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Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 23


PolAmKrakow  3 | 925
25 Jun 2025   #61
For all the fvcking morons, for the last time. Ukraine cannot win. Russia is not giving up the land it has taken, and they are taking about 5 square miles a day right now. Ukraine has no choice but to make a deal or eventually not exist. Clear enough for you? All the keep fighting talk is bvllshit. Ukraine is not going to do anything more than they have done which is put of a great fight. But the greatest fighters can also be outmatched, and this is that case. All the name calling of Russia and Putin isnt going to do a thing to help Ukraine, it just looks stupid.
mafketis  42 | 11601
25 Jun 2025   #62
taking about 5 square miles a day right now.

Source?

Ukraine has signed a peace deal and russia rejected it.

What now?

You keep implying that it's Ukraine that's continuing the war and not russia.

Why is that?
Torq  17 | 1624
25 Jun 2025   #63
For all the fvcking morons, for the last time. Ukraine cannot win.

Not according to one of your top generals, the director for operations of the Joint Staff...

wiadomosci.onet.pl/swiat/dostal-nominacje-od-donalda-trumpa-ukraina-moze-wygrac/1l6gtx9

... if you meet him make sure you call him a fvcking moron to his face.
Bobko  28 | 2700
25 Jun 2025   #64
Was listening to a funny podcast today about the Mongol conquests. The narrator read a letter at one point, from Hulegu Khan - to the Mamluk ruler of Egypt (essentially another Mongol, previously enslaved, but through sheer force of will and martial prowess elevated above the locals).

Look at this letter:

From the King of Kings of the East and West, the Great Khan,
To Qutuz the Mamluk, who fled to escape our swords.

You should think of what happened to other countries and submit to us.
You have heard how we have conquered a vast empire and have purified the earth of the disorders that tainted it.
We have conquered vast areas, massacring all the people.
You cannot escape from the terror of our armies.
Where can you flee? What road will you use to escape us?
Our horses are swift, our arrows sharp, our swords like thunderbolts,
our hearts as hard as the mountains,
our soldiers as numerous as the sand.
Fortresses will not detain us, nor armies stop us.
Your prayers to God will not avail against us.
We are not moved by tears nor touched by lamentations.
Only those who beg our protection will be safe.
Hasten your reply before the fire of war is kindled.

- Hülegü Khan


Now, the current undisputed writer of menacing letters is Donal Trump... but still - this epistle stands on another level. 800 years later - it stirs my Russian heart with the power of its prose.

This is what I wish we wrote to Zelensky:

" From the King of Kings of the East and West, the Great Putin,
To Vladimir the Jew, who fled to escape our swords.

You should think of what happened to other countries and submit to us..."
Torq  17 | 1624
25 Jun 2025   #65
From the King of Kings of the East and West..

What a lovely letter. If Qutuz the Mamluk had been Polish he would have composed the following reply...

Go f*ck yourself.- Qutuz the Mamluk

I hope that was his answer.
Bobko  28 | 2700
25 Jun 2025   #66
I hope that was his answer

Qutuz won.

Quite unexpectedly.

Lesson is - only a Mongol can stop Mongol expansion Westwards. Even if a former slave.

Turks will tell you he was Turkic. Don't listen to them. It is the same thing.
Torq  17 | 1624
25 Jun 2025   #67
Qutuz won.

Yesss!

I shall refer to him as Qutuzowski from now on.
Bobko  28 | 2700
25 Jun 2025   #68
Qutuzowski

Well, where do you think Kutuzov came from? Not the same Qutuz, but another Tatar.

P.S. Qutuz's response was to decapitate the envoys and place their heads on the gates of Cairo.

Again... respect.

This is why we have trouble with the Ukrainians, these ******** are as hard as we are.

A little scary, tbh, but in the end - we are even stronger.
Torq  17 | 1624
25 Jun 2025   #69
Hey, @moderator: "To Hulegu Khan, the Onanist of the East and West" was a vital part of Kutuzowski's reply. Put away those moderating scissors. :-/
Bobko  28 | 2700
25 Jun 2025   #70
@Torq

I'm very grateful to Donald Trump for reintroducing the "threatening letter" back into the diplomatic mainstream.

I hope to see more, from other leaders now.

This is an ancient and established tradition - we should come back to it.
Torq  17 | 1624
25 Jun 2025   #71
an ancient and established tradition - we should come back to it

Hear, hear.

Decapitating impudent envoys was an elegant custom too.
Novichok  7 | 9836
25 Jun 2025   #72
One can love the US and be proud of Russia. I am that one...


johnny reb  50 | 8242
26 Jun 2025   #73
I hope to see more, from other leaders now.

Which other leaders ?
Alien  28 | 7115
26 Jun 2025   #74
ancient

A fitting description of said leader.
PolAmKrakow  3 | 925
26 Jun 2025   #75
nytimes.com/2025/06/14/world/europe/ukraine-battlefield-russia-sumy-kostyantynivka.html

Maybe some far left news sources will help people think rationally about the war. "Yes, indeed Ukraine is winning." A wtf level statment.
Torq  17 | 1624
26 Jun 2025   #76
some far left news sources

Maybe you missed my post #63 or are you calling your generals "far left sources"? By the way, don't forget to write General Grynkewich and call him, I quote you, a "fvcking moron" because he thinks Ukraine can win this war.

Your pro-Putinist shilling, disguised as a desire for peace, is vomit-inducing.
mafketis  42 | 11601
26 Jun 2025   #77
s will help people think rationally about the war. "

So.... what should happen?

At this stage there are two possibilities:

A- Ukrainian surrender and eventual absorption of Ukraine (and Poland) into the russian sphere of influence.

B- Ukrainian resistance with or without US help.

Are you A or B ?
cms neuf  1 | 2070
26 Jun 2025   #78
Of course it's possible and even likely Ukraine will win

They have better weapons, fighting on home soil, support from the democratic world, not just the EU but also Britain, Australia, Korea, Japan.

And most of all they have clear war aims. Most of the farm boys have no idea why they spend a year 6km outside Pokrovsk when they could be at home with their girlfriends getting happily drunk
Torq  17 | 1624
26 Jun 2025   #79
So.... what should happen?

Well, the intelligent strategists in Poland have been talking about it for quite a while now. In our scenario America has one job, just one f*cking job, nothing more.

The American job is to control the escalation. Namely, if Russia fires a nuke, the US fires a nuke; if Russia fires three, the US fires three, if Russia fires a hundred, the USA fires a hundred. That's it. Their precious soldiers can stay at home. We don't need their infantry - we have our own, much better than theirs.

So, while the USA controls the escalation, a liberating force, let's call it the Freedom Army for the purpose of this scenario, consisting of Maavoimat, Wojsko Polskie, Bundeswehr and the Romanian Army (reinforced with expeditionary forces of other European NATO countries), rolls into Russia, Belarus and Ukraine to finally liberate Russians and other suffering peoples from the yoke of kleptocratic, gold toilet sh*tting, quasi-fascist putinist/lukashenist regimes.

I roughly calculate the time needed for the Freedom Army to liberate Russia to be from 6 to 8 weeks. If America can control the escalation that long, this war will be over in two months. But this requires resolve, brave decisions, and at least a moderate amount of tostesterone from all involved.

So, @PolAm, are you with us or against us?
Korvinus  4 | 688
26 Jun 2025   #80
Ukraine has no choice but to make a deal or eventually not exist.

Russia is currently engaging in a campaign of suppression against people who are still pro-Ukrainian in the occupied territories. This includes imprisonment, torture, and even unlawful executions. All sorts of human rights violations. They are also engaging in activities to destroy Ukrainian identity, and many of those activities do fall under the definition of genocide.

This will all continue and would be increased if an even greater amount of the Ukrainian population falls under their control. So people are being abused and killed under Russian occupation, while Russia tries to forcefully destroy the Ukrainian identity.

You can't argue that Russia would not continue with their criminal occupation activities and that they would stop torturing and killing people.
This is why we have trouble with the Ukrainians

Putina cannot let his own citizens can see how a very similar group of people are flourishing just across the border. You can't have that when you are doing all you can just to hang on to power and for obvious reasons. Hence, that other group of people either had to go, or they have to stop flourishing.
mafketis  42 | 11601
26 Jun 2025   #81
finally liberate Russians and other suffering peoples from the yoke of kleptocratic, gold toilet sh*tting, quasi-fascist putinist/lukashenist regimes

What makes you think russians want to be "liberated" for their horrible government? All the evidence is they _like_ every kleptocratic, fascist bit of it.

Keeping russians within the internationally recognized borders is enough. Europeans stay out and they stay in. Quarantine.
Bratwurst Boy  8 | 12240
26 Jun 2025   #82
All the evidence is they _like_ every kleptocratic, fascist bit of it.

Human nature is opportunistic....only the fringe are heroic-good....or that brutally-cruel!

Most Russians will by now have learned to live within the system...not quite different to the socialist past before....but not so different than polish or east-german experiences.

Of course when once the degree of suffering becomes to high, making it impossible for a rising number to eke out a living within the old rules, THEN it becomes dangerous for any ruler, no matter where.

But that doesn't seem to be the case in Russia (yet)...but that doesn't make them all "kleptokratic" or "fascist"....Poles or East-Germans weren't all diehart commies till '89 either....nor were most Germans diehart Nazis till '45....common people just don't work that way!
Korvinus  4 | 688
26 Jun 2025   #83
All the evidence is they _like_ every kleptocratic, fascist bit of it.

Significant number of srussians don't protest because they see no way it could do any good since it would be met with unrestricted violence.

The violence against Ukraine and its ambitions is the message to the srussian people. If not for it, putina would risk having to do the luka solution in moscow.
mafketis  42 | 11601
26 Jun 2025   #84
Significant number of srussians don't protest because they see no way it could do any good

Why don't the russians here protest?

Most Russians will by now have learned to live within the system...

russians exist in two states and two states only:

-brutally repressed (crappy but just barely functions as long as they keep their heads down0.

-total lawlessness (and unrestricted interpersonal violence).

Exceptions would be very welcome....

There's no easy solution here... and pretending that russians are just like Poles in the PRL or Germans in the DDR doesn't help anyone.

Let's stay out and keep them in. Quarantine.
PolAmKrakow  3 | 925
26 Jun 2025   #85
@Torq
I would absolutely call him a moron. Anyone saying that is a political shill. And you can fvck off, I am not fan of Putin. I am willing to bet you have never been to Ukraine and know no Ukraine people befroe they came to Poland. You're a typical leftist cheerleader. The Americans have zero job to do in Ukraine. Why arent you over in Ukraine fighting? All the tough talkers here are just full of $hit.
Torq  17 | 1624
26 Jun 2025   #86
I am willing to bet you have never been to Ukraine and know no Ukraine people befroe they came to Poland.

Brilliant.

How much are you willing to bet?
Novichok  7 | 9836
26 Jun 2025   #87
Are you A or B ?

C.

Ukrainian army leaves Russia. Stays out of NATO and lives happily from then on.
Novichok  7 | 9836
26 Jun 2025   #88
You're a typical leftist cheerleader.

...and a typical parasite...US this, US that...say weak, gutless, where-is-daddy retards...

Hey, retards, if Russia is a problem, Russia is your problem, not ours. We get along with Russia just fine...We even get rides into space from them...
Bobko  28 | 2700
26 Jun 2025   #89
Putina cannot let his own citizens can see how a very similar group of people are flourishing just across the border.

They were by no means flourishing.

Say what you want about illegal invasions, liberty, human rights, etc - but Ukraine had never been doing better than Russia economically. Not at any single point between today and 1991, did the Ukrainians grow faster than us, have higher incomes, or benefit from greater choice of consumer goods.

--///--

The dangerous example the Ukrainians were setting, was that you could don kitchen pots on your head, and start throwing bricks at policemen and taking potshots at them from your hunting rifle.

The dangerous example they set, is that it is enough to bring 15,000 people from all over Ukraine to the central square of the capital - in order to topple a democratically elected government. This, while every single other city in Ukraine stays quiet, and most normal people continue trying to live their normal lives.

This is exactly what happened during the October Revolution, when a small group of fanatics enforced their will on Petrograd - and plunged the rest of the country into 80 years of misery.

What I don't understand, is why the West cheers for this and pretends it is democracy. Nobody in the West seems to be ok with protesters storming government buildings.

Nobody thinks the Gilets Jauns have the right to storm the Elysee Palace and throw Macron in a rubbish bin. Nobody thinks it's ok for Jan 6 protesters to storm the Capitol.

Nobody calls for the overthrow of Spanish government, when Spanish riot police fire rubber bullets or tear gas into crowds.

But in Ukraine they are angels. They are saints. Martyrs for freedom. Noble elves... Why? Because it looks and sounds like they are against Russia. That's it.

All that is required to metamorphose from an unemployed street thug into a George Washington is to announce that you fight "for freedom from the Russian yoke".
Bratwurst Boy  8 | 12240
26 Jun 2025   #90
What I don't understand, is why the West cheers for this and pretends it is democracy.

Who says this? (Besides the ultra left radicals that is)

Today one has to be a retard to overlook the misery and death these revolutions brought about the people....Stalin or Mao or Pol Pot are only in nutter-circles still heroes or democratic idols!

Cuba and Chile didn't work out either, the last non-working example today is Venezuela.....so...who says this?


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