Polish Parliamentary Elections 2023

No it wasn't. Not nearly half as bad

no. 75-80 percent just as bad biased worshipping PO, not free and non-biased gov owned media. so can u blame PiS for cracking down and going too far in the other direction? Do u really want me to post the infamous TVP Happy Birthday Tusk We Love YOU Oh dear leader segment? I won't, it'll make u look less like a fool.

For every one of those I can give you ten even worse.


Yes I can. They didn't just did the same. They took it to the next level and then 2 or 3 more.

@Lenka
The great thing however is that TVP restricted itself mostly to Television. As a person who avoids using TV other then for streaming movies/series.

I have had very little presence of TVP or PiS in my life. The few things I have watched from TVP is via it's YouTube channel or small clips (which is good enough dosage).

PiS and TVP are straight to the point of criticising the opposition or foreign affairs (but fairly toxic in it's only constant criticising environment, so having a large distance to it is necessary)

I cannot fathom people mostly/only watching TVP. It's mind boggling to me.

The opposition has multiple media channels to contact and hear from (rzeczpospolita, Gazeta wyborcza, express, TVN, republika, TV Trwam and media narodowe) no matter if it's left side or right side of politics, religious or secular opposition.

TVP is a public newsnetwork, so naturally it will have a strong connection to it's government and in having a monopoly in broadcasting governmental information but, also views and has a higher chance of hiring people of governmental background or those connected with governments main party (there can be coslition governments, but main party is the tendancy as far as I know).

Having a situation with all/most media being one sided without room for certain sides of the political spectrum radicalizes the political scene and creates polarization.

In the U.S.A, having very strong media on side of republicans or Democrats creates a very strong and visually obvious divide, but gives a obvious choice of Fox news or CNN regardless of governmental spending. Unless somebody is outside of the "Democrats" or Republican" information Boubble it's a very stable political envirement that can afford a lot of instabity that other countries are unable to afford, to other countries astonishment, beeilderment but also fear. Cause they know deeply from within that they have no chance of upholding anything like that long term. (Think of monopoly of media and to what Great lengths Russian Federation and Illegitimate peoples party in China goes to control and limit information).

Poland is actually one of few exceptions within Europe that allows and has great deals of trouble with shutting down spread of information, mainly due to politicians voicing openly their opinion about most things. That in other countries politicians mostly keep to themselves and do not voice out loud.

Stigmatisation with belonging to a certain political party is not as strong as it used to be, it was far more the opinion of being a "burak" by voting PiS in the past. That has changed however, city living people tend to be fairly against PiS in general vs people living in the countryside.

Many news channel in the west seem left-wing or leftist and even newspapers or political persona who declare themselves conservative or right wing sound leftist due to a broad shift towards leftist type of speech and mentality.

Yet another reason why Poland will benefit from a new government: The draconian abortion laws implemented by PiS had most likely an averse effect on the (already terrible) demographic future of Poland. Repealing them might help undo some of the damage.

Annual number of births falls 11% in Poland, marking first double-digit decline

notesfrompoland.com/2023/10/26/annual-number-of-births-falls-11-in-poland-marking-first-double-digit-decline/

While decent intelligent people have been observing in shock and bewilderment what PiS have been doing for the last 8 years.
And we don`t want to see any more of this.

Democracy ruled, Korvin. Take it or leave it. Simple.


Ami, you don`t live in Poland so you don`t realise the scale of PiS supporting propaganda in ALL state media they seized 8 years ago. It is really sickening.

However, partly thanks to it, they lost the elections. Every cloud has its silver lining. HA!!!!

:):):) It is like saying that a hedgehog restricted itself mostly to fekking another hedgehog. Instead of fekking an elephant, for example hahahaha

What? Hedgehogs stealing other hedgehogs?? How odd. Very wise however not to try stealing an elephant. Or are you referring to hedgehogs throwing other hedgehogs? Where? Fecking them over the hedge, the wall, the famous Polish fence?

Not going to let up on this one ever Pawian. Show respect for Hiberno-English. It's feck, not fekk and to feck something is to steal it or throw it. You can feck a person, but that would mean you threw them over something.

Good, It means you are a bit bored in life having no bigger problems to deal with. You are a happy person. hahaha

@Tacitus
I cannot understand how somebody would even flirt with the idea of thinking that abortion is "normal" just like scalping somebody's head. Barbarian!

Nah, just bunch of idiots who have been too young during previous Tusk's rule, and older idiots with with memory span of a goldfish.

"she refused to be bored chiefly because she wasn't boring" who said it and of whom? :))

That`s nothing, really, compared to homo sovieticus voters of PIS and pro Russian incel voters of Konfederacja. hahahaha

@Mr Grunwald


Personally I am against abortions in most cases. It seems morally wrong to abort a healthy baby just because it does not fit into your life planning (unless it is the result of rape or endangers the life of the mother). But I can not deny the negative consequences of strict anti-abortion laws in practice.

"Technologically" is normal. Wearing a regular tampon can lead to worse complications.

The general fatigue with the PiS government has long been clear, especially with its incompetence, cynicism, level of demoralization and primitivism of propaganda.

The statistical map shows the level of anti PiS revival in Poland. There are areas where about 60-70% voted for the democratic opposition and 20-25% for corrupt PiS.

Blue - European democracy, red - bolshevik autocracy from Eastern Europe.

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That really is a striking map of results. Showing how divided the country is on the PiS platform. I think this really shows who, as in groups of people, benefit the most from PiS policies. The new government has a short period of time to get things right. Spring local elections are already being talked about.

Even more striking than the map last time and more polarised.

I'd like to see a different type of map, the kind where the shapes of the electoral district are distorted according to population size/density. On that map, the visuals would be even more striking.

Apart from Krakow (where many of the residents don't vote in that city) and Rezszow, the parts in red on that map don't have any major population centres.

Polam, I have never forgotten your prophetic words you spoke in July 2020, in the midst of the presidential campaign which PiS eventually won. Here they are:

This alone should say something to PiS that they need to do things differently. Whether they get bounced out this time or not, their days are clearly numbered. As the old die, and the uneducated who have educated children become more aware of their childrens opinions and wants, the old ways will die off.

You had foreseen exactly what happened on 15 Oct 2023 - namely, the educated young prevailed over the old and homo sovieticuses. Wow! Hats off. And thank you, coz I believed you then and your words instilled me with determination to fight on against PiS.

And Spike commented on Polam`s words in this way:

The problem with "total opposition" is that [...] have very deluded outlook. [...] They refuse to understand that they represent nothing of value for Polish society and in the age of widespread internet access and info exchange they cannot stupify the society any longer on such a scale with controlled access to information as before. The "king" is naked.

Now, judge for yourself, who nailed it better????

@pawian
While I appreciate you remembering those words, this new government is not settled yet and that concerns me. Already too many discussions on who should control what, and no real statements on what they will be doing. This is immature politics and more battling for control, which is no better than PiS in my opinion. If this return to the entrepreneur test returns it is bad for the country. If something is not done about ZUS it is bad for the country.

This group of parties should have had all of their appointments and positions already discussed and agreed to before the election. There should have been no window for Duda to make the statement that there are two groups claiming a majority. Pressure on Duda could have been leveraged, and he would have looked terrible for not leting this new government organize prior to the next session of the sejm.

That said, I also fear, when the new government gets into the real records of spending and graft, that Poland is in much deeper $hit financially than we could imagine.

Everybody is waiting for Duda`s move.
Think positively and stop bothering about things we have no influence on. :):):)

Candidate at the President's discretion - however customary/tradition to give it to "the winner" which PiS is currently claiming that they are, because most seats the 3 (likely) coalition parties didn't go to elections as one block (had separate candidate lists/election committees).

Best he can do is give Morawiecki first shot at the vote of confidence and maybe, if the Sejm's (Tusk-lead) cabinet proposal fails to get a vote of confidence after Morawiecki's fails, give another shot to Morawiecki (or indeed to whoever he wishes, I think people joked he could propose his wife as PM, as the constitution makes no restrictions here), which will again fail, triggering parliament dissolution and early elections.

That`s "democracy" by rightists. :):):)
As I said in another thread, they have learnt nothing after the lost elections.
Worse, they still refuse to learn.
That is why the swamp has to be definitely cleaned up to the very bottom. :):):)

FYI for non-poles and clarification the order for cabinet proposals is:

1) Candidate at the President's discretion - customary/tradition to give it to the party with majority.
2) Lower house of parliament (Sejm) proposes a prime minister to form a cabinet.
3) President proposes whoever he wants, but the vote of confidence needs a more lax majority to pass than in previous steps (I think just 50% of present MPs, while others require absolute majority regardless of absentees).

If all 3 fail to result in a vote of confidence for a prime minister's cabinet then the parliament is dissolved, meaning new elections.

Why 3 fails if there is a majority for the opposition gov??? :):):)

That`s why I said: rightist "democracy." When they are in power, it is absolutely OK. When sb else, it is not OK and they demand earlier elections.

Clean this swamp to the very bottom! this is my new motto which I am going to repeat very often, it seems.

What do you think would happen in early elections ? Do you think there are people who would change their minds after seeing this unreasonable behavior?

It would obviously be a complete wipeout for PiS, probably terminal.

Every day of delay about 700 PiS voters meet their maker.

Hopefully, if stalled long enough, opposition parties start fighting each other. The Left gives me high hopes in this regard.

For example, people working on b2b are now coming to realization how leftards want to undercut them.

Yes, the Left will be aggressive coz they lost the most of all. But Donald Tusk, that genius, will contain them.

@Korvinus
The coalition parties not going as one block was absolutely stupid. They left the door open for PiS to keep this $hit show going for potentially three months. Duda should have some balls for a change and do whats right for the country and nominate Tusk. Duda cant run again, and he has an opportunity to become his own man and not a JK puppet. CMS is right, if PiS messes around too much, an early election would likely be even worse for PiS. Stalling is bad for Poland, and would just be more proof that PiS didnt GAF about anyone but themselves. Their financial policies are a disaster for Poland and it will take decades to undo the damage.