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School meals in Poland


Atch 16 | 3,204
6 Jun 2020 #31
Sorry Atch but I would shoot myself in the head if that was how my school meals looked like.

Why?

-how can you not add sugar or salt for the kid!!!

Plenty of things are naturally sweet and don't need added sugar and salt is an absolute killer. It leads to high blood pressure and deposits on the arteries. It's also not needed for flavour and it's extremely damaging to the health of your heart in the long run. Studies have shown that very young children whose diet is high in salt already have elevated blood pressure. It has been shown that blood pressure in children follows a tracking pattern that continues into the third and fourth decades of life.

And that's why you need to watch a child's salt intake.
Chemikiem 7 | 2,480
6 Jun 2020 #32
asked about schools in the UK as I remember watching a Jamie Oliver show

To be honest I don't personally feel that much has changed. In 2015 new school food standards were introduced. For example, one or more portions of veg or salad must be offered as an accompaniment each day, more emphasis on making water the drink of choice. etc. Here are some links:

bbc.co.uk/news/education-30644523
foodforlife.org.uk/schools/benefits/school-food-standards
schoolfoodplan.com/actions/school-food-standards/
schoolfoodplan.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Checklist-for-school-lunches-140616.pdf

In my opinion UK meals are still too high in fat and sugar, although there is far less salt than in the Polish school meal menu, and more vegetables on offer. The problem here is that although healthier options are available,many students will still go for the less healthy choices, battered fish and chips, sausage and chips etc. At break times it's easy for students to grab pizza slices or sausage rolls too.

Not all schools have meals supplied by catering companies either, many schools cook the meals on the premises. To be honest, I don't much like the idea of pre-prepared food which has been hanging about.

The problem in the UK is that it has now become cheaper to eat crap food, burgers, chicken nuggets etc than it is to eat healthily. Plus eating out at fast food places is the norm rather than a an occasional treat.I think this is reflected in what students decide to eat at lunch times.

I'm not sure why we're educating kids to expect dessert after meal

It was no different when I was at school, but I agree with what you say. When I was growing up we had dessert on a Sunday and that was it. However, for some students that school dinner might be the only decent meal they get. More than likely that thought was in mind when school dinners were first introduced.
johnny reb 28 | 4,577
6 Jun 2020 #33
And that's why you need to watch a child's salt intake.

Sugar is much worse than salt for you.

for some students that school dinner might be the only decent meal they get.

Very true in America also.
Miloslaw 8 | 2,425
6 Jun 2020 #34
However, for some students that school dinner might be the only decent meal they get. More t

And this is the crux of the problem.
And as Kaprys and others have said, the "western" idea of "snacking" is a huge problem too.
It is better for the kids to have filling and fullfilling meals.
Atch's moronic idea of a "Vegetarian Day", would result in kids not eating that mush.... so they would either starve or eat junk....
mafketis 24 | 8,890
6 Jun 2020 #35
moronic idea of a "Vegetarian Day"

Not completely moronic, but the best place to start is non-mammal non-bird meat Fridays (in line with Catholic tradition). Sometimes that will be fish and sometimes something else.

The main thing is not to preach or talk down to kids (who have finely tuned b-s detectors) and not to forbid things. I remember back when I was in jr high they came up with an idea to outlaw candy on campus and the main effect was to create a large black market....

Of course kids aren't great judges of what to eat (since like all people they're hardwired to like sugar and fats and salt) but trying to cram unappealing 'healthy' foods down their gullets isn't a promising option.
Miloslaw 8 | 2,425
6 Jun 2020 #36
Not completely moronic

Yes, completely moronic because tbe kids will not eat it.

Sometimes that will be fish

Atch said Veggie.... so no fish allowed...
In the UK you may be able to get away with a veggie day by making it a spicey indian dish, but that won't work in Poland..

And anyway, spicey deep fried Indian food may be very nice but it is less healthy than a "Full English".
kaprys 3 | 2,502
7 Jun 2020 #37
There's actually one more issue. If a kid doesn't like the food, they won't eat it.
Some kids are too used to junk food and snacks.
So no matter how healthy the menu is, if they don't like it, they won't eat it.
And they won't feel hungry if they feed on snacks.
mafketis 24 | 8,890
7 Jun 2020 #38
completely moronic because tbe kids will not eat it.

They're much more likely to eat it if they're not preached at. Even in the PRL institutional food did not usually include meat on Friday (and IIRC least one other day though there wasn't a schedule as far as I know).

In the early 90s I often ate a student stołówka and the food was still pretty good quality (potatoes that were identifiable as potatoes and not reconstituted potato flakes) vegetables from the farm and not cans, etc. I remember thinks like fish dishes, egg dishes and the like on Fridays...it's possible to make non-meat based meals that kids will like but if you accompany it with a bunch of talking points they'll tune you out...

Also, IIRC the very first meal I ever had in Poland was non-meat some kind of dumpling and sauerkraut (there may have been small bits of boczek as flavoring but it wasn't a meat portion). Very delicious (if you like cooked sauerkraut which not everybody does).
Atch 16 | 3,204
7 Jun 2020 #39
unappealing 'healthy' foods

Why is healthy food unappealing? A nice dish of pasta with salt-free tomato sauce, served with chicken breast and a crispy salad is healty and tasty. And there's nothing wrong with having chips/fries once a week for example. Grilled salmon with fries and a veggie. If you add fresh veggies to any dish it helps to neutralize the fatty or salty elements.

Here's a menu from the British School in Warsaw, no dessert course and no sugary drinks but a reasonable balance of generally healthy, yet appealing foods.

img.nordangliaeducation.com/resources/europe/_filecache/0a3/ed5/60877-tbs-l-menu2020-06-01eng-1-1.pdf?_ga=2.239402947.1952210190.1591463021-1468808489.1591463021
mafketis 24 | 8,890
7 Jun 2020 #40
A nice dish of pasta with salt-free tomato sauce

Only works if you boil the pasta with a crap ton of salt though you need something to cut the acidity of the tomatoes....

chicken breast is the most boring meat in the world so you need to spice that mother up somehow... and of course you'll enrage any Italians who witness the atrocity of pasta with a chunk of chicken plopped on top of it...

f generally healthy, yet appealing foods.

Wha'ts the difference between the regular and "Bio" sets? why are there vegetarian options every single day? I wonder what the proportions are (regular vs vegetarian vs bio) either they're wasting a lot of food or overcharging

And who's allergic to wheat? Or is this for the fashionably pseudo-celiac crowd?
Atch 16 | 3,204
7 Jun 2020 #41
you need to spice that mother up somehow.

Great way to introduce kids to spices :)) which, coincidentally are very beneficial to health.

you need something to cut the acidity of the tomatoes....

Add some grated carrot and it counteracts the acidity. It simmers down to nothing and blends into the sauce, sweetening it naturally.

Come on now Maf, you're just being awkward on purpose. There's nothing wrong with the basic British School menu.

What would you consider to be a suitable family meal? What would you eat yourself?

they're wasting a lot of food

I would imagine you have to 'order ahead' as we did with the school lunches in Ireland.
OP delphiandomine 88 | 18,475
7 Jun 2020 #42
it's possible to make non-meat based meals that kids will like but if you accompany it with a bunch of talking points

Yes, I agree with this. Did you read the link that Lenka posted? It's about making the food visually attractive, something that really doesn't take that much effort. I don't think there's a need to preach or anything, it's enough to just serve up something that looks great.

I'm posting some more pictures, just for discussion. I also found this: sp34kat.pl/obiady.php# - which contains examples of meals served to kids in some school. For me, it's frightening as to how much fried food they're being served, as well as just how little vegetables there are. Atch will have a heart attack when she looks at this link ;)

but that won't work in Poland

I think this is part of the issue - many people simply don't know how to create decent veggie food. I've been experimenting a lot with tofu recently, and I've discovered one fantastic recipe involving baked tofu - if you didn't know what you were looking at, you'd think it was baked chicken nuggets. The taste is a bit specific, but if you make tomato sauce from real tomatoes, it goes perfectly with it, and I dare say kids would eat it.
mafketis 24 | 8,890
7 Jun 2020 #43
For me, it's frightening as to how much fried food they're being served

You scare easy, kids need fat (the brain is an expensive organ that needs fat to operate properly people who cut too much fat from their diet tend to suffer from 'brain fog'). They're not fashion models and if they can be kept from rampant junkfood snacking fatty meals in school will do more good than harm.

The only two that I wouldn't eat of that list was the pasta with 'boloński' sauce that looked like dog vomit and the strawberry pierogi (and that's mostly because I've never gotten my head around sweet main courses, I really don't get it the same way I've never gotten the idea of fruit soup before a savory main course... what?????).

many people simply don't know how to create decent veggie food

I remember when it was as much as your life was worth to find fresh vegetables for about half the year... you remember the song "addio pomidore" don't you? Europe in general has only recently (comparatively speaking) started sending fresh vegetables across the continent.

I also don't like mock meat - I love tofu done right but not when it's masquerading as chicken white meat... blech ) I used to make pretty good tofu burgers but I wasn't trying to make it seem like meat it was a carrier for the other ingredients.

Not long before coming to Poland there was a great falafel place close to where I lived and one of my favorite meals was freshly made hummus tahini with freshly made pita - heaven. My normie co-workers were freaked out and wouldn't even sample it which I didn't understand.
Miloslaw 8 | 2,425
7 Jun 2020 #44
If a kid doesn't like the food, they won't eat it

Exactly.

They're much more likely to eat it if they're not preached at

Also true.

Why is healthy food unappealing?

Because it often is.... as Maf said, Chicken breast may be healthy, but it is boring, tasteless and dull, unless
you add plenty of herbs and spices, but even then, other cuts with those same herbs and spices taste better.

chicken breast is the most boring meat in the world so you need to spice that mother up

Couldn't agree more.

A nice dish of pasta with salt-free tomato sauce

Sorry, but that is not appealing to me at all....

Great way to introduce kids to spices :)) which, coincidentally are very beneficial to health

Agreed 100% but that may be difficult in Poland.

Add some grated carrot and it counteracts the acidity.

This is true and something we do all tbe time.

You scare easy, kids need fat

The best comment in this thread Maf!
Lenka 3 | 2,354
8 Jun 2020 #45
People in different countries have different tastes....

Oh, of course. Even more than just taste. I don't see many parents paying for lunch that is basically a sandwich. Polish lunch in school has to be a warm meal. A sandwich is a second breakfast and prepared by parents.

But I meant something else.

And then the idiot wanted to give the kids sugar so they could do it themselves!

Oh I wouldn't oppose to sugar being available to the kids that are big enough to add it themselves. Many people won't stomach unsweetened tea or coffee. I meant babies diet. Still many people would sweeten their drink!

Why?

Because it's boring and even worse- awfully repetitive.
And if you want to go deeper- as you say school is not only about knowledge. This menu is so basic it hurts. How about introducing kids to different tastes? Where are vegetables like asparagus, courgette etc. Maybe some mushroom gravy?

trying to cram unappealing 'healthy' foods down their gullets isn't a promising option.

Yes and no. Healthy doesn't have to be unappetizing and you can change eating habits by introducing different stuff but it can't be done at once and definitely not in the fashion of an order.

- I love tofu done right but not when it's masquerading as chicken white meat... blech )

That is a funny paradox. Instead of saying 'This is lovely vegetarian dish' it say ' we can try to make meatless meals taste ALMOST like meat ones... As if they tried to convince themselves.
Atch 16 | 3,204
8 Jun 2020 #46
I don't see many parents paying for lunch that is basically a sandwich.

The lunches are provided free of charge. There's nothing wrong with them. Sandwiches, milk and fruit is a healthy, acceptable lunch for a young child. And I've seen the children eating them quite happily.

Where are vegetables like asparagus, courgette etc.

Where are they on the Polish school menu? The lunches I linked to are for those primary schools designated as 'disadvantaged' so getting the kids eating veggies of any kind is great. If the lunches weren't provided about half the kids would come to school with no lunch at all or with a bag of doughnuts. I once asked a little guy if he'd had breakfast "Oh yes, teacher" he responded "I had a Penguin bar and a glass of water."



johnny reb 28 | 4,577
8 Jun 2020 #47
"I had a Penguin bar and a glass of water."

Which supports my saying, "If ya can't feed them, don't breed them".
jon357 66 | 16,190
8 Jun 2020 #48
A sandwich is a second breakfast and prepared by parents

It's the kids who don't get that, or even a first breakfast (plenty of kids in Poland don't), that need to be fed.

Because it's boring and even worse- awfully repetitive.

That's school dinners. They're always on a tight
johnny reb 28 | 4,577
9 Jun 2020 #49
I once asked a little guy if he'd had breakfast

So what the hell is wrong with his lazy ass mother that she couldn't fry him some potato's and onions sprinkled with some cheese ?

Or fry him and egg with some toast ?
There is no excuse for such child abuse ......NONE !
For the price of a bottle of vodka and a pack of smokes you could feed a kid spaghetti all week.

How about introducing kids to different tastes? Maybe some mushroom gravy?

Exactly Lenka and send the recipe home to Mom.
Mushroom gravy over some potato's or rice or even a slice of bread for starters.
There is no excuse besides ignorance and neglect.
jon357 66 | 16,190
9 Jun 2020 #50
here is no excuse for such child abuse ......NONE !

That is not however an excuse for not providing school dinners. A child needs food and a good education regardless of how poor the parenting is.

Otherwise the vicious circle never breaks.
johnny reb 28 | 4,577
9 Jun 2020 #51
a good education regardless of how poor the parenting is.

Parents are apart of a child's education.
If a parent refuses to responsibly feed their children properly then have them arrested for neglect.
Once the kid walks into to school they become the schools responsibility and if the school doesn't want to feed them properly shut the damn school down.

Like I said, kids love spaghetti and you can make a truck load of it for $20 so what's the problem.
kaprys 3 | 2,502
9 Jun 2020 #52
@Atch
But kids in Polish schools are given milk/yoghurt or fruit /veggies free of charge, too.
Some eat them, some don't.
Milk is tricky as some would claim that only calves should drink cow's milk. Others don't digest lactose etc.
jon357 66 | 16,190
9 Jun 2020 #53
Parents are apart of a child's education.

In your ideal and nonexistent world, yes. In the real world, not parents live up to that ideal. Hence good, and where necessary free, school dinners.

If a parent refuses to responsibly feed their children properly then have them arrested for neglect

The prisons would be full and the kids' homes would be bursting to the seams. And families struggling t o cope with life would be penalised and . Rather than helped to cope.

Once.the kid.walks.into.to school they become the schools responsibility

In the U.K., all kids are the local authority's responsibility anyway, hence social services, educational guidance etc..

Of course if a school has to feed kids (as they should), then they need to be very well funded.
Miloslaw 8 | 2,425
9 Jun 2020 #54
@johnny reb
@jon357
I totally get where both of you are coming from.
Jim is right, parents need to be more responsible.
Jon is right, if parents are not responsible then what is the point in prosecuting everyone?
Because then everyone, including the kids, suffer.
The answer lies in catching this stuff early, education and the threat of penalties on parents if they don't respect their responsibilities.
I agree with Jim, if adults are not capable or interested in raising their kids properly, then they should not have them.
johnny reb 28 | 4,577
9 Jun 2020 #55
In your ideal and nonexistent world, yes. In the real world, not parents live up to that ideal.

Then they end up in family court here in the U.S. in my ideal existent world.
And you Brits wonder why we have so many people incarcerated in the U.S.
Because we hold people accountable for crimes like not feeding their kids and letting them run without guidance.

Of course if a school has to feed kids (as they should), then they need to be very well funded.

Not really as feeding kids foods like spaghetti, goulash, baked beans with hotdogs, coleslaw ect. that kids like are quite cheap.

Jim is right,

James to you Coldslaw.
jon357 66 | 16,190
9 Jun 2020 #56
And you Brits wonder why we have so many people incarcerated in the U.S.

Everybody wonders that.

In most places, the ideal is to support families that are struggling to cope, help them to manage life better. Not incarcerate people for poor parenting skills and split families up.

Not really as feeding kids foods like spaghetti, goulash, baked beans with hotdogs, coleslaw ect.

If it was that cheap, schools wouldn't be short of money. The costs, especially in a district with high population density and high povert6 levels, quickly mount up.
johnny reb 28 | 4,577
9 Jun 2020 #57
In most places, the ideal is to support families that are struggling to cope, help them to manage life better

We do here in the U.S.A. jon and it is called the Foodstamp program and the Manna Project not to mention the churches food pantry's full of free food.

No one goes hungry here in the U.S.A.

If it was that cheap, schools wouldn't be short of money.

Naw, Socialism is just catching up with ya'll and you are starting to find out that free education isn't so free.
Priorities jon.

The costs, especially in a district with high population density and high povert6 levels, quickly mount up.

Understandably as we know how the E.U. is economically in dire straights as the economy keeps getting worse there.
Socialism works great until the other guys money runs out jon and it sounds like the other guys money is running out.
jon357 66 | 16,190
9 Jun 2020 #58
the churches food pantry's full of free food.

We tend to do it more carefully over here in Poland. Hence a good school meal service rather than charity.

free education isn't so free

It is here.

the E.U. is economically in dire straights as the economy keeps getting worse there.

The economy's doing quite well here, COVID aside.
johnny reb 28 | 4,577
10 Jun 2020 #59
or even a first breakfast (plenty of kids in Poland don't), that need to be fed.

Now wait, you can't have it both ways jon, first you say how some children are being denied food and then in your next breath you say what a good meal service the schools have.

You are starting to find out that free education isn't so free.

It is here.

families that are struggling to cope - If it was that cheap, schools wouldn't be short of money.

How can schools be short of money if they are free ?
AGAIN jon, as I have told you, you can't have it both ways.
The E.U. economy is doing quite well you say.......compared to who, Venezuela ?
Now please just stay on topic and quit trying to confuse the issue.
jon357 66 | 16,190
10 Jun 2020 #60
More of your usual nonsense.

free education isn't so free.

It's free. Society can well afford to educate every child well, and to provide decentt, nourishing meals at school. Meals that compare well with what any child, regardless of background, gets at home.

The E.U. economy is doing quite well

Do pay attention; we're talking about Poland. Which provides decent school meals to its kids. Education is free too.


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