Presidential elections 2020 - your opinions about campaign, candidates

And lost him more... including that crucial "Don't want to be stuck in the 19th century" demographic...


And PiS keeps on diggin'

wiadomosci.onet.pl/kraj/wybory-2020-przemyslaw-czarnek-o-lgbt-oni-nie-sa-rowni-normalnym-ludziom/9vd252v

Money quote (from a PiS posel and part of Duda's campaign staff)

"Skończmy słuchać tych idiotyzmów o jakichś prawach człowieka, czy jakiejś równości. Ci ludzie nie są równi ludziom normalnym"

"Let's stop listening to that foolishness about supposed human rights or equality. Those people aren't equal to normal people."

Now Duda gets to own that or tries to walk it back.... neither choice is going to help his chances.... (except among self-exiled and/or plastic Poles who claim to not support PiS)

Be serious, perverts would have never voted for Duda , whatever he might be saying.
At least he has the guts a spade a spade, not a gardening tool.

Well it probably achieved one thing - we are talking about that and not about their pathetic economic response to the pandemic. Where PiS will need to shore up its support is not in the villages but in the new housing on the edges of cities - they did well there in 2015, even among voters in their 20s and 30s. And they won't win more votes there by obsessing about gays.

they're awful at doing anything that requires expertise because they priortize party loyalty over anything else (just like in the PRL, PiS = neo-PRL)

They've left most people high and dry and _still_ have no real economic vision for lessening the devastation wrought by the pandemic they're big mouth useless phonies...

PiS doesn't understand how this effects Poland internationally. Any family with a member who is LGBTQ isn't going to be coming to Poland to spend their money now. That's how people respond to this kind of thing today. I am not pro LGBTQ or anti. I simply don't care about them either way, and most people are the same. People who obsess over this may have something they are hiding themselves. Who really cares who does what in their own home. Gays have been around since the down of time, its not going away. Just a joke of a campaign platform.

Now lets see how those unemployment numbers look when they start leaking out in a few days. An 11% increase in the last three months will show anyone with half a brain that PiS cant manage a crisis, and they sure cant manage a country.

I wonder if PiS have their suits designed by Hugo Boss too. Anyone know?

Good riddance. I don't want their moneys.

That's such a funny argument on so many levels...LGBT movements really think that the world revolve around them and their sexual preferences.

Like I said before: I've got nothing against homosexuals who keep their sexual life to themselves. I'm against militant LGBT ideologists who seek an affirmation of all sort of sexual deviations in a public space. Political LGBT movements are a cancer on a society.

By this point, it is really down to the silent citizen. How many of these people are there compared to every twitter/facebook/etc loudmouth, workplace woke enforcer, and hard left media pundit or celeb? It could be honestly be 10 to 1, or even 100 to 1.

The "shock" of Brexit and Trump showed exactly this phenomenon. It was so mindblowing to the left because they can't comprehend how anyone can disagree with them.

@kondzior
You may not, but a lot of other tourism realted business not only want it, but need it more than ever now.

@Spike31
I agree with you. The militant marches are a joke. So why give more fuel to them with this stupid posturing? Leave them alone. Stop recognizing there is even a movement. Let people who live together have some rights to medical information and inheritance regardless of where they are same sex or not and move along. Couple who are opposite sex have no rights either unless they are married, and that is simply stupid too.

Poland looks absolutely stupid on the world stage. Doesn't anyone care about how the country is perceived by other intelligent people? By foreign investors? By the people with real money? Poland needs money. Not to alienate people who have it.

The fact that Duda took over the initiative and moved the political debate to a field very convenient for him - and very unconvenient for Trzaskowski - that is LGBT will give him a major boost 2 weeks before the elections.


To me it looks more like "how it is perceived by so called liberal left media outfits in the Western world". Truly intelligent people have opinions of their own

Oh please, he couldn't take over the initiative of falling off a bridge, he was told to go in this direction to distract attention from the awful performance of PiS.

Let's talk about those tarcze.... and everything PiS is doing for small businesses....

Let's talk about how they saved Pride of Poland from millions of zloties of profits and international respect....

@Spike31
He is preaching to his own choir. No boost will come. When the employment and economic numbers start coming out PiS should be done. This topic will last about 5 minutes in the debates. Duda will look like a complete incompetent when pressed on the economy.

The government should do nothing for small Polish business except for not interfering and for lowering taxes. It's not "tarcza" which was the issue but a moronic "quarantine measures" which have stopped the economy for almost 2 months.

And the fact that equally moronic measures were undertaken by the most of the Western World (except for Sweden, kudos to them) is not an excuse. We had a chance to act smarter but it was wasted by morons like Szumowski.

Then it should do nothing for large state owned enterprises too (or education or healthcare).


The problem wasn't the lockdown (which probably did a lot to slow the spread and save lives) but that once it's started it's going to be hard to stop. It shouldn't have been started without a clear exit plan.

This is the old rule of any bureaucracy - it's always about 10 times easier to start something than to undo something.

@Spike31
Your business education is from where? If not for small business Poland is still a third world former Soviet economy and in the same condition as Ukraine. Three month, not two, and it will take another 18 months before recovery actually begins. Unemployment will be someplace in the 15 to 20% range when the numbers come out. Something not seen since the Russians left.

This is what PiS, and yes the rest of the world, did to the economy. Its why Trump and others wont likely be re-elected. Szumowski is just another PiS crooked politician caught with his hand in the cookie jar time after time.

Intelligent people, whether they are left or right, pay attention to what others think. No one wants to stand next to an idiot. People who do are also perceived as idiots. Idiots don't get strong business partners, and left or right, if you have money, you want to associate it with people who are smart. Trump doesnt care if someone is a Democrat if they are buying property from him, and he doesnt care if its a Democrat who gets small business money because he knows without small business, economies collapse. Duda and PiS dont even understand the simplest economic principals.

Yes, moving towards private education system and health system would be beneficial. This cannot be done instantly but having more private innitiative in those fields is better than less. I, for example, have bought a private medical insurance for my parents in Poland which is far superior than state care.

Changes should be applied gradually but firmly. Obviously, a key industries should be controlled by a private Polish capital - money has nationality. Just like the key industrial players in the US are controlled by the US citizens.

It's going to be a long process and it needs to be powered by a younger generation with better understending on how the economy works. Konfederacja is the only major political party which has plan for it (read their political programme).

It is not something that PiS and Duda would do. I will vote for Duda in 2nd round (unless K. Bosak make it to the 2nd round) for a sole reason that he will proceed with decomunisation of judicial system and he will halt the spread of cultural marxism in forms of militant LGBT. Trzaskowski would be a real disaster for Poland.

By appointing more communist prosecutors to the supreme court?


how? especially since extreme anti-gay rhetoric tends to highly correlate with crappy economies....

I agree that PiS went too far with their LGBT rhetoric, however I don't see it as a disaster for Poland internationally. Like the boy who cried wolf the western media has already blown their wad that Poland is Evil Catholic nation hating Gays. Yes there has been coverage about Duda claiming LGBT is worse than communism (which is very disrespectfull to the victims of Commies) but just as much about Poland invading Czechia. The PiS electoral AI computer must have calculated that this was an effective electoral strategy, i don't agree but lets see how it plays out. If Duda loses to Czaszkowski because of this, i will happily say fair play PiS ****** up.

Tourism is degenerate activity and should be banned. Especially during the coronavirus crisis.

how Soviet of you....

This is what my staunch conservative catholic friend posted today. Possibly as a response to PiS rhetoric.

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Have you heard about election that pay attention to stuff like that? He is fighting for voters for their support. You mean that in the USA they run elections thinking about international minorities?


WTF? are you talking about? there is no LGBTQ people. That is a factual and logical nonsense. There some homosexual and unless there ideologically brainwasher or plain stupid I doubt it would affect their plans.


Dude seems to me you have no clue what it is all about. stop it, you embarrass yourself.


The best and biggest money are to be made internally by developing and upgrading economy. Once that is achieved international respect will follow regardless l of some neo-Marxist ideologies and opinion of it fanatics'.

And the big infrastucture investments of PiS sound a lot more credible than nothing from PO, just yapping about the Kanal and that we don't need CPK because it will be biggest airport in the world and Berlin has one . LOL. PO has literally no idea with what to do with the EU stimulus money apart from hospitals and 'job security' They want Poland to remain weak and a vassal of Germany.

@Ironside
Clearly you have no clue how important foreign policy is and how other countries use it to determine trade deals. You have no clue and follow antiquated principals proven not to help anyone advance society. Duda is so stupid to think that this ranting to the same people who will support him anyway will win new voters? Undecided voters dont give a damn about the anti gay or other movements. They care about their finances and how the rest of the world views Poland. But hey while PiS is at it maybe they should talk about some priests? You know because so much of their activity was simply a mistake right? Or it didnt happen? Oh wait, it did and Rome admitted it. The obsession with gays is really telling.

@kondzior
You're funny. Degenerate activity? Maybe education is a degenerate activity too? Perhaps we should all grab a hammer and sickle get down into the coal mines and out into the fields? Clearly this was a successful economic and societal plan that worked so well. Maybe everyone just needs to go back to eating kapusta, potatoes, and smoked meats? Who needs dishwashers, clothes washers, cable TV and internet?

You cant live in the modern world with a stone age mentality. Eventually people who try this end up left behind.

Something that the neo-PRL nomenkklatura of PiS is completely incapable of, witness what they did to Pride of Poland (a microcosm of everything wrong with them).


Maybe to 10 year old boys, they seem more like corruptions sinks for party cronies to cash in rather than anything that's actually needed.

Latest poll:

Duda: 40.7%
Trzaskowski: 28%
Kosiniak-Kamysz: 9.7%
Hołownia: 7.8%
Bosak: 7.1%
Biedroń: 3%

I'd say this is credible. I don't think Duda will lose any votes in the first round from his recent comments (although he's now backtracking - twitter.com/AndrzejDuda/status/1272164178237718530 ) - but I also don't think that he'll gain from them.

The question is the 2nd round - will he gain or lose from this? I've read some commentary about this from right wing political scientists, and one comment stands out: for the majority of Polish people, they are neutral towards sexual minorities. They don't love them, but they equally don't hate them - so focusing on LGBT issues is largely pointless regardless of the candidate.

Another poll, and this one (if genuine) is an eye-opener:

Duda 49,8%
Hołownia 50,2%

Duda 50,1%
Kosiniak-Kamysz 49,9%

Duda 50,7%
Trzaskowski 49,3%

Duda 60,1%
Bosak 39,9%

To give some sense of perspective, a lead of 1.4% is equal to around 420,000 votes, or a lead of 210,000 votes. It's not much.

Travelling is so incredibly superficial and degenerate, I can't even find proper ways to describe how much it disgusts me. Let alone, just consider for a second when in the history of mankind was such an extremely wasteful privileged experience even possible in the first place?

Then you annoy people for a few days in a foreign country that hate your touristy guts for good reason basically being the same ashole you are at home, expecting a degenerate tourist experience, or if you are the special kind of ashole, an "authentic experience". And after you lit the money on fire, paying a premium for sh!t you could have cheaply have had at home. Wasting the money that you worked your hours, days and weeks in the wage cage off to have one or two weeks of respite instead of, I don't know, work less in the first place? Make your life at home way more comfy instead? Anything that would have been exponentially better for the price?

No one in the history of ever "expanded their horizons" travelling. And those who did already had solid grounding and knew the names of their immediate neighbors and were usually some kind of scholar or could at least take something useful out an experience. And those did not just stay a few weeks or months in the country they actually wanted to properly experience which you can't by just being there a weeks, not even a few months will have any impact, really. And you must have some seriously good reason to abandon your real community, anyway.

Poor soul. Share with him this quote from New Testament which applies perfectly to an LGBT sex "education" of school children:

"But whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened around his neck and to be drowned in the depth of the sea."

Matthew 18:6

@Spike31
WOW I wonder how many priests knew that quote?

dorzeczy.pl/kraj/143456/ekspert-przegrzanie-tego-tematu-moze-zaszkodzic-andrzejowi-dudzie.html


This is from a PiS supporting and heavily government-funded magazine. It's worth reading, as it gives a clear warning to Duda that it's time to back off on the subject.

I'm looking at other political scientists now, and almost all of them seem to agree that Duda will lose śląskie. Trzaskowski is slightly struggling in łódźkie, and he hasn't made a major breakthrough in mazowieckie.

What's critical is that right wing political scientists aren't giving Duda more than 51% in the second round.