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To Poles: some food for thought


tired
4 Jan 2018 #1
This is both a complaint and a plea to my fellow Poles. I don't know why are we the way we are so please rethink your actions and beliefs. I'm not attacking everyone, I'm just attacking the views Poles as a nation have and not everyone, obviously, falls under that category. I do hope you're intelligent enough to understand that and not go #notallpoles on me.

Why do we, as a nation, are like this? Why are we so racist? Why are we so xenophobic? What is wrong with their skin colour that we feel the need to point them out and move away 5 seats? Why do we think we're better than our neighbours or anyone in general, when we go abroad and all we do is refuse to speak English and yell that one cuss word so everyone knows where we're from? Why do we hate women so much? Why do we refuse to give them the right's men have? Why do we think we're so progressive and different from a Muslim country when we refuse to give them equal pay, a right to not be harassed at work, not shame them for their choices and how we don't give them control over what's happening to their own bodies. Why don't we start treating them as people, not property, and then act like we're progressive. Why are we so homophobic? What have gay people done to us that we feel the need to bully them into suicide or just beat them to death? Why do we do that? Isn't love, love? Why are we so hateful towards people who have done nothing wrong but love someone? Why do we hate differences, when those differences are not harmful and don't have anything to do with us in the slightest? Why are we so vehemently protective of the catholic church? Why do we feel the need to protect paedophiles and greedy ********? Why do we like to go to mass so much, when all it focuses on is hate and excuses?

Why do we always find an excuse for all of this? "Oh, Russians are idiots, it's okay to make fun of them", "Oh, brown skinned people are uncivilised monkeys, it's okay", "Oh, women are just inferior to men scientifically, it's okay", "Oh, nothing wrong with it, it just grosses me out because the church says it's wrong", "You shouldn't question the church, they're servants of god".

All I see is a circlejerk of hate. Oh, you saw a Russian person drive a car off the road on the internet? I saw Poles smashing windows while chanting kurwa the other day. You saw a black person exist? Oh, wow, how about we talk about how white Poles think science isn't real and everything is godmagic. Women too emotional? You'd be emotional too if everyone told you all your life you're worthless and not equal and you certainly shouldn't be able to remove a literal parasite that doesn't feel from your body. So what if she forgot to shave the side of her leg? I've seen men who have never shaved a leg in their life. Talk about "unhygienic". You saw a girl kissing a girl? Good for them. Love is beautiful, isn't it? Hope they don't end up like those broken homes where the man beats the wife and everyone ignores it because it's somehow normal for hetero couples to do. The church said so? Well, I guess we should all jump off a bridge just cause a priest said we should. The bible also says that you can't wear clothes from two different fabrics at once. But I guess we'll just ignore that because it's not convenient for me.

And while yes, ignorance persists in many countries, it's the sheer amount of it that leads me to believe that the 96% of people who voted for presidential campaigns spreading this sort of thinking, are like this. "Oh, but this person said that they'll give us free money for every child we have." That person also refuses to give that money to legitimate families that are not the standard model of man-woman-child. Why would you vote for hate and make it worse for other people for a few zlotys? Why?

Please, rethink your views. Spreading love instead of hate will give us all a kinder world.
dolnoslask 6 | 3,043
4 Jan 2018 #2
Why are we so racist? Why are we so xenophobic?

Its not that bad there are some random idiots, there are many other countries that also have the above problem here and there.

Oh, Russians are idiots, it's okay to make fun of them"

Why would we make fun of them, they have murdered enslaved tens of thousands of us , they stole Poland and put it behind the iron curtain.

We are very wary of Russians, And do not be surprised that some Poles would not be able to forgive the murder , enslavement and deportation of their direct family members.

Russians are not idiots as in WWII have proved more than capable of the enslavement and mass murder of civilians.

Idiots are those who are unprepared for Russia's next invasion.
OP tired
4 Jan 2018 #3
#1: I am not comparing Poland to other countries. I am fully aware that they have those, too. Using other countries as an excuse to not better ourselves is very childlike behaviour. And I've never met a non ignorant Pole, so I would exchange that "some random idiots" for "most people here are idiots".

#2: History is history. We murdered and pillaged, too yet I see no reflection on this from Poles. We tend to glorify our past, leaving the uncomfortable details like rape, murder, torture, etc., behind and never mention it. If we're so quick to forget our and our ancestors mistakes why won't we do the same? If we're not the same people our ancestors were, why do we assume they are?

"Russia's next invasion" Am I living under a rock and missed a declaration of war overnight?
kaprys 3 | 2,480
4 Jan 2018 #4
If you have never met a non ignorant Pole, I'm sorry for you.
How about you? Are you Polish? Are you ignorant, xenophobic and racist?
Don't overgeneralise. There are gay and mixed race Poles, and there are loads of tolerant people. As for racists and xenophobes, well, look around, read the news, there are more and more radicalised sentiments everywhere.

It's disturbing but doesn't apply to Poles only.
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,605
4 Jan 2018 #5
@tired

Because Poland's lands, values, culture, traditions, security, etc. are constantly under threat and have been throughout history.

Poles have become more cautious in recent years and millions refuse to accept the failed multiculturalism of Western Europe. Poles simply don't want the terror attacks, the rapes, the PC bs, etc.
Ktos 17 | 456
4 Jan 2018 #6
@tired

You are officially the one of the .....est persons to have arrived on this forum. I pray for people like you to leave my country because people like you are so brainwashed it is sickening. Your inability to step out from the circle and look around and think what is going on and your lack of awareness of what other nations are about in comparison to Poland is astounding. You are so sad it is sad to read your wypociny. You sound like a KOD member. You are only correct about the histeria regarding Russia, the rest you wrote is complete rubbish.
dolnoslask 6 | 3,043
4 Jan 2018 #7
Am I living under a rock and missed a declaration of war overnight?

You probably were when they took over half of the Ukraine.

"most people here are idiots".

I suggest you get back under your rock and stay safe.
Bieganski 17 | 901
4 Jan 2018 #8
@tired

You don't offer "some food for thought" but rather a poison pill which is currently killing the West.

Everything you ranted about against Poles and Polish society is nothing more than overused and hollow talking points of the sinister professional left.

Your extremist ideological views can be summed up as such:

Intersectionality is a neo-Marxist doctrine that views racism, sexism, ableism, heterosexism, and all forms of "oppression" as interconnected and mutually reinforcing.

And all your overgeneralized examples and your final sappy appeal for an emotional solution (i.e., "spreading love") have all been seen before and is yet another blatant tactic of the sinister professional left:

Lived experience, according to intersectional theory, is a better guide to the truth than...Western and masculine styles of thinking. So don't try to refute intersectionality with logic or evidence: That only proves that you are part of the problem...

Above quotes from: Christina Hoff Sommers: The Threat to Free Speech aei.org/publication/christina-hoff-sommers-the-threat-to-free-speech/
texas 1 | 21
4 Jan 2018 #9
#1: I am not comparing Poland to other countries. I am fully aware that they have those, too.

I think the better question is why are humans like that in general. Why are humans so afraid of others, so afraid of having less that they must put down and discriminate others? So afraid that they must generalize an entire group of people, rather than being open to each individual they come across and treat them on their own merits?
mafketis 24 | 8,926
4 Jan 2018 #10
do we think 're so progressive and different from a Muslim country we refuse to them equal pay, a right be at , shame them for their choices how we don't give them over what's to own bodies.

How does this apply to Poland at all? I don't get it....
Bieganski 17 | 901
4 Jan 2018 #11
@texas

Hypergamy drives the demand for more (which in a world of finite resources has to come at the expense of others) so that reproduction can be successful.
lgfox
6 Jan 2018 #12
I am not polish, and to be honest I think your post is biased due to some kind of bad personal experience you or someone you care about had.
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,605
6 Jan 2018 #13
@tired

Chopin jp ii copernicus mustve too been ignorant poles...

Take a look around you and yes poland did invade Russia czechy etc and other countries as did every civilization over the past 2k years. Unlike france britain belgium Germany etc we never had colonies where we subjugated the local people and forced them to work or die and steal all their wealth. You need to check your facts. Almost all the wars poles fought were defensive esp since the past 300 years when it wasn't on the map or they had to fight for the partition powers.

Poles yes can be a bit racist. Its because when you have a million people vast majority of whom are economic migrants coming to live off welfare and benefits of course we dont want it. We dont want the terror, the assimilation problems, the rapes, etc. Poland helps people through caritas but has already taken in 1 mln ukranian migrants along witg many chechens belarussians indians pakistanis etc. Even in wroclaw youll see koreans and w africans.
pawian 175 | 13,542
21 Nov 2020 #14
Why are we so racist? Why are we so xenophobic? What is wrong

We lost too many inteligentsia members due to emigration, wars, risings, expulsions, deportations. There are a lot of decent intelligent people here but still not enough.
mafketis 24 | 8,926
21 Nov 2020 #15
emigration, wars, risings, expulsions, deportations.

Humanity has developed defenses against those events (which have happened everywhere). Genetic variation (meaning talent appears unpredictably in the population and not concentrated in a few lineages) and reversion to the mean (extraordinary people usually have ..... ordinary children).

Loss of physical intellectual infrastructure (libraries, universities etc) is much more damaging to societies than loss of outstanding individual people.
Lenka 3 | 2,198
21 Nov 2020 #16
You count only genetics. You forgot that t
,if alive, they would have been teachers, mentors, role models
Novichok - | 277
21 Nov 2020 #17
The OP forgot the kitchen sink.
I know it's an old thread but, seriously, is this the best response you, Polish patriots, are capable of? I would demand that he justifies each and every accusation - one at a time and with supporting evidence - and rip that crap apart in seconds.

No nation has to justify its internal rules and how the individuals living there feel. It is what it is, and if you (editorial) don't like it, don't come or go to the nearest lake.

If that nation breaks international laws, go to the relevant court or the UN. Otherwise, fo.
Life is actually very simple.
Ironside 49 | 10,671
21 Nov 2020 #18
Please, rethink your views.

Why don't go FY? Jerk!

Commie millennials and their trope. yuck!
yo Americans why don't you sort out your universities?
pawian 175 | 13,542
21 Nov 2020 #19
I would demand that he justifies each and every accusation

But in another thread you claimed that opinions are safe from justification.
Novichok - | 277
21 Nov 2020 #20
Why are we so racist

That's an accusation based on facts, not an opinion. "I prefer blondes" is an opinion.
Such an accusation ends careers and can get one in a pile of trouble where discrimination based on race is illegal.
But, predictably, you turned your polite tail instead of making him feel sorry he was born.

To his credit, Ironside's reaction was just right.

We lost too many inteligentsia members due to emigration, wars, risings, expulsions, deportations.

That's not how a patriot responds to some a-hole. It's an apology, dressed up as an explanation and a tacit confirmation that the OP was right. Grow a pair.
pawian 175 | 13,542
21 Nov 2020 #21
That's an accusation based on facts, not an opinion.

Yes, but in another thread you accused another poster of unhelpful attitude and later called it an opinion and refused to justify. Start being consistent at last - do you see that chaos which prevails in your reasoning?

Such an accusation ends careers and can get one in a pile of trouble

You seem to forget where we are.

To his credit, Ironside's reaction was just right.

Typical reaction full of bile by a defensive racist, homophobe and xenophobe in denial.

That's not how a patriot responds to some a-hole.

Instead of admitting that I was right when I mentioned inteligentsia emigration which is so true in your case, you prefer to beat about the bush. Shame on you.
Joker 2 | 1,241
22 Nov 2020 #22
I would want to visit as a tourist a Polish city with Poles, not with Arabs.

Its kind of like going to Londionstan and expecting to see some Brits. lol

They defied the queen of the EU (Merkel) and didnt take in the refugees. But, for how long before the libtards take over??

Muzzies and too much cultural dilution aka "enrichment", "multiculturalism"

Have you noticed that the ones who champion for PCness are the first ones the muzzies would throw off a building for being "different".
JacekthePole - | 20
22 Nov 2020 #23
@Joker
Well one thing for sure, as much as I am no fan of PiS, if they cave into the EU on this rule of law nonsense, then where does it stop. No budget if you don't take in refugees, no budget if you don't bow down to Frau Merkel?

The end of national sovereignty is nigh.

Well done to the brits for having sense to get out of it.
moondoggie - | 29
22 Nov 2020 #24
Germany destroyed Poland in WW2, not they wont stop until Poland is flooded with millions of 3rd worlders and living conditions collapse in Poland, joining the EU is reverse development, it will turn you literally into Africa!
Novichok - | 277
22 Nov 2020 #25
it will turn you literally into Africa!

Just added another nightmare to my list.
Cargo pants 2 | 562
22 Nov 2020 #26
Poland is flooded with millions of 3rd worlders

The moose limbs will never stay in Poland as they will not get a free flat and 1000 Euros a month,they will move on anyways,lol plus Pork is Poles national food.
Novichok - | 277
22 Nov 2020 #27
You are overlooking the fact that there are other ways to "earn" money - like theft, extortion, prostitution, gambling, drugs, bribery...This list is very long.

Pork will never be a deterrent when there is enough of them. This is why it's so critical to keep the numbers below the critical mass. Just as with nuclear bombs.

Once they reach that point, they are self-sustaining. Like the Amish here.
Mr Grunwald 27 | 1,816
23 Nov 2020 #28
The OP forgot the kitchen sink.
I know it's an old thread but, seriously, is this the best response you, Polish patriots, are capable.

Allright, you may feel sucessful as you have baited me. It made me rather unhappy you made that comment yesterday as it was sunday, but alas I did suceed in keeping my temper until this morning. Walked my dog, making some cofee... You should feel honored, I even decided to write on post on the computer which I rarely do nowadays as I most often just reply on my cellphone on the go wherever I am. Hope you are pleased...

This is both a complaint and a plea to my fellow Poles. I don't know why are we the way we are so please

1. The complaint is noted and I am reading your plea, you can thank dear pawian for that as he brought back the thread (I do like old threads being used again)

2. Get contact with more Poles, start going to church again. Talk it out with a priest is my best advice.
3. Oh yes you do actually as you wrote it in English, not in Polish as quite a bunch of the world is able to read this you are adding the words of bullets towards her heart... So save it as you are going to need it.

4. I am intelligent enough to understand that this is a general rant about people misbeheaving in general, especially if they aren't intelligent enough to understand that other people will view one quite negatively by bad behaviour and what the possible consequences might be. You are sadly part of that group in one way or another as I mentioned earlier in my post.

Why do we, as a nation, are like this? Why are we so racist?

Again when you think "nation" you are talking about all Poles, wether they allow it, ignore it or don't correct it or simply think it that way. The amount of generalisation you are making cause of Poles reputation abroad is quite anouying and creates a larger huge distaste of you. So to me, you are basically arguing like a lawyer.

Rascism... There are many ways as to look at rascism. The one I understand you are talking about is generally xenophobia, one only has to pick up a history book as to why Poles can be quite.... wary of ANY foreigners! This again shows the likeliness of you being a Pole diminishes further...

Rascism's origin stems from Darwin's thoughts about evolution and the concept change of "Man being made by God directly" to either "Man being made by God inderectly" or "Man coming from animals without God in the picture". Out of this thought came the worst possible versions of ideologies which based their societies on the thought of organising it without religion or directly abusing it for the purposes of political power (Soviet Union and Nazi Germany are the most known examples)

Which is again a tactic used by left side of the political spectrum, the further extreme one is the more often it's heard from a leftwinger about rascism. Which is a paradox when the leftwinger isn't a believer since the thought he/she is pushing is a result of rascism itself actually. Food for thought and possible comedy for others.

I am not going to divulge in to the topic too much as it is rather disturbing

Why are we so xenophobic?

Again... Pick up a history book. Doesn't have to be university level, teenager schools should be more then adequate enough. I suggest starting to learn Polish aswell, it would give you insight in to the mentality of the People living in those times. It's rather ambitious but, who knows? Maybe you will.

What is wrong with their skin colour that we feel the need to point them out and move away 5 seats?

That has a lot to do with several factors:
1. We as Poles in general (humans in generals too, it's just... a bit more overstimulated among Poles for some reason) are quite hypocondric, you only need to watch commercials on the TV and know a Polish family or look how kids are dressed for winter to know that. Getting cold or sick is something to take very serriously. Which also explains PiS's ability to come up with authoritiarian meassures in a rather Liberty driven society as health issues are a real concern in Poland to a much larger degree then other places. (How it's organised economically and politically we can rather please discuss in another thread)

2. Any factor of not knowing about a persons background is frightening for any human being, Poles know what to expect from a German, Russian, Ukrainian or other Poles! Tell him to talk to a person from another continent which Poland has never been in (as a state, not as in the form of diplomats) and most Poles wouldn't even have a clue as to which language to start talking in! In most cases Poles tend to be quite careful with the use of english and don't feel sure enough in using it. I was lucky growing up with several languages, so I don't have this problem. It's still real non-the less.

3. During the aftermatch of World war 2, cause of political situation and general civil war. The period after 1953 was heavily focused on having the Nazi-Germans (Germans also in general as the dictator of that regime was elected, so plenty of Poles lay the blame on the population aswell. Not only the Nazi-fringe) to stableize the internal factors which were quite volatile, even for Poland to be. The political regimes used the anti-Nazi Germans card as heavily as they could. It was seen as positive by Moscow and by larger part of the Polish public for obvious reason (one only has to know about the horrors of world war 2) not only that it also diverged away from problems with the political establishment itself but, also it's negative ties to Moscow and the enforced chains that Poles were placed under. In that way, Poles were brainfed socialism and communist theory in school on a daily basis. Then spoon fed Nazi-German behaviour from the entertainment industry and everything related to "German" behaviour as an enemy, one only had to hate the communist regime a bit too much to start copying this negatively presented image of an enemy to **** of the chainholders. Talking about, discussing Polish political opposition wether it was peaceful or militant were at first banned, then sensured and liberalised step by step as not to anger or worsen relations with Moscow. This push and tug "tactic" in the Polish society drove finally to the situation of 1989, where plenty of political parties either felt left out or cheated in the new dealing of cards. The whole mess we are in now in Poland is about that deal, some fight for it to be preserved out of fear of the possible consequences and instability while other aren't able to withhold themselves any further from ignoring the situation.

4. Also most people don't have time to think too much about all this or dig in to themselves cause of a busy life, expecting people to be perfect in every part of their life is quite... I don't know?

Why do we think we're better than our neighbours or anyone in general, when we go abroad and all we do is refuse to

Again, it's about the level of English and being put down by our neighbour states that were of the opinion that there is too much chaos so order had to be restored. It's a big middle finger to those past opressors, behaving chaotically even abroad. Also I would blame human psychology in this situation far more then anything about Polish nationality.

Why do we hate women so much? Why do we refuse to give them the right's men have?

What on earth are you writing about? You clearly haven't lived in Poland buddy

Why do we think we're so progressive and different from a Muslim country when we refuse to give them equal pay, a right to not

Oh I see, let's say what you call progress... I call regress
What you call progress: Liberty without consequences and a life full of rights and privliedges (Wake up buddy, you sound pampered and spoiled)
What I call progress: Being able to grow and improve while understanding the responsibilities and burden of the liberties that have been earned and fought for by our ancestors (biological or/and spiritual)

The Polish nobility lived a life of an utterly spoiled life and no concern for the future, you should trust people being people. Especially your enemies being the enemies they are. Grow up

As to your arguments:
1. Islam is heavily based on authority and subjecation, your willingness to debate about inviting people who were raised up by this way of life makes you comical at best.

2. again rights, I am against harassment. If the company you work for allow such practices, there isn't something wrong with the law. It's something wrong with the workplace...

3. Shaming tactics are frankly quite effective and a lot better then other possible options I can think of. How would you want people to behave towards unwanted behaviour? Beheadings? Stoning? Again, this makes it a bit of a parody comparing it to your argument nr. 1

4. Nobody is treating women as property, if women were treated as property... They would be slaves, with a number on them ordered to be sent to the man who wishes for her then thrown away and tortured publically with no fear of punishment. Read up on how ancient Rome worked and you might learn how it was when humans were ACTUALLY treated as commodities...

5. I don't know who you are, but I can hardly think of any Poles acting as if he is a "progressive" in the way you think it is. Sounds a lot more like something you yourself are

Honestly, I planned on responding to every bit of his post, but I just woke up spent two hours writing this thing. This is a waste of time for me right now. Hope to be able to write more and come back to this at a later date. Going to drink up my coffeee and be off with my day.

It sickens me to read this and I need a break to bring my health back up, toxicity is bad for your health I tell you

I had to shorten the quoting, hopefully people are able to understand which parts I quoted
Novichok - | 277
2 days ago #29
Allright, you may feel successful as you have baited me.

I never bait. I shot directly and post what's on my mind. That is why I react poorly to the accusations of trolling. Nobody is important to me enough to lie to get a reaction.

Out of curiosity, please let me know which post of mine was "bait" and what "Sunday" has to do with it. Would Monday be better?

Rascism... There are many ways as to look at rascism.

A tactical blunder. When some moron accuses you (editorial) of racism, you don't explain why you are not a racist. The burden of proof is 100% on the claimant. Let him first define what racism is and how the accused - you or the Poles - meet HIS definition. If he refuses, you are done.

Think courtroom, not a bar.
Mr Grunwald 27 | 1,816
2 days ago #30
@Novichok
Yes Monday is a lot better
I prefer to have my sundays for rest and not online battles

When you were quite condescending about patriots, I took that as willful baiting I couldn't ignore.

You may thought I was mentally in a bar... and suggest for me to enter a courtroom... I was mentally at a classroom where I eventually sighed over his possibility of learning something.

Winning arguments I find quite shortsighted and downright senseless, it's when we move forward (actual progress) with our knowledge and information that I aspire to.

If anyone accuses me of rascism I automatically know he/she doesn't know me, or isn't interested in knowing me as I take that as a grave error on their part. Me wanting to share information with such an individual gets drastically altered


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