Alligator
12 Feb 2012
Alligator
12 Feb 2012
Language / Using first year Polish material from Uni Pitts and have questions about grammar please? [4]
There is no mistake in those sentences. You are simply stating here your amazement about how big those animals are, not asking a question. The only thing I would ad is exclamation mark at the end of sentences. Other than that, they are perfectly sound.
"Jakie duze mrowki"
"Jakie duze motyle"
"Jakie duze dzdzownice"
"Jakie duze motyle"
"Jakie duze dzdzownice"
There is no mistake in those sentences. You are simply stating here your amazement about how big those animals are, not asking a question. The only thing I would ad is exclamation mark at the end of sentences. Other than that, they are perfectly sound.
Alligator
12 Feb 2012
Language / pronounce "Kocham Cię" [57]
After verb you should rather use shorter form of personal pronoun. That doesn't mean you can't use longer form, but in most cases it sounds awkward.
After verb you should rather use shorter form of personal pronoun. That doesn't mean you can't use longer form, but in most cases it sounds awkward.
Alligator
12 Feb 2012
Language / Chcę and chce [21]
In polish language there is something like partial genitive (dopełniacz cząstkowy). You use it, when you talk about indefinite part of a whole.
You use "chcieć" with partial genitive, when you want to say about indefinite quantity of something.
So when you say "chcę zimnego drinka" you mean by that you want some/ much/ glass...
You also use "chcieć" with partial genitive, when you talk about something abstract, e.g. chcę wolności.
You use "chcieć" with accusative, when you talk about something definite and considered as a whole "Chcę czerwony samochód".
That doesn't mean, that partial genitive is only applied to uncountable nouns. It is true in most cases, but not all.
For example "naleśniki" may be considered as countable and uncountable.
In your example "Chcę słodkiego naleśnika" - although you used singular noun, if you apply partial genitive, it will mean that you want some naleśniki (indefinite amount). Naleśniki may be considered here as a dish and you want part of it.
If you would say "chcę slodki naleśnik", it will mean that you want 1 sweet pancake.
Also, if you say "chcę wody", it will mean you want some indefinite amount of water. But, for example you are in shop and you ask for a botlle of water, you may say "chcę wodę".
See, not complicated at all ;)
Hope that will help:)
In polish language there is something like partial genitive (dopełniacz cząstkowy). You use it, when you talk about indefinite part of a whole.
You use "chcieć" with partial genitive, when you want to say about indefinite quantity of something.
So when you say "chcę zimnego drinka" you mean by that you want some/ much/ glass...
You also use "chcieć" with partial genitive, when you talk about something abstract, e.g. chcę wolności.
You use "chcieć" with accusative, when you talk about something definite and considered as a whole "Chcę czerwony samochód".
That doesn't mean, that partial genitive is only applied to uncountable nouns. It is true in most cases, but not all.
For example "naleśniki" may be considered as countable and uncountable.
In your example "Chcę słodkiego naleśnika" - although you used singular noun, if you apply partial genitive, it will mean that you want some naleśniki (indefinite amount). Naleśniki may be considered here as a dish and you want part of it.
If you would say "chcę slodki naleśnik", it will mean that you want 1 sweet pancake.
Also, if you say "chcę wody", it will mean you want some indefinite amount of water. But, for example you are in shop and you ask for a botlle of water, you may say "chcę wodę".
See, not complicated at all ;)
Hope that will help:)
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
Love / Polish Wedding Blessing [16]
Well, 2 months ago I attended wedding in Warsaw. There were 300 hundred guests. So more than 150 is city tradition and less than 150 is village tradition? Thank you! Everything is clear now!
Well, 2 months ago I attended wedding in Warsaw. There were 300 hundred guests. So more than 150 is city tradition and less than 150 is village tradition? Thank you! Everything is clear now!
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
Love / Polish Wedding Blessing [16]
Would you be so kind to give examples of city traditions.
This is old Polish tradition, that was observed by christian Poles (where they lived was irrelevant). If now some couples choose to do something else is their choice. People who live in village are normally more conservative and traditions tend to live longer there (that is case in Polish, German, French etc villages). Don't try to make divisions, where they don't exist.
The only differences in wedding traditions exist are in different parts of Poland (south, north, Małopolska, Wielkopolska etc.) not between city and village of some region.
A village tradition through and through - anyone doing it in cities nowadays is quite clearly of village stock.
Would you be so kind to give examples of city traditions.
This is old Polish tradition, that was observed by christian Poles (where they lived was irrelevant). If now some couples choose to do something else is their choice. People who live in village are normally more conservative and traditions tend to live longer there (that is case in Polish, German, French etc villages). Don't try to make divisions, where they don't exist.
The only differences in wedding traditions exist are in different parts of Poland (south, north, Małopolska, Wielkopolska etc.) not between city and village of some region.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
Love / Polish Wedding Blessing [16]
After wedding and before party, mothers of married couple bless them with bread and salt. Mothers make wishes and end them with a wish, that newlyweds will never run out of bread (remember that this is very old tradition and in previous centuries parents literally wished that newlyweds will never suffer from hunger and would be prosperous). Next, the couple salt their slice of bread and eat it. In old times this blessing was not only reserved for newlyweds, but also for guests. By giving them bread and salt, their hosts showed them respect and hospitality.
Moreover bread symbolises here the flesh of Christ. In many cultures, as well here, salt is believed to deter evil.
After wedding and before party, mothers of married couple bless them with bread and salt. Mothers make wishes and end them with a wish, that newlyweds will never run out of bread (remember that this is very old tradition and in previous centuries parents literally wished that newlyweds will never suffer from hunger and would be prosperous). Next, the couple salt their slice of bread and eat it. In old times this blessing was not only reserved for newlyweds, but also for guests. By giving them bread and salt, their hosts showed them respect and hospitality.
Moreover bread symbolises here the flesh of Christ. In many cultures, as well here, salt is believed to deter evil.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
I simply wasn't aware of the scale of actions that Polish government took against Ukrainians. I also wouldn't use such strong words, as lie to somebody, who tries to have a constructive disscussion with you. I guess that you belong to that part of Polishforums community, who just can't mantain good quality conversation and start accusing/cursing/insult whenever they can. My bad I didn't realised this sooner, our disscussion would be shorter, so don't worry, I won't make the same mistake again.
Sorry that I nailed your lie about Poles not forcing Polonisation.
I simply wasn't aware of the scale of actions that Polish government took against Ukrainians. I also wouldn't use such strong words, as lie to somebody, who tries to have a constructive disscussion with you. I guess that you belong to that part of Polishforums community, who just can't mantain good quality conversation and start accusing/cursing/insult whenever they can. My bad I didn't realised this sooner, our disscussion would be shorter, so don't worry, I won't make the same mistake again.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Thanks for elaboration; interesting book. But I find your post a little lacking. Few sentences above this you can find reasons, why Polish authorities did that: Orthodox church was associated with tsarist government and its policy of russification. Although at time when these churches were destroyed, that was no longer true, you have to remember that attitudes, mentality doesn't change quickly. In such situations calm and time brings constructive ideas and discussion. I don't want to repeat myself, I stated in above post that relations between Poles and minorities were sometimes unjust, and difficult, but at the same time Poles are not the only one to blame.
There is no reason for you to make bias statements, without giving reasons for such situations (and they were more complicated than you make them seem like.
While "protecting cultural heritage and values" Russians apparently didn't think that Poles are it's bearers and didn't mind to kill them. Monuments are not enough, they forgot about human factor.
In the Chelm and Podlachia regions alone, in 1929 and 1930 59 churches were destroyed and 111 closed (and another 150 converted to RCC). Then in 1938 in those two regions nearly 150 more were destroyed.
Thanks for elaboration; interesting book. But I find your post a little lacking. Few sentences above this you can find reasons, why Polish authorities did that: Orthodox church was associated with tsarist government and its policy of russification. Although at time when these churches were destroyed, that was no longer true, you have to remember that attitudes, mentality doesn't change quickly. In such situations calm and time brings constructive ideas and discussion. I don't want to repeat myself, I stated in above post that relations between Poles and minorities were sometimes unjust, and difficult, but at the same time Poles are not the only one to blame.
There is no reason for you to make bias statements, without giving reasons for such situations (and they were more complicated than you make them seem like.
Absolute Truth. my grand grand -father who died in Poland in the First world war, sent to my grand-grand mother letter in which he wrote that Russian soldiers must protect and do not touch Cultural or any other values in Poland or any other country...
While "protecting cultural heritage and values" Russians apparently didn't think that Poles are it's bearers and didn't mind to kill them. Monuments are not enough, they forgot about human factor.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
Travel / Is Poland's Wroclaw zoo worth visiting? [17]
In Wrocław there is special itinerary for children: they look for dwarfes in Old Town. Here you have map:
krasnale.pl/mapa
There is also cool aquapark in Wrocław:
parkwodny.wroc.pl/galeria
In Wrocław there is special itinerary for children: they look for dwarfes in Old Town. Here you have map:
krasnale.pl/mapa
There is also cool aquapark in Wrocław:
parkwodny.wroc.pl/galeria
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Which churches again? I think that I explained the situation of church in former Polish Kresy in previous post. Care to read them.
destroying their churches would be another.
Which churches again? I think that I explained the situation of church in former Polish Kresy in previous post. Care to read them.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Whats wrong with taking an oath to Poland, when you are a citizen. First you have to remember that 20 years between I and II WW were very volatile and neighbours of Poland along with preparations to war, lead agressive politic. The result of that was a mentality of besieged fortress. Polish politicians tried to show the unity of society in face of danger, sometimes they forced it. But one always have to remeber that Poland at that time was very young state, with agressive neighbours, who didn't helped particularly to make Polish society more open and tolerant.
At that difficult time minorities also didn't help very much. Every agressive move from Poland's neighbours was welkomed and supported. It resulted in resentful actions from Poland and that created vicious circle. There were very few people on both sides who proposed a constructive way out of this situation.
requirement for Ukrainians to take an oath of allegiance to Poland or be fired in the university there.
Whats wrong with taking an oath to Poland, when you are a citizen. First you have to remember that 20 years between I and II WW were very volatile and neighbours of Poland along with preparations to war, lead agressive politic. The result of that was a mentality of besieged fortress. Polish politicians tried to show the unity of society in face of danger, sometimes they forced it. But one always have to remeber that Poland at that time was very young state, with agressive neighbours, who didn't helped particularly to make Polish society more open and tolerant.
At that difficult time minorities also didn't help very much. Every agressive move from Poland's neighbours was welkomed and supported. It resulted in resentful actions from Poland and that created vicious circle. There were very few people on both sides who proposed a constructive way out of this situation.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Suppresing in what way? That was polonisation?
Suppresing in what way? That was polonisation?
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Which one? Elaborate please.
Historical facts very much show the exact opposite.
Which one? Elaborate please.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Piłsudski had idea of federation of Poland, Lithuania and Ukraine. The idea was formed long before 1918-1920. By the way his actions in 1918-1920 were part of implementation of those ideas. Again, get your facts straight.
I don't think that Germany would take beating from such alliance. It takes time and some military exercises to coordinate actions of different armies. They didn't have both. Moreover attacking side always have upperhand, so for some time alliance would take beating anyway. In that time CCCR would probably attack. Another thing - CCCR was an aggresive, totalitarian state. They wanted attack anyway. They would do that sooner or later.
Poles didn't forced polonisation. Acceptance of polish culture and language was voluntary. Nobility of those countries saw political freedom of Polish nobility and atractive culture and naturaly wanted to be part of it. Because of most of nobility of Luithuania and Ruthenia became culturaly Polish e.g. Piłsudcy, Miłoszowie etc. The same happened later with Polish nobility accepting French culture and language in later centuries.
Also Polish people didn't convert orthodox Christian churches to catholic one. Orthodox church in Poland was for a long time subordinate of Moscow Patriarch. Tsars started to take advantage of it and used Orthodox Church as excuse to meddle in Polish internal affairs. Because of that part of Polish Orthodox bishops breaked subordination to Patriarch and formed Union Church (they still were orthodox but were subordinate of Pope in Rome).
Pilsudski's actions in 1918-1922 were somewhat different from his later ideas.
Piłsudski had idea of federation of Poland, Lithuania and Ukraine. The idea was formed long before 1918-1920. By the way his actions in 1918-1920 were part of implementation of those ideas. Again, get your facts straight.
would they really have intervened if they saw Germany taking a beating from some military alliance in this part of the world?
I don't think that Germany would take beating from such alliance. It takes time and some military exercises to coordinate actions of different armies. They didn't have both. Moreover attacking side always have upperhand, so for some time alliance would take beating anyway. In that time CCCR would probably attack. Another thing - CCCR was an aggresive, totalitarian state. They wanted attack anyway. They would do that sooner or later.
One example is the forced Polanisation of the non polish population in then polish occupied Ruthenia and Lithuania.
Poles didn't forced polonisation. Acceptance of polish culture and language was voluntary. Nobility of those countries saw political freedom of Polish nobility and atractive culture and naturaly wanted to be part of it. Because of most of nobility of Luithuania and Ruthenia became culturaly Polish e.g. Piłsudcy, Miłoszowie etc. The same happened later with Polish nobility accepting French culture and language in later centuries.
Also Polish people didn't convert orthodox Christian churches to catholic one. Orthodox church in Poland was for a long time subordinate of Moscow Patriarch. Tsars started to take advantage of it and used Orthodox Church as excuse to meddle in Polish internal affairs. Because of that part of Polish Orthodox bishops breaked subordination to Patriarch and formed Union Church (they still were orthodox but were subordinate of Pope in Rome).
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Why would they call slaves friends? They had a clear cut objective: turn Slavs into slaves and afterwards exterminate.
Germans were so honest that they attacked Gliwice radiostation and blamed for it Poles. That was honest reason to start war.
When they invaded, they did not call it "Brotherly help". When they occupied, they did not demand to be called "friends"
Why would they call slaves friends? They had a clear cut objective: turn Slavs into slaves and afterwards exterminate.
Germans were so honest that they attacked Gliwice radiostation and blamed for it Poles. That was honest reason to start war.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
I am not the one who should hear that, but that guy
Even if such alliance was formed it still wasn't enough to fight with Germany and CCCR. They purpose was war and they prepared for it for a long time. Poland, Czechoslovakia etc. wasn't militarly and politicaly prepared for that. The result would be more or less the same.
I think that we shouldn't consider what Poland, Czechoslovakia etc. didn't do, but what Germany and Russia did do.
Can you blame them? After the tricks of Pilsudski, they wanted nothing to do with Poland - it was certainly not his finest hour.
I am not the one who should hear that, but that guy
Even if such alliance was formed it still wasn't enough to fight with Germany and CCCR. They purpose was war and they prepared for it for a long time. Poland, Czechoslovakia etc. wasn't militarly and politicaly prepared for that. The result would be more or less the same.
I think that we shouldn't consider what Poland, Czechoslovakia etc. didn't do, but what Germany and Russia did do.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Eaxtly because of Piłsudski's ideas Poland couldn't count on Lithuanians. Get your facts straight.
As for the Zaolzie (I think that what you are saying), Czechoslavakia took it from Poland in 1920, when Poland was fighting with bolszevics. Stab on the back, I would call it. But that wasn't so crucial in relationship with Czechoslovakia at that time, as their frindly relationship with bolshevic Russia. It wasn't Poland who didn't want to form an alliance with Czechoslovakia, but Czechs who at first didn't want to make difficult their relations with CCCR. When they tried to form this alliance ti was too late.
Eaxtly because of Piłsudski's ideas Poland couldn't count on Lithuanians. Get your facts straight.
As for the Zaolzie (I think that what you are saying), Czechoslavakia took it from Poland in 1920, when Poland was fighting with bolszevics. Stab on the back, I would call it. But that wasn't so crucial in relationship with Czechoslovakia at that time, as their frindly relationship with bolshevic Russia. It wasn't Poland who didn't want to form an alliance with Czechoslovakia, but Czechs who at first didn't want to make difficult their relations with CCCR. When they tried to form this alliance ti was too late.
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
and that was the reason why Germany and Russia attacked Poland. I am sure they were very concerned about Polish minorities. Spot on delphiandomine.
Poland's absolutely senseless aggression towards Lithuania/Czechoslovakia, Poland's marginalising of her minorities
and that was the reason why Germany and Russia attacked Poland. I am sure they were very concerned about Polish minorities. Spot on delphiandomine.
they try to forge history, show it as being relativistic, to diminish their crimes or in the worse case to blame Poles for what happened
Alligator
8 Feb 2012
History / Do Polish people in general dislike Russia or Germany more? [369]
Because he coudn't figure what Poles done to Germans and Russians. However Lisowszczycy not only took part in partisan war with Russia at that time, but also defended Vienna against Turks. Looks like alexmac would now need to take fast course in polish history to find something else.
Moreover I think it is pretty difficult for anyone (and probably somebody on this forum would try to do that), to compare atrocities of XVII and XXc. The sheer scale of killing and inflicting pain was on different level in XXc. Moreover I wouldn't be so ready to compare history of distant centuries. Between XVII and XXc. happened many things, that changed peoples mindsets, mentality, whole cultures (e.g. Enlighment, education, freedom for everybody). Despite that people in XXc. commited so many crimes against each other. If we wan't to compare distant centuries why not compare todays Poland, Germany and Russia to XIII c. P., G. and R.; or why should we put such restrictions, lets compare to 100000 B.C. whatever was in place of Poland. Russia and Germany.
That being said I don't have any grieviances toward Germans and Russians unless they try to forge history, show it as being relativistic, to diminish their crimes or in the worse case to blame Poles for what happened to them during WWII (unfortunately there are some people like that).
Exactly gumishu.
Because he coudn't figure what Poles done to Germans and Russians. However Lisowszczycy not only took part in partisan war with Russia at that time, but also defended Vienna against Turks. Looks like alexmac would now need to take fast course in polish history to find something else.
Moreover I think it is pretty difficult for anyone (and probably somebody on this forum would try to do that), to compare atrocities of XVII and XXc. The sheer scale of killing and inflicting pain was on different level in XXc. Moreover I wouldn't be so ready to compare history of distant centuries. Between XVII and XXc. happened many things, that changed peoples mindsets, mentality, whole cultures (e.g. Enlighment, education, freedom for everybody). Despite that people in XXc. commited so many crimes against each other. If we wan't to compare distant centuries why not compare todays Poland, Germany and Russia to XIII c. P., G. and R.; or why should we put such restrictions, lets compare to 100000 B.C. whatever was in place of Poland. Russia and Germany.
That being said I don't have any grieviances toward Germans and Russians unless they try to forge history, show it as being relativistic, to diminish their crimes or in the worse case to blame Poles for what happened to them during WWII (unfortunately there are some people like that).
Alligator
6 Feb 2012
Genealogy / I'm trying to find my old friends who used @poczta.onet.pl email [22]
Apparently not only, There is no Osiedle Korfantego in Katowice.
marriage and change of name ?
Apparently not only, There is no Osiedle Korfantego in Katowice.
Alligator
6 Feb 2012
Life / Why Milosz not Herbert ? [38]
Here I thought that I finally found interesting thread, where I could talk to intelligent and well-mannered people. Bummer again!
Also Miłosz spent most of his live in America. Should get his prize as an American. He even wrote some of his poems in English, that telling.
Here I thought that I finally found interesting thread, where I could talk to intelligent and well-mannered people. Bummer again!
Alligator
4 Feb 2012
Genealogy / My grandmother Mary Sadowski came from Poland. [6]
There is about 37 thousand people in Poland who have Sadowska/-i surname. I'm affraid that it is impossible to find your family.
There is about 37 thousand people in Poland who have Sadowska/-i surname. I'm affraid that it is impossible to find your family.
Alligator
4 Feb 2012
Genealogy / My grandmother Mary Sadowski came from Poland. [6]
You need to give more information about your grandmother. Her name is not enough to find your family here.
By the way, in Polish her name is Maria Sadowska.
You need to give more information about your grandmother. Her name is not enough to find your family here.
By the way, in Polish her name is Maria Sadowska.
Alligator
4 Feb 2012
Genealogy / Is Aleska a Polish baby name ? [42]
What brings us to conclusion that Valeska is misspelled, messed up name. Slavs don't need dictionaries, linguists to know what traditional slavic names derives from and what they mean. The very discusion that we are having now proves that there is something wrong with name Valeska.
What brings us to conclusion that Valeska is misspelled, messed up name. Slavs don't need dictionaries, linguists to know what traditional slavic names derives from and what they mean. The very discusion that we are having now proves that there is something wrong with name Valeska.
Alligator
4 Feb 2012
Life / Why Milosz not Herbert ? [38]
Then make a new thread, where all trolls could gather.
Incidentally in the English speaking world American fiction is far superior to any thing else and has been for some time.
Then make a new thread, where all trolls could gather.
Alligator
4 Feb 2012
Life / Why Milosz not Herbert ? [38]
Their poetry is distinctive. I don't really think, that you can compare poets or any other writer, painter etc. and measure which is better. You can only say which you like better. I like both Miłosz and Herbert.
For reason stated above I can't understand how Nobel Committee chooses who's the best writer. The idea seems absurd to me.
Do you agree that Herbert was a better poet ?
Their poetry is distinctive. I don't really think, that you can compare poets or any other writer, painter etc. and measure which is better. You can only say which you like better. I like both Miłosz and Herbert.
For reason stated above I can't understand how Nobel Committee chooses who's the best writer. The idea seems absurd to me.
Alligator
4 Feb 2012
Genealogy / Is Aleska a Polish baby name ? [42]
and we were talking about slavic name Valesca- great ruler.
Madam Walewska name was Maria...
and Walewska was a surname, as any kid in Poland knows it.
It is a German name and it means strong, beautiful, powerful
and we were talking about slavic name Valesca- great ruler.
Madam Walewska name was Maria...
and Walewska was a surname, as any kid in Poland knows it.
Alligator
4 Feb 2012
Genealogy / Looking for Pontus relatives [10]
Pontus is probably the right name. There are 36 people in Mława, who's name is Pontus. (Mława is a powiat - district, to which Ostrów and Budy Mdzewskie belongs.
moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/pontus.html
Pontus is probably the right name. There are 36 people in Mława, who's name is Pontus. (Mława is a powiat - district, to which Ostrów and Budy Mdzewskie belongs.
moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/pontus.html
Alligator
4 Feb 2012
Life / Why Milosz not Herbert ? [38]
Fully agree.
I don't think that is completly true. Not every decision of Nobel Prize Committee is measurable and rational.
No doubt Zbigniew Herbert was nominated too, however there's one prize per year and the world has a lot of good poets and authors.
Fully agree.
Milosc (who was a good person) had the edge and came to the attention of the Nobel Committee.
I don't think that is completly true. Not every decision of Nobel Prize Committee is measurable and rational.