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Can anyone from Poland tell me about Auschwitz and The Ghetto?


Lyzko 30 | 7,388
31 Jul 2017 #301
Were the majority of Poland's population living predominantly in the countryside more neutral towards their Jewish fellow citizens, as were, say, the Danes, the Bulgarians, even the Spaniards and the Italians, the Nazis would doubtless have less success in recruiting locals to help in rounding up Jews!

You mean to tell me that you can put Poland, Lithuania, Ukraine, Hungary, Romania or Latvia in the same category as Italy, Spain, Denmark, Bulgaria or Albania??
dolnoslask 6 | 3,085
31 Jul 2017 #302
Were the majority of Poland's population

With respect could you please give me a straight answer to my question Lyzko.
kaprys 3 | 2,511
31 Jul 2017 #303
Any difference in numbers concerning Jewish population in both groups? It just keeps me wondering why there were so many Polish Jews if Poland was such a terribly anti-semitic country. Care to explain?

Any difference in the rage with which they were invaded?
Any agents form the latter group who volunteered into Auschwitz to gather intelligence which was then totally ignored by the Allies?
Lyzko 30 | 7,388
31 Jul 2017 #304
That's as straightforward as I can get at this time, pal! If it were any straighter, it would snap:-)
lol

@Kaprys,

Do you think that if the Poles en masse had openly refused to cooperate with the Germans, as happened by in large in Denmark for instance, the Holocaust would have occurred as swiftly and "efficiently" in Poland as it did?
Lyzko 30 | 7,388
31 Jul 2017 #305
Again, I'm not condemning Poland, any more than one would condemn the Germans aka "collective" Germany!

Obviously, in any group, there will be exceptions. Poland had a mighty resistance, far greater than in Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Hungary etc., almost equal to the French Resistance in her tenacity!

All I'm saying is, that as with post-War Austria, far too often, Poland was made to seem the mere victim of Nazi aggression. History shows, Gross for example, that there was a latent anti-Semitism in Poland which Hitler and cohorts manipulated all too skillfully during his occupation of that country.

Poland was perhaps more susceptible to anti-Semitism. That scarcely makes all Poles monsters now, does it? I hardly think so:-)
kaprys 3 | 2,511
31 Jul 2017 #306
Denmark lost 3000 people in the war. Further 4000 were killed fighting for the German army. The king was still in the country. Most institutions worked perfectly normal.

You compare that to Poland?
kaprys 3 | 2,511
31 Jul 2017 #307
As I have already pointed out, I'm not denying anti-semitism in Poland. But it exists everywhere. Even among Jews.
Gross - a son of an ethnic Pole and a Polish Jew. Yet another example of how anti-semitic Poles are. I mean, if you can't hurt Jew in any other way, just marry one ... pff

So care to explain why there were so many Jews in Poland despite its anti-semitism?
dolnoslask 6 | 3,085
31 Jul 2017 #308
That's as straightforward as I can get at this time, pal!

I wonder where you get the information that forms your conclusion that the Poles as a mojority were complicit in the holocaust.

Some days ago I sent you a PM explaining my own fathers experience during the Russian invasion in the east I was trying to explain that during those dark times there were a minority individuals Jews / Poles who would take advantage of conflict to take revenge or for monetary gain, In my families case it was land.

I did not post this on the main forum as I didnt wish to deepen the divide that is being created on this thread, but for the sake of balance in this debate I have posted the PM below

My own view is to heal any wounds of the past and for Poles / Jews to once more live together in peace, as we once did in the past.

"I didnt want to discuss this in open forum , but i feel i need to tell you that never during my catholic upbringing was a single anti Jeweish word said.

When my parents were taken to Siberia there were Jewish familys in the Village who were on the side of the NKVD, but my fatheres direct Jeweish neighbours pleaded with the communist, Ukrain NKVD not to take my family away, there was bad history all round, hell Lyzko lets remember the past and forgive, let us build a future where Jew Christian, Pole can live side by side again, we did it before why can't we build a better future, to hell with ant semites and crazy catholics like pol every long journey takes the first step for me that is education, let us teach the truth and hope the youth wil bring our peoples together again, the damn Nazis have alot to answer for."

The truth is Lyzko that some Jews had a hand in what is known as the hidden Holcaust in the east, not at the same scale as the Nazis , but Jews did have a hand in the murder and deportation of Polish citizens to Siberia, my family included.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_repressions_of_Polish_citizens_(1939%E2%80%931946)
kaprys 3 | 2,511
31 Jul 2017 #309
Lyzko seems to be nicer in PMs.
I told him about my grandparents' war experiences -all of them forced labourers. Now I wish I hadn't. Waste of time.

I'm sorry for your family, dolnoslask. From what I have read it was hell on earth.
dolnoslask 6 | 3,085
31 Jul 2017 #310
Lyzko seems to be nicer in PMs.

I realy do not understand what his agenda is here on PF, every time he debates this history with a Polish poster (especialy new posters) it;s as if he is is trying to goad them with into saying something atnti Jewish, usualy by making wild claims of majority complicity as you can see from his posts above, there is no reasoning with the guy, I don;t know where he gets his information from or if he even has had any experience or time with the survivors of that terrible time.

I have been fortunate enough to speak with a few of the survivors of Auschwitz, I had the chance to talk to them about my fanilies experience during the war, they new I was of Polish decent that is why the asked about my family , never did they cast equal blame toward the Polish people, the blame fell squarely with the Nazis and their leader.
TheOther 5 | 3,711
31 Jul 2017 #311
When my parents were taken to Siberia

How old were your parents when that happened?
Ironside 50 | 11,056
31 Jul 2017 #312
You compare that to Poland?

Don't try to explain anything to him. He is one of those retarded 'experts' that happens from time to time in America. He would most likely imply that Poles in the German occupied Poland should have had organized a demonstrcions against III R policy or a strike.

All he got are some bits and pieces and most of all that Holocaust myth that a majority of the American Jews are weaned on, build mostly from few stereotypies and prejudices plus some grandma tales.

Cannot you see that he know nothing about historical reality? It's clear that he is not asking to learn, it so called a wilful ignorance. Educating people like that is a waste of time.

I realy do not understand what his agenda is here on PF

You should remember that he is also a progressive. For him intergenerational guilt of imagined or real complicity in oppression are reality that he can use to see Jews as perpetual victims, an oppressed minority. Its fit his biased perspective perfectly and if he add few Jewish prejudices, so what, you cannot expect consistency from a leftie.

When my parents were taken to Siberia

My family lost a substacial real estate and acres of land in the east. Never heard about compensation or anything. Lucky my ancestors had been able to avoid soviets. Had pleasure with the German Nazis, one of great uncles died in Majdanek 1943. Ah and my great grandma had her precious gold watch stolen by one of those thieving Germans. A female working for gendarmerie (if I remember correctly) while checking her papers she just took it - thieving German b.

Do I call all Germans thieves and murderous Nazis who should at lest compensate me and apologise to me? No? Why not? Because I'm not a twat like Lyzko and some of his compatriots.
kaprys 3 | 2,511
1 Aug 2017 #313
It seems to me the guy is just biased. Or a troll. Or both.
Lyzko 30 | 7,388
1 Aug 2017 #314
There's no agenda here, folks!

There were those Poles who hid Jews, made huge sacrifices, and those who may have for a time, but then realized that it wasn't worth their while, that's all.

Think we're blowing what I wrote way out of all proportion:-)

Incidentally, gaining sympathy works both ways. Sob stories on the gentile end can be as effective as vice-versa.

The dirty shame, rather than just a pity, is, that a fair number of Jewish survivors have in fact either invented or at least embellished their experiences during the Holocaust, thereby making a mockery of the entire event, not to even mention fueling the already festering resentment of anti-Semites the world over!!
Dirk diggler 9 | 4,714
3 Aug 2017 #315
[moved from]

@Lyzko

If there were only more Zionists who thought like you..

I was actually surprised to learn that many in the orthodox community are supportive of Palestinian rights. Some even go as far as saying israel shouldn't exist (which I personally don't agree with) but their position comes more from the Torah rather than geopolitics.

Article on Auschwitz with some points from yehuda Bauer
nytimes.com/1989/11/12/weekinreview/ideas-trends-auschwitz-revisionism-an-israeli-scholar-s-case.html
Lyzko 30 | 7,388
3 Aug 2017 #316
The Palestinians are our neighbors as well as our brothers....before G_d!
No brainer, pal":-)
johnny reb 29 | 5,420
3 Aug 2017 #317
So you are claiming our neighbors are gods above God ?
Lyzko 30 | 7,388
3 Aug 2017 #318
Don't catch your drift, Johnny?

All I'm saying is that I resent the Zionist notion that Eretz Yisroel belongs SOLELY to the Jews, forgetting that the Palestinian Arabs lay equal claim to said land.

Any issues regarding primogeniture are and will always be fraught with legal ramifications and Israel today under Netanyahu is a nation with one mega identity crises on her hands!
gregy741 4 | 1,204
3 Aug 2017 #319
"Can anyone from Poland tell me about Auschwitz and The Ghetto?"
i got one interesting story,about Bartoszewski-a jew,sent to "death camp" aushvitz,but soon was released cus he felt unwell..got headache,so germans let him go.

i remember one story about" death camp" SS commander,who was executed by SS for punching jew,and taking his property in so called "death camp"

hes name is Karl-Otto Koch.
funniest thing is that the person who ordered his execution Prince of Waldeck and Pyrmont ,was later trialled by americans for war crimes.
they couldnt find anything so they sentenced him to death for ordering execution of Koch. lol
life can be so ironic. ehhh..dont get me started on swimming pools,football matches dentists,operas ect
jon357 67 | 16,921
3 Aug 2017 #320
Bartoszewski-a jew,sent to "death camp" aushvitz,but soon was released cus he felt unwell..got headache,so germans let him go.

Professor Bartoszewski was from a Catholic family, not Jewish at all, and was released from Auschwitz due to actions by the Polish Red Cross.

Karl-Otto Koch.

Koch was the commandant of Buchenwald and later set up the Death Camp at Majdanek. He was moved to Majdanek after personally looting large amounts of valuables that the German state wanted for themselves. He was fired from Majdanek for criminal negligence after 86 Soviet POWs escaped. The subsequent investigation revealed that he had been personally enriching himself there too, and was executed for disgracing both himself and the SS.

His wife was Ilsa Koch, the B1tch of Buchenwald, notorious for her cruelty. She was the one who had prisoners skinned for their tattoos.

So don't lie, Gregy, don't lie.
mafketis 25 | 9,334
3 Aug 2017 #321
So don't lie, Gregy, don't lie.

What do Russian trolls have if they don't lie?

The fact that the komuchy in PiS hate Bartoszewski ( a true Christian ) says everything.
gregy741 4 | 1,204
3 Aug 2017 #322
Bartoszewski was from a Catholic family

bartoszewski catholic muahahahahaha and he call me a liar haha
some insights from holocaust survivors:
youtube.com/watch?v=YVmIaBW-HjI

Koch

na,he was officially sentenced to death for looting jews property in camps and for their mistreatment,by waldeck
this guy Waldeck was sentenced to death be americans for ordering "unlawful execution" of Koch..
se we got a guy ,punished for ordering of execution of SS "death camp" commander..for mistreating jews
jon357 67 | 16,921
3 Aug 2017 #323
bartoszewski catholic

Yes, Catholic. He was a Righteous among the Nations.

na,he was officially sentenced to death for looting jews property in camps and for their mistreatment

He was executed for for disgracing both himself and the SS, by personally enriching himself with murdered people's assets that were meant to be stolen by the German state.
mafketis 25 | 9,334
3 Aug 2017 #324
some insights from holocaust survivors:

video not available in poland
of course a putinista wouldn't know that...
gregy741 4 | 1,204
3 Aug 2017 #325
He was executed for for disgracing both himself and the SS, by personally enriching himself with murdered people's assets that were meant to be stolen by the German state.

here is full story:
historyandtheholocaust.wordpress.com/2014/06/05/karl-otto-koch
waldeck discovered that koch ordered to kill prisoner,so he called investigation:

" Josias had also gained reports of a prisoner being shot while attempting to escape, by this time Koch had been transferred to Majdanek in Poland. However his wife was still working at Buchenwald. Josias ordered to have a full scale investigation of the camp by Dr. Georg Konrad Morgen"

A charge of incitement to murder was lodged by Prince Waldeck and Dr. Morgen against Koch"
you lie again and again

ehhh..this is what happen when you learn history from wikipedia...you become an ignorant jon357
jon357 67 | 16,921
3 Aug 2017 #326
here is full story:

Thank you for backing up what I said.

so he called investigation:

The investigation was caused when the 86 Soviet POWs escaped. Some of Koch' other deeds at Majdanek (which existed to murder people in vast numbers) and which were primarily concerned with financial embezzlement, came out during the investigation. He was executed "for disgracing both himself and the SS".

Dr. Georg Konrad Morgen"

Who dicovered that Koch had murdered the camp medics, so they couldn't tell anyone about his syphilis.

Stop lying, Greggs, stop trying to detract from the enormity and horror of the Holocaust.
gregy741 4 | 1,204
3 Aug 2017 #327
" Although the camps were known for vast amount of crimes against humanity, the Nazis did not officially sanction cruelty to the prisoners, Nazis did not tolerate cruelty to the concentration camp prisoners, as strange as that sounds, another camp commandant was also arrested for stealing from the concentration camp factories and food supplies, Among Goth, one of the more known commandants due to the film Schindler's List. Ilse Koch and Dr. Hoven were also arrested in the same month. "
jon357 67 | 16,921
3 Aug 2017 #328
the Nazis did not officially sanction

That makes all the difference. Officially, eh, Greggs...

Nazis did not tolerate cruelty to the concentration camp prisoners,

Only whipping children to death, conducting horrific experiments on live subjects, arbitrary executions and gassing people to death on a huge scale.
gregy741 4 | 1,204
3 Aug 2017 #329
enormity and horror of the Holocaust.

true,,tho exaggerated massively to the point of grotesque.

gassing people to death on a huge scale.

you forgot about lampshades from human skin and soap making
jon357 67 | 16,921
3 Aug 2017 #330
exaggerated massively

No Greggs, nothing 'exaggerated', everything thoroughly documented by living witnesses and corroborated beyond any doubt.

The only 'grotesque' thing is that pond-life such as yourself feebly attempt to detract from the full horror of that period, from the sheer scale of the crime.


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