Weapons laws in Poland. Carrying a concealed handgun?

@Tacitus

Well, we are really starting to get into some speculative areas, with how exactly a popular uprising would play out, and I know we all hope it doesn't. My opinion is that there would be mass defections if orders akin to the kind you were hinting at would attempt to be implemented. In addition to the large size and population of the states versus the number of people in the military. Anyway, I think we can just agree that we view the potential outcomes differently and therefore the necessity for the citizens to have these weapons.

Fortunately, we both agree on more extensive background and mental health checks for gun ownership. I agree that it is entirely too lax in some states, but those of you commenting should understand that gun laws across the country are not a monolith. In my home state it is a process to get a license for purchasing a weapon, and each handgun must be individually licensed (not the case with long guns). The process is not overly cumbersome, but a minor inconvenience. In fact, the process I went through to get my concealed handgun license when I was 21, was much less intense than the process of obtaining the license to buy firearms in the first place. So, I think we can do a much better job at the point of sale. I am open to hearing about a road map to require say, an interview with a psychologist to sign off on a firearms purchaser card, every time its renewed which is every 5 years. Of course with this sort of compromise with the left, I would like to see a bill which gives reciprocity for concealed handgun permit holders so that they can carry in all 50 states, and do not have to navigate an intense road map of laws every time they cross state lines with their handgun on them.

Thats kind of how concealed carry works in illinois. Cant have any evident mental problems for atleast 5 years. In my area theres a ton of gun owners. Weve had 1 shooting herr in literally like 3 decades and a great range and shop here too now. And it just happened to be this year and it only happened bc some ghetto trash crashed a rich dudes halloween partt and were kicked out so they stayed down the block waiting for him to escort some guests and shot him and his house up. Thankfully he went in got his rifle and sniped em from his bedroom window. Before that the last murder was a bathroom fist fight at a rest stop between rival football fans in which a dude fell wromg and cracked his head

Well you see now, that's taking aggressive action and I know it seems odd to say so, but you have to do the opposite. You can't browbeat people into disarming which is really what we're talking about. In a sense you have a state of war in America and what's needed is peace talks. You need a huge national initiative, public debate and discussion on a massive level and meetings between the government and the police with community leaders and key figures in the worst communities where the gun crime is at its highest levels. You also need total reform of the police force. It's the work of years, maybe even decades, but it has to start somewhere. You could also do with having somebody coming in from outside to act as mediators. But unfortunately America is a bit too arrogant ever to ask for help. That'll be its downfall in the end.

Holding the police accountable for their unjustified shootings to start.
Let the citizens decide weather it was justified, not some police panel that ALWAYS rules in the police favor even if the shooting is captured on video and the cop is guilty as sin.

That's where I would start.

Atch the people you/we are talking about don't know how to read or write, can't speak proper English, have never had a legal job, have been raised by a single mother on welfare, been in and out of jail half dozen times for high court misdemeanors, have been robbed, have been beat, use illegal drugs and the most expensive thing they own is their cell phone.

Their mothers rake in about $75,000 a year on welfare by pumping out kids that she can't afford.
Starting to get the picture of what we are dealing with here ?

Now, I have repeatedly ask this question because I am seriously ignorant on the subject.
How does the mental health system work in Europe ?
What does the EU do with mentally ill people that are not responsible for themselves ?
The U.S. has closed the doors to our mental institutions and turned these people out on the streets.
They then end up in prison, homeless on the streets or dead.
How does Europe handle these people ?
ALL of the mass shooters have been mentally ill.

Okay and exactly how would you convince tens of millions of people to give up their guns - legal and illegal - without using force?


Peace talks? And who are the parties of these peace talks suppose to be? The hundreds of thousands of gang bangers in my city to all agree to stop shooting each other and give up their guns? Those are the people who are responsible for 80% of shootings in Chicago. Get rid of gang members and shootings will drastically lower. Democrats know all this but they provide political protection to these people in exchange for votes. They say it's not a teenagers fault that he shot 3 people with an illegal gun, no it's a race issue, it's a police issue, etc - it's all bull$hit - no one wants to take responsibility for their actions because its easy to play victim - and the left encourages it. It's the same **** when that black kid got shot by cops in Chicago. The media got so focused on the cop that shoot a black 'unarmed' teenager but no one talks about the fact that he was in a stolen jaguar, surrounded by cops, told to get out with his hands up, and instead gasses and tries to run over the cops - who then fire back.The left depicts the cop as the villain yet they'd gloss over the fact he was in a stolen jaguar and tried to run the cop over BEFORE the cop shot back and was given numerous chances to surrender. But of course ' he a good boy - he dindu nuffin - he wuz gettin his life together' yeah sure mom - your son wasn't carrying books in that backpack when he got caught - he had screwdrivers and tools to break into cars and a black ski mask

Patriotism is racism.

Of course it is in the left's eyes. Obama would salute marines with a coffee cup. Patriotism is white supremacy and racism in the left's eyes. Except look at the US military and you'll see how many blacks and hispanics are in the armed forces.

Ha HA reminds me when I use to go to the army base with some friends for breakfast and some white boys with black eyes,who had never seen a black guy in there life and when they joined the army, met a black guy and called him a N!$$(r,LOL the worst was that they couldnt even report the nights incident as it would reflect as a bad case on them.

No, you never have, you still don't and you never will. All you do is sending "thoughts and prayers". Remember what action the NRA took after Sandy Hook when the vast majority demanded some gun control? That's right, me neither. They went mute and after a week or so that dipsh*it LaPierre reappeared with his "brilliant" idea of arming teachers and putting armed guards in front of our schools. What's next? Security guards with a 9mm Magnum in front of day care centers? Metal detectors and bomb sniffing dogs in movie theatres? Full body cavity search before you are allowed to enter a grocery store? If you can't see what's wrong with this picture, then I'm afraid I can't help you. The NRA and their minions, the GOP, have never done anything to protect the American people from gun violence. Their only answer is "more guns" so that the manufacturers can up their sales and donate additional millions to the Republican Party. That's what it's all about: money and greed.


You've been here for 4 months, how do you know? LOL!

If you think that blindly following Trump into the abyss is what "makes America great again", then go ahead. I for one prefer a tolerant nation that continues to be welcoming to immigrants and that doesn't allow its children to be massacred by brainless fools who think that an automatic weapon and a rocket launcher is a God given right granted by the Constitution. Voicing criticism does not equal anti-Americanism, but people like you will probably never understand that concept. There is no American exceptionalism, my friend, and if you ever manage to cross your county line and travel a bit, you will find out.

Neither has the left. In fact, they are the ones encouraging the conditions in the ghettos and illegal immigration from latam countries like El Salvador and Honduras exacerbating the problem of gun violence which is overwhelmingly caused by people who are illegally unable to obtain guns. They care more about illegal immigrants and anchor babies than citizens who have lived here for generations. When there's tens of millions of criminals, the largest prison population of any country in the world - even more than china (we have 20% of the worlds prisoners despite only 3% of the population - obviously most of those prisoners are going to get out one day) and illegals are flooding this country.... Yet you expect law abiding citizens not to exercise their constitutional rights to pursue happiness and be able to have a secure home and be able to have a fighting chance against the millions of criminals with illegal guns who seek to do harm?


Poland only welcomes certain immigrants that fit a simple criteria - work, assimilate, contribute and don't cause problems.... The Poles can see that the majority of the migrants coming from ME and Africa since 2015 that have arrived do not meet that criteria. Ukranians, Indians, Belarussians, Italians, etc. who have migrated to Poland however have. That is why we want immigration for those countries and not ME or Africa.


How wrong you are - of course there's American exceptionalism. We're the richest most powerful country in the world and the US dollar is the most popular currency int he world. The US has gone against the UN and security council countless times, oftentimes with actions I disagree with. Nonetheless, America is special and unlike any other country and it has certain privileges for being the biggest swinging d1ck in the room.

In countries such as Germany, most of Scandinavia as well I imagine, the ONLY way in which any private citizen (the operative word here) can ever hope to legally obtain a weapon is by taking a mandatory aka certified course in how to operate such a firearm, then through the application for a state-sponsored license accurately attesting to the individual's proven ability to operate said weapon!

America is about the laxest country in this regard among the industrialized nations today, not to mention that her primary care for all is basically in the toilet.......on the same level as Costa RicaLOL

Along with with many other issues regarding standardization, this country's become a joke, and the joke's on us.

... migrants have turned the places from beautiful countries into rape capitals, no go's for white european women and police,... [places where radical muslims drive crowds into people, stab people for buying beer on ramadam, and grope/rape thousands of women a year. Now in Sweden, Somalis are throwing grenades at people killing little kids.

Just look at all the grenade attacks in Sweden:

Even far left site acknowledges this:
qz.com/886244/open-borders-and-vintage-balkan-hand-grenades-are-being-blamed-for-a-crime-wave-in-sweden

time.com/4990765/sweden-bombs

Malmo no go zone - big surprise.... not....
express.co.uk/news/world/906242/Sweden-explosion-Malmo-Von-Lingens-police-station-lockdown

dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5281677/Swedish-police-station-rocked-hand-grenade-attack.html

Notice how the list become EXPONENTIALLY greater after 2015 - the same year Sweden became Swedistan
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_grenade_attacks_in_Sweden


Same as the US's concealed carry classes.

Well of course, eventually all the bad guys will end up being shot and killed just like back in the old west with Billie the Kid to Bonnie & Clyde to Bin Laden.

Seems to be working pretty good so far.


Understandable since you are a migrant yourself. (Who you trying to get in from Aussie ?)


Do you have any idea who you are talking to ?
Sig has visited more countries in the last six months then you will in your life time.

Australia is notorious for the ridiculous amount of pedophiles in it including the most notorious ones Scully (who tortured an 18 year old and sold the videos for 10k a pop on the dark web) and McCoole who ran several day care centers in which he abused children including babies. Such people should suffer a slow agonizing death.

...ahemm, most places in our country, save for East Coast metropoli like New York, Boston, possibly D.C. included, laugh and merrily give the middle finger to rules, laws, regulations etc. as the stuff of sissies, Dirk, hate to disappoint ya!! Tell the Clyven Bundy Bunch about the need to follow rules and they'll take shotgun to yer butt, dude:-)

Sure. concealed carry classes are offered, but are they attended, except by the instructor?LOL

Hell, guns are still readily "available" for purchase at a bleedin' Wall Mart, they can be demonstrated at gun shows (of which there are many) and look at the numbers of people, Nikolas Cruz as a prime example, whom our wonderful FBI allowed to slip through the cracks, including Dylan Roof etc.....

I was talking about legal immigration, of course.


And? We lose tens of thousands of people to gun violence each year, our school system is a joke, child poverty (a.k.a. "food insecurity") and abuse abounds, drug addiction is a major problem - just to name a few. Nothing exceptional or something to be proud of here. America is a great country in many respects, but there are also heaps of other nations out there which do certain things much better than us.


Is that you, Sig? Ha ha ha.

Spot on, TheOther!

Of course, but that doesn't mean a policy that works in Australia or Germany or even Canada will work in the US.


Almost all due to ILLEGAL guns - not legal ones.


That's because democrats run the public school system in most major cities, hence it falls apart just like everything they touch. Poland spends less money than Illinois on its schools yet the kids are far smarter and years ahead.

Child poverty - well, if poor people didn't pop out 5 kids to 3 different dads so they could get a bigger section 8 apartment and more money to spend on weaves, nails, and Jordans instead of feeding and educating the kids this wouldn't happen. My parents were poor but made good long term decisions - hence why we didn't go hungry even though we had less money than people living off welfare.

And as far as drug addiction - well, that's simple. If you're going to do hard drugs you're going to get addicted. A famous Mexican narco once said - 'if you smoke the pipe, you're going to get burned' Even heroin is too weak now for all these punk ass kids - they're going for fentanyl and dropping like flies because of it - especially when they mix alcohol or sedatives with opiates.

All right, but at least see if certain aspects of those laws can be implemented here, not just chuck out the baby with the bathwater!!

Better yet, tell the Bureau of Land Management the need to follow the rules.
If that was the case the hero Bundy Bunch would not have had to force them to back down.

If you don't try, you won't find out. That's the problem of believing in the concept of exceptionalism: it prevents you from learning and seeing things from a different angle.


That doesn't really matter. Where did all the guns come from in the first place? The number of weapons has exploded in the past two or three decades.

Besides, most of the kids in the hood don't give 2 sh1ts about school and are more concerned with hanging out on the corner. Notice how different the graduation rates are between whites overall and even hispanics compared to blacks.


Try what? Total gun confiscation like Australia? It will be a bloodbath. Besides, why should legal gun owners who haven't committed any crimes which would prevent them from owning a gun be help responsible because other people commit shootings with ILLEGAL weapons.

Again, the vast majority - easily of 90% of ALL gun violence is caused by illegal guns - mostly gang members shooting it out and then a small percent (at least in Chicago) 10-20% is legal guns used by cops or civilians in self defense.


Obviously they were created in factories - a lot of gun manufacturers are headquartered in the US - all with the intention of going into legal users' hands. However, some of those guns are stolen from homeowners, pawn shops, are bought in straw purchases, even cop cars and police stations have been robbed for guns before. Then add all the illegal guns especially 1911 colt 45s coming from the Philippines.

Like I said, criminals will ALWAYS find a way to acquire a gun if that's what they want - regardless of the country. All you need is money and to look hard enough - even in Australia. Well, since there's millions upon millions of criminals, and you can't be a proper criminal atleast not a street gang member (as opposed to a white collar criminal) without having a gun

Then something's wrong in our society, don't you think?


That's not what it was, Adrian. They banned semi-automatic weapons, prohibited their import and implemented a countrywide buyback program. Most people gave up their weapons voluntarily, and it worked. No more mass shootings, suicides down significantly.

fortune.com/2018/02/20/australia-gun-control-success

Exactly - and most the people were probably legal owners who received some sort of compensation for their guns. You think most Aussie criminals especially the biker gangs that rule the meth and coke trade walked right into a police station and said here have all my guns?

I can guaruntee you that the majority of gang members would NEVER give up their guns - which are almost all illegally owned and acquired and responsible for the vast majority of shootings not just in Chicago but all over the US.


Of course. America is hugely messed up in countless ways. From the ridiculous amount of shootings, to now schools forcing kids to play soccer without a soccer ball so there's no score hence no 'loser' of the game so no one's feelings get hurt, to all the effeminate males, to the people trying to convince 99% of society that there's 72 genders and gay propoganda is okay to broadcast to children, to the AIPAC dominated jew party system, and much much more.... Guns, especially illegal ones as they are responsible for almost all of the gun violence (even violence caused by legal guns is more often than not in response to some criminbal with an illegal gun or doing something illegal) are just one of many problems. With the political landscape and the way society has changed especially in the past 10-15 years, there's honestly no hope for US to return to the glory days of past generations. Before we use to hunt communists, now they're teaching our kids.

Is it fair to say that America has so many guns now that it's impossible to regulate things to a European level?

Exactly - and not even because there's so many legal guns, but illegal ones.


If you ban semi-autos that's basically banning every single modern gun. All you're left with after autos/semiautos is muzzle loaders, bb guns, bolt action (which if is probably banned too as it could be classified as semi auto) etc. Pistols, civilian issue rifles, shotguns are all semi auto. That means the 22 KBKS rifle i got as a kid would be banned even though you can't kill more than a crow or rat with it. It took 3 shots to kill a possum it didn't go down till i got a head shot

In Detroit on 23% of Blacks graduate from high school.
Did you know that obama implemented government programs in the Chicago schools (paid for by our government) NOT to call the police on minority students that commit misdemeanor crimes like bringing a knife to school ?

It's true and the Florida school where the shootings took place had this same program there.
It was created to balance out the ratio of between Whites vs. Blacks and Latino's arrests and crimes since it was so disproportional.
Let's put the blame where it belongs and quit blaming the NRA.

I'm aware. Trump is complaining too about California doing nothing about enforcing border control, immigration, etc. He's p1ssed and wants to fire everyone and replace them. He has been sending ICE to sanctuary cities since the politicians there don't want to do anything and are against their future voters being taken away from them and deported. Personally, I don't mind Latinos - even if they're illegal as long as theyre hard working and contributing. Even if they don't pay federal income taxes theres still plenty of ways in which illegals Latinos benefit the society. Black males are citizens, know the language, and are able bodied yet they prefer to go on welfare and make money on the side by selling drugs. I mean its obviously not all black teen/20 year old males, but it is a huge chunk of them. Just drive through the west and south side of chicago and youll see what i mean. The thing is, since latinos are mostly normal family people, due to their sheer numbers in the US especially chicago where they're 1/3 of the population basically, well even if say 10% of teens or even 1%-5% of all latinos are gang members, criminals, etc. thats still a sh1t load of people

@You got that one right on the money, Johnny!

In the end, it's a basic culture in this country that's got to change, gun "laws" or no gun laws. My opinion anyway, for whatever it's worth.

Obama and Mayor Rahm Emanual`s policies have destroyed much more than the Chicago public school system. They have the highest payed union teachers in the nation with the lowest grade results. Why would you send your child there or even stay in this battle ground sanctuary city? Chicago has the toughest guns laws in the country and they dont work! Only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun. We all know we cant count on the Police here!

Im out of here in just a few more years:)


I would say its too late as well. Even with a gun by back program, we all know the criminals wont turn them in and the police are worthless for protection.

This would also instantly create millions of felons that would refuse to give up there weapons causing havoc on our legal system.


I was never in favor for the AR-15 and other assault rifles for the public sector, these weapons are for the military. You dont need an assault rifle to go Deer hunting! I've have shotguns and pistols (legally) most of my life without incident and plan on keeping them for home defense.