Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
Again you try to twist words. No one said anything about shots fired at the train station. Everything you comment on is completely twisted and any conversation with you is just a waste of time. Enjoy your day.

@Paulina
If you read what I wrote when the conversation was involving drugs and crazed meth heads you will find how it lead to hooligans. While normal in Europe, they do not exist in North America, so being new to Poland, I could not have anticipated being confronted by them. I certainly wouldn't have known about two teams in one city after just moving there and not being a big football fan.

Anyway, my only discussion point is that safe gun ownership, and the process by which it can be accomplished should be streamlined, not in any way resembling the US. But people, all people in Europe, should be trained how to use fire arms as long as Russia exists as a threat.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
If? I can get one now, I have Polish citizenship. I would not carry one on the street here unless I was in Lodz or a few other places. I have never used the word "quality" of the gun laws here. There is no such thing as a "quality" law in any respect because all man made laws are technically imperfect and subject to interpretation, which is why we have courts.

I have been in two situations in Poland where I felt there could be violence. The one as I described with hooligans, and one at the train station in Warsaw. As I said, I can handle myself and am not a small or timid man. Neither would have required a gun, but the one at the train station was sketchy enough to make me think now that it could have easily escalated into a situation where it would have been warranted.

As for pointing out cities that have multiple teams, Krakow's teams are direct rivals, this changes the dynamic of the hooligan rivalry. The rivalry between team hooligans at different levels is nothing like the one between top level teams in Krakow. When teams have to take a bus with police security just to travel a few blocks, and have to wait inside the stadium until all fans have been cleared out, and those fans have to be physically separated inside the stadium, you have a very different environment. A team in the third or fourth league in Krakow is not even considered in the hooligan rivalry here. Comparing "fans" to hooligans is not something I do. Fans, and hooligans are very different.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
Most big cities don't have two competing football teams in the same league. Within 10 minutes walking distance from each other. American cities do not have professional sports teams located that close to each other playing in the same league except in American Football in the case of the NY Jets and NY Giants who share an arena. There is no trouble between those fans because hooligans just do not exist in US sports.

Not once have I said I wanted a gun because of them. Really man you need to stop trying to twist what people say in order to fit your narrative. Please show me a poll, unbiased one, thats been done to check the desire of Poles for gun ownership. If there isn't one, one should be done. I think there would be 40% or more in favor of more streamlined licensing. Again, I have never said guns for everyone. But everyone who wants one, who is legally allowed to have one, regardless of reason, if they can prove it will be kept safely and managed properly, should have the ability to get one. The process exists, it should just be tweaked a bit to speed it along.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
Context Jon, context. I had just moved here. I had no clue there were two teams in the city. That encounter is how I found out. It was not a rough neighborhood at all.

No. I do not feel the need to carry a gun here at all. I can handle myself without one in most cases. I don't feel the need to carry in the US either unless I am carrying a lot of cash or traveling through a bad area that I am aware of. Both cases are very rare.

I am a dual citizen now Jon, and no, I would not shoot someone anywhere unless I felt threatened or my family was in danger. A couple hooligans do not scare me when I know they do not have guns.

I do however subscribe to gun ownership for the protection of your home and family. I subscribe to hunting and other shooting pursuits that are fun and require skill. I do not support crazy access for everyone.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
I know football fans, and I know hooligans and how to differentiate. My first year here, I was in a Wisla neighborhood wearing Cracovia baseball hat and had the pleasure of meeting hooligans. They spoke to me and told me how things were there and gave me a pass because I was American. Football fans I see every day and there is a big difference.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
I am surprised genuinely that you haven't seen a hooligan. I see them nearly every day in Krakow for one football team or the other. I have seen them in Warsaw, Gdansk, Chorzow, and a whole lot of other cities. They are not difficult to spot whether its at a match or just roaming around.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@Miloslaw
Sorry but I have to disagree with drugs not being a problem in Poland. Have you been to a football (soccer) game lately? Been to a club lately? I have seen people sniffing in bathrooms at Michelin Star restaurants. Its not just in a city like Warsaw or Krakow, but in smaller cities. Hooligans, who control most of the drug trade are everywhere. I remember being on a trip to Gdansk with a whole train full of hooligans, drunk, doing drugs in the bathroom, and completely crazy. I will say that alcohol is a much larger issue in Poland, but drugs with young people from certain groups is rampant. Lots of Poles, young men, carry knives and that is very well known. The knife wielding scenario is a very real scenario regardless of the drug or alcohol a person may be using.

While everyone's opinion, mine included, is shaped by their environments, there is a danger in not looking at todays environment. Today, in Poland we all need to recognize that the world around us is changing. There is more crime. Inflation, the war, COVID, and the influx of Ukraine people have created an environment ripe for trouble of this nature. Sure, some people hate guns. I have no problem with their opinions, except for when they inhibit my ability to defend my life, my family's lives, my home and my property. The threats of criminal activity in Lodz are much different than those in Nowy Sach, as they are different in Warsaw and Sanok. But there are threats, and the threat level is rising. While everyone can insulate themselves to a degree, there are no completely safe places. Safe, controlled, and responsible gun ownership anywhere in the world is a good thing.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
Did I at any time say drug crazed attacker? No, you did. I hang out in Rynek in Krakow and affluent areas of the city. I still see drug use walking through Planty. I see it when I am in Warsaw, and other places too. Your opinion is an oppressive one, a controlling one, one that reminds me of an extreme far left group in the US. You cite no real statistics, just general comparisons from Poland to the USA, and then sometimes the EU. No guns, no guns, when it should be responsible guns, responsible guns. But hey, when a war, or intruder comes, and your neighbor kills the POS that was about to kill you, you can thank him then and forget you want to limit access to people with good intentions.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
Did I say meth crazed? No. I said drug use. Plenty of drug use in Poland, and plenty of addicts.

Get off your high fvcking horse. You are no one to judge or say what Poland should or shouldn't do. Thats why there is voting. You need an intervention with your above everyone and everything attitude. You are stuffed so far up the left's a$$ that you can't even have a reasonable discussion. You are the all knowing and all seeing. Fine to speak your opinion but to claim that it is the majority opinion when you have no proof of it is wishful thinking. You take no account of other peoples thoughts, observations and opinions because of course you know what's best, not based on anything other than your opinion.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@johnny reb
I think joun is reading Hillary Clinton speeches in his spare time. Plenty of drug use all over Poland anyone saying otherwise lives under a rock. But I do like his idea of a gin license, particularly in Poland since alcohol use is probably the craziest I have seen anywhere in the world on a day to day basis. But, you dont have to worry about two drunks shooting each other because they dont have guns and they are probably too busy puking on the sidewalk or pi$$ing in the park in front of children to go look for a gun to buy. Nothing to see here folks, move along.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@Lenka
Clearly you didn't see the hypothetical essence of that statement. Yes, I agree though, the army buying weapons now is wise. A little late but still wise.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
Wrong Jon, in Poland and the US any conviction for a drug crime will disqualify you for gun ownership. It does not matter the age of conviction or the drug. A relative of mine in USA, pillar of the community where he lives, denied right to purchase a shotgun for skeet shooting because he had an impaired driving conviction when he was 19, the conviction was from the 1980's. Gun laws in the US are pretty strict. The problem is, many people are so careless with how they store their guns. Robberies, burglaries, and idiots just not remembering what they did with them and they go missing. Then they end up on the black market or in the hands of criminals.

@Lenka
Ok, so you don't see a problem with 6 months or even longer. When Ivan and the boys are rolling into Warsaw what do you think is going to happen then? The same exact thing that happened in Ukraine. Guns will be given to everyone, and most people will have no clue what to do with them. Ivan will be going street to street whacking who ever they want, raping who ever they want. Meanwhile Norbert will be waiting by the mailbox for his permit?

While I do not think Russia is a real threat to Poland right now, it could be a week, a month or a year from now. While I don't think crime rates in Poland warrant mass arming of the people to guard their homes, I think the process needs to be updated and made more streamlined. When someone does break into your neighbors house and tries to rob or rape them, are you going to be upset if that intruder is killed or would you prefer for him to get away and then come back in a week for your family?

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@Lenka
I do advocate for it. The process takes too long, and some people are excluded who probably shouldn't be. Example; if your neighbor got caught smoking pot in the 90's in Warsaw while at University, he can be excluded for this reason that is 30 years ago or so. What if that person now is not only well regarded in his community, physically and mentally sound? Should the process take six months or more? Realistic changes, nothing drastic. I have been a constant proponent of safe gun ownership.

As for maintaining old weapons, in families, I think you would be surprised at how many have been maintained. My relatives here have a nice cache of their own well hidden and safe in the mountains. The mountain people don't give these things up easily and are probably the most paranoid when it comes to Russia. At least in my experience with family anyway.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
You have been pointing things out and quoting me, so I asked you a direct question. As for my gun ownership, not only have I passed all background checks, licensed for a carry permit in two US States and volunteered teaching hunter safety programs years ago. My ability to use, maintain, and repair a weapon is exactly the skill set that would be in high demand if anything took place here.

If Russia does come, or Belarus, the 150K Polish military will not be able to stop them. An armed, responsible citizenry is what the Swiss have, and that would be a very good way to begin to educate people on gun safety and responsibility. I would propose any gun ownership comes with a mandatory biometric safe. Poles already have to pass background, and mental health checks to get licensed, it really is a pretty good system, it just takes a long time to get through the process like everything else in Poland.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@mafketis
NATO response time to a direct attack on Poland would not keep Russia from destroying a whole lot of places and killing a lot of people. While it would be quick, there would be a lot of damage and death. NATO is defensive after all and a threat of attack is not enough to trigger anything other than a higher level of readiness under Article 4. Response time for full NATO involvement would be at least a few weeks. Example September 12, 2001 when Article 5 was invoked.

@jon357
Please point out to me where I suggested anything close to gun laws of the USA. You cant. And because you are on the road so much it would be impossible for you to participate in conversations with people actually interested in gun ownership or self defense because you are not at the ranges or at the military surplus shops or the gun stores around the country.

Its funny how people opinions change when they are actually attacked. But you cant put toothpaste back in a tube after it is all over the countertop. You can try, but it sure gets messy. Now try putting Putin back into Russia when the army of idiots comes. Just look at Ukraine.

Amiga, there are lots of guns all over Poland. Lots of WW2 relics that have been well taken care of. Lots of people in the mountains armed to the teeth. Idealists are usually the first ones killed. I'll take some ammo and body armor thank you.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
When did anyone say anything about having things like the USA? Not me, not once. Once again though you and others take it to the extreme. Allowing mentally fit, responsible people to own weapons and be trained how to use them when there is a war next door is pretty wise. Otherwise Putin can and likely would roll through Poland in short order. Polish military is pretty small and could not handle an invasion force of 150K as well as Ukraine has.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
You are not in Poland now are you? You are not involved in conversations here are you? No one is calling for US style ownership, but they are calling for relaxing controls. But of course you didnt even read the article I posted after you requested a source. A bill was actually proposed by PiS.

@Joker
It takes me less than three seconds to roll over, open my safe and be up and armed. No entries upstairs, all bedrooms and valuables upstairs and only one stairway. Anyone trying would be a fool.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
polskieradio.pl/395/7789/Artykul/2976651,Security-concerns-in-Poland-are-increasing-pressure-to-reduce-gun-restrictions

Do your own research. There is mounting pressure and a lot of talk about gun controls. Not just in between politicians, but a lot of conversations with people in general. You should see how busy shooting ranges are now in and around Krakow, and how many people are taking classes on proper use of weapons. This outside of the increased military goals.

@cms neuf
It takes two seconds to open a bedside safe with a fingerprint or using a 4 digit combination.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@jon357
You should do some research before making a statement like there are no calls for changing gun laws in Poland. PiS are taking steps to make obtaining a gun much easier. Like they are building the military in Poland. This of course in response to what is happening in Ukraine.

In the US, depending on where you live there are very real possibilities of having an intruder in your house. In Poland these are less common occurrences.


This is the exact reason why these safes should be used. So no child, or other person who should not have access can get access. If you want to arm others, then buy more guns and more safes and put them in those areas where they sleep. Simple, more expensive, but problem solved.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@Novichok
A biometric thumbprint gun safe opens in in less than 2 seconds and they are pretty cheap for the safety and technology. Being much younger than you I also move much faster than you. Better luck next time.

Law / Obtaining Poland's citizenship through decent [11]

Just get your birth certificate translated, get both parents birth certificates, and it wont be a problem.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

This really would be a hilarious conversation if the problem involved was not so real. Smart guns, those with biometrics or and RFID type bracelet or ring are the future. A fingerprint or palmprint to release the safety is simply brilliant. Long guns will be next. Smart bullets being used by the US already are another item worth discussing. Imagine being able to shoot around a corner of a building in combat.

As for locked guns being useless, that is simply just idiocy. A locked gun can be accessed in less than 10 seconds if placed strategically. Useless when all sleeping areas are inaccessible upstairs and an intruder enters from downstairs? Thats one dead intruder before he gets out of the kitchen.

Responsible gun ownership, education, mental health awareness, and restricted access are the only things that will solve these problems. Taking guns away doesn't solve anything. Everyone I know would simply hide them or buy enough parts to build their own ghost guns.

As for gun ownership in Poland, the laws are changing, and with the Orcs invading next door, a lot more people are getting training and getting permits for weapons. A few of my friends here, who never hunted, never wanted to shoot or were never into being outdoors are now regulars at the gun ranges shooting AK's and other weapons just for fun, just in case. The world is changing thanks to little Vlad, and Poland has changed its tune on guns in the hands of citizens.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

Smart guns, or smart pistols are now making their way in the US. Several forms only allow an authorized user to fire these weapons. An authorized user can be someone with a biometric safety on the weapon, or some piece of jewelry that has to be worn while firing the weapon. This is the future of gun ownership.

People kill people, not guns. Education, and proper storage of any weapon will almost always result in no accidents or unauthorized use. Mental health awareness, and proper restriction weapons sales are what's needed. Grandpa's old .38 special from when he was a police officer can't just be kept loaded in and unprotected place. Common sense goes a long way for gun safety and ownership.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

Comparing Australia, Europe and other gun control countries makes zero sense. While the US Constitution and its subsequent amendment's guarantee rights for gun ownership, States also have gun laws. Even if the US were able to pass a federal gun law, they could not overrule State laws. So Australia may do one thing, but it would never happen in the US.

People kill people. Guns do not fire themselves. The problem is mental health, irresponsible gun security in many homes, and illegal gun sales. Legal gun sales account for a small portion of gun crimes. Mental health is the biggest issue concerning gun safety.

News / Poland's PiS party members and crime [346]

@pawian
I said this was happening nearly a year ago. Record profits in this economy for one sector controlled by the government. And where does all that money go? The guy running Orlen is a scumbag.

Law / The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland? [2237]

@mafketis
Guy was absolutely justified for the first three shots. The last four shots were execution and he will likely be charged with second degree murder or manslaughter. Welcome to Texas.

Travel / Do Poles like to hunt? Hunting in Poland. [211]

@Paulina
JR is actually correct. In many States wolves died off in the 1800's and early 1900's due to growth in farming, reduction in habitat, and yes over hunting for fur. Since the 70's though many States have repopulated with transplanting wolves from other area's and other States. Michigan is one such State. Wolves are quite amazing creatures and there are several varieties. I have been lucky enough to see the Michigan Wolves while out hunting and Wisconsin Timberwolves while on a fishing trip. Very different animals.

Predators in general attack the weakest points of any animal. The neck is not a frequent area that's attacked. Most attacks come from behind, at the spine or at the anus because they are so vulnerable and lead to near instant disability. Bears can go for the neck but not many others outside of Africa.

Travel / Do Poles like to hunt? Hunting in Poland. [211]

@johnny reb
Yes JR I do have pictures of the swamp buck taken in Alanson about 150 yards off the Crooked River in an incredible old growth cedar swamp that has a great corn field on the other side of the swamp. The land is privately owned and I was given permission to use it for about ten years before the owner passed. I am sure you know the area right near 68 and 31. Opening day in 2016.

You want to discuss the UP? OK. The deer population is in decline for many reasons, mostly due to die off a few years ago when the winter was very hard, coupled with predation from wolves, coyote and bear in the spring. I hunt up near lake of the clouds so I know the area well.

For the record, my deer hunting was not just rifle season, but bow and black powder. I never shot anything other than a mature animal. I stopped bird hunting when my lab died. While you may be an expert in central Michigan, and I will give you that because I don't know your area as well, few knew better hunting than I did in the lower NW. I will say, I do not hunt anymore because I am just not into putting in all the real effort it takes to help maintain a healthy heard year-round, and I am not in Michigan enough to commit to it. But ethical, safe hunting of mature animals should never be looked down on. It is the most humane way to provide meat for a family. Hunting for trophies is simply abhorrent.

Travel / Do Poles like to hunt? Hunting in Poland. [211]

@pawian
Go have another vodka.

So, Are There Any Differences Between Cougars and Mountain Lions?

The short answer is no, because they are from the same species, but there do tend to be some slight contrasts in overall size due to geographical concerns, diet and climate. "There are no significant differences other than vernacular taxonomy, if you will," says Charlie Jasper, founder of C&C Security Consultants, whose private clients live on the urban/wilderness divide in Los Angeles, necessitating his expertise in helping them to deny access to predators on their property.

"Panthers in Florida and the Southeastern U.S., like most creatures there, tend to be a little smaller," he adds. "If you compare a Carolinian white tail deer with its equivalent up in Maine, it's like looking at a labradoodle versus a wolf."

Those geographical differences do allow for people to make distinctions. Being from the US, I would never call a Florida Panther the equal of a California Mountain Lion, while technically in the same species they are dramatically different animals in size.

Travel / Do Poles like to hunt? Hunting in Poland. [211]

@pawian
Actually yes I will say the wolves have never been the dominating predator of the whitetail. Wolves are not and have never been in all the whitetail territories. There are so many sub species of wolf and of deer in the US most people cant even imagine. The explosion of whitetail is directly related to farming, not the hunting of their predators.

If JR took 3 and only got 50 kilo's those were some very small deer in his neck of the woods because I hunted those same area's and the smallest I ever took weighed at least 60 or 70 kilos, and that would be about the average size in that area. Some deer in that area can get to 100 kilo easily if the winters are mild.

Your high and mighty attitude based upon your pseudo intelligence is boring.