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Posts by boletus  

Joined: 13 Apr 2011 / Male ♂
Last Post: 11 Nov 2012
Threads: 30
Posts: 1,361
From: Canada, Toronto
Speaks Polish?: yes

Displayed posts: 1391 / page 2 of 47
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boletus   
4 Nov 2012
History / Polish relation about Russians, Ukrainians? [281]

Start by reading up on Mickiewicz, how he was received in St. Petersburg's literary saloons

Just so our foreign friends understand it well, Mickiewicz did not go to St. Petersburg for pleasure, he was rather on a tour organized by the tsarist police:

In 1823 he was arrested, investigated for his political activities, specifically his membership in the Philomaths society, and in 1824 banished to central Russia.

his Crimean Sonnets, and how Russian writers were in turn influenced by him, and his views of Pushkin, who greatly admired him.

That's partially true. But most of it is just exaggeration. Much of what was said in the past about the friendship and mutual influence of these two poets was coloured by the politics of Communism ("Long live the fraternal love between Soviet Union and Polish People's Republic") and in the distant past - between a subdued nation and a nation doing the subduing. In the case of the latter, it did not cost much to pat the Poles on the back and show some patronizing attitude: as Mickiewicz was often being shown as a kind of a backdrop for the great Pushkin.

Much what was said about their eye to eye communication looks quite apocryphal and it does not make much sense when viewed from afar in the historical context.

Much what was written by the two poets shows how different they actually were: Mickiewicz, a romantic hapless revolutionary and Pushkin - less hysterically patriotic and actually the tsarist apologist. After all Pushkin committed three anti-Polish poems about the Russian military response to the 1830-31 Polish Uprising, which seemed starkly to contradict the ideals of poetry which scholars typically emphasize in both poets.

The "trilogy" includes the poems "Before the Sacred Tomb" ("Pered grobnitseiu sviatoi"), "To the Calumniators of Russia" ("Klevetnikam Rossii"), and "The Anniversary of Borodino" ("Borodinskaia godovshchina");...

Friends of Pushkin such as Viazemskii and the Turgenev brothers were horrified by the poem's jingoism. In them Pushkin asserts that Russia is within its rights to crush the romantic resistance of Poles to their fated rulers; the image of all Slavic rivers flowing into the Russian sea in "To the Calumniators of Russia" makes this clear ("slavianskie l′ ruch′i sol′iutsia v russkom more")....

Mickiewicz may have responded to these poems in his poem published in 1833, "To My Muscovite Friends" ("Do Przyjaciół Moskali") in which he reproaches those Russian poets who betrayed their Decembrist brothers in arms by remaining loyal to the tsar and taking payment for praising his victories. Pushkin may in turn have "responded" in his own poem of 1834, "He lived among us..." ("On mezhdu nami zhil") in which he reproaches Mickiewicz for giving in to the unruly crowd (buinaia chern′) of Polish émigrés in Europe.

Pushkin's own comments in letters to friends during the Polish Uprising of 1830-31 contributed to the picture of Mickiewicz as more "hysterical." Pushkin wrote to Sofia Khitrovo in December 1830 that "the love of country, such as it can exist in a Polish soul, has always been a funereal sentiment. Just look at their poet Mickiewicz."This cool assessment of Polish romanticism resonates with Pushkin's comment to Viazemskii in June 1831 about the length of the fighting and Poland's dramatic resistance: "All this is very well in a poetic sense. Nevertheless we must stifle them, and our delay is unbearable."

So much for the eternal friendship... :-)

pushkiniana.org/vol-4-articles--/227-dixon-article04.html
boletus   
4 Nov 2012
Language / Polish past tense of chodzic/ jezdzic? [23]

Well, you are right; and they have Chinese takeaway food:

Chińska kuchnia : na miejscu i na wynos
Wok Marvell oferuje wok - najlepsze jedzenie na dowóz
Woo To Go - Kuchnia chińska i tajska na miejscu i na wynos
Jedzenie na telefon, zamówienia na wynos
Oferujemy jedzenie na wynos
Dragon Box – chińskie jedzenie z dowozem na telefon
Bar chiński - dostawa na telefon
Chińskie żarcie na telefon.
boletus   
3 Nov 2012
History / Polish relation about Russians, Ukrainians? [281]

Still doesn't change the fact that there are no Slavs, outside of the immigrant community, in Paris.

Well, there were some in the past and there are still some in the present; and you can hardly call them immigrants: Guillaume Apollinaire, Michel and Axel Poniatowski, Elena Poniatowska, Nathalie Kosciusko-Morizet (and many of her famous ancestors), Irène Joliot-Curie, Helène Langevin-Joliot, Pierre Joliot, Ève Curie, Paul Landowski, Louis Mękarski, Philippe Duke of Anjou, Louis Dauphin of France (and a bunch of other children of Maria Leszczyńska and Louis XV), and so on... :-)
boletus   
3 Nov 2012
Language / i don't understand this, "rozmawianO" and "pitO"? [18]

@boletus are you a teacher?

No, god forbid. :-)
I actually knew my grammar the best at the age of 12-13. My mom, who was also my teacher, made sure that most, if not all, of us, knew the difference between "przydawka dopełnieniowa" and "przydawka dzierżawcza". But do not ask me such questions now. I would have to read about it first. :-)

He's the PF Oracle :)

You flatter me sir. :-)
boletus   
2 Nov 2012
Genealogy / Looking for Dziekanczyk family origins and more [6]

Thank you!
Linda

You are welcome.

And one more request, is there anyone who can give me a clue how to pronounce Dziekanczyk? I would hate to be saying wrong! :)

Press this:
translate.google.com/#pl/en/Dzieka%C5%84czyk
then press the speaker icon in the Polish (left) field.
boletus   
2 Nov 2012
Genealogy / Looking for Dziekanczyk family origins and more [6]

Would any of these names point me towards an origin?

Very unlikely. The place of birth or marriage is by far more useful that the surname alone.

The standard database of surnames "Moi Krewni" does not list any Dziekańczyk (with or without acute accent) living in contemporary Poland.

The name seems to be so incredibly rare that there are only four Google records pointing to "dziekańczyk" [with N acute] - three of them related to Rosalia Dziekańczyk (Grugiel) (c.1785 - 1830) on geni, Rozalia Dziekańczyk (Grugiel) (c.1785 - 1830) - Genealogy, geni.com/people/Rozalia-Dzieka%C5%84czyk/6000000012572293398 . Nothing exciting if this was your doing, but a real surprise - if not! :-)

There are only 144 Google records for "Dziekanczyk" [without accent over N]

But because the name is so rare, you might be incredibly lucky. Here what I have found in (Polish) Geneteka database:
Eva Dziekanczyk, born in 1816, Cekcyn, Kuiavian-Pomeranian Voivodship.

Altogether this database shows 5 births of "Dziekanczyk" in early 19th c. in this voivodship (villages Cekcyn and Świekatowo), two deaths (Cekcyn and Byszewo), and four marriages (Cekcyn and Byszewo). That's it. For the entire Poland.

geneteka.genealodzy.pl/index.php?rid=A&from_date=&to_date=&search_lastname=Dzieka%F1czyk&exac=1&rpp2=50&rpp1=0&bdm=&url1=&w=02kp&op=gt

Cekcyn is the picturesque village in the middle of 'Bory Tucholskie' Region. It is located in Tuchola County, just south of Kashubian Region of Gdańsk Pomerania.

You have to realize that this database is under construction, created by hand by volunteers, who scan old parish books page by page. Many of the parishes have not been yet indexed.

The Pomeranian Genealogical Association has this detailed record for Eva Dziekanczyk:
(Parish/Registry Cekcyn) (year 1816) (book 200) (Picture no 0077) (number 44) (Child forename: Eva) (Father's forename: Joannes) (Farther's surname: Dziekanczyk) (Mother's forename: Rosalia) (Mother's surname: Gruglowna)

ptg.gda.pl/index.php/certificate/action/showinfo/parishId/42
Some explanations: Given names in parish books used to be written in Latinized forms; hence Eva rather than Polish Ewa, or Johannes rather than Polish Jan, Rosalia rather than Rozalia.

Gruglowna, or rather Gruglówna, or more correctly Grugelówna is a maiden version of the surname Grugel. Grugielówna would stem from Grugiel. Spelling aside, it looks like this is the right record.

There is a parish in Cekcyn, but since its church was built in 1869, no records of Eva (Ewa) Dziekanczyk would be there. But, if they exist, they must be somewhere in national archives, or in some catholic hierarchy archive. And indeed, the PTG (Pomeranian Genealogical Association) points out to the source of the record we found, ptg.gda.pl/index.php/certificate/action/showinfo :

It is a book of baptisms #200, covering the years 1802-1834, indexed by the volunteer Jan Kontek, source stored in the Pelplin Diocese Archive.

Archiwum Diecezjalne w Pelplinie
The Diocesan Archive in Pelplin
ul. Biskupa Dominika 11
83-130 Pelplin
Phone: (+48) (58) 536 12 21; (+48) (58) 536 12 22
Fax (+48) (58) 536 16 99

archiwum@pelplin.diecezja.org
pelplin.diecezja.org/diecezja-en
boletus   
2 Nov 2012
Genealogy / Lublin - Looking for Klepacki - Klepadlo - Klepackzi - Blaschik - etc Ancestors [18]

These is the quintessential information. Without it you would not go anywhere in Poland's archives. Now you have at least the starting points for your searches in Poland.

1. Stanisława Błaszczyk, born in KALISZ, Wielkopolska Voivodship (Greater Poland Province), 1889-05-08
German spelling: Kalisch, Poznan Provinz, Prussia

2. Zygmunt Klepacki, born in Krasnopol, 1879-06-08
Krasnopol comes from the combination of words "krasny" (lovely, colourful, red) + pol (from Greek "polis", a city).
However, here are some ambiguities, since there are, or were in the past, several places of this name in former Poland. I know of at least three, and there were possibly some more:

a. Krasnopol (old name), now Niżankowice (ukr. Нижанковичі), region Stary Sambor, Lwów (Lviv) Province,
pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ni%C5%BCankowice_(Ukraina)
b. Krasnopol, Żytomierz Province, Ukraine
c. Krasnopol, gmina Krasnopol, Sejny County, Podlaskie Voivodship, NE Poland.
pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krasnopol_(wojew%C3%B3dztwo_podlaskie)

The surname Klepacki (fem. Klepacka) is quote popular in Podlaskie Voivodship. See this map moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/klepacki.html and pay attention to red colours there.

One old fragmentary database shows 50 Klepackis born between 1800 and 1885 in that province; particularly in Rajgród, Suwałki,Trzcianne and Tykocin but none of them are particularly related to Krasnopol. Go here geneteka.genealodzy.pl , select "Podlaskie", type in Klepacki surname, the range of years to search, number or records per page (50, say), and type of the record: all, births, marriages, deaths.

Another database, related to family WIELKA, has an index of marriages from Krasnopol between 1808 and 1877. It shows one record related to Klepacki:
1847-01-09, Tomasz Klepacki married Leonarda Mochniewicz in Krasnopol

Without much of the search, I can only assume, that whatever data is available from this region - which was not burnt or damaged otherwise - is now in the archives of Suwałki:

Archiwum Państwowe w Suwałkach, ul. T. Kościuszki 69,
16-400 Suwałki, tel./fax 87 566 21 67,
e-mail: archiwum@suwalki.ap.gov.pl
So at one point you may want to contact them for search and retrieval of birth certificate of Zygmunt Klepacki. This would give you a confirmation of his birth, as well as the names of his parents. The service would cost you few bucks/ hour for search (maximum 10 hours) plus few bucks per printed copy.
boletus   
2 Nov 2012
Genealogy / Lublin - Looking for Klepacki - Klepadlo - Klepackzi - Blaschik - etc Ancestors [18]

A note - someone above questioned the spelling of my grandfather's name - all I can say is: His immigration form - typed- spells his name as : Zygmont. He, himself, hand signed his first name as Zygmunt. Again - I truly do not know who is wrong/right - the spelling on his tombstone is different still - Siegmund.

Many people are getting too sensitive while being corrected in Polish spelling of first names and surnames of their ancestors. Some of them got visibly angry. You have to realize that nobody here really cares how do you spell your names or names of your grandfathers in America, Canada or Australia. But you need to be reminded that you will not get anywhere far in Poland and Polish archives with your made up Americanized names. That's why you are being corrected, not for some perverse pleasure of some sort.

That's said, I already explained it to you: both forms Siegmund (alt. Sigmund) and Zygmunt are correct. The former is German, the latter is Polish spelling. They all came from the name Sigismund - a German proper name, meaning "protection through victory", from Old High German sigu "victory" + munt "hand, protection".

Many European nobles and several Polish Kings wore this name:
Sigismund I the Old (1467–1548), King of Poland, Grand Duke of Lithuania => Polish spelling: Zygmunt I Stary
Sigismund II Augustus (1520–1572), King of Poland, Grand Duke of Lithuania => Polish spelling: Zygmunt II August
Sigismund III Vasa (1566–1632), King of Sweden (as Sigismund) and Poland, Grand Duke of Lithuania => Polish spelling: Zygmunt III Waza

The Royal Sigismund Bell (Polish: Królewski Dzwon Zygmunt or Dzwon Zygmunta) is the largest of the five bells hanging in the Sigismund Tower of the Wawel Cathedral in the Polish city of Kraków. It was cast in 1520 by Hans Behem and named after its patron, Sigismund I, King of Poland and Grand Duke of Lithuania, who commissioned it.

Again - I truly do not know who is wrong/right - the spelling on his tombstone is different still - Siegmund.

As I explained above - there is no right or wrong when choosing between Siegmund and Zygmunt. Some Polish parishes use Latinized first names and I would not be surprised to see Polish birth certificates with the names like Sigismund.

However, the ZYGMONT is a name made up by the American authorities. I know that many people use it over there - probably because the MONT is a familiar sound, close to MOUNT, or something?
boletus   
2 Nov 2012
Language / i don't understand this, "rozmawianO" and "pitO"? [18]

Both the above explanations concentrate on the first of the two impersonal forms ending with -no or -to. It is used in past tense: zrobio-no, umy-to, widzia-no, zobaczo-no.

There is however the second important form with -no and -to endings: the subjunctive form, such as zrobio-no by, widzia-no by, umy-to by. And this seems to be the gist of the OP's question, since he provides the following two examples in subjunctive form:

"Rozmawiano by ze mną"
"Pito by za moje zdrowie"

Both forms can be used in compound sequences, such as these second conditional sentences:
Gdyby mnie lubiano, pito by za moje zdrowie... i pito by i pito by ... ad nauseum.
[simple past impersonal form, followed by subjunctive impersonal form, imperfective aspect]

If I was liked my health would be toasted (and toasted and toasted).

Gdyby mnie zauważono, wypito by za moje zdrowie.
If I was noticed my health would be toasted [toasted once only. Here the perfective aspect is used in subjective impersonal form wypito by]

Evidently both perfective and imperfective forms can be used with subjunctive impersonal forms:
pito by
wypito by
rozmawiano by
porozmawiano by

The forms -no and -to can be replaced by the passive voice - as long as the verb is transitive:
widziano to ==> to było widziane [imperfective aspect]
widziano mnie => byłem widziany [imperfective aspect]

zuważono to => to zostało zauważone [perfective aspect]
zauważono mnie ==> zostałem zauważony [perfective aspect]

Many non-transitive verbs, however, make impersonal forms -no or -to, but yet do not form the corresponding passive voice
chodzono ==> no corresponding passive voice
płakano ==> no passive voice
boletus   
1 Nov 2012
Genealogy / JARENTOWSKI [17]

I did not say you were related to those people in Poland. I just showed you some possibilities, that's it. You asked for the alternate spelling of Jarentowski. Jarantowski is close enough to warrant possible misspelling. Both names are rather rare in the contemporary Poland, but almost equally probable. And both names very likely originate from some village name, such as Jarantowice or Jarantów.

There is one village Jarantów in Poland, located in Gmina Blizanów, Kalisz County, Wielkopolskie (Greater Poland) Voivodship and three villages Jarantowice in Kuiavian-Pomeranian Voivodship:

Jarantowice, gmina Osięciny, Radziejów County
Jarantowice, gmina Wąbrzeźno, Wąbrzeźno County
Jarantowice, gmina Choceń, Włocławek County

Statistically, the village "Jarantów" seems like a good match, since it is located in Kalisz County, and the biggest population of Polish surnames Jarentowski and Jarantowski are exactly in that county. So that could be a cradle of those families way back. But your grandfather is from around Kraków and this does not connect directly to Kalisz.

Checking all those 300 surnames would be time consuming and costly, unless you have some extra information that would narrow the scope significantly. You would have to comb internet for some approximate locations, like a village name for example, then approach the appropriate authority for the exact address. But this kind of data is protected in Poland and they would only give it to you after obtaining first a permission from a person you wish to contact. Time consuming!

Also, there was a thread about Jarentowski on this forum JARENTOWSKI/BIELAWSKI/MAKOWSKI, started five years ago, so check it out. Oh, gosh, that was you - what a waste of time! Could not you just bump it up, rather than opening a new thread and wasting our time here?
boletus   
1 Nov 2012
Life / I hate Warsaw. The worst part about living here is the people who move here from small towns, villages.. [124]

I said: the Old Train Compartment Syndrome. :-)
But hey, some things stay the same as usual. Try to take a train (no buses) from Komańcza to Krynica Zdrój. This is only 133 km by road, probably 180 km by rail.

Here is one example. There are three train rides: Komańcza => Zagórz, Zagórz => Stróże, Stróźe => Krynica. 0:48, 3:38 and 3:11 rides, 2:12, 4:43 waiting times.

Total 14:30 hours : 7:37 ride and 6:53 waiting time.
Plenty of time for food and staring around. :-)


boletus   
1 Nov 2012
Life / I hate Warsaw. The worst part about living here is the people who move here from small towns, villages.. [124]

I had two good staring experiences so far.

I got your point. I call it the old train compartment syndrom (OTCS).
There are four of you in the train compartment: relaxing, swapping stories, sharing hard boiled eggs and home grown tomatoes.

A new face shows up. Everybody stares. With hate.

But soon the man opens a bottle of something delicious.

The hard boiled eggs, tomatoes, and schnapps around. All are friends.

Until another intruder shows up...
boletus   
31 Oct 2012
History / Polish relation about Russians, Ukrainians? [281]

For me he is like a naive little kid, full of a propaganda stuff, and knowing nothing about his own history. As I said before, I am all for reconciliation, but for god sake, please spare me all this propaganda. I have had enough of it in my life.
boletus   
31 Oct 2012
History / Polish relation about Russians, Ukrainians? [281]

Leaders of UPA bilieved in Free Ukraine and served in Nazi army? And were they so stupid not to realize that whoever would win those war (either Hitler or Stalin) there can`t be Free Ukraine?

They did. Exactly, as you said.
Read this, version nr 1:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_Ukrainian_Independence,_1941
Version nr 2 (my translation from a written source):

The Proclaimation Act of the Ukrainian State
Out of the will of the Ukrainian Nation, the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists, under the leadership of Stepan Bandera, announces the creation of the Ukrainian State, for which the generations of the best sons of Ukraine lay their heads in stake.

The Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists, which under the leadership of its Founder and Leader, Jewhen Konowalec, carried a fierce struggle for freedom against Moscovite-Bolshevik's subjugation during the past dozens of years, calls upon the entire Ukrainian Nation not to lay down its arms until the Ukrainian Sovereign Power is established across all the Ukrainian Lands.

The Ukrainian Sovereign Power will assure law and order to the Ukrainian nation, the comprehensive development of all its forces and meeting all its needs. The Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists, under the leadership of Stepan Bandera, calls for submission to the service of the National Government created in Lviv, chaired by Jaroslav Stec'ko.

Hail to the heroic German Army and its Fuhrer Adolf Hitler! Ukraine for the Ukrainians! Down with Moscow! Down with the foreign power on the Ukrainian land! We are building our Ukrainian Independent State!

Same as here, in both Polish and Ukrainian:
dictionnaire.sensagent.com/akt+odnowienia+pa%C5%84stwa+ukrai%C5%84skiego/pl-pl

Another version of this proclamation, to which Ukrainians admit more willingly, proclaims the capitol to be in Kiev and creation of the national-revolutionary arm forces, which will fight for the Sovereign Councliar Ukrainian State. The fragment about Hitler and its heroic German Army is no longer there, and it is directly signed by Jarosław Stec'ko. It ends as follows:

"Long live the Sovereign Counciliar Ukrainian State! Long live the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalist! Long live the Leader of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists, Stepan Bandera!

The City of Lion, June 30, 1941, 2000 hours.
Jaroslav Stec'ko. President of the National Assembly.

However, Stec'ko's fait accompli policy against Hitler has failed. The humilation was horrible. Not only the hope for the Sovereign Councliar Ukrainian State was squashed, but also the lands where it supposed to be created have become divided, treating the Eastern Galicia, as in during the Austrian times, as lands taken from Poland. What's worse the capital of this lieutenancy, run by the governer Hans Frank, has been set in Krakow - not in Lviv, as in the times of Franz-Josef. It was hard on Ukrainians. The border on the San river was also abandoned. All notices were printed in three languages.

I whish to know who exatly of your family members and how exactly suffered from Ukrainians?
Could you tell entire story?

I do not care to go into details of my private affairs. I gave you the PUBLIC source documenting atrocities committed in 502 villages and towns. Village by village. Read just the first few pages. You might find them eye opening.
boletus   
31 Oct 2012
History / Polish relation about Russians, Ukrainians? [281]

I have no imagination about their motives and never been close to Ukrainian ultranationalist movement.

And yet you come here and teach us your state propaganda.

I do not know what may trigger their actions toward Poles

Simple. This was the ethnic cleansing ordered by one faction of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists (OUN) to prepare the land for the future Free Ukraine. In Wołyń (Wolhynia) the order was simple: KILL THEM. In Galicia the standing order was TO SCARE THEM first and if that would not work then KILL THEM.

Look, part of my family came from Kresy but I have nothing against Ukrainians, even though some of my family terribly suffered through some of them. But past is past and I am glad that Ukrainians have their independence at last, and possibly true democracy in the future. But history is history and one cannot built relationships among peoples based on lies. I have seen many books written by both sides, exaggerating the losses and tragedies, or white washing the tragic events. In Toronto, where I live, the local bookstores perpetuate the hatred ad infinitum since there are big Ukrainian and Polish communities here. I usually stay away from those propaganda books, and I hope most Poles and Ukrainians do the same. Personally, I have not observed any antipathy or aversion among the groups. In contrary, many Ukrainians gain employment through Polish bosses or vice versa.

So I found it interesting to see a quite balanced book "Kresowa Księga Sprawiedliwych 1939-1945" about Ukrainians saving Poles subjected to extermination by OUN and UPA. This is a compilation from records (including IPN) by Romuald Niedzielko. I am attaching a summary from his book showing documented murders of Poles across several Voivodships, as well as actions of some Ukrainians attempting to save some of their Polish neighbours and often suffering because of it.

Headers

- VOI Voivodship
- PLC # Places
- KIL # Poles Killed
- ACT # Acts of Ukrainian help
- SAV # Poles saved by Ukrainians
- HUT # Ukrainian helpers total
- HUN # Ukrainian helpers known by name
- HUM # Ukrainian helpers murdered by UPA for helping Poles

Statistics of help given by Ukrainians to Poles

- [(VOI Wolyń ) (PLC 255) (KIL 11,006) (ACT 493) (SAV 1806) (HUT 794) (HUN 530) (HUM 189)]
- [(VOI Polesie) (PLC 3) (KIL 200) (ACT 5) (SAV 8) (HUT 4) (HUN 2) (HUM 0)]
- [(VOI Tarnopol) (PLC 144) (KIL 6751) (ACT 245) (SAV 417) (HUT 336) (HUN 209) (HUM 120)]
- [(VOI Lwów) (PLC 34) (KIL 357) (ACT 56) (SAV 116) (HUT 67) (HUN 55) (HUM 18)]
- [(VOI Stanisławów) (PLC 39) (KIL 270) (ACT 55) (SAV 95) (HUT 85) (HUN 57) (HUM 29)]
- [(VOI Rzeszów) (PLC 18) (KIL 90) (ACT 19) (SAV 23) ((HUT 42) (HUN 33) (HUM 24)]
- [(VOI Lublin) (PLC 9) (KIL 155) (ACT 9) (SAV 62) (HUT 13) (HUN 10) (HUM 4)]
- [(TOTAL) (PLC 502) (KIL 18,829) (ACT 882) (SAV 2527) (HUT 1341) (HUN 896) (HUM 384)]

The actual numbers are estimated as high as ten times the documented numbers in that book. The book is accessible from here:

nawolyniu.pl/sprawiedliwi/sprawiedliwi.pdf
boletus   
29 Oct 2012
News / First female Polish Mig-29 pilot [8]

However the point here is that a woman finally became a fighter pilot in Poland :)

Janina Levandowska (1908-1940 Katyń)
pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janina_Lewandowska

There is a controversy as to whether she was a military or civilian pilot and whether her rank--Second Lieutenant--was real.
But she was posthumously promoted to the rank of Lieutenant by Minister of National Defense on Oct 5, 2007.
boletus   
29 Oct 2012
Language / IS "MURZYN" word RACIST? [686]

how am I wrong? Native Americans are not Indianie or Indianski- they are something else.

Because you do not see the difference between these two words:
INDYJSKI - coming from India
INDIAŃSKI - coming from South or North America

And because your grammar above is senseless.

According to you:

Indians from India should be called Indianie or indianski

But they are not - no matter how much you want it to be. Someone, long time ago, decided to differentiate the two cultures: Native Americans and people from India by using the big letter HHHHHHHH!!!

This way, he corrected the Columbus'es error in Polish language.

The male word in Polish is Hindus, and the female word is Hinduska, which in Polish means "obywatel / obywatelka Indii - a citizen of India". It has nothing to do with the religion. Simple

The corresponding adjectives are either hinduski (in reference to people) or indyjski (to objects). Once again - there is no indiański here.
pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/Hindus

On the other hand the word "hinduizm" in Polish is a collective term for a group of religious beliefs, mainly from the Indian subcontinent.

Believers of "hinduizm", in English Hindu, are called hinduiści (sing. hinduista, hinduistka) in Polish.

Simple. Do not mix English Hindu with Polish Hindus.
boletus   
29 Oct 2012
Language / IS "MURZYN" word RACIST? [686]

should be something else of which I am not sure- perhaps rodowity, rodzimy - something to this effect

The word is "tubylec", "tuziemiec", or "autochton" (from Greek's 'autochthon' - 'from this land') and it covers Native Americans and Australian Aborigenes.

Native Americans are Indyjski-

Wrong again, the noun in plural is "Indianie", and the adjective is "indiański" - in politically incorrect speech.

how do you say taupe, sage, jade, indigo, slate--there are endless colours and they all translate to the same word with a Polish spelling.

taupe = ciemnoszary (taupe)
sage = szałwia
slate = łupek
indigo = indygo
jade = jadeit
boletus   
29 Oct 2012
Language / IS "MURZYN" word RACIST? [686]

My point is that Polish language is so primitive that it has to steal words. If you would use only POLISH words (not the one stolen from other nations) you would be able to describe any complex matter or describe colours.

Because we do not need any girlie colours, such as "różowy"; true Poles just use manly colours:

maść kara (black):
+ krucza (raven)
+ wronia (crow)

maść kasztanowata (chestnut):
+ kasztanowata, cisawa - rudożółta w różnych odcieniach, od morelowych do miedzianych,
+ jasnokasztanowata - sierść słomkoworuda, ogon i grzywa jasne
+ złotokasztanowata
+ brunatnokasztanowata
+ ciemnokasztanowata (wątrobiana)

maść gniada (bay):
+ jasnogniada (light bay)
+ gniada (bay)
+ ciemnogniada (dark bay)
+ skarogniada (black bay)

maść siwa (grey):
+ ciemnosiwa
+ jabłkowita
+ szpak miodowy
+ szpak różany
+ jasnosiwa
+ mlecznosiwa (milky grey)
+ dropiata

maść izabelowata:
+ masłowata (buttery)
+ złotoizabelowata
+ palomino

maść jelenia (deer):

maść przydymiona kara: (smoke
maść kremowa:
maść perłowa:
maść przydymiona kremowa:
maść czerwonobułana:
maść bułana:
maść myszata:
maść szampańska:
+ złotoszampańska
+ burszztynowoszampańska
+ klasyczna szampańska
+ złotoszampańska kość słoniowa
+ burszztynowoszampańska kość słoniowa
+ klasyczna szampańska kość słoniowa

maść srebrna (silver):
+ srebrna kasztanowata
+ srebrna gniada
+ srebrna kara

maść dereszowata - pleśniawa (roan - mildew)
+ kasztanowodereszowata
+ gniadodereszowata
+ karodereszowata

maść tarantowata (dappled)
+ leopard
+ derka (horsecloth)
+ derka z plamkami (horsecloth with spots)
+ na tle dereszowatym
+ płatki śniegu (snow flakes)
boletus   
29 Oct 2012
Language / IS "MURZYN" word RACIST? [686]

But when written like that "Włochy" doesnt mean nice clean curly hairs. It means soaked, dirty, greasy lump of disgusting hairs.

Not only that. They try to confuse the poor foreigner by mixing the words Włoch with Wołoch. And who is Wołoch? Everybody else knows him as Vlach. But no, Poles call his people Wołosi (not Włosi !) and they say that he came from Wołoszczyzna, while everyone knows it as Wallachia, Walachia or Valahia. Wołoska jazda (cavalry), wołoskie wojny (wars), wołoskie osadnictwo (settlements, colonization).

And then, to make things even worse, they decided to name multiple villages in Southern Poland and Ukraine "Wołochy"! Yes, and this supposed to be historically justified!

And then the Czechs are not that much better either; they have their Wołochy too in Moravia, on Morawska Wołoszczyzna! Imperialists!
boletus   
29 Oct 2012
Language / IS "MURZYN" word RACIST? [686]

This is so deeply offensive that almost make me cry.

Yes, and think about G£UCHONIEMCY, Walddeutsche
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walddeutsche

Not only mute but also deaf!
boletus   
29 Oct 2012
Language / IS "MURZYN" word RACIST? [686]

perhaps, but my husbands isn't and we often discuss this.

Well, madam, your husband might be a Polish language authority for you, but not for me. Do not make me laugh. If I had to choose one - that would be possibly profs. Bralczyk, or Miodek instead, not your spouse.

See for example this response of prof. Bralczyk to reader "Małgorzata", who proposed a word "Ukrainczyk" instead of "Ukrainiec" due to the latter's WWII bad connotation.

Szanowna Pani Małgorzato,
Istotnie, czasem mamy ochotę, znajdując niepożądane konotacje w słowie, zastąpić je innym. Czasem ma to wymiar powszechny, związany z tzw. polityczną poprawnością, w imię której w USA mówi się o Afroamerykanach, a u nas o Romach. Bywa i tak, że te nowe słowa po jakimś czasie znów nabywają negatywnych skojarzeń, bo przecież nie tylko w słowach rzecz. Co do mnie, jestem zdania, żeby raczej starać się coś zrobić z dawnym i dobrze zakorzenionym słowem Ukrainiec w jego podstawowym znaczeniu niż wprowadzać nowego i nieco (przyznam) dziwnego Ukraińczyka - który trochę kojarzy się z Chińczykiem, a trochę przywołuje nieco zabawną zdrobniałość.

sjp.pwn.pl/slowniki/Murzyni.html
boletus   
28 Oct 2012
History / Polish relation about Russians, Ukrainians? [281]

One of the methods of measuring the linguistic distance between Polish and other Slavic languages is based on phonetic similarities. The data was collected by calculating frequency of occurrence of certain speech sound chains of consonants and vowels, which included nine basic phonemic patterns typical for Polish: labial, apical, palatal, guttural, sonorant, occlusive, fricative, voiced and vowels. This is a work of Yuri Tambovtsev, from Novosibirsk Pedagogical University, Novosibirsk,

hss.fullerton.edu/linguistics/cln/SP10PDF/Tamb-Polish.pdf

There are probably many other linguistic distance measures. I am not particularly supporting this point of view but since it seems reasonably interesting I decided to demonstrate one of the tables taken from that work:

Distances between Polish and other languages
The ordered distance series (TMB coefficient) between Polish and the other Slavonic languages on the basis of the nine phonetic features is the following:
Polish - Czech (9.32)
Polish - Slovak (11.99)
Polish - Sorbian (15.60)
Polish - Belarusian (17.11)
Polish - Ukrainian (23.72)
Polish - Russian (24.99)
Polish - Slovene (25.46)
Polish - Old Russian (30.54)
Polish - Serbo-Croatian (34.81)
Polish - Bulgarian (53.60)
Polish - Macedonian (66.29)
boletus   
27 Oct 2012
Genealogy / THE MEANING AND RESEARCH OF MY POLISH LAST NAME, SURNAME? [4501]

If you are asking whether the surname Malinowska has anything to do with "framboesa" than you are right: Polish malina = English raspberry = Portuguese framboesa = Spanish frambuesa.

Malinowska is a female version of Malinowski. It probably derives from some village name, such as Malinów, or Malinówka, and hence indirectly from"malina" - the rasperry.
boletus   
27 Oct 2012
Genealogy / THE MEANING AND RESEARCH OF MY POLISH LAST NAME, SURNAME? [4501]

Yes, you are right! There are 359 people of this name in Poland.

Comes from the village name Suchoraba, Gmina Niepołomice, within Wieliczka County, Lesser Poland Voivodeship, in southern Poland. Old name: Sucha Raba (Dry Raba).
Name "Raba" of a river in Southern Poland, a tribute of Vistula River, is probably of Celtic origin.
boletus   
27 Oct 2012
Food / Polish roast pigeon anyone? [17]

And may not be safe to eat if city bird.

True. Definitely not the dirty city pigeons.

No Squab for me... it is in the; not good for anything but pie; category of small game.

But there is this Polish saying: "pieczone gołąbki nie lecą same do gąbki" (roasted pigeons do not fly into your mouth by themselves), which means "nothing in life comes easy, with no action". Evidently roasted pigeons used to be known as a delicious dish - considering that they have been elevated to the proverb level.

Recipes?

Some are very elaborate, such as roasted pigeons served in special sauce made of pigeon (or chicken) liver, white wine, beef bullion, butter, juniper, salt, pepper, lemon.

Some are rather simple, but they all have something in common: they need spiking them with lard of wrapping them in slices of bacon. The roasting time differs: from 20 minutes (220 C) to one hour.

Some call for 24 simple marinade: water, onions, spices, vinegar.
Other recipes suggest rubbing them first with salt, pepper, garlic, oil and herbs (juniper, thyme, rosemary), and letting them soak the aroma for several hours before roasting. Either way, make sure to pour butter, water, or broth over them during roasting.

If you hunt them yourself make sure to select only the young pigeons for roasting because the old ones are usually tough. Breast meat of young pidgeons is white, while old ones - purplish blue. Pluck them carefully so that the skin is not torn. Put them into cold water for two hours right after shooting, then gut and clean them.

You can serve them with lettuce, blueberries, red cabbage (warm of cold), and treat yourself to dumplings topped with mushroom sauce. Silesian "black" dumplings (made of potato and potato flower) is a good example of "kluski" for this meal.

[Red cabbage: shred, cook until soft, mix apple, onions, spices and vinegar, pour some bacon or lard fat ]
boletus   
26 Oct 2012
Genealogy / JARENTOWSKI [17]

Jarantowski sounds close enough to Jarentowski ...

Currently in Poland there are 84 Jarentowski males, 111 Jarentowska females, 54 Jarantowski males and 49 Jarantowska females
Check this (modifying variations of the last names):
boletus   
26 Oct 2012
Life / Which animals are native to Poland? [58]

And wood buffalo? Native?

The European bison have been always under the protection of Polish Kings, and later of Russian Tsars - but also under constant pressure from poachers. In 1914, there were 727 bisons in Białowieża Forest. However, none was left in 1919, due to hunting by withdrawing German armies, Russian partizans, and poachers. In early 1920s twelve pure blood animals from international ZOOs were selected for reintroduction and by 1939 16 bisons lived in Białowieża Forest. They survived the war and in 1950s they were supplemented by a Soviet stock.

żubr - a wisent, a wood buffalo (4230)

Ouch, that's the world's population of żubr a.k.a. European bison, wood bison, as of 2009. The correct numbers are attached below.

World-wide, as of 2009 (other source):
4300 total
2787 in free-ranging populations (66%)
1144 in breeding centers and zoos (34% world population)

World-wide, free-ranging herds:
Ukraine - 6 populations, 222
Poland - 5 populations, 991 (Białowieska Forest - 473)
Belarus - 9 populations, 937
Russia - 10 populations, 414
Lithuania - 1 population, 61
Slovakia - 1 population, 9

Poland: total 1235, as of 2011
Free-ranging herds: 1041
.... Bieszczady - 277 (a mixture of Caucasian and Białowieża bisons)
.... Białowieska Forest - 481
.... Borecka Forest - 91
.... Knyszyńska Forest - 103
.... West Pomeranian herd - 89
Enclosed herds: 194
.... Breeding centers - 111
.... ZOOs - 24
.... Centre of Forest Culture in Gołuchów - 9
.... City parks - 11
.... Provincial parks - 39

Wasn't Poland the last country to have living Aurochs in modern day ?

The last one, a female, died in 1627 in the Jaktorów Forest, Poland, central Poland.
Its skull was later taken by the Swedish Army during the Swedish invasion of Poland (1655-1660) and is now the property of Livrustkammaren in Stockholm.

kozica - a chamois, a Tatra mountains goat (770 in 2008)

According to the latest fall population count, the number of Tatra mountains goats on both sides of the Polish-Slovakian border is record high - 1096: 810 in Slovakia and 286 in Poland; including 134 and 43 young goats, correspondingly. This is 24 more than the previous record high from the year 1964.

The lowest count was in 1999 - only 241 goats. The count of goats steadily increases in the recent years:
2010 - 841
2011 - 929
2012 - 1096
Counting the Tatra chamois (Rupicapra rupicapra) takes place twice a year: in spring and autumn. It is organized since 1954, and together with the Slovaks since 1957. Chamois is a symbol of both Polish and Slovak Tatra National Park. It is a protected species, although it happens that the poachers hunt these animals.
boletus   
26 Oct 2012
Life / Which animals are native to Poland? [58]

Ok, so they are the brazen wild hogs; coming illegally from Germany. :-)

Of course, the 244,000 number I gave (the estimated recent population) is only part of the picture. Another number would be the population growth, which is quite big.

Referring to your article, here is another one (in Polish), from the same locality, Świnoujście, as of 2012-10-09:

Authorities of Świnoujście (West Pomeranian Voivodship) plan culling about 60 wild boars, which feed downtown, in November/December this year. Those are part of the heards, which are made of 300 or so pigs, prowling in the buffer zone of Wolin National Park and German Naturpark Insel Usedom.