The BEST Guide to POLAND
Unanswered  |  Archives 
 
 
User: Guest

Posts by genecps  

Joined: 25 Jun 2012 / Male ♂
Last Post: 12 Jul 2013
Threads: 7
Posts: 131
From: USA, Huntsville
Speaks Polish?: No
Interests: History

Displayed posts: 138 / page 1 of 5
sort: Latest first   Oldest first   |
genecps   
21 Jul 2012
Genealogy / Poland Heraldry and Nobility in names/families [59]

Do you mean what were the relations between the szlachta nad the peasantry? If so, they weren't great, I'm afraid

Can you elaborate more on this?
genecps   
21 Jul 2012
Genealogy / Poland Heraldry and Nobility in names/families [59]

No Puzzie, not part of Polish szlachta!

Just curious about it.

Puzzie, I find it strange that a Jewish family from Eastern Europe has European looking family crests. It's weird to myself. I know a Jewish guy who's family converted to Catholicism and they became Polish Lords. He recently took up Judaism.

PS. I didn't know your zlata voted on who is going to be the lead monarch. That's friggin cool! That does give a certain "family" feel to the whole nation. Especially since Poland had a such a large number of Lords (so it seems). How was the general relations between lords and their landed subjects?
genecps   
21 Jul 2012
Genealogy / Poland Heraldry and Nobility in names/families [59]

Nice to meet you, brother.

Puzzie, I'm not going to go into what I am, I got a whole threat I'm explaining my origins, and keep arguing with a few people on this website about who and what I am. I will tell you this: I'm a white guy who practices Judaism from Eastern Ukraine, my grandpa and grandma are from Belarus, some on the other side are from Northern Ukraine. We found 3 European family crests belonging to our clan, and we got some oral tradition of being from royal stock. By religious tradition our last name is the highest "honorary" one can get, and we were also given the title of a Kosher butcher (so everyone in our village, including the priest has to pay us if he wants to eat meat). Here's a link to our families facebook group. I think that can sum up who we are better.

facebook.com/groups/223616031059309/

(This is the post where we, and my hators argue, I just hope they can keep it in there and not bring it into this threads. I'm posting this for your amusement)

Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine

Correction: Ozi Dan, I wanted to say that all royal clans were usually affiliated with their countries military. So it's no surprise to find that you have a solid military tradition in your family.
genecps   
21 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

No, Khazars became Jews because they thought that being the founder religion and always having Islam to one side and Christianity to another, it would bring a balancing effect.

The Interest is one of the most necessary tool in the development of the economy.

That's why Islam stagnated, no one wanted to give any money for any building of enterprises.
genecps   
21 Jul 2012
Genealogy / Poland Heraldry and Nobility in names/families [59]

Ozi Dan, Ya, it seems everyone from royal clans seem to be afilited with their countries family at one point or another. And owners of land, and usualy a small town.

Puzzie, you are welcome. Also I think that Polsih were slightly different then a lot of other Europeans because they treated their royals much more equaly, and I think Polish as people are much more prone to give people respect. Your zlata had primarily the Lord title, unlike the others, which had:

King & Queen consort or Princess consort
Queen & King consort or Prince consort
Queen dowager or Queen mother
Princess dowager or Princess mother
Grand Duke & Grand Duchess
Grand Prince & Grand Princess
Viceroy & Vicereine
Archduke & Archduchess
Infante & Infanta
Duke & Duchess
Prince & Princess
Marquess & Marchioness
Marquis & Marquise
Margrave & Margravine
Count & Countess
Earl & Countess
Viscount & Viscountess
Baron & Baroness
Freiherr & Freifrau
Baronet & Baronetess
Hereditary Knight, Ritter
Knight & Dame
Nobile, Edler von
genecps   
21 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

BTW. All of you are right. Khazar culture died a long time ago (except among the tiny Lithuanian Karaim community).

Just think of us as white Jews with Asiatic eyes who like violence & mooony.

I'm sure it will help you sleep at night think you guys are absolutely right.

;)



genecps   
21 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Oi Vei;)

I've gotten offered into quiet a few groups: KKK, Posse Comitatus, skinheads. When my dad came out and stayed with me in Texas, he was joking that he was going to join the KKK. Living in L.A. can do that to you. (lolevich!)

I know you think that I'm trying to show you how important I am to European culture, and because Khazars "are Europeans", stopped the spread of Islam to Europe. But the real truth is when I'm among most Europeans. I feel like a guest. I'm like a ghost. I look like all of you, but I only feel half related to you same about Semitic Jews. I like to visit your country your culture, but I just wanna live among my own. So I made it my life's mission to do what ever it takes to convince as many of us to move to a "magical, mystical place, I like to call Zion", Jewish Autonomous Oblast.

When I was talking about my people, I meant Segal ( Segal, Sagal, Shagal, Segalchik, Segalevich, Segaliovich, Segalov, Segalovich, Segalovskij, "Segel, Segelman, Segelson, Segelevich, Segil, Seglin, Segolov-Shchegolev, Sejgal, Sejgalus, Sejgel, Sigal, Sigalchik, Sigalskij, Sgalov, Sigalovich, Sigalovskij, Sigalus, Sigolovich, Sycal, Sycalovskiy, Tsigal, Tsigal, Tsycal, Tsoglin, Salal, Dagalchik, Sagalin, Sagalov, Sagalovich, Sagalovskij, Sagelevich, Saglovskij, Sagol, Sagolovich, Sogalov, Sogalov-Shchegolev, Sogalovskij, Sogolov, Sogolovich, Sogolovskij, Shegal, Shegal, Shegalov, Shegelman, Shejgal, Shigalov, Shugal, Shugol, Shugul, Shagaliovich, Shagalov, Shagelman, Zegal, Zegelman, Zigal, Zigelman, Zygal, Zagel) and everyone related to us.

I get enough people who recognize my "true blue royal ass"

PS. Just found a 3rd family crest, with our last name on it.

(and by the way, I am their gypsy prince)

facebook.com/groups/223616031059309/
genecps   
20 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

And nothing both of you said points to anything I said as false. So far all the people who have the q1b haplogroup (Turkic people haplogroup) out of the Russian Jews either have red hair or have family members who are red haired. So what's more likely, that the reason they have red hair is because they are descended from a known group of red heads who converted to Judaism, or that they just happen to get it from Russo/Polish?Belarus people who barely have any members with this one feature? And Joh, what "academic" qualifications are you talking about? A Degree in engineering? lol
genecps   
20 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Your reasoning isn't up to par since you have not contributed a single fact or a single reference! Just your opinions.

As far as a PhD, right after I get my MBA, that's exactly what I was thinking of doing for fun, getting a degree in History (Masters and later a PhD) with a thesis and then a book in this study (There is even a University called Xazar in Azerbaijan;). And since the more I dig about my family, the more "cool" stuff tends to show up, I'm sure there are more and more things that will come out. The reason it makes no sense to you is simple, this is not you "lane" (you really need to argue by bringing in references, not saying, I don't believe none of them, it's like talking to a drunk!). After the fall of Khazaria, Khazars, who by that time were already heavily involved in farming were only distinguishable from other populations by their faith, and thus became known as Karaim! Karaim is a branch of Judaism, so obviously they just became known as Jews. I'm a Jew, my descent is mostly from the people who left Southern Russia about 600 to 800 years ago and settled in Belarus, not Hebrews who left Jerusalem and surrounding areas 2,000 years ago. I got a written family tree dating back almost 300 years, and in our family mixing with non Jews is unheard of. We all look very white, non Semitic, straight red hair, slightly Asiatic eyes, rounded faces is our key traits, even on distant cousins. We do not look like Polish, Russians, or Ukrainians, and genetic testing confirms that we are much closer related to Chuvash, Hungarians, and Turks rather then Slavs, so to say that we are a product of Hebrews mixing with non Jewish people of the region we lived in is completely inaccurate. But I'm sure you'll say DNA testing is bull too. ;o)
genecps   
20 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

200 year gap, but what kind of history do you expect from a farming community?

That "side show" is a community with it's own traditions.

Everything you said so far amounts to "neiner-neiner".

I like what Des Essientes said: Google "Inductive Reasoning", I think yours is broken.
genecps   
20 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

"Avraham ibn Daud, a renowned writer, who reported meet rabbinical students from Khazar in Toledo, Spain in the mid-12th century wrote: Khazars remained in Southern Russia over 200 years after Khazaria was incorporated into greater Kievan Rus Kingdom"

That brings it up to 1200's! Lithuanian Karaim (the name Khazars adopted after being incorporated into Southern Russia;) were brought to Lithuania to serve as guards in about 1400 AD, while other Karaim (Khazars) moved everywhere in between Lithuania and Hungary! The only dark part is 1200 to 1400, but it is known that they mostly farmed and raised cows, and lived in piece. And nothing unusual happened, and Karaim is just a branch of Judaism, so they just became known as Jews;)

So if it offends your senses to call me a Khazar, call me Karaim, or Karaite!
genecps   
20 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Here's some education for the above anti Khazar "theorists" (bulls#!t artists is more like it!):

1. Khazars Asiatic? If Khazars were Asiatic, then so would be all the other groups Khazars are known to be related to: Magyars (Hungarians), Bulgars, Tatars, Azeri, Chuvash, etc. But all are white non Asiatic people.

2. Turkic Asiatic? I asked Kazakhs (Turkic people) who have a heavy Asiatic genome mixing if they were Asians mixed with white people? They told me NO, they were white people who mixed with Asians. Turkic language group is one of the biggest groups in the Aryan (Indo-European & Indo-Iranian) Language family. They are all Caucasian people. But many Turkic people in Southern Russia have mixed with Mongolian groups ( likeTurkmen).

3. Red hair Jewish trait? I know the stories of David and Solomon being ruddy... and no other Jewish group except European Jews is known for red hair, if red hair was a Jewish trait it would show up among Yemeni, Mizrahi, Sephardim in high volume. Red hair is a receive gene, which means that if both parents have red haired ancestors 1 in 4 kids at least will be red haired, that's why you can find red headed black people (I got one in my class), but not blonde black people. This gene is extremely strong and would be seen in other Jewish groups in high volume. But that is not so!

Since none of you have done much reading about Khazars (as seen from your ignorant postings about turkic people and Khazars themselves), here's some quotes from Arab writers who lived with Khazars and wrote about them (look it up;):

"The 10th-century Muslim geographer al-Istakhri claimed that the White Khazars were strikingly handsome with reddish hair, white skin and blue eyes."

"According to Hispano-Arab historian and geographer Ali ibn Musa ibn Sa'id el-Maghribi (1213-1286), who wrote that "their complexions are white, their eyes blue, their hair flowing and predominantly reddish, their bodies large and their natures cold. Their general aspect is wild." It would seem evident, therefore, that from here derives the epithet "the red Jews."

"The investigation of the genetic relationship among three Jewish communities revealed that Kurdish and Sephardic Jews were indistinguishable from one another, whereas both differed slightly, yet significantly, from Ashkenazi Jews. The differences among Ashkenazim may be a result of low-level gene flow from European populations and/or genetic drift during isolation. In comparison with data available from other relevant populations in the region, Jews were found to be more closely related to groups in the north of the Fertile Crescent (Kurds, Turks, and Armenians) than to their Arab neighbors."

The last statement is from The American Journal of Human Genetics, here's a link: ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1274378/

So maybe just STFU you ignoramuses;)
genecps   
19 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

I know you think it's an imaginary identity, but being a white guy, who's dad told you that his dad told him his whole life that we are descendants of Jewish royalty from the South. It is what it is. And you know what, genetic testing proves we are related to Hungarians, Chuvash, and other Turkic tribes, so there it is! But really, I think all white Jews even of not Khazar origins should consider JAO instead of Israel. I have no interest in mixing with dark Jews, I have never dated one and never will. Never found girls with dark hair or dark skin that much attractive (except Chicanas, but would never marry one). And there are a lot that come across different Q1b haplogroup website that wonder... "I'm white, I have red hair or it's common in my family do I have the same haplogroups thst point to Turkic origins, or get encouraged from other people who have done the tests, and go do it and find out that yup, it's true for them.

But I'll tell you like this cousin, I know religious Jews and Zionists think every Jews belongs in Israel... I'm of the opinion that white Jews should consider making a place for themselves, like JAO for example (and a bunch of us have committed to start an expat community there). Most of us do not feel in sink with the greater Jewish community, We feel Jewish, just not Semites. As they say you do you, and I'll do me.

Yehudi... it's a white thing, you wouldn't understand. lol

Yehudi, you really need to read writings about Khazars written by Arabs who lived among them and wrote about them, not articles written by Zionists who obviously will write anything to debunk Arabs.

but what's more realistic, that Ashkenazi Jews who never mixed with outsiders mixed with a group of Jewish of Khazar origin, or that there is a such a huge number of white goim that mixed in when mixing was almost unheard of? And why are Red hair only atributed to Ashkenazi Jews, when all you anti Khazar theorists claim that David and Solomon are gingers? How come Sephardi Jews are not described as having lots of red heads, or Morocan, Yemeni, etc?

Anti Khazar theories are just bull, by ignorant people who refuse to read material, and are just upsessed with anything that might harm their claim to Israel.

For all of you it's about Israel, not the truth!!!
genecps   
19 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

One million people....with all that mixing and begettin going on you choose to be a Khazar rather than something less exotic.

Exotic to you, but passed on from father to son doesn't seem that much exotic, just seems like what it is, our descent!

PS. I don't claim descent, I claim direct paternal descent. And as far as I know, it's only my dad, his brother, my brother, and myself.

Will anyone believe me? Some do, most don't. Will it change what I claim? Nope! Will it change their minds? Nope! Tis life.
genecps   
18 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Jon, that's the thing. We became just normal people. We committed to Judaism. If anything I can attribute to Khazars is our need to be warriors. Everyone in my family was a competitive wrestlers or boxer. Everyone joined combat units of the military (no support units ever). And every time we buy land we plant stuff (green thumb runs deep). I spoke to distant cousins who I met on facebook not too long ago, and they said the same thing: did combat units in military spent many years doing somekind of martial arts, after military worked in security while going to college (bouncers/bodyguards, etc). Just simple country folks who respect education and warrior training. Other then that, the royal descent has been told to me over and over since I was 5 years old. Weather someone want's to or doesn't want to believe it, it is what it is. But I'm always finding things about our family and last name that point to that direction. Like 2 different looking European style family crests (unusual to see family crests from a Jewish family that did not convert to Christianity). Also my last name means: Prince of Levites or Assistant High Priest, kinda like they were honorary title to denote our families importance. And we know that my paternal heritage is not of Hebrew Levites, yet we got the Highest Levite title.

I didn't care for the article much. It is not well reserched. Just another guy stating his opinion to debunk the Arab claim. Another side of the extreme coin.
genecps   
18 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Jon, the culture survived. You just do not understand how. Khazars, when incorporated into Russia became farmers and ranchers. Then moved Westwards and continued ranching and farming. The men continued to teach their kids to be tough. Wrestling became the basis of the warrior tradition. And Judaism continued. Cultures change, that's just normal. We became citizens of Belarus, and now Russian Jews. In my family particularly, wealth was passed on, with verbal tradition of our royal descent.

As far as the article, just another one that says there is absolutely no Khazar blood among Jews. How unlikely is it that No One has Any Khazar Blood? Yet there are several communities still surviving: 2 in Lithuania, I in Crimea. And by the way, members of my family are not the only ones who claim heritage from the Khazar Aristocracy. I know one more family that claims this too, Krupa family. Like I said before Arabs take one extreme position, and Zionists take another. The truth is somewhere in the middle.
genecps   
17 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Khazar khan named Ratmir amongst the suitors for the hand of Ludmilla in his poem Ruslan and Ludmilla (I highly reccomend viewing the 1972 cinematic adaptation of this poem, not just for an example of the high esteem modern Russians have for the Khazars, but also for its mindblowingly surreal sets and special effects.)

Interesting, thanks, I will look it up.

I have spoken to one of the Ottomans from Donskie Cossacks (who is very Russian Orthodox Christian and is pretty Antisemitic), and after many discussions, even he agreed that I have claim to the land in Russia, and wished me luck on building my community in the Jewish Autonomous Oblast. What these anti-Khazar theorists do not realize is that just as it is important for them to have a claim on Israel, it is just as important to us to have a claim on our ancestral land: Russia!!! By calling me a product of mixed genetics, doesn't diminish my claim to Russia, as obviously... if I'm a product of Russian converts, I definitely can claim Russia as my motherland. but denying me my Khazar heritage is an assault on my Judaism, and the fact that my family, being European Warriors took Judaism as a rational and intelligent choice, and are not some shmucks who "married" up as these ignoramuses seem to imply!
genecps   
17 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Indeed, and the Khazars are Jews too.

Yah, I never thought how being Khazar made me any less a Jew!!

I'm not a Semite, you don't have to be a genius to figure that out, but I'm a 100% practicing Jew with 4 Jewish grandparents, who have 100% Jewish parents and grandparents.

BTW. The bible says land of Israel belongs to Jews, EVEN converts!!!

So all these crackpots are just screaming and hollering over NOTHING!!!

And Yehudi, if it hurts you so much to hear me say that Khazar is my heritage, then think of me as a Russian Jew, White Jew, or Karaite Jew, or maybe Aryan Jew. All would be true. Names of tribes change. Before Khazars used Khazar as their description, they were Huns. Hungarians used to be Magyars. Ukrainians used to Rusini, French/Spanish/Portugese used to be Visigoths. Italians used to be Romans, etc.

The funniest thing is that I have never come across a Russian Jew with red hair or a red beard who has ever denied the possibility of being descendant of the Khazars. Most actually seem to like it. And why not, no shame in being descended from great warriors who ran one of the biggest empires in Europe to date. And by the way Arab historians have many written accounts about Khazars. They seemed to have saved a lot of things in history that were destroyed by Medieval Christian Europe. It is a well known fact that European Renaissance started after crusaders came upon Arabic scripts that were translations of Greek Philosophy. We wouldn't even have Greek Philosophy today if it wasn't for great Arabic scholars. The Anti Khazar theorists are just mostly poorly educated Jews on this subject who will discount anything if it comes from Arab sources. Instead of making an honest attempt to filter the truth they just deny everything. In this respect they remind me of the disgusting Holocaust Deniers (not I'm not calling them disgusting like the later, just not-knowledgeable, which serves their purpose)!
genecps   
17 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

The whole Khazar bullsht is a figment of the imagination. Sure there were Khazars in history but their only recorded descendent is apparently your pal Genecps. They faded out of history a thousand years ago. On the other hand, the Jews just don't fade away. And our little "Project in palestine" is not fading away either. Get used to it - we'll be here long after your sorry ass is long forgotten.

Here's a video of a community of these "bulshit" people who don't exist anymore! lol

I certainly do not want to de-legitimize claim to Israel. I have dark Jews in my family, they are centainly descendants of Israelite's. But do you really think all the really white Jews from Russia belong n Israel?! Come on!! If that was so, I wouldn't hear from my friends in Israel how they dislike it there and plan on moving to the US!

PS. There's a bunch of us who claim Khazar Heritage, you just do not know about it. I know several communities in Ukraine and Tukey, and a bunch of people in the US!

PPS. I'm a Karaite Jew, and most Karaites consider themselves of Khazar heritage. And more and more white Jews of Eastern European descent are embracing both Karaim Judaism and possibility of their descent being of Khazar origins, that's why a lot of us are doing DNA testings.
genecps   
17 Jul 2012
Love / Nice Polish women photos [329]

Merged: Polish Girls

I didn't see any threads that show beautiful Polsih women, I'm sure I wouldn't be able to tell what one looks like, even though one of my ex's was a beautiful half Polish half Russian girl. So I figured I would start one!

youtube.com/watch?v=OulOwJpaYFM&feature=related

'Search' is your friend...

hehe, I guess you are right. lol
genecps   
17 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Exactly!!!

BTW. Magyars(Hungarians) are considered turkic people (like all tribes who were the major groups in the Hunnic Horde- Khazars, Bulgars, etc). Hungarian language is classified as Finno-Urgic which shows a posible connection between Finnish and Turkic way down the line, and certainly points to the similarities between Redhaired Khazars and Udmurts (who are Urgic speaking people)!

Being Khazar isn't even a threat to Jewish claims on Israel. There is only 1 in 20 Jews (5%, or roughly 1,000,000 people) who can even claim Khazar heritage!
genecps   
17 Jul 2012
History / Khazar migrations to Eastern Poland, Belarus, and Ukraine [106]

Yehudi, you couldn't be more wrong. Turkic people are white like any other Indo-European group. The reason modern people of Turkey are dark is from mixing with Arabs, Persians (Indo-Iranian a.k.a. Aryan) were very white too, until mixing with Arabs. BTW, Bulgarians, Tatars, Chuvash, and Hungarians/Magyars (who are related to Udmurts who are closely related to the Irish) are all turkic people. BTW. I got slightly Asiatic eyes like most people in my extended family, but that is not from the Turkic people but from Asians who lived and mixed with Turklic people. and I do consider myself Turkic.

The misconception about Turkic people being Asiatic is common by people who are not familiar with European migrations. Turkic tribes just remained in Southern Russia and Central Asia and over time due to close proximity mixed with different Asian groups. If Khazars would not have moved West and settled everywhere between Lithuania and Hungary *to include Belarus, Ukraine, Bulgaria, and Eastern Poland) I would also probably look more Asiatic too.