Husariawiktoria 1 | 7
3 May 2010 #1
The confederation of Bar happened today in 1791. Short lived and bittersweet, it was none the less a huge leap for European democracy.
Happy Constitution day! 3 May 1791 (Poland Constitution)
he confederation of Bar happened today in 1791.
Huh ?
I thought it was 1768?
M-G (tiens)
M-G (tiens)
no, it was 1791.
Oh.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bar_Confederation
>^..^<
M-G (to the how manieth partition did this lead?)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bar_Confederation
>^..^<
M-G (to the how manieth partition did this lead?)
Torq
3 May 2010 #6
The confederation of Bar happened today in 1791.
I thought it was 1768?
A Dutch Jew knowing the history of Poland better than a Plastic Pole.
Hilarious :-)
oh yes.... i thought about The Constitution of May 3, 1791
you have right about confederation of Bar
i'm sorry for mistake
you have right about confederation of Bar
i'm sorry for mistake
A Dutch Jew knowing the history of Poland better than a Plastic Pole.
Hilarious :-)
Hilarious :-)
Half Jewish, eh? :) Well, I did pay attention during the lectures on Eastern European history between 1500 and 1900. But besides all that - TS's claim that this would be the first Democratic leap forward makes it impssbl that it could've taken place in 1791; at that point in time there had been already three major democratic leaps: The US constitution of 1776, the Dutch Palace Revolution of 1787 and it's copy, the French Revolutionairy act of 1789.
>^..^<
M-G (tiens)
Torq
3 May 2010 #9
the Dutch Palace Revolution of 1787 and it's copy, the French Revolutionairy act of 1789.
These are not constitutions.
Polish constitution was the first modern constitution in Europe and second in the World
(after the US constitution of 1787, not 1776).
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Constitution
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constitution_of_May_3,_1791
The Constitution of May 3, 1791 (Polish: Konstytucja Trzeciego Maja; Lithuanian: Gegužės treèiosios konstitucija) is generally regarded as Europe's first and the world's second modern codified national constitution, following the 1788 ratification of the United States Constitution
na zdrowie to that. :)
I knew that the Polish constitution of 1791 was the first modern in Europe. Never denied that - was more intended at TS's mixup of facts.
You just take every opportunity to have a drink, don't ya?
:))
>^..^<
M-G (cheers anyway)
na zdrowie to that.
You just take every opportunity to have a drink, don't ya?
:))
>^..^<
M-G (cheers anyway)
hague1cmaeron 14 | 1366
4 May 2010 #12
The confederation of Bar happened today in 1791. Short lived and bittersweet, it was none the less a huge leap for European democracy.
My contribution.
youtube.com/watch?v=rqirek3ppQo&feature=related
You just take every opportunity to have a drink, don't ya?
why not.. :)
The confederation of Bar happened today in 1791. Short lived and bittersweet, it was none the less a huge leap for European democracy.
A good number of Wroclaw youth and myself marked the occasion in usual style by attending a gig on the Wyspa Slodowa. All to the tunes of KNZ, Coma, Myslovitz etc.
I hope everyone has a good constitution day, many people all over the world are celebrating, in fact it was polish emigrees that kept this tradition going as May 3 was ignored during communist times.
It is encouraging that the Presidents of Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia and Ukraine are all commemorating the event as well.
I found a great multimedia website in both polish and english about the May 3 1791 and the events before and after. konstytucja3maja.gov.pl/pl/
It is encouraging that the Presidents of Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia and Ukraine are all commemorating the event as well.
I found a great multimedia website in both polish and english about the May 3 1791 and the events before and after. konstytucja3maja.gov.pl/pl/
Szczesliwego Dnia Ustawy!
What the authors of all constitutions everywhere ignored was that power corrupts and that the bums who managed to lie well enough to be elected should not be allowed to run ever again - even if they can walk on water. One term and out for life, including those related by marriage or DNA.
I hope everyone has a good constitution day,
Yes, we did, the food was excellent.
BTW, let me remind you that the Constitution was abolished by Targowica traitors who prefered to ally with conservative imperialistic Russia than follow the liberal trends of the West.
Today we see exactly the same situation. PiS and other rightists reject the Western ideals and don`t mind or even think warmly of being in close relationship with conservative Russia today.
Matrix Reloaded - those cons were traitors then, and they are traitors today!
Constitution was abolished by Targowica
Ha,ha, Pawian, you are missed here.
Happy Constitution Day in which the second written constitution in modern Europe is celebrated.
nice modern analysis facebook.com/reel/971196465299606
for once the polish nobility were forward thinking.
for once the polish nobility were forward thinking.
nice modern analysis
Not an analysis, simply a fact.
I'd not call most of the szlachta nobility either; there were too many of them to be a ruling class.
However yes, those who drafted the K3M were forward thinking rather than those who drafted the first written constitution (actually the first two since K3M was the third in modern Europe ) who were largely doing damage limitation.
I'd not call most of the szlachta nobility either; there were too many of them to be a ruling class.
Here you are making a classic mistake of someone who has only superficial understanding of polish history (and polish society in the past).
"Szlachta" ("nobility") was never the same as aristocracy, not in context of Poland. Szlachta historically when was still a leading political class tried to protect themselves from aristocracy, looked at it with distrust - this is the reason why aristocracy never existed as a separate class in LEGAL terms in pre-partitions Poland. It existed de-facto (a "magnat" was legally just a very rich noble but in practice it was the equivalent of aristocracy). After partitions even that distinction disappeared and many magnat families got aristocratic titles from one source or the other (mostly monarchs of the 3 powers that partitioned Poland).
Szlachta was historically mostly middle class (and many were de facto but not de iure - peasants, they were growing their own lands just like peasants but had privileges of a noble.
In 19th century a lot of nobility was materially de-classed - and then had to came to cities, intelligentsia mostly originated from them. My family (both from father and mother side) was like that. They didn't really own anything in terms of land since second half of 19th century. That's was pretty common. People like that often had good education and lived in cities and worked in academia, bureaucracy, or in what french call "profession liberales" i think, lawyers, doctors, etc...
was never the same as aristocracy
So not a mistake. They were a caste rather than a class, distinguishing themselves by customs, language and a false feeling of superiority.
distinguishing themselves by customs, language
In that case, it is indistinguishable from contemporary Poland.
Ranked: What Europeans Are Most Proud Of
🇵🇱 Poland
Identity (21%)
History (20%)
People (18%)
a false feeling of superiority.
Classic British projection: clinging to a false sense of superiority to mask their self-loathing and characteristically spectacular, crooked, yellowed horse teeth.
Where National Pride Is Weakest
🇬🇧 UK
Negative feeling (29%)
People (25%)
Politics (22%)
"In the UK, 29% of respondents cite "negative feeling" when describing their country, which is higher than any single positive category."
visualcapitalist.com/cp/what-makes-europeans-most-proud-of-their-country/
indistinguishable
You've missed the point again.
Proud
Don't confuse pride with your inferiority complex. And don't make any note threatening 'anonymous' phone calls to people who, unlike you, are Polish citizens.