Off-Topic / Lovely Souvenirs Thread [11]


You see what you want to see. And you are wrong as you usually are.

The upper scarf - Spartak Moscow - is from 2003 (or 2004) - almost 20 years before the invasion. It was issued on the occasion of Polish goalkeeper, Wojciech Kowalewski, joining Spartak. The lower one is Russian NT scarf and the slogan is similar to "Let's go England!", "Forza Italia!", "Hup hup Oranje!" and so on.

Anyways, Pawian, post a nice souvenir or f*ck off and stop ruining my thread.

Off-Topic / Lovely Souvenirs Thread [11]


Wow! Respect! I always knew you were a sound fellow.


We were all young once. :)


Something like that might rather be posted by some SS-Galizien loving neo-nazi, not me. Why would you even bring this up in connection to sports scarves from 20 years ago? Strange.

Off-Topic / Lovely Souvenirs Thread [11]

Hey, you can post any Ukrainian souvenir that you have here and I will have no problem with that. Cheer up :)

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


Yes, they are fighting also for us. I agree.

However, not everybody in Poland would seem to agree. Football supporters - a very patriotic element would seem to be of a different opinion...

...and it's not only in Wrocław that you see banners like that. These folks are as patriotic as it gets, the salt of Polish earth. Interesting, isn't it?

The salt of the earth.

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


You are lying like a rabid dog now - I said on several occasions that I don't give a flying f*ck about Ukrainian apologies; all I want is for the genocidal sickf*cks to just allow the exhumation and proper burial of the victims, like any civilised country would. Unfortunately the barbarians don't allow even that. F*ck them.

400 tanks, 200 Rosomak afvs, shitl*ds of other vehicles, artillery, attack choppers, fighter planes, modern drones, manpads, train after train loaded with ammo, fuel and f*ck knows what else. They would be speaking Russian in Kiev long time ago without our help. Plus, millions of refugees with health care, education, child benefits etc. granted and the bastards don't even allow the burial of our dead? Amasing.

P.S. I am enjoying my holidays. Posting occasionally to counter Pawian's rabid lies. :)

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]

Just one final post before I take another well deserved summer break...


If you think that any Pole, worthy of that name, has embraced or will ever embrace the Ukrainian nationalist legacy of OUN-UPA/SS-Galizien then you are one deluded Australian.

The rising support for Konfederacja (which is widely considered a pro-Russian party, or at least Ukraine-skeptical) indicates also, among other things, the rising objections among Poles towards unconditional support for Mr Zelensky's politics (I recommend Paweł Lisicki's editorial in the latest issue of Do Rzeczy).

As for our dear Ukrainian friends, allies and brothers - they have been glorifying UPA/SS-Galizien for over 30 years now, deciding that it's a good idea to build their national identity on that. They lied about it, sabotaged or falsified historical research and refused exhumation of Volyn victims. Their far-right elements, so celebrated now, even talked about territorial demands on Poland (so called Закерзоння, with ancient Ukrainian cities of Холм and Перемишль)...

pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakerzonie

... some time ago I even posted photos of lovely Закерзоння banners that they like to display on various occasions. As for what Ukrainians did towards their Russian minority, I am not a specialist, so I won't write about that, but if even small part of what Velund and Bobko wrote about is true, then it looks like our dear friends and allies thought that they could spit on their western neighbours and spit on their eastern neighbours at the same time. Now they find themselves in a rather difficult predicament.

Karma is a lady whose livelihood depends on her engaging in sexual intercourse for monetary remuneration. Alas!

What a brilliant thread. It made me see so many things much clearer.

Have a nice summer, people! :)

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]

Most people here know that I have a personal connection to Volhyn... does that make me biased? Perhaps. Anyway, of all the stories I heard from Volhyn survivors or read about, there is one in particular that sticks with me and doesn't want to leave my memory (I don't think it ever will):

... a typical story. Ukrainians slaughtering a Polish multi-generational (as it used to be in the countryside) family. A boy manages to hide. He can't see what's going on but can hear everything. He hears his family's agony. He hears his little brother being bestially tortured and eventually begging the Ukrainians to kill him next to his mommy.

I just can't f*ckin forget it... a four-year-old boy... realised that they are now going to kill him and asked to be killed next to his mamusia. They murder him like they murdered everyone else.

Today in Poland we have people who want to apologise first. To apologise to those who still glorify UPA, build their monuments, hang their portraits in their offices and name stadiums after them. They want to do it because in Middle Ages "Polish colonisation of Ukraine" started and lasted for centuries. The people to whom they want to apologise very often blindly refuse to acknowledge the genocide or even lie about it. We had an example of this when prime minister Morawiecki went to one of the villages, or rather to a place when one of the slaughtered villages used to be (Puźniki). Ukrainian media wrote that Polish prime minister visited the place of Soviet war crimes.

Judge it for yourselves.

I will write nothing more on the matter, for fear that my conversation with certain members here might turn overly acrimonious; and anyway the likelihood of people changing their minds - one way or another - is rather slim. Judge it for yourselves.

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


Do you agree, Paulina, that Bucha was a genocide but Volhyn merely an ethnic cleansing? An ethnic cleansing that was provoked by centuries of Polish oppression and that's why Poland should apologize to Ukrainians first?

No malice intended on my part, I'm just curious. It's a good moment for me to establish who I am dealing with on this board. With Pawian I already have a good idea; I like you (for some reason unknown to me), so I'm just curious about your opinion on this matter.

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


Rabid leftist. It's a pity he won't see my closed Slovak and Turkish threads - he would gladly apologise for every point I mentioned.

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]

Ah, the short ban is over. How nice.


Check out the fragment of the article that starts with "As Polish sociologist Lech Nijakowski of Warsaw University explains" (...) and ends with "Spectacular torture, rape, and other atrocities have a rational purpose - they cause panic, which accelerates the exodus of the population."

Do you see now, Bobi, what we have to deal with in Poland? The guy rationalises the bestial murders and claims that they were merely ethnic cleansing, not genocide. If I recall correctly the same Mr Nijakowski wrote about Russian genocide in Bucha (73-178 victims acording to the UN, 458 according to the Ukrainian government). Can you believe it? In Bucha we had genocide, in Volhyn merely an ethnic cleansing (of course provoked by centuries of Polish oppression, so Poland should apologise first).

I have no words.

History / Poles should apologise to Slovaks first [7]


Yes, and Ireland is only one little item on the list of things you don't know about. :)

I spent three lovely years in Ireland (2005-2008). I recommend it to you too; maybe if you left your village and spent some time in the West, you would realise the need to apologise to everyone for everything and wouldn't interfere with my masterplan. See ya later, monkey. :):):)

History / Poles should apologise to Slovaks first [7]


You are missing the point as usual. Ha!

Gotta go now. Lithuanian, Czech and Swedish (and possibly French) threads coming soon. Watch this space. :)

History / Poles should apologise to Turks first [7]


Truth is absolutely irrelevant in the Apologising Masterplan. Such a neo-marxist, globalist oikophobe like yourself should be aware of it. Now, stop interfering.

History / Poles should apologise to Turks first [7]

There there, pawian. Stop foaming at the mouth (I can tell by your excessive use of smileys) and don't interfere with my Apologise to Everyone Masterplan.

You inspired it, so now grin and bear it. :D

History / Poles should apologise to Turks first [7]


What do you mean? You think that Poles should apologise to Ukrainians for things as far back in the past as 1018 but they shouldn't apologise to the Turks for much more recent events in 1683, for example? For denying them what they had been desiring for centuries? Are you an islamophobe? Or racist?

Besides, you're missing the point as usual. The point is to apologise to everyone for everything, and in this way become a moral superpower which will enable us to lecture everyone about minority rights, European values or tolerance as well as stop everybody's European funds on the basis that they are not democratic enough. :):):)

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


Mr Zelensky must be very forgetful of his country's history, or he must suppose that all others are ignorant or forgetful of it. But it is not my intention, at present, to reply to this extravagant pretension.

I shall, however, observe this thread with utmost interest. :)

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


But apart from that the thread is not entirely pointless in its core. Mutual apologies, some time in the future, brotherly understanding, and - why not? - a bit of kumbaya singing would eventually be nice. :)

Pawian, pawian, pawian... you're not a bad guy at heart, I'll give you that.*


Should we apologise for that too? If we go back 1000 years the Europe will be stuck in apologies for another millenium - there will be no time for anything else. :D Oh, well... anyway, I'll leave this humorous thread in peace for the time being and will observe it with kindhearted interest. :)


Hey, what happened to "it was the Austro-Hungarians who created Ukrainian nationality against both Russians and Poles"? ;)

*But you can be an annoying c*nt sometimes nonetheless. Peace.

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


I know exactly that there are people in Poland who formulate similar views - even in a more pronounced manner - and that's exactly why I'm asking the questions in this thread. :):):) So, would you be so kind and answer them?


Aaaah.... so now you see that it's not nice when you start a thread and somebody comes and start nitpicking in it? :):):) I just gave you a taste of your own medicine.

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


No, you did not. You said in #6 that "no atrocities can be justified, neither Polish or Ukrainian". That's not what I asked in #10, so I will repeat my question...

Would you say that when a group of people "desires something for centuries" (as you said) and the elites of the country where they live, the ruling class, don't want to satisfy their desires, then when the aforementioned group of people commits bestial atrocities on civilians - mostly peasants, women, children and the elderly - this is merely a "direct result" (as you said) of those frustrated desires?

...and just in case you missed it, I will repeat the second (but definitely not the last :)) question:

Were the Poles bestially slaughtered by OUN-UPA, the children tortured and begging to be killed next to their mums (you should try and read Volhyn survivors memoirs every now and then) - were they "oppressors and partitioners" (as you said) in Ukraine?

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]

How about answering my question from #10? :)


Another question, just to establish what you mean by that. Were the Poles bestially slaughtered by OUN-UPA, the children tortured and begging to be killed next to their mums (you should try and read Volhyn survivors memoirs every now and then) - were they "oppressors and partitioners" in Ukraine?


Indeed. A Putinist, hoping to turn Poles against Ukrainians, could do nothing better than propagate Pawian's thread to achieve his aim. Who knows - maybe he is a covert Putinist agent? Hmm... :):):)

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]


Something tells me that this suggestion, made repeatedly in the past by several members, shall not be followed. :)

Besides, let's remain calm - maybe Pawian just wants Poland to go the German way: let's apologise everyone for everything and then claim to be a moral superpower, lecturing everybody in Europe about decency, minority rights, democracy etc. Hmm... maybe he's onto something here. :)


Interesting. So would you say that when a group of people "desires something for centuries" and the elites of the country where they live, the ruling class, doesn't want to satisfy their desires, then when the aforementioned group of people commits bestial atrocities on civilians - mostly peasants, women, children and the elderly - this is merely a "direct result" of those frustrated desires? I'm just making sure if I understood you correctly.


Don't forget the Swedes, Alien. We should definitely apologise to them for brutally repelling their Potop and driving them back across the Baltic Sea. That was definitely uncalled for by Poland! We should have folded, so that today we would be a part of Sweden, "socially just" and with full tolerance of various minorities.

History / Poles should apologise to Ukrainians first [395]

This will be interesting :)


Are you - by any chance - suggesting that banderist atrocities can be justified by "centuries of Polish oppression"?

News / Despicable Ukrainian lies [144]


But I admitted it straight away some posts later. If I don't write about everything in one single post, it doesn't mean that I "cleverly omit" that. Really, Pawian, you must be a difficult person to live around - your willingness to ascribe bad intentions to people is astounding.

News / Polish Parliamentary Elections 2023 [933]


As far back as I can remember young voters were voting for JKM and his UPR - it's a phase that a lot of adult teenagers in Poland went through :) This time however it's different - UPR never got even half of the support Konfederacja has now. Something changed and I wouldn't dismiss it with jokes about provincial Poland.

News / Despicable Ukrainian lies [144]

@pawian

The fact that Polish businesses cooperated with Ukrainian oligarchs in the process of selling the grain here doesn't take the blame away from the latter. They knew straight away that the grain will be sold on the Polish market (instead of being just transported through Poland, like agreed) and that's exactly what they demand at the moment - to open the Polish and other frontier countries' markets.

The fact that their prime minister is so impudent in his lies indicates - as Iron very sensibly predicts - that he might sit in their pocket, figuratively speaking. Ukraine is not one bit less corrupt than Russia and their oligarchs are not one bit less greedy. If you think otherwise, you display naivety unbecoming of your age.

News / Despicable Ukrainian lies [144]


Of course, and some of those businesses were - surprise, surprise - connected with PiS politicians...

wiadomosci.radiozet.pl/Biznes/lista-firm-sprowadzajacych-zboze-z-ukrainy-sa-powiazania-z-pis

... it was only after desperate farmers' protests that they withdrew from their shady proceedings.

Ukraine is not yet an EU member and they don't yet have full and unrestricted access to European markets; that's why the current mechanism of transit is in place to protect Polish (and also Slovak, Hungarian, Romanian and Bulgarian) farmers.


This is from November. As recently as June Ukrainian IPN director was giving us a lovely ultimatum, saying that there won't be exhumations if Poland doesn't take proper care of UPA monument in Monastyr...

wiadomosci.dziennik.pl/swiat/artykuly/8735483,anton-drohobycz-ekshumacje-wolyn-monastyr-ipn.html

... the impudence! :-/

About two weeks ago Polish IPN president informed that they still don't have permission for exhumation...


polskieradio24.pl/130/5553/artykul/3205933,wznowienie-ekshumacji-na-wolyniu-prezes-ipn-to-zalezy-wylacznie-od-woli-ukrainskich-wladz

... later he mentions that some exhumation works started in one village (Puzniki) but that without permissions from Ukrainian authorities the full process will take forever (we are talking about 1500 destroyed villages).

@pawian

War cannot justify everything. If Ukrainians are so reluctant to cooperate about Volhyn and feel so free to lie about us now, when they are so desperately dependent on our help, then after the war they will just tell us to f*ck off straight away. Remember my words when it happens.