The BEST Guide to POLAND
Unanswered  |  Archives 
 
 
User: Guest

Home / History  % width posts: 168

Where did the power of Poland vanish to, since... let`s say, some 300 years ago?


Antek_Stalich 5 | 997
7 May 2011 #91
Antek_Stalich: Alliance with Russia was never sought throughout the history of Poland.
No true.

My fault. Yes, such alliance was sought by some politicians.

Are you showing the Polish officer's sabre, 1919-1939?
PolskiMoc 4 | 324
7 May 2011 #92
gumishu

There are still enough Poles in Zaolzie.

There is a higher percentage of Poles in Zaolzie then there are Silesians of silesian nationality in Polish Silesia.

So Poland has a better claim on Zaolzie than anyone does on Polish Silesia!

Which was the point I was trying to make.
Sokrates 8 | 3,346
7 May 2011 #93
I was no expert on cold weapon - just read somewhere that epee( or small sword) as a piercing and not cutting weapon was superior to sabre in dueling - however some English officer and fencer showed in XIX th century that he could defend himself from any attack made with a small sword using his sabre

The polish sabre along with the fencing schools is very different from the western type sabre (which was for example heavier) and had a different hilt which facilitated a different type of grip.

The smallsword (epee is a later adaption) was a thrusting weapon, significant part of polish fencing consisted of various thrusts so i imagine having a smallsword provided no real advantage over using a sabre.
PolskiMoc 4 | 324
7 May 2011 #94
Russia wanted to expand into Poland, there was no way of forging an alliance as long as both countries were powerfull.

Alot of the problems go back to the Livonian wars.

In the First Livonian war Poland made more enemies with Sweden

Then in the 2nd Livonian war Poland made more enemies with Russia

This is what lead to the chain of events of what became the Deluge

This is what directly lead to decline in Polish power & to the Partitions of Poland.
Ironside 50 | 10,907
7 May 2011 #95
Are you showing the Polish officer's sabre, 1919-1939?

no - polska szabla husarska !
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,426
7 May 2011 #96
...and the livonian wars were without doubt the fault of the apecocroachwormslime! (did I miss something?)
piktoonis - | 86
7 May 2011 #97
It is strange that most of you say that it was Poland only. Commonwealth was "marriage" of GDL and Poland. By the way first Livonian war was fought by GDL only, as Poland didn't send anything to help.
PolskiMoc 4 | 324
7 May 2011 #98
...and the livonian wars were without doubt the fault of the apecocroachwormslime! (did I miss something?)

At this time we should have been attacking Germans...

I mean Poland let her guard down on Germans.

Even tried to help Germans & Make friendship with Germans with Jan Sobieski in 1683

Then Germans backstab Poland & Steal our land in the 1700's
gumishu 11 | 5,632
7 May 2011 #99
It is strange that most of you say that it was Poland only. Commonwealth was "marriage" of GDL and Poland. By the way first Livonian war was fought by GDL only, as Poland didn't send anything to help.

very good point - Polish was not even an official language of the Grand Duchy until 1697 (according to wiki) - Ruthenian was - the nobility of the GDL polonized in time though (but not the peasant masses for the most part)
OP Crow 146 | 9,112
7 May 2011 #100
To pewnie ten pacan Crow.

:)

We have a thread about a subject which has nothing to do with Serbia.

actually, Serbians greatly contributed to the strengthening of medieval Poland. shall i remind you of winged cavalry tactics (Gusar > Hussar) that was by Racowie (Serbians) introduced in Hungary and Poland? But, only in Poland that skill was implemented in its full potentials. Cavalry doctrine of Polish Hussars was further transferred on all European countries and even to the USA. BDW, wild west was `conquered` thanks to that cavalry tactic.

You are not fair Crow...you kept the Turks for 500 years in Europe.

this is biggest nonsense

Half of Serbian regions were (as it was case with most of Hungary) under the Turkish occupation for 180 years and other half was under the occupation maximally for 350 years. Some regions never experienced Ottoman occupation. Serbian lands were border region between Austro-Hungaria and Ottoman Empire and border constantly changed its position. All in all, thanks to Polish, Ukrainian and Russian support we survived and repelled the invasion.

Germany has them for barely 50 years!

but, Serbs resisted and still resist to Turkey, while Germany hug with Turks
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,426
7 May 2011 #101
Half of Serbian regions were (as it was case with most of Hungary) under the Turkish occupation for 180 years and other half was under the occupation maximally for 350 years.

So true...
If you had really cared you would had kicked them out long before, the great warrior people that you are!
OP Crow 146 | 9,112
7 May 2011 #102
If you had really cared you would had kicked them out, the great warrior people you are!

at the end we kicked them but, we wouldn`t make it if Poles, Ukrainians and Russians didn`t help us. Its a fact. As you know, Austria also had problem to repel the invasion and made it just after Poles arrived and kicked Turks
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,426
7 May 2011 #103
at the end we kicked them but,

After 500 years....during Serbs worked for Turks...and with big help! ;)

But Turks work in Germany, for Germany usually...since 50 years....spot the difference! ;)
piktoonis - | 86
7 May 2011 #104
I don't get it, what nowadays turks have to do with commonwealth fall?
Ironside 50 | 10,907
7 May 2011 #106
It is strange that most of you say that it was Poland only.

As Poland is the only real successor of the Commonwealth - and it is just an expression.

y the way first Livonian war was fought by GDL only, as Poland didn't send anything to help.

Yeah, typical piking on somebody and then calling for help, Crown was far too long stuck with the GDofL!
sobieski 107 | 2,128
7 May 2011 #107
Koala:
I think it's a combination of many things. Liberum veto, which lead to parliament losing any sort of legislative or decisive power

Rubbish.

As it is, all historians - including Norman Davies who for sure you adore - agree that the Liberum Veto, combined with the limitless selfishness of the schlachta, led to Poland's downfall.
Des Essientes 7 | 1,291
7 May 2011 #108
Liberum Veto, combined with the limitless selfishness of the schlachta, led to Poland's downfall.

It was the traitors amongst the szlachta who used the Liberum Veto in the service of their foreign patrons that precipitated Poland's downfall. The Liberum Veto itself is not to blame.
sobieski 107 | 2,128
7 May 2011 #109
Traitors? Polish neighbours took profit of the greedy nature of the schlachta. Money, that is all. I remember Edmund Burke reflecting on the insane nature of this system. The interests of one individual preceeding the interests of the nation.

A recipe for disaster. Almost everywhere in Europe at that time such foolish aristocrats lost their head upon rebelling against the Crown.
Sokrates 8 | 3,346
7 May 2011 #110
As it is, all historians - including Norman Davies who for sure you adore - agree that the Liberum Veto, combined with the limitless selfishness of the schlachta, led to Poland's downfall.

The same selfish szlachta who sacrificed by tens of thousands during the Deluge?:)
Antek_Stalich 5 | 997
7 May 2011 #111
Sokrates

The same selfish szlachta who sacrificed by tens of thousands during the Deluge?:)

Nothing is granted forever. Czasy saskie są faktem. The Saxon era cannot be denied.
ZIMMY 6 | 1,601
7 May 2011 #112
The Liberum Veto itself is not to blame.

It is to blame! The concept is inherently flawed.
Sokrates 8 | 3,346
7 May 2011 #113
Nothing is granted forever. Czasy saskie są faktem. The Saxon era cannot be denied.

I dont think Sobieski knows anything about them though :)))))
OP Crow 146 | 9,112
7 May 2011 #114
The Liberum Veto itself is not to blame.

i agree to it. It would be same as if we today blame democracy because USA turned democracy into the biggest joke. Blame USA magnates, not the democracy, of course.

Serbs???

WTF? Serbs were iron penis of Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. We penisized even Russians and gave double doze of penis to the Germans
Antek_Stalich 5 | 997
7 May 2011 #115
Antek_Stalich: Nothing is granted forever. Czasy saskie są faktem. The Saxon era cannot be denied.
I dont think Sobieski knows anything about them though :)))))

I mean, things started degrading after the Sobieski's reign. The Constitution of 3rd May was made far too late.
Ironside 50 | 10,907
7 May 2011 #116
I blame Russia and Prussia.
OP Crow 146 | 9,112
7 May 2011 #118
what about Hungary? is there anything that was done by Hungarian elite that led to weakening of Poland?
sobieski 107 | 2,128
7 May 2011 #119
I think that besides the selfishness of the szlachta and the betrayal of the magnates (all in someone's pay), the problem is that Poland had no standing army. Nothing to compete with Prussia's army for example.

And who was against this? All these narrow-minded szlachta.
Who opposed Koszcziuzko's reforms and liberation of the serfs - and sided with the Russians? The church and the aristocracy.
Sokrates 8 | 3,346
7 May 2011 #120
I think that besides the selfishness of the szlachta and the betrayal of the magnates (all in someone's pay), the problem is that Poland had no standing army

It had a standing army, for christs sake you moron why not try and read something about the PLC?

Nothing to compete with Prussia's army for example.

What? You mean with the 40.000 soldiers Prussia had duriing the partitions? Poland had around 56.000 very modern troops.

And who was against this? All these narrow-minded szlachta.

I'm sorry but the Sejm debated each year on the composition and increase/decrease of the standing army, no one was against it too.

Who opposed Koszcziuzko's reforms and liberation of the serfs - and sided with the Russians? The church and the aristocracy.

Not really no.


Home / History / Where did the power of Poland vanish to, since... let`s say, some 300 years ago?
BoldItalic [quote]
 
To post as Guest, enter a temporary username or login and post as a member.