News / Presidential elections and debates 2015 Poland [472]


If that report is true, which is a possibility-the way these things work is that you can't show that you are too keen or otherwise you are viewed as too ambitious, what usually happens is that your minions sound everybody out by putting forward a hypothetical scenario, which goes something like this: "If Mr Tusk declared his interest in running for EU president/chairman would you vote for him? Based on the information the minions get, they brieaf Tusk with the information, and if there is enough support for him he declares his interest in a subtle way.

Having said all of this, he is on record as saying that he is not interested, so if he said that he was that would mean that he has changed his mind.


You going to put me up whilst I give him my support(:

I would have you know that last year and early this year i lived in Poland for a grand total of 2 months, i did not get the opportunity of supporting him apart from arguing with my family about how silly they are disliking him and supporting kaczynski instead. Unfortunately some Poles are caught in a communist mindset, they view everything through the same old prism, and although they profess how much they hate communism they are nostalgic about the social security that went along with communism.

Life / Polish history as a school subject in western Europe [24]


Well Canute was a 1/2 Polish and the other 1/2 Danish i think, so there is a bit of Polish/Danish association, but very few people would know about it.

News / Presidential elections and debates 2015 Poland [472]


I think that the above description is more attributable to Kaczynski than to Tusk, after all Kaczynski sees himself as the "savior", or did you forget about how he described the situation how people where calling on him to save Poland. If he was a man of greater charisma and stature such an observation would be frightening, but given what he is it is rather funny and sad.


Yes that probably explains why he has decided to retire in 2014, and in the process sacrificed his personal ambition in the part's favor-just like he refused to nominate for President because he wanted to be the PM, so he could actually do something for Poland.

News / History lessons no more in Poland (Tusk's change) [61]


Your relentless negativity is really becoming a bit passe. God i hope you are not married, because if you are I really pity your wife.


It's not my test you fool.

News / Presidential elections and debates 2015 Poland [472]


Well you are not very observant, because Tusk himself is on record as saying that he will not lead his party to the next election. Tusk will retire in 2014, giving his successor (most probably Sikorski or Nowak) the opportunity of cementing his position for the 2015 election. The thing with Tusk is that he is 10 steps ahead of his opponents, before Kaczynski even manages to wipe his arse in the morning Tusk already has the rest of the day planned out.

That is why PO and Tusk are taking the tough decisions early, so that Tusk's successor has an easier run at the next election campaign. What will probably happen is that Tusk's successor will have a honeymoon period, all the tough decisions will be taken care of, the economy will hopefully be well and truly in the boom phase again, hopefully Kaczynski will still be the opponent-older and probably more demented than before, which will mean that all things taken together PO should win a 3 consecutive term in office.

News / History lessons no more in Poland (Tusk's change) [61]


It will take a bit of time to work out, and I think you have to have the second component in place of the student paying for his or her education, for the first to work better. I guess initially the universities will pick everyone as you say, but after some 10 years time there should be a definite educational trend, which the universities should be forced to publish (this should be another part of educational reform, forcing universities to publish data on the employment attainment of students who leave university). This will give future students a good idea whether it is worth it, and they will be more careful about how they spend their money.


Actually i would disagree, I think that early education in Poland is a lot better than higher education. Poland actually does quite well in international rankings for primary and secondary education outcomes.

News / History lessons no more in Poland (Tusk's change) [61]

That will change in the future i can guarantee it. I am sure that in the next ten years the government will force students to pay for their education, i already had the privilege of paying for my own. What will happen is that they will introduce a system were the money follows the student, which will mean that the best resourced universities will be the ones that give you the most useful education.

What will also happen is that the government will force students to pay by giving them a loan, which they will be expected to pay back interest free, after they find employment and earn a certain level of income. I think it is inevitable, and i must admit probably fair, after all why should somebody who finished a zawodowka pay for somebody's education who is attending a university.

News / Presidential elections and debates 2015 Poland [472]

I believe that the definition of madness is trying the same things over thinking that you are going to get a different result. I distinctly seem to remember that you were saying the same things before the general election, and the only thing that happened is that people like me and pawian were proved right and you and ironside were proved wrong. So my question is how many times do you need to have egg over your face to realize that the vast majority of people don't see Poland's reality the way you do.

What they see is a increasingly prosperous country which is weathering the economic storm around it, a competent government that is prepared to take the tough decisions for the country's future. And than they see a weak and divided opposition who can do nothing else but criticize, led by a leader with a distinctly probable metal illness. Why would anybody vote for this so called opposition, when they are a complete shower. How can they possibly govern Poland when they can't even govern themselves. And who can honestly say that they feel any attraction towards a party with a mentally ill leader, and a spokesman (Hoffman) that is a chubby cheeked opportunist who will stoop to anything to win power for the sake of it.

I think that this division is could news, it will mean that Poles will only have to vote once in the presidential election.

News / History lessons no more in Poland (Tusk's change) [61]


I can't really make much of this rant, perhaps you would like to rephrase your argument.


It has everything to do with what you mentioned above

News / History lessons no more in Poland (Tusk's change) [61]


Very few things to you actually do. Unless of course they are PIS inspired, than they make perfect sense.
PISA: Programme for International Student Assessment.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Programme_for_International_Student_Assessment

Poland has been recently going up in the league. Crucially a study has found that the more time you devote to mathematics and literacy-which among others are the subjects that the league measures, the more likely you are to be competitive. So the more time you spend on religion and history, the less time you devote to those crucial subjects. Which is why the system needs to be reformed, ideally religion should be axed and combined with other subjects like history for instance, you could call it society and environment and teach a combination of religious teaching, life skills, and a bit of history.

History / The story about German- Polish reconciliation [194]


Well lets face it, self preservation and survival is your primary goal, that is a pretty good way to play it(:

History / The story about German- Polish reconciliation [194]


you are right actually, I read somewhere a description of his describing him as Russian but wiki says something else.

History / The story about German- Polish reconciliation [194]


Was a Russian not a Pole. Bach-Zalewski had a Polish background though.


Funny but obviously not true, I am not sure if it helps though. To be fair to them it's only like half a "goose Step"-it's not the knee high lift like the Germans used to do it and the Russians continue doing it.

News / History lessons no more in Poland (Tusk's change) [61]


That is just idiotic. The rationale behind the reforms is quite simple the government wants children to focus on the "useful" subjects in school like maths, physics, chemistry, biology, and Polish. History and Religion are seen as big obstacles to this, and personally I would be in favor of cutting religion out of the curriculum or combining it with something else like a hybrid of something. I understand where the government is coming from. Sadly for history-it is not measured on the PISA league table of international competitiveness in education, and Poland want's to be competitive, so something has to give.

And as someone who loves history it has to be said that history never invented anything nor did it cure anyone or made anybody else's existence on this planet any easier, the subjects that i have mentioned above have. It pains me to say it, but history is just not as useful as the others.

History / The story about German- Polish reconciliation [194]

I think Jordan could be Dutch, Deresz possibly Swedish or German, and Prugar-Ketling possibly German as well, or at least 1/2 his surname indicates this. Though as you pointed out that isn't 100% definite, although the others almost certainly are.

History / The story about German- Polish reconciliation [194]

One interesting historical paradox is that while the Germans gave up on the Prussian march otherwise know as the "goosestep"-for obvious historical reasons, the Poles continue to practice it:

History / The story about German- Polish reconciliation [194]


(: a good attempt

However there are a few more Polish generals of German origin in WWII:
Władysław Langner



en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mieczyslaw_Norwid-Neugebauer

Bronisław Prugar-Ketling

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronis%C5%82aw_Prugar-Ketling

The following didn't fight in WWII but they fought for Poland in the Polish-Bolshevik war: General dyw. Gustaw Orlicz-Dreszer

Tadeusz Jordan-Rozwadowski:

General dyw. Jan Edward Romer

pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jan_Romer

And on the topic of German/Polish reconciliation I can't think of a better example than Róża Maria Gräfin von Thun und Hohenstein, a Polish member of the EU parliament. Her son Christoph Thun und Hohenstein speaks Polish and German and will spend part of his studies in Poland and Germany.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%B3%C5%BCa_Thun

History / The story about German- Polish reconciliation [194]


I don't doubt you have a lot of pulling power but I think the Poles have got more.
A few examples:

some notable Polish generals of German origin who fought for Poland in WWII, including:

General Franciszek Kleeberg-arguably the best polish general in the conflict.

upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cd/Kleeberg.jpg/220px-Kleeberg.jpg

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franciszek_Kleeberg

Władysław Anders
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W%C5%82adys%C5%82aw_Anders

And General Juliusz Rómmel
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juliusz_R%C3%B3mmel
apparently a relation of the desert fox

Józef Unrug
fought for Germany in WW1 and later for Poland in WWII
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B3zef_Unrug

I think that is partly because this:
youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=sgnZ7htD8A4
is far more interesting than this (:
youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=fAX1RD2BFJ4

History / The story about German- Polish reconciliation [194]


You got to be careful with that delph, you do know that Frederick the Great counterfeited the Polish currency(:


it turned out that he already had a copy of this poster, he will take one home and leave the other in the office(:

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


source please?

Where i live there was a whole colony devoted to them, and they have grown to over 20 million in number.

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


That's because no one in authority is authorized to make such conclusions. The real fool is the one who is unable to look at the figures, do the maths and come up with his or her own conclusion. Or is too intrinsically racist to admit to their meaning.

The stats that you provided in the table only strengthen my point, that in proportion to their population the Poles are some of the most law abiding foreigners in the UK, which probably means you will disown them because it does not fit in to your view of the Poles as a people (which lets not beat around the bush, is at the heart of this debate).

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


Not just any stats, these stats are compiled by the Police and Home Office, and what they demonstrate is that Poles are 4 times more law abiding than the locals.

The clip that you provided contains an untruth namely that you can't deport foreign criminals from the UK.

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


Using your logic you could also argue that this number is over representative, and that Poles are actually more law abiding than the given statistic, and that instead of being 4 times more law abiding than the natives they could 8 times more law abiding.

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


So what you are saying is that there might be Poles, that we don't know about, who might have committed crimes, which we don't know about WTF.

Since you are not challenging the figures that I have provided, it seems that you agree with them.

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]

No that wasn't an estimate those were the figures provided by the police. The link has been provided, it's only you that has rejected it because it doesn't support your world view of the Poles. 4 times more law abiding that's what the stats show.

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


I am sorry that the facts do not support your view of Poles as a people, but facts are facts. And what they demonstrate is that Poles are 4 times more law abiding than the natives in the UK.

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


I hate repeating myself: "Poles in England & Wales 4 times more law abiding than average Brit?
Latest statistics published in the Daily Telegraph and the Daily Mail show that Poles living here are overwhelmingly law abiding in comparison to the average resident of England and Wales.

Latest estimates of the number of Poles in England and Wales by the Polish Consulate are around 700,000. In 2010 the Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) recorded that 6777 convictions in England and Wales concerned Polish citizens. On the face of it this is still a high number, but in view of the total estimate of Poles in this country, it does show that less than 1% of Poles in this country have been convicted of committing a crime in England and Wales. Or, put another way, less than one Pole in every hundred has been convicted of a crime. Considering that most of the Poles here are young and live in a land with unfamiliar customs to which many have not yet fully adjusted, this is indeed a relatively low figure.

By comparison the Home Office Statistical Bulletin, published in January 2011, stated that the total number of recorded crimes in England and Wales between October 2009 and September 2010 stands at 4,223,362. This covers roughly the same time period as the above crime statistics for Poles. The last recorded population of England and Wales stands at 52,042,000 (2001 Census) though it is probably somewhat higher now. That is equivalent to more than 7 crimes having been recorded for every 100 residents of England and Wales, i.e. one crime for every 14 persons in the country. Obviously many of the above offences would have been carried out by repeat offenders, but it would not be unfair to estimate that some 4% of the indigenous population may have committed a crime."

As for " Anything to suggest that this is not the same in reverse for Brits in Poland?" I have no idea

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


It should be pointed out (as was done on several previous threads), that in terms overall crime compared to the native population of Britain Poles commit less crime per capita than do the locals.

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]


And you got that statistic from where exactly, it wouldn't happen to be the daily mail or the sun by any chance?

News / Drunken Brit beats up young Polish policewoman [62]

It's good to see that the media isn't making a meal out of this, if this was the UK and the man in question was a Pole and the woman a Brit, you can bet your life on the fact that this would make the front headline of both the Sun and the Daily Mail.