing.

5000zl will certainly cover your expenses (I guess we spend about that here in Warsaw) and the salary is good - you will be able to save money with that and it's worth mentioning that it's more than three times the average for Kraków.
tellthetruth    
1 Dec 2016  #10
GD1410, as far as Indian food is concerned there is an abundance of places to buy spices and ghee, also all types of exotic vegetables. I don't believe that will be a problem for you. The point raised about your wife is an interesting one, I am sure your wife may find a number of Polish female students of hindi, who would be willing to spend time to show her around in exchange for language lessons. Maybe contact the Jagalonian hindu department or any other language departments teaching Hindi. Your wife could also give cooking lessons to wealthy Poles or expats there is quite a large community of expats in Krakow especially Brits and Irish both nations enjoy Indian food very much. Just to give you an update there are currently in excess of 50 Indian restaurants in Warszawa, the last time I was in Krakow I was hard pressed to find good Indian food in comparison to Waw. Namaste India: Restauracja Indyjska Warszawa also sells spices, the main Indian importer I believe is CPT - Little India 'littleindia.pl/lang/en' so once you speak with other Indians in Warsaw, I am sure you will find the Indian community in Krakow. A rent of 2,000 -2,500 zlotys is not going to give you a lot so if your company will pay for month one, my suggestion would be to ask them to find you the apartment for one month, you can then search around and find your own place when you arrive. Children's clothes are very expensive in Poland. You will also need a good supply of medicine while your bodies/ immunity acclimatises to new viruses in Poland. Hope all goes well and you enjoy at least the little one will have a snowy experience this winter as its going to be a cold one.
DominicB - | 2,639    
1 Dec 2016  #11
my employer is not providing any accomodation as such...that i have to manage upfront.

That will be a problem. Try Airbnb, but expect to pay a large premium. Like double.

A rent of 2,000 -2,500 zlotys is not going to give you a lot

Once you settle in, and you find an experienced older Pole to help you, you will be able to find an apartment in this price range. However, it will be a very basic, small one-bedroom apartment. If you're planning on keeping costs below 5000 PLN a month, you won't be able to afford anything larger or more comfortable.

Likewise, a car is out of the question if you are on that budget. You will have to take public transport, which is not a problem in Kraków.

Children's clothes are very expensive in Poland.

Anything having to do with children is very expensive in Poland. Make sure to bring as much baby supplies as you can with you.

People will tell you this is a good wage for Poland, and it is.... for Poland. However, wages in Poland are very low. People will tell you also that you are making a lot more than the average Pole. That doesn't mean anything because you are not an "average Pole", and share nothing in common with them, just as you share little in common with the "average Indian". People will also tell you that the cost of living is low, bit it's quite high in relation to prevailing wages. For a foreign worker, the only financial figure that matters is savings potential. Your wages, prevailing wages and cost of living do not matter except in relation to savings potential, which is very low in Poland. Poland is a very poor choice for those for whom savings is a major priority.

You are being hired at very low wages compared to the richer countries of Western Europe and the English speaking countries. Somewhere between a half to a quarter of what you could make there. $43000 USD is less than a starting engineer makes in those countries. Your savings potential would be several times higher in those countries than in Poland, in spite of the higher cost of living.

If you were able to find this job in Poland, it is a pretty sure bet that you will be able to find a much better job in a richer country, and be able to save significantly more a year. Remember that the best jobs are advertised solely by word of mouth, and NEVER on the internet or through recruiters, so exploit your network of real life contacts, especially ones who work or have worked in richer countries.

If you are viewing this job as a way to get your foot in the back door of the EU, you're wasting your time. Someone with your qualifications can walk through the front door. Going in through the back door isn't going to help you any. I suggest you explore better opportunities in richer countries, relying on your real-life contacts.
Nextstopforme.    
3 Dec 2016  #12
GD1410, are you also being offered free healthcare, the Polish system is not really the best for foreigners.
OP GD1410    
5 Dec 2016  #13
My employer will give a medical Insurance...( free for me and very small premium for my family..~100pln permonth)..they are also giving a multisports card..donno of what use that is ..they said with this..i can avail sports/gym facilities on discount..

Some of the points raised above are really interesting...

I agree with Dominic that as compared to US and other european counties the pay in Poland is not great...but then its also cheap to live in poland I believe..which compensates to an extent...

Also...getting a visa is becoming increasingly difficult now...especially for US...

For me..the main motivating factor to come down to Poland is the opportunity to move into a field which is promising and would add great value to my CV..even an experience of a couple of years would be gr8 for my carrier..

Also...its an internal company transfer for me ( although a permanent one)..but there is a chance that i can return to my base location ..i.e.India...in case the company set's up a new team here...
OP GD1410    
5 Dec 2016  #14
Just to add..

My office will be in krakow business park...what should be my target area to rent an apartment so that i don't have to travel much (not more than 30 mins)...Also will the rent fit into my budget of 2500-3000pln ...including everything..
DominicB - | 2,639    
5 Dec 2016  #15
@GD1410

You said that this is an internal transfer. Are there other Indians working at the location you will be working that you can contact? Or anyone who speaks English in the company that can help you find an apartment before you come?
OP GD1410    
6 Dec 2016  #16
Well...the HR...said he will find out if there is anyone relocated from India to krakow...he said he will share the contact .....but it's better that I also do my research and try to get any connections from my network.

And Yes...the posts in this site also are really helpful.


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